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#101 Posted by DarkRaiden (7729 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden:

Why would he say he's faster than I, rather than he's faster than me? It's more likely that he meant he's faster than I thought he was considering just before that he comments on Wolverine dodging hits he didn't expect him to. Context is everything.

I see what you are trying to say now. But you have to remember that he doesn't talk like the "modern" person. He talk like he's in Romeo and Juliet.

I think its that Wolverine was dodging the hits(Of course when you're missing you'll try even more) and then he said he is faster than him. He basically talks like he's in the 1500s or so

I'd think he'd be more like "He's faster than myself" based off of that dialogue then "He's faster than I." Also the hyphen to me dictates something different.

#102 Posted by pooty (11400 posts) - - Show Bio

@heraldofganthet: Your points regarding their team work and powers make it hard to disagree. Since I don't know their feats well enough, I'll change my comment from "Thor wins" to " not knowledgeable enough to make an informed decision".

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#103 Edited by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty: Your points regarding their team work and powers make it hard to disagree. Since I don't know their feats well enough, I'll change my comment from "Thor wins" to " not knowledgeable enough to make an informed decision".

A very reasoned point of view, mon ami. I like the way you think.

#104 Posted by Wardemon32 (4152 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden:

That's just how he talks...

Wouldn't it make more sense if he's saying that Wolverine is faster than him if he is having trouble landing a hit on Wolverine?

#105 Posted by pooty (11400 posts) - - Show Bio

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

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#106 Posted by WillPayton (9558 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty said:

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

Yeah, if the statement was cut off then we cant tell what he was trying to say. People need to stop arguing over that.

#107 Posted by BigCimmerian (8589 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty said:

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

I agree.

#108 Edited by dum529001 (1635 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty said:

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

Exactly. Some people are so getting desperate to convince themselves and everyone that Thor is lame that they resort to these pathetically weak arguments in an attempt to low-ball Thor, trying to make Thor look like a chump based on their favoritism for the other character. No solid proof, just people believing what they want based on nothing.

#109 Posted by WillPayton (9558 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty said:

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

Exactly. People are so getting desperate to conivince themselves and everyone that Thor is lame that they resort to these pathetically weak arguments in an attempt to low-ball Thor, trying to make Thor look like a chump based on their favoritism for the other character. No solid proof, just people belive what they want based on nothing.

Agreed. Thor has plenty of other examples to show how lame he is. This particular one is not needed.

#110 Posted by BigCimmerian (8589 posts) - - Show Bio

@dum529001 said:

@pooty said:

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

Exactly. People are so getting desperate to conivince themselves and everyone that Thor is lame that they resort to these pathetically weak arguments in an attempt to low-ball Thor, trying to make Thor look like a chump based on their favoritism for the other character. No solid proof, just people belive what they want based on nothing.

Agreed. Thor has plenty of other examples to show how lame he is. This particular one is not needed.

hahahahahahhaha lol you won Internet today bro.

#111 Posted by RetconCrisis (4202 posts) - - Show Bio

@bigcimmerian: Superman's stated himself that a swing from HM's mace feels like being hit by the mass of a planet at high velocity. I don't think it can keep up with Thor's hammer, but it can most certainly hurt Thor. And Steel was able to crack and hurt Doomsday's armor (which in the arc was a part of himself, since it had his body's healing factor as well). Thor has survived in space like characters like Captain Marvel, Black Adam, and Goku have- they hold their air supply in. But if Thor's lungs are cut off from the inside, then it can hurt Thor.

#112 Posted by Perethorn (3449 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor can pull this off, only threats for him here are Guy Gardner and Steel.

#113 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@retconcrisis: Superman's stated himself that a swing from HM's mace feels like being hit by the mass of a planet at high velocity.

You're on the right track, mon ami. But it wasn't the Mace that Superman commented on, as mean as it is (especially to magical opponents), it was the Claw of Horus that got Superman's undivided attention.

Just sayin...

#114 Edited by WillPayton (9558 posts) - - Show Bio

@retconcrisis: Superman's stated himself that a swing from HM's mace feels like being hit by the mass of a planet at high velocity.

You're on the right track, mon ami. But it wasn't the Mace that Superman commented on, as mean as it is (especially to magical opponents), it was the Claw of Horus that got Superman's undivided attention.

Just sayin...

HM was able to hurt Despero with that mace. The Nth Metal properties make it a dangerous weapon.

#115 Posted by RetconCrisis (4202 posts) - - Show Bio

@heraldofganthet: Thanks for the info, it's been a while since I've seen that quote. But his mace is still pretty powerful.

#116 Edited by pooty (11400 posts) - - Show Bio

@retconcrisis: But if Thor's lungs are cut off from the inside, then it can hurt Thor

They used to write Thor as having to breathe. but recently he doesn't need to breath

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#117 Posted by Lvenger (20777 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: Bane's covered what I would have said already. Thor usually refers to himself in ye olde, Shakesperean dialogue so it makes sense for him to use I instead of me sometimes. The syntax fits with Thor's dialogue so it's in keeping for Thor to use those terms instead. Thus, it's clear he was calling Wolverine faster than he was.

#118 Posted by Cgoodness (5170 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: so wolverine can move faster than the speed of light?

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#119 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@willpayton: HM was able to hurt Despero with that mace. The Nth Metal properties make it a dangerous weapon.

Yes he certainly did. Nth Metal is admittedly some very versatile and dangerous stuff.

@retconcrisis: Thanks for the info, it's been a while since I've seen that quote. But his mace is still pretty powerful.

Agreed. I want one for Christmas.

#120 Posted by XiiX (8748 posts) - - Show Bio

I swear Red-Tornado's something of the "new Aquaman" insofar as being underestimated in a fight.........

#121 Edited by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@xiix: I swear Red-Tornado's something of the "new Aquaman" insofar as being underestimated in a fight.........

Agreed. As a Wind Elemental, his mystical weather-bending abilities should be at least as strong as Thor's at a bare minimum. And while Thor would beat him in an arm wrestling contest, he wouldn't be alone in this fight. Red Tornado by himself should serve to undo any weather manip Thor would or could do in this match up, causing him to rely on his other talents/abilities to defend himself.

#122 Edited by Lvenger (20777 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: so wolverine can move faster than the speed of light?

No but neither can Thor in combat nor can he travel that fast without Mjolnir. Thor can travel at FTL speeds, that much cannot be disputed. But he cannot fight anywhere near those kinds of speeds either.

#123 Edited by MaximumGeyser5 (584 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor has This.....with Difficulty

#124 Edited by Cgoodness (5170 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

1) microsecond reaction time

2) fighting Adam Warlock and SS at the same time, all faster than the speed of light

3) blitzes Quicksilver

4) jukes SS silly

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#125 Edited by Lvenger (20777 posts) - - Show Bio

@cgoodness: I've debunked these before you know. Nothing new here and all that's needed is some illumination on your part for what's actually going on

  1. Classic scan. Highly inconsistent and a one off feat that does not gel with Thor's current speed showings
  2. Street levellers have also been stated to move in fast blurs of motion or like the lightning itself
  3. Notice how he never actually tags Quicksilver here. Way to give a non reaction or speed feat here. All he does is smash the ground which disrupts it and the shockwave throws Quicksilver to the floor. Area of Effect attacks don't count as legitimate taggings I'm afraid. At least not actually hitting a fast moving target like Quicksilver
  4. Travel speed feat, not a combat speed one. Thor just veered off slightly and Surfer was expecting Thor to fly straight at him. Surfer's shown proper reaction feats and being able to tag fast foes which is more than I can say for Thor.

All in all, those are the reasons why none of your scans are any form of sound proof of Thor's combat speed I'm afraid. Hope you realise this for future reference in Thor battles.

#126 Posted by alessandro_souzamarques (699 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Yes he can fly faster than light without Mjölnir. Thor can use winds to travel way faster than light. Thor can even make his drakkar travel faster than light.

#127 Posted by Cgoodness (5170 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

1) well when mjlonir is show to be faster than SS himself, id say its consistent and relevant

2) to be a blur, you have to move around 1/20th of a second, and lighting is slower than light because it curves and turns plus is slowed down in air so yes thor does move at lightspeed

3) it doesnt matter if it was AoE attack, it still hit him.

4) SS was trying to stop thor by tackling him, thor juking him was indeed a reaction time

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#128 Posted by Lvenger (20777 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Yes he can fly faster than light without Mjölnir. Thor can use winds to travel way faster than light. Thor can even make his drakkar travel faster than light.

Way to blow the scan out of context. Do you know you're using it incorrectly? All Thor is doing in that scan is using his command of the solar storms to make the ship go faster. This is in no way related to Thor's non existent combat speed. You still haven't proved that Thor can go faster than light in travel speed let alone combat speed without outside assistance.

@cgoodness

  1. Again, that's travel speed, not combat speed. Assuming that's true, it doesn't change a thing as only the hammer can reach those speeds, not Thor. That's what we call consistent and relevant, not spammed classic scans or scans where only the hammer travels at those speeds.
  2. What? That makes no sense whatsoever. The faulty logic is evident in this point. Look at this scan above and tell me Deathstroke can move at FTL speeds. Go on try it. He's moving in exactly the same way Thor is. And since when does Adam Warlock serve as any guide on speed.
  3. Yes it does matter because it wasn't a direct hit that tagged Quicksilver, it was an indirect one.
  4. No it's not. It's a travel speed feat. Show me one instance of Thor doing that in combat and you'll have an ounce of credence to your point. Until then, it's baseless, faulty speculation on your part.
#129 Posted by dondave (38571 posts) - - Show Bio

This thread cracks me up

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#130 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: All Thor is doing in that scan is using his command of the solar storms to make the ship go faster.

Correct. In likewise fashion, Red Tornado as a Wind Elemental possesses total control over not just atmospheric storms, but all gasses in creation. Hydrogen (as an example) is the single most abundant element in the universe. Space is full of it. Both he and Thor can manipulate it and other gasses at their leisure. Him (RT) being a part of this battle effectively removes the weather-bending option completely from Thor's bag of tricks. He'd need to utilize different methods to survive here.

#131 Posted by Lvenger (20777 posts) - - Show Bio

@dondave said:

This thread cracks me up

Me too. I'd forgotten how many people believe Thor is actually fast in combat.

#132 Edited by rcranium (94 posts) - - Show Bio

@darkraiden: This isn't King Thor or Rune King Thor is it? I'm a big fanof Thor, but this 20 planet lifting stuff is BS. The laws of Physics and inertia do not allow "planet lifting." Even if he had the strength, which he doesn't, the planet would crumple from the force. Even if you made it true adamantium, Thor doesn't have the requisite mass to "lift" it.

#133 Edited by alessandro_souzamarques (699 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Well,In fact this first scan that Cgoodness posted has already been replicated.

Mjölnir was at least 3x speed of light

#134 Edited by alessandro_souzamarques (699 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:You said Thor can't travel faster than light without Mjölnir. I was replying to that. Thor can use the air around him to fly.

#135 Posted by Cgoodness (5170 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

1) thor sensing, reacting, and catching Mjolnir at that speed is reaction speed, not travel speed, he's not wielding Mjolnir he's sensing an catching it

2) I have no idea what you are blabbering about, how is Deathstroke moving the same way thor is lol? Because Thor can block bullets and DS can also doesn't mean DS has the same reaction speed thor does. If DS was a god and fights beings like SS then your point will be accurate. And it's not thor vs warlock it's thor vs warlock & SS who both are well beyond light speed.

3) What makes you think Thor was trying to hit QS directly? He was trash talking QS so it makes more sense he'd rather knock him back than kill him. If thor was bloodlust then it would make sense that thor was trying to hit him directly and kill him but thor trash talking after knocking him back shows he was most likely trying to knock him back and humiliate him.

4) so you think SS was just flying at thor to say stop and hope he'd just say ok and turn back?No he was attacking thor and thor juke him silly, that's combat speed my friend

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#136 Posted by ForeverEvil (4788 posts) - - Show Bio

HAHHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHA
AHAHAHAHHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA

OMG. A THOR FAN SAID "YES THOR CAN TRAVEL FASTER THAN LIGHT WITHOUT MJOLNIR" AND HE POSTS SCANS OF THOR RIDING IN A VEHICLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AHAHHAHAHAHHA

OH MAN, I THOUGHT I WAS AACCTUALLY GOING TO SEE A SCAN OF THOR GOING FTL WITHOUT AID

ROFLMMFAO!!!!

#137 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@foreverevil:

Now, now. No need to humiliate the guy for trying.

Congratulations on your 400th post, by the way. Moving on up (lol)!

#138 Edited by alessandro_souzamarques (699 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: Are you really trying to compare those two feats? Deathstroke was said to move like lightning by a mere human that doesn't know how fast a lightning is. Thor was said to move like the lightning he commands by someone that knows how fast those lightnings are. Try again

#139 Posted by ForeverEvil (4788 posts) - - Show Bio

@foreverevil:

Now, now. No need to humiliate the guy for trying.

Congratulations on your 400th post, by the way. Moving on up (lol)!

LMAO no, no. i didnt mean that to sound humiliation. I was literally LOLing. Not AT him. I was just laughing cause it was anti climactic. my internet connection is slow, you see, so when the scan finally loaded, it was thor riding in a big canoe LMAO. i was like, seriously? i really thought id see thor flying FTL without aide. i didnt mean it to sound rude

#140 Edited by alessandro_souzamarques (699 posts) - - Show Bio

@foreverevil: He was using solar winds to make his drakkar so fast that Galaxies passed by in a blur.... Thor to be able to fly (without Mjölnir) uses winds to make him fly, so he can fly FTL. Edit: I mean, not as fast as with drakkar i guess.

#141 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3615 posts) - - Show Bio

@foreverevil: I gotcha. It's al good!;)

@alessandro_souzamarques: He was using solar winds to make his drakkar so fast that Galaxies passed by in a blur.... Thor to be able to fly (without Mjölnir) uses winds to make him fly, so he can fly FTL.

Fair enough. But you're overlooking the fact that Thor + Red Tornado= nullification of weather-bending. For them both. Thor's ability to manipulate storms as an attack and/or a transportation method is cancelled just by having Red Tornado on the scene here. RT would have nasty amounts of help here outside of him completely shutting down one of Thor's favorite go-to options in a combat setting.

Love your User Name, by the way. Really cool.

#142 Posted by DarkRaiden (7729 posts) - - Show Bio

@rcranium said:

@darkraiden: This isn't King Thor or Rune King Thor is it? I'm a big fanof Thor, but this 20 planet lifting stuff is BS. The laws of Physics and inertia do not allow "planet lifting." Even if he had the strength, which he doesn't, the planet would crumple from the force. Even if you made it true adamantium, Thor doesn't have the requisite mass to "lift" it.

It...happened.

#143 Edited by Lvenger (20777 posts) - - Show Bio

@alessandro_souzamarques: Really? Are we now assuming that Mjolnir is travelling at FTL speeds then? It returns to Thor far more slowly than it's thrown so that's a weak basis to even present a case for Thor's reaction speeds on. And yes I am comparing the two because they are closely linked to what Thor has done in combat speed. He's consistently shown up by street levellers and possesses few, if any truly good combat scans that cannot be debunked.

@cgoodness

  1. I fail to see the proof behind this. Besides see above for a more accurate response.
  2. Neither do I have any idea what you're going on about. In all of Thor's fights with Silver Surfer, Surfer has NEVER used his combat speed. Try and prove me wrong there but I doubt you'll succeed.
  3. He couldn't hit Quicksilver even if he was bloodlusted. His feats show he pales drastically in the speed department. And to try and support the other view is folly on your part. I've shown that Thor can't tag Quicksilver directly and you haven't given me a shred of proof otherwise.
  4. Nope it's travel speed still. If Surfer was moving his limbs and engaging Thor with his vastly superior speed and reactions, then it would be combat speed. Otherwise, Surfer flying towards Thor on his board doesn't count as proper combat speed. To dispute that only displays your lack of knowledge in what constitutes as combat speed and what doesn't. And Thor's flying towards SS was movement speed, not combat speed. You're showing yourself up now really.

#144 Posted by Cgoodness (5170 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

1) as above shows, thor can react and avoid a hammer that goes faster than 3x the speed of light in point blank range

2) i showed you that in #4 lol and thor jukes SS silly

3) can you show me where QS was able to avoid Thor? as far as the what i posted before thor smashed the ground in front of QS to fast for QS to react, nothing about QS able to avoid his direct hit, QS wasnt interrupted or anything so i have no dea why you think QS was able to avoid a direct hit because its not shown

4) thats part of being juked, it is combat speed because Silver Surfer was trying to takedown thor. they werent going for a highfive and missed, SS was trying to take thor down to stop him from attacking galactus, but ends up getting juked instead, thats combat speed buddy

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#145 Posted by WillPayton (9558 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

1) as above shows, thor can react and avoid a hammer that goes faster than 3x the speed of light in point blank range

I'm sorry, but, what??? Where does it say in that scan that the hammer was moving "faster than 3x the speed of light"?

#146 Posted by Ancient_0f_Days (12346 posts) - - Show Bio

oh dear lord.......how many new clones of Majestic99 are there around here.

#147 Posted by Cgoodness (5170 posts) - - Show Bio

@willpayton: I already showed Mjolnir flys faster than SS when it's returning to thor, that's actually way more than 3x the speed of light

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#148 Posted by WillPayton (9558 posts) - - Show Bio

@willpayton: I already showed Mjolnir flys faster than SS when it's returning to thor, that's actually way more than 3x the speed of light

I'm pretty sure Mjolnir can fly at different speeds. And, the scan says absolutely nothing about how fast it's moving.

Also, and I know comic books tend to ignore little things like logic and physics, but if the hammer was moving faster than light then Thor certainly would have no chance to see it before it hit him.... just like you cant hear something coming that's moving faster than sound.

I've never seen any convincing evidence that Thor has reaction speeds to be able to react to something moving that fast. Maybe you can dig up a scan or two from 30 or 40 years ago, but all that would prove is how Thor doesnt have any such feats for decades. Even for Marvel, if a character doesnt show a power or feat in decades, then it's hardly believable that he/she can actually do that now.

#149 Posted by bump1010 (299 posts) - - Show Bio

@pooty said:

Regarding what Thor said about Wolverine's speed: Since we don't know whether he was saying "Wolverine is faster then I.....am" or "Wolverine is faster then I.... imagined. We shouldn't even use that statement for or against Thor. It is inconclusive.

Yea but in the scan thor also stated that he "dodges my fieriest blows while he connects" and he also stated that wolverine was "too fast." He also said "if wolverine continues to evade my finest blows". Honestly the whole page is basically thor marveling at wolverines speed.

For the record I agree thor is faster then wolverine I just don't think this showing is inconclusive.

#150 Posted by GhostRavage (9196 posts) - - Show Bio

I think no one in the team can beat Thor via disrupting/absorbing/neutralizing his magic, let alone Mjolnir's magic. It's WAY out of their league to begin with. Other ways, yeah, probably.