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#1 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

RESULSTS: HARRY POTTER (TDLP) WON 5-4

Harry Potter (TheDarkLordPandamonium):

Magic-Focused Dovaahkin (I_Like_Swords)

RULES

  • All characters are bloodlusted
  • Random encounter
  • Harry is post-timeskip and assumed to know all spells
  • Harry has any/all notable artifacts at his disposable, as well as Felix Felicitis, Fire Protection, and Girding Potions, 1 each
  • Dovaahkin has only non-offensive shouts as well as Disarm, Unrelenting Force, and Marked for Death and Enchanted Clothing + Mastery of all schools of magic

Fight takes place in Hogwarts, the Dueling Hall

VOTING: NO NAMEVOTES OR QUOTING SOMEONE ELSE'S OPINION. PLEASE HAVE REASONS.

#2 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: It's Dovahkiin. Double i, not h ;p

You should include that it's a random encounter and in a dueling hall.

Other than that, would you like to start with a list of gear/abilities?

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#3 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

Character Powers, Abilities, Gear and Feats

Little do some people know, the Dovahkiin is capable of astonishing magical abilities as well as physical.

I will be using some game mechanics to measure magic output. This is a level 81 Dovahkiin, with a Magic capacity of 510.

Various magical resistances:

Resistance to magic:

As a Breton, the Dovahkiin has a natural 25% resistance to offensive magic. Also, through mastery of Alteration magic, he gains a further 30% resistance.

Base resistance to magic - 55%

The Dovahkiin is also able to absorb magical attacks that land (absorb, not resist), replenishing his own magic reserves.

Through mastery of Alteration magic, the Dovahkiin gains the ability to absorb 30% of incoming magical attacks.

Base magic absorption - 30%

The Dovahkiin, by taking a "Resist magic" potion, will give his base resistance to magic a 20% boost for sixty seconds.

Extended resistance to magic - 75%

As a Breton, the Dovahkiin also has a racial ability called "Dragonhide" which allows him to absorb 50% of incoming spells for sixty seconds.

Extended magic absorption - 80%

Other Passive abilities:

Through mastery of Restoration magic, the Dovahkiin regenerates magic 50% faster.

Also through mastering restoration, he is capable of an ability called "Avoid Death", which, once per day, allows him to restore half of his health once his overall health drops below 10%.

Through mastery of Illusion magic, all spells cast are silent.

Gear

The Dovahkiin will be dressed in enchanted robes, hood, gloves, boots, ring and necklace.

Through mastery of enchanting, the Dovahkiin is able to enchant his gear to the following specs:

Hood, robes, ring and necklace - enchanted to fortify Destruction and Restoration magic by up to 29%. This means that it will cost 29% less to cast spells from those magic schools for each enchanted piece of gear. Since I have four of these enchanted pieces of gear, the Dovahkiin essentially will never have to spend magic to cast Destruction or Restoration spells.

Boots - are enchanted with muffle (which makes footsteps completely silent) and resist fire (resists fire and fire magic by up to 20%)

Gloves - fortify his magic by 72 points (bringing him to a total of 582).

Miraaks staff - Sprays a wall of writhing tentacles on any surface. These tentacles slowly poison and stagger any who pass through them. Effective for area denial.

Potion of Resist Magic - Increases magic resistance by 20% for 60 seconds.

Potion of Magic Regeneration - Regenerate magic 50% faster for 60 seconds.

Potion of Restore Magic - Restores magic reserves fully.

Destruction Magic

Destruction magic is the mastery of creating and manipulating fire, frost and shock magic. There are five levels of spells ranging from Novice to Master (novice taking the least magic to cast, master taking the most. Although, thanks to enchanted gear the Dovahkiin need not worry about casting costs for this school of magic). This novice to master system is the case for all schools of magic. Here are a list of important spells:

Adept level:

Runes. Runes are spells that can be cast on a surface, and when stepped on, release a powerful explosion. These come in variations of fire, frost and shock. They can be cast from a large distance away.

Fireball - An exploding fireball that causes powerful AoE damage.

Ice Storm - A slow, but powerful frost attack that sends a cold storm of ice. It reduces stamina and can bring a target almost to a complete halt.

Expert level:

Thunderbolt - A fast moving, significantly powerful Thunderbolt, that also reduces a targets magic reserves.

Icy Spear - A moderately fast, significantly powerful Spear of Ice. Will also stay inside the target (not causing internal damage), slowing them down significantly.

Incinerate - A moderately fast, significantly powerful blast of fire.

Master level:

Blizzard - Surrounds the caster in a powerful blizzard. Also damages stamina.

Fire Storm - A fiery explosion that surrounds the caster. The closer a target, the more damage they take.

Thunder Storm - Fires a continuous stream of lightning. Also reduces targets magical reserves.

Restoration

Restoration is the art of healing and magical defense. There are not many spells in this school worth mentioning, but two important ones. (Again, thanks to enchanted gear, the Dragonborn can cast an unlimited amount of these spells)

Close wound - Heals self of all injuries. Quick casting.

Greater Ward - Protects the user from offensive spells. Takes one second to fully engage and can be broken with sufficient magical force. (It normally consumes a great amount of magical reserves to preserve a ward, but thanks to enchanted gear, the DB can keep up a protective ward permanently, supposing it isn't broken.)

Alteration

The art of mage armor and altering the world around you, and more. Again, only a few spells worth noting.

Paralyze - Paralyzes the target on impact for 10 seconds.

Ebony Flesh - Grants the user the magical armor equivalent to a very durable metal known as "ebony" for 60 seconds.

Detect Life - Detects living beings. Enemies glow red, neutral beings glow blue.

Illusion

Illusion magic is the art of mind manipulation and deception. Again, only a few notable spells.

Invisibility - Makes the caster fully invisible.

Pacify - Calms target down, ceasing combat, for 60 seconds.

Rout - Causes target to flee in fear for 60 seconds.

Conjuration

The art of summoning from oblivion and necromancy. A few notable spells.

Conjure Dremora Lord - Can summon two ferocious as well as durable Daedric warriors for 60 seconds.

Conjure Fire, Frost and Storm Atronach - Can summon two of any. Fire atronachs are human sized, hovering beings that float and cast fire magic. Will burn when close. When destroyed, cause a fiery explosion. Frost atronachs are large, durable beings composed of ice, who have powerful physical attacks that can stagger opponents from a short distance. Storm atronachs are beings composed of floating rocks and shock magic, which are very durable. They fire storm magic from a distance and also use moderately powerful physical attacks when close.

Shouts

Shouting is an ability used by dragons. It is the dragon language, projected into powerful attacks. The Dragonborn are the select few humans with the soul of a dragon, who can absorb the knowledge and soul of a dragon, and quickly master any and all shouts, as dragons do. After using a shout, the user will have to wait a varying amount of time before he/she can shout again. Notable shouts are:

Aura Whisper - Functions the same as the "detect life" spell. Detects life by showing people as a glowing red light. Lasts ten, twenty or thirty seconds depending on how many words are shouted. One word, 30 second recharge. Two words, 40 second recharge. Three words, 50 second recharge.

Become Ethereal - The Dragonborn becomes spectral (ghost-like) in appearance. For 18 seconds, user will be completely invulnerable. However, if the user attacks in any way, the effect will be undone instantly. Fifty second recharge.

Disarm - Disarms an enemy of whatever weapon/object that is in their hand. (In this instance, a wand.) Forty second recharge.

Ice Form - Freezes target solid in an ice statue state for 30 seconds, while causing minor frost damage. Target will come loose if attacked sufficiently. Two minute recharge.

Marked for Death - Causes target to lose health over time, and lowers the durability of any armor. Forty second recharge.

Soul Tear - Causes heavy damage by ripping the soul out of an opponent, likely resulting in death. Ninety second recharge.

Unrelenting Force - "FUS RO DAH".. I'm sure a lot of you are familiar with this one. For those who aren't; it sends the target flying through the air. Forty five second recharge.

Whirlwind Sprint - User sprints a short but relatively far distance at extreme speeds. Thirty five second recharge.

Notable feats

The Dragonborn is no stranger to facing powerful magic users in combat. In his world, he is one of the most powerful of them all, boasting mastery of the ability to "shout" as dragons do.

The Dragonborn is the ultimate Dragon slayer. He is able to absorb their knowledge, and their soul, the only way to permanently kill the immortal beasts. Dragons are powerful magic users. In ancient times they rules over all of mankind. It was not until the gods themselves gifted man with "the voice" (the ability to shout) that they were able to really fight back against the dragons and claim a place in the world.

The Dragonborn, impressively, has defeated many, many Dragons. He will have had to kill dozens at the very least to acquire the knowledge necessary to master shouting. Not only this, but two dragons the Dragonborn bested in combat, chose to lend their services to him whenever he needed. Dragons don't only fear the Dragonborn, they respect him. The most powerful Dragon of all is Alduin, the World Eater. He is the son of the dragon god Akatosh, the first dragon. There are prophecies of him devouring Mundus (Elder Scrolls earth) and all of mankind. He is a planet buster at the very least. He was never defeated until the Dragonborn faced him. He was bested by him on two separate occasions, seemingly killed permanently on the second, when he was defeated in Sovengard (the resting place of honored men) after collecting all of his power.

Aside from this, the Dragonborn also defeated Harkon, the oldest and most powerful Vampire Lord in known existence, preventing him from bringing a prophecy to fruition that would mean a permanent night.

Also, notably, the Dragonborn has defeated one of his own kind. Miraak, the first Dragonborn, attempted to take over the island of Solstheim and later the rest of Mundus, through the aid of the Daedric prince (evil god) Haermaus Mora. He was a powerful mage, and cruel sorcerer.

The Dragonborn has faced rogue mages, powerful necromancers, vampire masters, the Thalmor, and more notably, Dragon Priests. Dragon Priests, the servants of the Dragons, are equipped with powerful magic staffs and unique masks. Some of the most powerful magic users in Skyrim, the 15 dragon priests are to be feared and avoided.. well, by anyone that isn't the Dragonborn, that is.

Lastly, the Dragonborn rose to the position of Arch Mage at the college of Winterhold, after averting a crisis that could have caused wide scale damage to all of Skyrim. The Psijic order, a group of powerful, High Elf mages/monks, prophesied that the Dragonborn was the only one capable of stopping this disaster from happening, and he pulled through. It is a rare honor to even be contacted by the Psijic order (who spend most of their, seemingly wiped off the face of the earth), much less "chosen" by them.

That's basically the run down of the magical side of things concerning the Dragonborn. I'll have an opening strategy up shortly.

@thedarklordpandamonium

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#5 Posted by Cooldes (3925 posts) - - Show Bio
#6 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords:

Remember though, morals are off. Does Dovahkiin get any special rage bonuses in the new DLC?

@cooldes:

Ys

#7 Posted by dondave (34590 posts) - - Show Bio

This should be good

#8 Posted by Bossmoss4l (242 posts) - - Show Bio

Slightly disappointed so far ._. was expecting more Lore feats than actual game stats.

#9 Edited by Cooldes (3925 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: sorry again, but i was just wondering if dragon aspect is allowed, and if staves are allowed, also with gear, can you use any gear because ahzidals ring of arcana gives you extra destructing spells, and dragon priests masks help magic etc. sorry again for interruption i was just wondering before this starts

#10 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium:

Rage bonuses? Not unless you're an orc ;p

@bossmoss4l:

Honestly, in the past I've looked around for lore but couldn't find much. PM a link to where I can get a better look? I'll mostly be using gameplay feats, however.

@cooldes: There will be voting at the end. Dragon Aspect is allowed but it won't be a terrible help here. Might throw it on later. I've already chosen my gear. It's alright, just try not to comment on the battle itself too much.

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#11 Posted by Dratini1331 (6989 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords: There's a dragon shout that's basically expelliarmus =3

#12 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio
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#13 Edited by reikai (4109 posts) - - Show Bio

The Dovahkiin also has other spells that are limited one use before needing to interact with the All-Maker Stones on Solstheim.

From the Tree Stone he gains "Root of Power", a spell that reduces the cost of all magical spells cast by 75% for 60sec.

From the beast stone he gains "Conjure Werebear" where, as one might guess, he summons forth a Werebear (like a werewolf, only a bear) to his aid for 60sec or until it is defeated.

From the Earth Stone he gains "Bones of the Earth", which shields him from physical harm and negates 80% of all physical damage for 30sec.

From the Wind Stone he acquires "North Wind" which strikes the target with a fierce blizzard (doing 20pt of frost damage per second for 20 sec, plus stamina damage)

From the Sun Stone he gains "Sun Flare" which creates a fiery explosion around the caster, doing more damage to those the closer they are to its epicenter.

From the Water Stone he has "Waters of Life" which will restore the vitality of the caster and his allies (by 200 points).

The spells granted by the All-Maker stones greatly resemble Master Level spells as cast through the various schools, and while the drawback being they can be used only once before needing to interact with the stones again, the greatest benefit is the fact they are cast instantly and cost no magicka to unleash.

And yet there is still more, for the Dovahkiin has further spells and powers to unleash, which have been acquired from the Black Books, tomes of esoteric knowledge created by the Daedric Prince, Hermaeus Mora, that have driven many to mindless from the act of interacting with them, as the Black Books forcibly draw the readers consciousness from their body and drag it into Apocrypha, the realm belonging to the Daedric Prince that created those texts.

Of those that did not fall to madness, many did not return alive, becoming consumed by their thirst for knowledge, they became twisted abominations within this realm of forbidden knowledge and secrets, becoming the many-tentacled Seekers, whose very hunger for knowledge is deadly to any who would venture there.

#14 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

Alright, let's start this up!

Harry James "The Boy Who Lived" "I beat Voldemort" "The Chosen One" "I beat Voldemort again" "I beat Voldemort again" "I traveled through time" "The Heir of Slytherin" "Probably the Heir of Gryffindor" "Triwizard Champion" "I beat Voldemort again" "I beat Voldemort again" Potter

Equipment

-Firebolt

Since we're in the Great Hall, this 0-150 in 10 seconds baby is going to be flying all around, carrying one Harry Potter on it!

It's got state-of-the-art Braking Charms, superb control...I could go on about this things for hours really, but seeing as Harry punked a dragon on it, well...suffice it to say he'll be moving around a lot more than the Dragonborn.

-Invisibility Cloak

It's a cloak.

It makes him invisible.

#notmuchelsetoit

-Wand

It's bitchin'.

-Felix Felicis

Felix Felicis, when drunk, gives Harry unnatural precognition and luck.

Precog: Harry was able to know exactly what to do in order to make Slughorn give up his memories, using talent and charm far beyond his capabilities

Luck: Ron, Ginny, and others drank the Felix during the Battle of Book 6, and were unharmed throughout the battle, because everything missed them.

-Fire Protection Potion

It protects Harry from fire. :|

-Girding Potion

This one is only in the games, but it doubles Harry's endurance. Pretty cool.

-Phoenix Tears

I CAST HEAL! Heals everything and its mother.

-Sword of Gryffindor

Imbued with Basilisk Venom, a cut from it is as destructive as skyscraper-sized fireball monsters, and will kill within a minute with loss of motor control after a few seconds. The only cure is Phoenix Tears

-Fawkes

Instant block; flies in front of stuff all the time and saves Harry

-Shield Hat

Instant shield

Natural Abilities

Alright all you non-Potterheads.

You wanna know WHY nobody just picks up a gun and kills Voldemort?!

It's because...

"With the force of a bullet, the wad of chewing gum shot out of the keyhole and straight down Peeves's left nostril; he whirled right way up and zoomed away, cursing."

And guess what?

According to Pottermore, it was one of the spells that had a great 'vogue' during the Marauder's Era, though it hurt little more than a flick.

Let me emphasize that:

a BULLET hurt about as much as a FLICK

And guess what? When questioned about this on Pottermore, J.K. Rowling just smiled knowingly!

Buuut if that's not enough, Neville Longbottom was dropped on his head from 2 stories up -a fall which would have killed literally every single human being on the planet, yet one to which his magic simply was like 'lolno' and caused him to bounce.

Not enough?

Harry regularly survives four-hundred-foot falls in Quidditch with little more than broken bones, when by all scientific logic he should literally be paste on the ground.

TL;DR Harry is a brick

Other than that, he's also incredibly fast with the natural abilities of a Seeker and someone who regularly exercises about four hours a day in Quidditch season. Fast enough to dodge basically anything and everything thrown at him.

Spells

Ah, yes -the humdinger.

For the purposes of this, we're going to be assuming Harry can use all the spells in the series, and here's a list of notable ones:

Accio: Pulls anything towards him. Harry doesn't have to know the name and it can be miles and miles away; it'll come to him.

Aguamenti: Water jets.

Alarte Ascendare: Throws things into the air

Some Random Spell Voldemort Couldn't Block: A spell which apparently couldn't be blocked by anything except a physical shield. I admittedly have no idea how this differs from Avada Kedavra, which can also only be blocked by physical shields, but...er...e_e

Some Other Random Spell: A spell used by Dolohov in the Ministry of Magic, a silent slash. Does more damage when spoken, but was still enough to cause internal damage.

Aresto Momentum: Stops the velocity of moving things

Arrow-Shooting Spell: Shoots arrows. Not enchanted arrows, like, actually arrows from the wand, because they went through a Protego.

Avada Kedavra: Magic resistance? LOL! Avada Kedavra laughs at magic resistance. All you can do is throw a physical object in front of it.

Avifors: Turns other people into birds. Used by some of the antagonists in the games.

Bombarda Maxima: Building-busting explosions.

Cantis: Causes the target to burst into song. No shouts for you!

Cascading Jinx: Beats up people.

Cheering Charm: Makes you high.

Collosho: Makes you unable to move via sticking your boots to the ground.

Confringo: Heat-based explosions

Confundo: Makes you confused af.

Conjunctivitis: Makes you blind, used by Krum on a dragon.

Crucio: Pain.

Defodio: Apparently gouges away enormous chunks of rock big enough for a dragon's wingspan.

Depulso: Throws things in a direction

Deprimo: Downwards pressure explosion

Descendo: Makes things fall down

Diffindo: Cuts people in half

Diminuendo: Makes you shrink.

Ducklifors: Turns you into a duck.

Duro: Makes things hard.

Episkey: Heals minor wounds

Epoximise: Glues your hands together

Everte Statum: Throws you away

Expelliarmus: Causes things to fly away, can knock people out.

Expulso: Pressure-based explosion, building-busting

Fianto Duri: Creates kinetic energy barrier if used on shield spells

Fiendfyre: Creates hundred-foot-tall giant fire chimaras and dragons.

Firestorm: Creates random fire.

Finite Incantatem: Cancels spell effects.

Finger-Remover: Removes your fingers.

Flagrante: Makes things burn when you touch them.

Flipendo Tria: Pushes people back via tornado

Fumos Duo: Creates powerful cloud of smoke

Geminio: Creates a copy

Glacius Tria: Turns you into ice, 'near absolute zero' according to the video games

Immobulus: Makes you immobile.

Impedimenta: Knocks you back, freezes you, knocks you out, etc.

Imperio: Makes you do whatever I want.

Impenetrable Charm: Creates incredibly powerful barriers, strong enough to withstand tens of thousands of psi

Incarcerous: Ties you up with ropes.

Incendio: Burn.

Inflatus: Makes you swell up.

Jelly-Mind Jinx: Makes you really stupid and loopy

Knee-Reversal: Reverses your knees

Langlock: Glues your tongue to the top of your mouth.

Legilimens: Miiiiindraaaaape

Levicorpus: Dangles you by your ankles

Leg-Locker Curse: Locks your legs together, making you fall over

Obliviate: Miiiiiindraaaaape

Obscuro: Puts a blindfold over your eyes

Orbis: Sucks you into the ground

Partis Temporis: Specialized shield-breaking curse

Petrificus Totalus: No motion!

Protego/Totalum/Maxima/Horriblis/assorted shield spells: Powerful enough to disintegrate people who have magic shielding on. Stops all kinetic energy. Does not let anything pass through except the most powerful curses.

Reductor Curse: Disintegrates people.

Relashio: Whips people.

Sectumsempra: Cuts people.

Voldemort's Random Spell: Goes through shields.

Serpensortia: Summons a snake.

Stupefy: Knocks fools out.

Ventus Tria: Strong enough gust of winds to blow down doors

Waddiwasi: Shoots anything at the target with the force of a bullet. Includes, but is not limited to: Chewing gum, shards of glass.

Wingardium Leviosa: Makes things fly

#15 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium:

"Glacius Tria: Turns you into ice, 'near absolute zero' according to the video games"

Yet I'm not allowed Ice Form? Fishy

Also, didn't know you were allowed firebolt.. ah well, just makes things interesting.

Edit: I'd also like to request a couple more shouts considering how stacked Harry is. I have one similar to Avada Kadavra.

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#16 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@reikai: For the sake of fairness can you not say anything that will affect the battle? I now can't really use anything of what you said.

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#17 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords:

I said 'all of the equipment'. My strategy is to cast a smokescreen, put on the invisibility cloak, and set out the book from book 2 that makes you look at it constantly. Then I win because Dovahkiin has to read forever.

Also, sorry. Lol. You can have the ice shout.

#18 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: That and soul tear. Soul tear basically negates armor/protection and attacks the soul. Instant kill like the killing the curse.

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#19 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio
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#20 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords:

Aw what

But then Dragonborn wins!

Anyhow the book is from book 2. When Harry finds Tom Riddle's diary in the bathroom, Ron warns him about dangerous books, such as a book that, once opened, you couldn't stop reading. You would have to go around doing everything with your face in the book.

#21 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: Not instantly, still has to aim, not miss to avoid cooldown, and it can be negated in the same fashion as other shouts.

So your plan is to throw a book at me, and I'm going to keep reading it forever? I can think of a good number of ways to negate that.

I'm going to lay out my first proper strategy, and I'll edit both my shouts into the powers list, supposing soul tear is okay with you? (considering it's like a diet coke killing curse)

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#22 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords:

Does it actually one shot?

And I'm not throwing a book at you. Harry smokescreens, Cloaks, leaves the book on the ground.

#23 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio
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#24 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio
#25 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: Sweet.

Couple things wrong with your strategy.

1. As soon as your smoke screen goes up, the Dragonborn uses his Aura Whisper shout, which detects life with a glowing red light, even through smoke. So there's nothing he can do to surprise him there.

Reference to the shout: Detects life by showing people as a glowing red light. Lasts ten, twenty or thirty seconds depending on how many words are shouted. Not knowing what to expect, the Dragonborn would use all three words of power, allowing this shout to last for thirty seconds. So that's only fifty seconds of recharge time.

2. As soon as this fight starts the Dragonborn is going invisible himself, except he is both invisible and silent, and you are glowing bright red. Couple of distinct advantages there.

3. If there's a smoke screen the Dragonborn won't be able to even see this book, so unless it has a "badass dragonborn" magnet, he won't have to come across it. I'm also questioning whether or not the Dragonborn will be compelled to read it. I mean for one, he's in the middle of a battle, he's not going to want to read, much less notice a book (through a smokescreen) in the first place. And for two, who says a "muggle" will be as compelled as a wizard to read such a book. They don't share the same behaviours and characteristics as wizards, so I doubt he'll show as much interest as a Potterverse wizard would, unless you can elaborate?

(Also, can you tell me how long the smokescreen lasts?)

Initial Strategy

Step 1:

First things first, you're throwing up a smoke screen, so I'll use the Aura Whisper shout.
Next, the Dragonborn goes invisible himself using illusion magic. In this state his footsteps are silent, he is invisible, and he can cast spells silently, at the cost of becoming visible. That's no biggie, however, as he can just become invisible again as he goes.
The way the fight is currently panning out, Harry is flying around at great speeds on his broomstick, while a smokescreen is up. He's painted as a big red target for the Dragonborn, but Harry has no idea where the Dragonborn is. So while he flies around blindly in the smoke, the DB has a bit of time to decide what he wants to do.
First, he conjures two Storm atronachs at different ends of the room, a good distance away from himself, to confuse Harry. He goes back to being invisible, and should still be invisible to Harry. After all, all he did was cast two silent spells and a third to become invisible again.
Those two atronachs will begin to seek Harry, and once they detect him, they begin attacking him with lightning magic. Shouldn't be hard considering he's zooming around at great speeds. People (and the conjured undead) do have a knack for picking up on SOUND, as well as anything else.
If that's not enough, then here is what the Dragonborn does:

- Gets in position to intercept an unaware Harry.

- Waits for him to line up the shot.

- Releases two Ice Storms to get in Harrys way, hurting, slowing, and crashing him. He won't see it coming. One second nothing will be there, the next, out comes the Dragonborn behind two massive ice storms. Bare in mind this is still powerful Frost magic, not just your average ice storm, so it's going to hurt a bunch. Again, once those are cast (silently), the DB goes back once again to being invisible.

- Harry has crashed at this point, allowing the Dragonborn plenty of time to capitalize. When Harry, oh so sophisticatedly, lands, he will be hit with a barrage of paralyze spells, just to make sure they work. Once he is paralyzed, for ten seconds, it's essentially game over.

- The Dragonborn has a paralyzed Harry Potter, at his mercy. He removes the invisibility cloak, puts it over himself for good measure, commands his atronachs to focus fire on the helpless teenager, and joins in on destroying him with thunderbolts. Every few seconds he'll top up the paralysis spell, in order to prevent Harry from escaping. Soon Harry will literally be disintegrated by the combined shock magic of the DB and his atronachs. He need not even delve into more advanced magics.

- For good measure, the DB also uses Miraaks staff to spray tentacles over Harry, to further damage and incapacitate him.

So, that's one plan debunked.

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#26 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

I do, in fact, know where you are. Homenum Revelio, etc.

Sooo since we're both throwing up smokescreens and going invisible when we can see each other, shall we just say we don't go invisible?

#27 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

I do, in fact, know where you are. Homenum Revelio, etc.

Sooo since we're both throwing up smokescreens and going invisible when we can see each other, shall we just say we don't go invisible?

What's that?

I'm not throwing up a smokescreen, you are. And nope, my strategy still stands, and invisibility will still be a part of my strategy.

Also, how long does the smoke screen last?

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#28 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

What's that?

I'm not throwing up a smokescreen, you are. And nope, my strategy still stands, and invisibility will still be a part of my strategy.

Also, how long does the smoke screen last?

Homenum Revelio? Does literally exactly what your spell does; even if they're invisible, living things become bright red.

Okay. So we're both invisible, yet visible.

Smoke screen lasts a good few minutes.

Though, considering I can now see you, most of your strategy is moot given I can just launch an Avada Kedavra and be done with it, whereas the Dragonborn has never had experience with a 150mph target.

#29 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@i_like_swords said:

What's that?

I'm not throwing up a smokescreen, you are. And nope, my strategy still stands, and invisibility will still be a part of my strategy.

Also, how long does the smoke screen last?

Homenum Revelio? Does literally exactly what your spell does; even if they're invisible, living things become bright red.

Okay. So we're both invisible, yet visible.

Smoke screen lasts a good few minutes.

Though, considering I can now see you, most of your strategy is moot given I can just launch an Avada Kedavra and be done with it, whereas the Dragonborn has never had experience with a 150mph target.

Fair enough, fair enough.

We're invisible yet visible, at the start, that is!

Okay, for one. The Dragonborn causally dodges arrows and lightning magic, so I think at least the first spell will be difficult to land.

For two, hows Harry going to accurately aim at 150mph speeds? While having two ice storms shot at him.

Furthermore, I have my magical ward that I can keep up permanently, while casting a spell in the other hand. So as soon as Harry starts casting, the ward goes up, protects the DB, and the ice storms follow.

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#30 Edited by PrinceAragorn1 (16131 posts) - - Show Bio
#31 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@thedarklordpandamonium: Expanding on what I said on my last post..

I mentioned that the DB is a casual arrow dodger, which is true. He is shown to be able to with relative ease sidestep arrows even after being shot.

The average speed of an arrow being fired from a longbow is between 237.2 - 360 km/h. That, in mph, is 147.4 - 223.69 mph.

Not only does this mean the Dragonborn has reacted to projectiles moving at your speeds and above, it means he's likely reacted to arrows that well exceed the previous statistic, given the varying higher qualities of bows in Skyrim, such as Elven, Glass, Dwarven and Daedric.

There's more. A Red-tailed Hawks top speed caps in at 121.7 mph. Hawks are very common in Skyrim, often targets of hunters.

When a dragon was first sighted, a Whiterun guard told the Jarl "It was fast! Faster than anything I've ever seen!"

So, what does this tell us? That the Dragonborn routinely takes on and tags dragons, whose speed at the very least matches, or likely, exceeds Harrys broom. Seeing as the Dragonborn has to tag these Dragons with shouts, spells, and arrows, there is no doubt in my mind he could tag Harry with an Ice Storm, much faster Shock magic, or a shout mid flight. Not only this, but the Dragonborn is fully capable of reacting to Harry.

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#32 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

For two, hows Harry going to accurately aim at 150mph speeds? While having two ice storms shot at him.

He does broomstick combat literally all the time. He has been on a broomstick, 4 hours a day, 7 days a week, 9 months a year, for 6 years IN SCHOOL and according to J.K. could have played for Puddlemere United if he had supported it.

Furthermore, I have my magical ward that I can keep up permanently, while casting a spell in the other hand. So as soon as Harry starts casting, the ward goes up, protects the DB, and the ice storms follow.

Protego Totalum, Maxima, etc. etc. Ice Storms will do nothing, as in the games even Glacius Tria bounces off of all the Protegos.

I mentioned that the DB is a casual arrow dodger, which is true. He is shown to be able to with relative ease sidestep arrows even after being shot.

The average speed of an arrow being fired from a longbow is between 237.2 - 360 km/h. That, in mph, is 147.4 - 223.69 mph.

Not only does this mean the Dragonborn has reacted to projectiles moving at your speeds and above, it means he's likely reacted to arrows that well exceed the previous statistic, given the varying higher qualities of bows in Skyrim, such as Elven, Glass, Dwarven and Daedric.

Which would be nice, if Skyrim bows were longbows. And they're not. After 60-65 yards they deal 0 damage, but longbows are typically 3-4 times that in range. Skyrim bows are reflex bows, based on their velocity, etc. which fire at more around 80 mph. Impressive, but barely half of Harry's speed.

There's more. A Red-tailed Hawks top speed caps in at 121.7 mph. Hawks are very common in Skyrim, often targets of hunters.

When a dragon was first sighted, a Whiterun guard told the Jarl "It was fast! Faster than anything I've ever seen!"

So, what does this tell us? That the Dragonborn routinely takes on and tags dragons, whose speed at the very least matches, or likely, exceeds Harrys broom. Seeing as the Dragonborn has to tag these Dragons with shouts, spells, and arrows, there is no doubt in my mind he could tag Harry with an Ice Storm, much faster Shock magic, or a shout mid flight. Not only this, but the Dragonborn is fully capable of reacting to Harry.

Their top speeds, yes -when DIVING. Soaring, red-tailed-hawks are more like 30mph, 40mph if they're being pursued by say an eagle. So the dragons would be minimally say 50 mph, a generous estimate. There is absolutely nothing that points to to them being anywhere near Harry's 150mph.


But now I'm going to step off the defensive.

What's Harry's plan?

Well, Harry will throw down a smokescreen or some Peruvian Instant Darkness Powder, both are pretty much the same, then drink the Felix, Fire Protection, Girding, the Protegos, and throw on the cloak. Meanwhile, the Dragonborn is using his Aura Whisper shout, and now Harry shoots out on his Firebolt at 150mph.

Due to the combination of him being 3x as fast as anything the Dragonborn has encountered (and the Dragonborn still has trouble tagging dragons) AND the Felix which makes you nearly impossible to hit, Harry will easily be dodging everything.

But say they fight for 6 hours (lol) and Felix wears off, and Harry can actually be hit.

The Dragonborn's Fire spells are moot, something he'll quickly realize, and even the most powerful ice spell in the HP games, Glacius Tria, slides off of Protega Totalum + Protega Maxima -assuming it hits, which it won't.

Lightning would effective, if numerous Wizards hadn't tanked lightning and only been slightly frazzled, or a lightning bolt from the Elder flipping Wand hadn't bounced off of Harry's Protego, which was strong enough to stop everything but the Unforgivables.

On the offensive front, Harry is going to be firing an incredibly versatile load of spells. Obscuro will stop the Dragonborn from seeing, Langlock from shouting, Glacius Tria, Flipendo Duo, firestorms, Defodios, Avada Kedavra and Dumbledore's Avada Kedavra, Transfigurations, the list goes on and on.

The only thing Dragonborn has which is even CLOSE to Avada Kedavra is Soul Tear, which only does 300 damage. As I've already established wizards only feel stings from lets say an average caliber bullet, one which would penetrate the coat of a Cave Bear which has 450 health. So on the low end lets say wizards have 900 health, doubled to 1800 via the girding potion.

This is more than enough to tank Soul Tears or really any other spell the Dragonborn has, whereas a single Avada Kedavra (verbal) or Dumbledore's Unblockable (nvbl) would put down the Dragonborn.

TL;DR Harry is faster than Dovahkiin, can easily dodge his attacks which will miss due to Felix, and can one-shot him while tanking.

#33 Posted by Chaos Prime (10842 posts) - - Show Bio

This should be epic :)

#34 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

Protego Totalum, Maxima, etc. etc. Ice Storms will do nothing, as in the games even Glacius Tria bounces off of all the Protegos.

Can you actually provide more clarity about the spells you're using? I don't know them all off by heart. I can't counter something I have no understanding of.

Which would be nice, if Skyrim bows were longbows. And they're not. After 60-65 yards they deal 0 damage, but longbows are typically 3-4 times that in range. Skyrim bows are reflex bows, based on their velocity, etc. which fire at more around 80 mph. Impressive, but barely half of Harry's speed.

I'm not really sure where you're getting that from to be honest. There is a bow literally labelled as a "Longbow". The 0 damage at a certain range is purely down to game mechanics, as arrows are still seen to go further than that distance in game and are still at great speeds. If you fire an arrow into the air you will see it go a giant distance, much more than 65 yards.

Please tell me how you measured the velocity of Skyrim bows? "Based on their velocity ect" is pretty vague, whereas I've given real statistics. So yeah, show me the actual base for these measurements and I'll believe you. And again, they are "longbows", not "reflex bows."

Their top speeds, yes -when DIVING. Soaring, red-tailed-hawks are more like 30mph, 40mph if they're being pursued by say an eagle. So the dragons would be minimally say 50 mph, a generous estimate. There is absolutely nothing that points to to them being anywhere near Harry's 150mph.

Again, wrong. Not at their top speeds or while diving. You know the guard I mentioned that talked about the dragons speed?

Yeah, he also witnessed the dragon kill several guards and destroy a watch tower, "faster than anything" he had ever seen before.

So the dragon demonstrated combat speed faster than a Hawk, native to Skyrim, which comparably moves at an average speed of 120+ mph.

"when diving may exceed 120 mph (190 km/h)." Source - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red-tailed_Hawk#Flight

Diving, meaning chasing another bird (since they are birds of prey) or avoiding a hunter.

Dragons were described as faster than this common bird. My measurements are valid. Where are yours?

What's Harry's plan?

Well, Harry will throw down a smokescreen or some Peruvian Instant Darkness Powder, both are pretty much the same, then drink the Felix, Fire Protection, Girding, the Protegos, and throw on the cloak. Meanwhile, the Dragonborn is using his Aura Whisper shout, and now Harry shoots out on his Firebolt at 150mph.

One thing.

1. He's going to have his hands full juggling casting a smoke screen, drinking 3 potions, spell casting further, putting on a cloak, and taking off. The Dragonborn has no such issue. He sticks on aura whisper by shouting, starts an early assault on Harry using powerful Thunder Bolts while Harry juggles three of his potions and spell casting, and injures him right off the bat. Alternatively, or more suitably, the Dragonborn can cast a paralyze spell in conjunction with his Thunder Bolt. You've made Harry dangerously vulnerable right from the beginning.

Due to the combination of him being 3x as fast as anything the Dragonborn has encountered (and the Dragonborn still has trouble tagging dragons) AND the Felix which makes you nearly impossible to hit, Harry will easily be dodging everything.

But say they fight for 6 hours (lol) and Felix wears off, and Harry can actually be hit.

The Dragonborn's Fire spells are moot, something he'll quickly realize, and even the most powerful ice spell in the HP games, Glacius Tria, slides off of Protega Totalum + Protega Maxima -assuming it hits, which it won't.

Lightning would effective, if numerous Wizards hadn't tanked lightning and only been slightly frazzled, or a lightning bolt from the Elder flipping Wand hadn't bounced off of Harry's Protego, which was strong enough to stop everything but the Unforgivables.

Harry isn't going to be 3 times faster. The Dragonborn routinely uses the Dragonrend shout on moving dragons in order to ground them. He'll have no problem keeping up with Harry. He won't have drunk Felix by the time he's been zapped.

A potion that makes you unhittable for 6 hours? You didn't key that in when we arranged the match. You only said it gives a form of precog and makes you hard to hit. Nevertheless, he won't be able to drink it in time.

Good thing he doesn't need to use fire spells, and likely won't anyway. Again, you need to actually clarify the spells you're using and how/when they would be used. I'm assuming you meant while Harry was on broom.

Tanking conventional lightning isn't the same as tanking magical lightning. Again, actually talk about the "Protego" and can I also see a source for these durability feats?

On the offensive front, Harry is going to be firing an incredibly versatile load of spells. Obscuro will stop the Dragonborn from seeing, Langlock from shouting, Glacius Tria, Flipendo Duo, firestorms, Defodios, Avada Kedavra and Dumbledore's Avada Kedavra, Transfigurations, the list goes on and on.

The only thing Dragonborn has which is even CLOSE to Avada Kedavra is Soul Tear, which only does 300 damage. As I've already established wizards only feel stings from lets say an average caliber bullet, one which would penetrate the coat of a Cave Bear which has 450 health. So on the low end lets say wizards have 900 health, doubled to 1800 via the girding potion.

This is more than enough to tank Soul Tears or really any other spell the Dragonborn has, whereas a single Avada Kedavra (verbal) or Dumbledore's Unblockable (nvbl) would put down the Dragonborn.

TL;DR Harry is faster than Dovahkiin, can easily dodge his attacks which will miss due to Felix, and can one-shot him while tanking.

All of these spells which can easily be side stepped or blocked using a protective ward. Besides, has Harry shown any combat in which he effectively uses all of these spells in combination? It's one thing to be taught a diverse set of skills, but actually using them in combination in combat is far different.

Woah woah woah. So it's going to be like that is it?

You classify a Skyrim "longbow" as a mere "reflex bow", yet when it comes to Skyrim wildlife we're suddenly back to normal earth animals? Sorry, but you can't pick and choose what is comparable to real life and what is unique to the game based on your desired situation.

Newsflash, Skyrim cave bears aren't the same as a North American grizzly bear. They are far more durable, and are able to contend with wildlife such as Saber Tooth tigers, trolls and more. They can take several arrows, magical spells and sword slashes, and to a degree can resist mind manipulation. They are way above the league of any earth wildlife. Besides, you haven't even given a workable calculation for how you give a wizard a health rating of "900". What, so because a Wizard can take a low caliber bullet, and because a bear who likely also can has 450 health in game, that translate to Harry having double that? You're just making stuff up now.

If you had a feat of Harry tanking 3 arrows, and a cave bear dying from 3 arrows of the same quality, that would be a workable formula. Yours however, wasn't.

Soul Trap should be sufficient to kill a weakened Harry. He may tank it at full health, but not after being attacked sufficiently. I'll get onto that.

Avada Kadavra wouldn't get past a magical ward, nor would Dumbledores spell. They can also be sidestepped or avoided altogether by the fifty second mark of the fight, since the dragonborn can become ethereal by shouting one word.

Now, I'll go on the offensive.

Step 1 - Harry casts his smoke screen. The Dragonborn whispers aura whisper. Harry fumbles around in the smoke castin defensive spells, drinking 3 potions, putting his cloak on, and preparing to take off.

- The Dragonborn looks at the glowing red light, points his paralyze and Thunderbolt spells at it, and releases.

- Harry is paralyzed and shocked.

- The Dragonborn capitalizes on Harrys paralyzed state, removing any gear from him, such as his dandy Felix potion, and finishes him off.

- He does this in a number of ways. Keeps him paralyzed while allowing his storm atronachs to attack with their shock magic. Uses a master level shock spell to completely obliterate Harry. Casts a wall of tentacles over Harry to poison and disorientate (supposing he comes out of paralysis). When his shout recharges, casts Soul Tear, effectively finishing the job.

Also, some distinct advantages the Dovahkiin poses over Harry:

- The Dragonborn has a resistance to magic of 55%, 75% if a potion is taken.

- The Dragonborn will absorb in 30% (in excess of this if the spell hits a ward) of all offensive magic, replenishing his own. For sixty seconds at any given time, he can absorb 80%.

- The Dragonborn is invisible through magic. Harry is invisible through a cloak. What happens when the cloak is blasted by magic? It comes off. Also, you haven't really cleared up exactly how your detect life spell works.

- The Dragonborns spells are cast silently, whereas yours make a loud noise and some have to be spoken beforehand. This gives me a further edge in stealth given the smoke screen. I'll know when you go to cast a spell, but you won't.

- The Dragonborn can tank at least one Avada Kadavra through his Avoid Death ability. It allows him to regenerate up to half health upon his total health dropping below 10%. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. But you won't be fooling me twice, even supposing you do land one killing curse this match, nevermind the second.

@thedarklordpandamonium

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#35 Edited by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

Protego Totalum, Maxima, etc. etc. Ice Storms will do nothing, as in the games even Glacius Tria bounces off of all the Protegos.

Can you actually provide more clarity about the spells you're using? I don't know them all off by heart. I can't counter something I have no understanding of.

They are defensive spells. Glacius Tria is the most powerful offensive spell.

Which would be nice, if Skyrim bows were longbows. And they're not. After 60-65 yards they deal 0 damage, but longbows are typically 3-4 times that in range. Skyrim bows are reflex bows, based on their velocity, etc. which fire at more around 80 mph. Impressive, but barely half of Harry's speed.

I'm not really sure where you're getting that from to be honest. There is a bow literally labelled as a "Longbow". The 0 damage at a certain range is purely down to game mechanics, as arrows are still seen to go further than that distance in game and are still at great speeds. If you fire an arrow into the air you will see it go a giant distance, much more than 65 yards.

I meant that longbows can puncture armor at 180-200 yards but go much further.

Please tell me how you measured the velocity of Skyrim bows? "Based on their velocity ect" is pretty vague, whereas I've given real statistics. So yeah, show me the actual base for these measurements and I'll believe you. And again, they are "longbows", not "reflex bows."

Based off their design, no. All skyrim bows look like either reflex bows or recurve bows other than the basic longbow.

Their top speeds, yes -when DIVING. Soaring, red-tailed-hawks are more like 30mph, 40mph if they're being pursued by say an eagle. So the dragons would be minimally say 50 mph, a generous estimate. There is absolutely nothing that points to to them being anywhere near Harry's 150mph.

Again, wrong. Not at their top speeds or while diving. You know the guard I mentioned that talked about the dragons speed?

Yeah, he also witnessed the dragon kill several guards and destroy a watch tower, "faster than anything" he had ever seen before.

So the dragon demonstrated combat speed faster than a Hawk, native to Skyrim, which comparably moves at an average speed of 120+ mph.

"when diving may exceed 120 mph (190 km/h)." Source - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red-tailed_Hawk#Flight

Diving, meaning chasing another bird (since they are birds of prey) or avoiding a hunter.

Dragons were described as faster than this common bird. My measurements are valid. Where are yours?

No, diving as in 'diving down to earth peregrine falcon style'. Hawks don't generally do this, they chase other birds via...well, flying after them. Also, the speed for diving is based off of terminal velocity for a hawk; if they were incredibly high up and a dragon was right on top of them perhaps they'd reach this speed, but avoiding hunters? Please. Hawks do not move at an average speed of 120+mph, their maximum speed is 122 mph including gravity and diving like a ROCK.

Also, you are basing your argument off of something a random guard said, from my experience in-game dragons aren't generally that much faster than hawks which again soar at 40 mph max.

What's Harry's plan?

Well, Harry will throw down a smokescreen or some Peruvian Instant Darkness Powder, both are pretty much the same, then drink the Felix, Fire Protection, Girding, the Protegos, and throw on the cloak. Meanwhile, the Dragonborn is using his Aura Whisper shout, and now Harry shoots out on his Firebolt at 150mph.

One thing.

1. He's going to have his hands full juggling casting a smoke screen, drinking 3 potions, spell casting further, putting on a cloak, and taking off. The Dragonborn has no such issue. He sticks on aura whisper by shouting, starts an early assault on Harry using powerful Thunder Bolts while Harry juggles three of his potions and spell casting, and injures him right off the bat. Alternatively, or more suitably, the Dragonborn can cast a paralyze spell in conjunction with his Thunder Bolt. You've made Harry dangerously vulnerable right from the beginning.

Smoke screen or Peruvian Instant Darkness Powders are basically instant. If they meet up the Dragonborn would go for magic, Harry would do that. After the Dragonborn realized what was going on, he'd do an Aura Whisper shout, and then maybe attack. Harry drinking potions is a third of a second, he's pulled the cloak over him in less than a second in the movies, and the spells are another second. The Dragonborn is recovering from the solid black and using his shout, which is a few seconds.

Harry's not vulnerable at all, they're spending the same amount of time on initial preparations.

Due to the combination of him being 3x as fast as anything the Dragonborn has encountered (and the Dragonborn still has trouble tagging dragons) AND the Felix which makes you nearly impossible to hit, Harry will easily be dodging everything.

But say they fight for 6 hours (lol) and Felix wears off, and Harry can actually be hit.

The Dragonborn's Fire spells are moot, something he'll quickly realize, and even the most powerful ice spell in the HP games, Glacius Tria, slides off of Protega Totalum + Protega Maxima -assuming it hits, which it won't.

Lightning would effective, if numerous Wizards hadn't tanked lightning and only been slightly frazzled, or a lightning bolt from the Elder flipping Wand hadn't bounced off of Harry's Protego, which was strong enough to stop everything but the Unforgivables.

Harry isn't going to be 3 times faster. The Dragonborn routinely uses the Dragonrend shout on moving dragons in order to ground them. He'll have no problem keeping up with Harry. He won't have drunk Felix by the time he's been zapped.

Moving dragons are 50mph max, given that hawks cruising along are generously half the speed of a dragon at 20 mph. Also, Harry drinks Felix in a third of a second, the Dragonborn takes two seconds to say his Aura Whisper spell.

A potion that makes you unhittable for 6 hours? You didn't key that in when we arranged the match. You only said it gives a form of precog and makes you hard to hit. Nevertheless, he won't be able to drink it in time.

Yes, it...makes you hard to hit and gives you precog. All these potions have a pretty long duration. And it would take him but a second to drink them.

Good thing he doesn't need to use fire spells, and likely won't anyway. Again, you need to actually clarify the spells you're using and how/when they would be used. I'm assuming you meant while Harry was on broom.

Tanking conventional lightning isn't the same as tanking magical lightning. Again, actually talk about the "Protego" and can I also see a source for these durability feats?

By likely won't, you mean...what? The Dragonborn's going to fire off a fire spell, which would be moot. It's not like he has full knowledge, and yes these spells are from a broom.

Why wouldn't tanking conventional lightning be the same as tanking magical lightning? Kind of moot, anyways, since it wouldn't get through a Protego combo. What do you want to know about them, BTW?

On the offensive front, Harry is going to be firing an incredibly versatile load of spells. Obscuro will stop the Dragonborn from seeing, Langlock from shouting, Glacius Tria, Flipendo Duo, firestorms, Defodios, Avada Kedavra and Dumbledore's Avada Kedavra, Transfigurations, the list goes on and on.

The only thing Dragonborn has which is even CLOSE to Avada Kedavra is Soul Tear, which only does 300 damage. As I've already established wizards only feel stings from lets say an average caliber bullet, one which would penetrate the coat of a Cave Bear which has 450 health. So on the low end lets say wizards have 900 health, doubled to 1800 via the girding potion.

This is more than enough to tank Soul Tears or really any other spell the Dragonborn has, whereas a single Avada Kedavra (verbal) or Dumbledore's Unblockable (nvbl) would put down the Dragonborn.

TL;DR Harry is faster than Dovahkiin, can easily dodge his attacks which will miss due to Felix, and can one-shot him while tanking.

All of these spells which can easily be side stepped or blocked using a protective ward. Besides, has Harry shown any combat in which he effectively uses all of these spells in combination? It's one thing to be taught a diverse set of skills, but actually using them in combination in combat is far different.

Yes. He fires off tons of spells in conjunction, very quickly.

Woah woah woah. So it's going to be like that is it?

You classify a Skyrim "longbow" as a mere "reflex bow", yet when it comes to Skyrim wildlife we're suddenly back to normal earth animals? Sorry, but you can't pick and choose what is comparable to real life and what is unique to the game based on your desired situation.

...what? I'm not sure what bows in Skyrim you're talking about the Dragonborn dodging, but none of them have range equivalent to a longbow, and they all look like either reflex bows or recurve bows (which affects how they fire). I'm assuming everything is equivalent for both worlds.

Newsflash, Skyrim cave bears aren't the same as a North American grizzly bear. They are far more durable, and are able to contend with wildlife such as Saber Tooth tigers, trolls and more. They can take several arrows, magical spells and sword slashes, and to a degree can resist mind manipulation. They are way above the league of any earth wildlife.

Err...regular bears could take several arrows as well...

Besides, you haven't even given a workable calculation for how you give a wizard a health rating of "900". What, so because a Wizard can take a low caliber bullet, and because a bear who likely also can has 450 health in game, that translate to Harry having double that? You're just making stuff up now.

I think you're confusing 'take a low caliber bullet' with 'it's canonical that bullet force only stings wizards as much as a slap'. At that point you'd need armor-piercing rounds to even penetrate skin, which go through bears easily. I'm being generous here.

If you had a feat of Harry tanking 3 arrows, and a cave bear dying from 3 arrows of the same quality, that would be a workable formula. Yours however, wasn't.

Soul Trap should be sufficient to kill a weakened Harry. He may tank it at full health, but not after being attacked sufficiently. I'll get onto that.

Not sure what you mean by weakened, but alright.

Avada Kadavra wouldn't get past a magical ward, nor would Dumbledores spell. They can also be sidestepped or avoided altogether by the fifty second mark of the fight, since the dragonborn can become ethereal by shouting one word.

Avada Kedavra and Dumbledore's Spell go through all magical wards. That's not a rule that's suddenly going to change because the Dragonborn has magical wards; AK at least is confirmed to go through everything. It's unblockable except by physical means, and same with Dumbledore's Spell.

Now, I'll go on the offensive.

Step 1 - Harry casts his smoke screen. The Dragonborn whispers aura whisper. Harry fumbles around in the smoke castin defensive spells, drinking 3 potions, putting his cloak on, and preparing to take off.

Alternatively he drinks all his potions and casts his spell in the same 2-3 second time range as the Dragonborn's recover+Aura Whisper...not sure why you're trying to pretend that Harry's fumbling around.

The rest of this is mostly moot. Though Fawkes would tank anything for Harry. I'm not sure how this paralyze works.

- The Dragonborn is invisible through magic. Harry is invisible through a cloak. What happens when the cloak is blasted by magic? It comes off. Also, you haven't really cleared up exactly how your detect life spell works.

Erm...it...tells you if people are there? What exactly do you want to know? Also, there are 3-4 invisibility spells. Realistically Harry would use one of those, but I'm using the Invisibility Cloak for nostalgia's sake...so say he's under an invisibility spell, it's the same.

- The Dragonborns spells are cast silently, whereas yours make a loud noise and some have to be spoken beforehand. This gives me a further edge in stealth given the smoke screen. I'll know when you go to cast a spell, but you won't.

You realize all spells other than the Unforgivables can be cast nonverbally...right? And for AK I have Dumbledore's Spell.

- The Dragonborn can tank at least one Avada Kadavra through his Avoid Death ability. It allows him to regenerate up to half health upon his total health dropping below 10%. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. But you won't be fooling me twice, even supposing you do land one killing curse this match, nevermind the second.

Um. No. You can't 'tank' an Avada Kedavra. It one-shots you. Avoid Death doesn't stop OHKOs, does it?

@thedarklordpandamonium

#36 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

They are defensive spells. Glacius Tria is the most powerful offensive spell.

Fair enough. So what, they're like a ward, or they are fired at the incoming spell? I get they're defensive but give me an idea of what they look like in combat.

I meant that longbows can puncture armor at 180-200 yards but go much further.

Great..

Based off their design, no. All skyrim bows look like either reflex bows or recurve bows other than the basic longbow.

Considering, as I'll say again, a bow is literally listed as a "LONGBOW", I don't see what your argument is based on here. First, the bows weren't true "longbows" because of their "velocity ect" and now it's because of their design? You haven't even backed up either of these points. You're basically just saying "in my opinion, it doesn't look like a longbow." Newsflash, there is a labelled longbow in game, and it's the most basic bow in the game, meaning all others are more powerful and fire faster and farther. Pretty moot point there. Give it up, they are "longbows."

No, diving as in 'diving down to earth peregrine falcon style'. Hawks don't generally do this, they chase other birds via...well, flying after them. Also, the speed for diving is based off of terminal velocity for a hawk; if they were incredibly high up and a dragon was right on top of them perhaps they'd reach this speed, but avoiding hunters? Please. Hawks do not move at an average speed of 120+mph, their maximum speed is 122 mph including gravity and diving like a ROCK.

Also, you are basing your argument off of something a random guard said, from my experience in-game dragons aren't generally that much faster than hawks which again soar at 40 mph max.

According to my source they dive, otherwise how would they have a measurement for diving speed?

Imagine this. You live in Skyrim. You're a hunter. You see an eagle chasing a hawk. The hawk in an effort to out-maneuver said eagle takes a dive downwards. Likewise, a Hawk see's a dragon coming, dives down and out of the sky as fast as possible and into a tree. It is a defensive maneuver for a bird to take a dive, allowing them to reach great speeds.

I'm basing my argument off main story dialogue. The guard was at a watchtower, and witnessed the dragon kill other men and destroy the watch tower "faster than anything he had ever seen before", which is what he told the Jarl. Face it, Dragons fly faster than birds of prey. They fly much faster than diving Hawk, as the guard pretty much confirmed, capping the dragon at over 120mph at least, which makes it assume they move at similar speeds to Harrys broom, or faster.

Besides all of that, where are your reaction feats?

Smoke screen or Peruvian Instant Darkness Powders are basically instant. If they meet up the Dragonborn would go for magic, Harry would do that. After the Dragonborn realized what was going on, he'd do an Aura Whisper shout, and then maybe attack. Harry drinking potions is a third of a second, he's pulled the cloak over him in less than a second in the movies, and the spells are another second. The Dragonborn is recovering from the solid black and using his shout, which is a few seconds.

Harry's not vulnerable at all, they're spending the same amount of time on initial preparations.

I like how you're dictating what my character would do and how he'd do it.

So the smoke screen is cast "instantly" and also instantly fills the room? (A large dueling room at that). Not buying it.

"If they meet up the Dragonborn would go for magic".. when wouldn't they meet up and when wouldn't they use magic...

Sorry, but honestly this whole paragraph is just a moot point. You're throwing statements like "After the Dragonborn realized what was going on" and "he'd do an aura whisper shout and then maybe attack" as if you know what he will do, and how he'll do it. You stick to what your character will do and I'll respond.

I don't even know, that para is so poorly structured I don't know what to make of it to be honest. So according to you:

- Unknown amount of time to use the smoke screen. We'll say one second to cast. Also, you haven't said how quickly it fills the room, so until you do I'll reserve how the Dragonborn would react.

- Harry won't drink three potions in under a second if it's a third of a second each. He has to unscrew the lid, drink them, and repeat for each one. Doing this as fast as possible would take roughly 3-5 seconds for all 3 potions. I'll be generous and say 3 seconds altogether.

- Pulls the cloak over himself. Roughly one second to put on a cloak.

- One second to cast your chosen defensive spell.

That reaches a grand total of *drum roll here* ..... Six seconds of initial preparations. Minimum. Six seconds to cast a smoke screen, drink three potions, put on a cloak, and cast a defense spell. Probably would take more than six seconds to do all of that realistically. ASIDE FROM THAT, how can you even cast spells with a cloak on. In the films Harry never casted a spell wearing the cloak, much less anything offensive. So explain that one to me.

Now, here's what the Dragonborn would do.

-Fight starts. One second to go invisible.

- Additional second to shout (technically, a quick whisper) aura whisper, since you're immediately smoke screening.

- One second to dual cast lightning magic and paralyze spell.

- We'll generously say a 0.5 seconds for the paralyze spell, and 0.25 seconds for the lightning magic.

That's a total of 3.25 seconds, or slightly exceeding that, for my first offensive spell to reach you (4 seconds for the paralyze to have reached you), whereas you take in excess of 6 seconds for "initial preparations." It's much more handy being able to operate from non-worded magic spells as well as worded shouts in brief succession, opposed to having to pop 3 potions, throw on a cloak, and cast extra worded spells just to have a solid gameplan.

Also, baring in mind at this point you won't have even had time to cast a detect life spell, meaning I'll be invisible and you won't be. Well.. you will also be paralyzed, so there's that.

Yes. He fires off tons of spells in conjunction, very quickly.

Proof?

By likely won't, you mean...what? The Dragonborn's going to fire off a fire spell, which would be moot. It's not like he has full knowledge, and yes these spells are from a broom.

Why wouldn't tanking conventional lightning be the same as tanking magical lightning? Kind of moot, anyways, since it wouldn't get through a Protego combo. What do you want to know about them, BTW?

He isn't going to be firing off a fire spell for a couple of reasons. One, we agreed that all each other know is they are facing a magic user, and given Harry is in Hogwarts robes, it's safe to assume lightning magic (which damages a users magic reserves) would be a better choice than fire. Two, lightning magic is faster than fire, so would also be a better choice.

It's different because they have different properties. One, conventional lightning is a product of weather, whereas magic lighting is a product of magic energy. Two, magic lightning also damages magic reserves, meaning it behaves differently to traditional lightning, and is more powerful.

Isn't moot because I've stated above why you won't have time for any kind of defense with your current strategy.

I just want to know how they act in combat. Are they fired at the offensive spell to deflect/negate it? Are they magic shield/ward/barrier?

Not sure what you mean by weakened, but alright.

Well, once Harry is paralyzed and has been the target of lightning magic for 50ish seconds from 3 different casters, I'd consider him weakened.

(Note, I skipped replying to a lot of your points as I'd be reiterating myself, saves reading time)

Um. No. You can't 'tank' an Avada Kedavra. It one-shots you. Avoid Death doesn't stop OHKOs, does it?

Yep. As soon as health drops below 10% he recovers 50%, in an instant.

A one hit KO is equal to an instant revive, or a "one hit revive", if you will.

Alternative strategy that frankly just makes more sense

The Dragonborn as soon as the fight starts, shouts using his disarm shout. Harrys wand goes flying. Then, as he stands helpless, is paralyzed and struck by lightning/has his soul torn.

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#37 Posted by Thedarklordpandamonium (4825 posts) - - Show Bio

They are defensive spells. Glacius Tria is the most powerful offensive spell.

Fair enough. So what, they're like a ward, or they are fired at the incoming spell? I get they're defensive but give me an idea of what they look like in combat.

They're bubble shields. Lol.

I meant that longbows can puncture armor at 180-200 yards but go much further.

Great..

So you're conceding? Probably not. Do you understand what I'm getting at here? Skyrim bows don't have enough range to be classified as longbows scientifically.

Based off their design, no. All skyrim bows look like either reflex bows or recurve bows other than the basic longbow.

Considering, as I'll say again, a bow is literally listed as a "LONGBOW", I don't see what your argument is based on here. First, the bows weren't true "longbows" because of their "velocity ect" and now it's because of their design? You haven't even backed up either of these points. You're basically just saying "in my opinion, it doesn't look like a longbow." Newsflash, there is a labelled longbow in game, and it's the most basic bow in the game, meaning all others are more powerful and fire faster and farther. Pretty moot point there. Give it up, they are "longbows."

No, they aren't. It's not my opinion, it's a fact.

The first picture is of a Skyrim recurve bow. The second is of a regular recurve bow with parts labeled. These are not longbows. Your 'longbow' either a) does not meet the real-world classification for a longbow, meaning you can't use real-world speeds for longbow arrows or b) the guy pulling it couldn't even bench his own weight...meaning it wouldn't fire as fast as a real-world bow.

All Skyrim bows other than the basic Longbow are Recurve Bows or Reflex Bows. Newflash: These are NOT LONGBOWS. They sacrifice some aspects for others, and have much lower top speeds. If you'd like more detail, just go ahead and ask.

No, diving as in 'diving down to earth peregrine falcon style'. Hawks don't generally do this, they chase other birds via...well, flying after them. Also, the speed for diving is based off of terminal velocity for a hawk; if they were incredibly high up and a dragon was right on top of them perhaps they'd reach this speed, but avoiding hunters? Please. Hawks do not move at an average speed of 120+mph, their maximum speed is 122 mph including gravity and diving like a ROCK.

Also, you are basing your argument off of something a random guard said, from my experience in-game dragons aren't generally that much faster than hawks which again soar at 40 mph max.

According to my source they dive, otherwise how would they have a measurement for diving speed?

Imagine this. You live in Skyrim. You're a hunter. You see an eagle chasing a hawk. The hawk in an effort to out-maneuver said eagle takes a dive downwards. Likewise, a Hawk see's a dragon coming, dives down and out of the sky as fast as possible and into a tree. It is a defensive maneuver for a bird to take a dive, allowing them to reach great speeds.

Except Eagles DON'T EAT HAWKS. That's either high-school ecology or AP ecology, I've forgotten. The Hawk is lower down on the food chain, but there is literally no reason for an eagle to hunt a hawk. Meat tastes better the less stress is apparent in it, and...okay, yeah, that's a tangent.

Also, this guard isn't a hunter.

I'm basing my argument off main story dialogue. The guard was at a watchtower, and witnessed the dragon kill other men and destroy the watch tower "faster than anything he had ever seen before", which is what he told the Jarl. Face it, Dragons fly faster than birds of prey. They fly much faster than diving Hawk, as the guard pretty much confirmed, capping the dragon at over 120mph at least, which makes it assume they move at similar speeds to Harrys broom, or faster.

Am I denying they fly faster than birds of prey? Nope. But I've played Skyrim, and a dragon crossing the screen doesn't move 4x faster than a bird crossing the screen. 2x faster, max. Hawks soar at 30mph if they're pursuing prep, which is what a dragon is typically doing. Your guard is literally just a random guy who's saying the dragon is fast, and you're assuming he's seen everything and is being like 'hmm...saw a hawk dive-bombing the other day...if I graph this against the velocity of that...BY THE GODS OF OLYMPUS, THE DRAGON IS FASTER!'.

Whereas we know in-game that hawks crossing the screen are NOT that much faster than dragons crossing the screen!

Besides all of that, where are your reaction feats?

Dodging spells with no quantifiable speeds. Just like your spells.

Smoke screen or Peruvian Instant Darkness Powders are basically instant. If they meet up the Dragonborn would go for magic, Harry would do that. After the Dragonborn realized what was going on, he'd do an Aura Whisper shout, and then maybe attack. Harry drinking potions is a third of a second, he's pulled the cloak over him in less than a second in the movies, and the spells are another second. The Dragonborn is recovering from the solid black and using his shout, which is a few seconds.

Harry's not vulnerable at all, they're spending the same amount of time on initial preparations.

I like how you're dictating what my character would do and how he'd do it.

Prolly because you did the same thing.

So the smoke screen is cast "instantly" and also instantly fills the room? (A large dueling room at that). Not buying it.

http://harrypotter.wikia.com/wiki/Peruvian_Instant_Darkness_Powder

The word 'Instant' is literally in the name. If you want me to pull up excerpts, okay, but it was...well, instant, and it filled the entire Room of Requirements (cathedral ceiling) and the corridors outside it until the stairs (so an entire damn floor of a castle).

"If they meet up the Dragonborn would go for magic".. when wouldn't they meet up and when wouldn't they use magic...

Wat.

Sorry, but honestly this whole paragraph is just a moot point. You're throwing statements like "After the Dragonborn realized what was going on" and "he'd do an aura whisper shout and then maybe attack" as if you know what he will do, and how he'll do it. You stick to what your character will do and I'll respond.

Wat.

I don't even know, that para is so poorly structured I don't know what to make of it to be honest. So according to you:

Wat.

- Unknown amount of time to use the smoke screen. We'll say one second to cast. Also, you haven't said how quickly it fills the room, so until you do I'll reserve how the Dragonborn would react.

It's instant?

- Harry won't drink three potions in under a second if it's a third of a second each. He has to unscrew the lid, drink them, and repeat for each one. Doing this as fast as possible would take roughly 3-5 seconds for all 3 potions. I'll be generous and say 3 seconds altogether.

I have never seen Harry unscrew the lid of a potion. Polyjuice in Book 2, Felix in Book 6...nope, in the movies there were no lids, he just tossed them back like shots.

- Pulls the cloak over himself. Roughly one second to put on a cloak.

Alternatively, invisibility spell since this is bloodlusted Harry and invisibility spell>cloak according to Dumbledore.

- One second to cast your chosen defensive spell.

Combined with the nvbl invisibility spell, considering these would also be nvbl? Kay, sure.

That reaches a grand total of *drum roll here* ..... Six seconds of initial preparations. Minimum. Six seconds to cast a smoke screen, drink three potions, put on a cloak, and cast a defense spell. Probably would take more than six seconds to do all of that realistically. ASIDE FROM THAT, how can you even cast spells with a cloak on. In the films Harry never casted a spell wearing the cloak, much less anything offensive. So explain that one to me.

I count two seconds, actually, three max. Same time as Dragonborn being like 'what's going on' and then an Aura Whisper.

Now, here's what the Dragonborn would do.

-Fight starts. One second to go invisible.

Just watched a playthrough...unless you're going for 10 second invis, it's 2-3 seconds. So Dragonborn takes 2 seconds to go invisible, I instantly throw the powder and throw back the potions, then do an invis and a basic Protego.

- Additional second to shout (technically, a quick whisper) aura whisper, since you're immediately smoke screening.

Not buying it. Just watched a playthrough and Aura Whisper was a good 2-3 seconds. While you're doing this I finish my Protegos, do a Homenum Revelio, and mount on up.

- One second to dual cast lightning magic and paralyze spell.

Which will miss due to Felix/bounce off due to Protegos/be dodged because Harry's on a broom.

- We'll generously say a 0.5 seconds for the paralyze spell, and 0.25 seconds for the lightning magic.

Still flying...

That's a total of 3.25 seconds, or slightly exceeding that, for my first offensive spell to reach you (4 seconds for the paralyze to have reached you), whereas you take in excess of 6 seconds for "initial preparations." It's much more handy being able to operate from non-worded magic spells as well as worded shouts in brief succession, opposed to having to pop 3 potions, throw on a cloak, and cast extra worded spells just to have a solid gameplan.

Actually, I count 5-6 seconds for you to know where I am and be invisible, whereas I'm invisible and untouchable in roughly half of one.

Also, baring in mind at this point you won't have even had time to cast a detect life spell, meaning I'll be invisible and you won't be. Well.. you will also be paralyzed, so there's that.

Nope.

Yes. He fires off tons of spells in conjunction, very quickly.

Proof?

Have you even READ a Harry Potter book? Battle in the Ministry? Battle of the Lightning-Struck Tower? Battle of Hogwarts, Parts 1 and 2?

By likely won't, you mean...what? The Dragonborn's going to fire off a fire spell, which would be moot. It's not like he has full knowledge, and yes these spells are from a broom.

Why wouldn't tanking conventional lightning be the same as tanking magical lightning? Kind of moot, anyways, since it wouldn't get through a Protego combo. What do you want to know about them, BTW?

He isn't going to be firing off a fire spell for a couple of reasons. One, we agreed that all each other know is they are facing a magic user, and given Harry is in Hogwarts robes, it's safe to assume lightning magic (which damages a users magic reserves) would be a better choice than fire. Two, lightning magic is faster than fire, so would also be a better choice.

Mkay, that makes sense.

It's different because they have different properties. One, conventional lightning is a product of weather, whereas magic lighting is a product of magic energy. Two, magic lightning also damages magic reserves, meaning it behaves differently to traditional lightning, and is more powerful.

Alright, that makes sense.

Isn't moot because I've stated above why you won't have time for any kind of defense with your current strategy.

Not...really. Your counterattack is based off of not really knowing anything about the HPverse and trying to pull a few quick ones over my head about the Elder Scrollsverse (Soul Tear being a one-shot, Aura Whisper being a second)...which isn't working.

I just want to know how they act in combat. Are they fired at the offensive spell to deflect/negate it? Are they magic shield/ward/barrier?

Bubble shield.

Not sure what you mean by weakened, but alright.

Well, once Harry is paralyzed and has been the target of lightning magic for 50ish seconds from 3 different casters, I'd consider him weakened.

(Note, I skipped replying to a lot of your points as I'd be reiterating myself, saves reading time)

Um. No. You can't 'tank' an Avada Kedavra. It one-shots you. Avoid Death doesn't stop OHKOs, does it?

Yep. As soon as health drops below 10% he recovers 50%, in an instant.

A one hit KO is equal to an instant revive, or a "one hit revive", if you will.

Can I get a vid clip of the Dragonborn surviving a one-shot with Avoid Death, such as falling off a mountain? Forum search says that's not true.

Alternative strategy that frankly just makes more sense

The Dragonborn as soon as the fight starts, shouts using his disarm shout. Harrys wand goes flying. Then, as he stands helpless, is paralyzed and struck by lightning/has his soul torn.

Disarm shout takes a few seconds. Peruvian Instant Darkness does not. Also, Harry has never been Disarmed before. He's kind of a boss like that. He'll just hold onto the wand.

Also, I'd like to point out that you completely dismissed the whole 'Harry has like 2000+ hp' thing. Quick wiki search shows you'd have to be hitting me for a good 20 seconds with magic to actually kill Harry, whereas he is faster than you and can one-shot you.

#38 Posted by SuperDrummer (721 posts) - - Show Bio

Although I personally think that Harry could take this, I'm going to have to give this battle to @i_like_swords due to better arguments, and better portraying his character and their abilities.

#39 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

Although I personally think that Harry could take this, I'm going to have to give this battle to @i_like_swords due to better arguments, and better portraying his character and their abilities.

Well voting hasn't really started yet, but thanks anyway.

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#40 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

Although I personally think that Harry could take this, I'm going to have to give this battle to @i_like_swords due to better arguments, and better portraying his character and their abilities.

@thedarklordpandamonium: Having quoted that.. I'm am getting pretty exhausted from debating this. Magic isn't normally my field of expertise. Want to put it up to votes?

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#41 Edited by OptimusPalm (1803 posts) - - Show Bio

This fight would be more interesting if they started further apart and couldn't see each other at the beginning. Its a good fight though, there's some holes in both battle plans, so its quite even at the mo (IMHO)

#43 Posted by OptimusPalm (1803 posts) - - Show Bio
#44 Edited by Dextersinister (5795 posts) - - Show Bio

Can I take over on Dovahkins behalf.

Scratch that I'm too lazy

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#45 Posted by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio
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#46 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio
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#47 Posted by The_Red_Viper (4167 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not in the tourney, can I still vote though? If so, I'm in for Dovahkiin.

#48 Edited by i_like_swords (13244 posts) - - Show Bio

@the_red_viper: It's a CAV match, not a tourney.

Edit: So yes you can vote.

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#49 Posted by The_Red_Viper (4167 posts) - - Show Bio
#50 Edited by reikai (4109 posts) - - Show Bio

We all know who I vote for.

Me!...I mean...Dovahkiin.

Also, if you'd like me to add to the argument, I can certainly do so.