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DC Loses Superman's Krypton Origins

Federal court rules for Superman's co-creator, Siegel

 

 
 

It seems that DC Comics is gradually coming increasingly close to losing the rights to their biggest heavy hitter and the leader of the DCU, Superman. According to a report by Variety, Federal court Judge Stephen Larson ruled on Wednesday, August 12th that the character's co-creator, Jerry Siegel "successfully recaptured" some of the rights to Superman's early years.

Jerry Siegel, has [acquired] rights to additional works, including the first two weeks of the daily Superman newspaper comic-strips, as well as portions of early Action Comics and Superman comic-books.
This means the Siegels -- repped by Marc Toberoff of Toberoff & Associates -- now control depictions of Superman's origins from the planet Krypton, his parents Jor-El and Lora, Superman as the infant Kal-El, the launching of the infant Superman into space by his parents as Krypton explodes and his landing on Earth in a fiery crash.


 In 2008, the same court order ruled on summary judgment that the Siegels had successfully recaptured (as of 1999) Siegel's copyright in Action Comics No. 1, giving them rights to the Superman character, including his costume, his alter-ego as reporter Clark Kent, the feisty reporter Lois Lane, their jobs at the Daily Planet newspaper working for a gruff editor, and the love triangle among Clark/Superman and Lois.

 
 
 
The case was determined based on the ruling that when the character and his story were bought, that it did not fall under the 1976 "works-made-for-hire" portion of the Copyright Act (Title 17 of the United States Code). The code distinctly states that the work of the creator is protected; and that "when the work is written down or otherwise set into tangible form, the copyright immediately becomes the property of the author that created it....[and] only the author or those deriving their rights from the author can rightfully claim copyright" ( Copyright.gov).

What this means is that since DC did not commission the origin story of Superman and Siegel was not hired by DC or commissioned when the concept for Superman was created; that it does not fall within the scope of "works-made-for-hire," and therefore the rights of the character can be returned to the creator.

The issue behind this case sadly has less to do with the ownership of the character, and more to do with how much Warner Brothers and DC Comics owes Shuster and Siegel for the use of the elements of the character's origin story over the years. By 2013, Schuster and Siegel combined will completely hold the rights to Action Comics No. 1, giving them the ability to move projects (i.e. motion picture, television program) associated with the character to another studio.

It seems that in the end, the Man of Steel is not invincible after-all; and that sadly, the incredibly iconic character may one day no longer be a staple in DC Comics continuity. That is, unless, they wish to completely change Superman's origin history. Does this story happen to have anything to do with the fact that the re-telling of the Superman origins tale is set for release this September? What are your thoughts on the future of Superman? How do you think this will effect the DC Universe?

136 Comments

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Aronmorales

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Edited By Aronmorales

You know what? this is bull, I'm usually in support of the creators, but this time I have to say "let it go".
He's better off in the DC universe, let's hope they aren't dumb enough to change that.

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The_Ghostshell

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Edited By The_Ghostshell

 
 
Pass the Vodka Comrade
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Nelsonalot

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Edited By Nelsonalot
@Gambler:

I wish
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No_Name_

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Edited By No_Name_
@Aronmorales said:
" You know what? this is bull, I'm usually in support of the creators, but this time I have to say "let it go". He's better off in the DC universe, let's hope they aren't dumb enough to change that. "
Who's dumb enough? The Federal court judge that ruled on the case? LOL
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Aronmorales

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Edited By Aronmorales

I was referring to the creators.

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Nelsonalot

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Edited By Nelsonalot

Just Let Mark Millar do a ongoing Red Son series, i dont think anybody would be mad about that.
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ceniza

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Edited By ceniza

According to my brother, who is a law man and works this kinda stuff everyday basis, both parts could make an arrangment to own the rights to invest and profit from the character, be it separately, or togetgher. But both parts won't do it because of the same old greedy reasons, they don't want some, they don't want just. They want it all. 
Funny how they all seem like corporate villians tearing Superman apart.
Whatever the outcome, will the winner of the ownership of Superman be so bold as to incorporate this very legal struggle into the pages? 

That'd be more Marvel than DC a move, but you have to agree, so far... it's the best way somebody's found to destroy Superman, Luthor is laughing his @ss off right now.

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gunswordfist

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Edited By gunswordfist
@Babs: It's sad to hear about Superman losing his origin but it rightfully belongs to Siegel and Shuster no matter what anybody says. I hope no one in this thread says anything stupid like "Oh so DC is going to lose Superman's origins so that Siegel's and Shuster's family's spoiled brats can buy fancy cars" like some genius did in a similar thread earlier this year. It's better than people at DC spoiling their family over something that's not theirs. That's for damn sure.
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SerjShelldrake

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Edited By SerjShelldrake

From what I understand by this is that DC will no longer own his origin story in krypton, but there's so much more that makes Superman especially the Superman of our generation that they do own. So if the family was to sell something they can only sell the origin story of Superman which is ridiculous because the baby sent to Earth would have to be used as the origin for another character or create a character from that origin, so it could become Sentry or some other comic industry superman, but the daily planet. Lois Lane, Metropolis, the fortress of solitude, the JLA, everything the makes Superman so Super is still owned by dc because all those stories were created under the DC contract. So even if someone wanted Superman the stories would suffer disgustingly. Especially since the DC universe is the only industry where even in the places where superheroes are looked down upon they are basically accepted and loved by all for patrolling and protecting the world. In marvel there's no way Clark Kent/Superman would ever give up their identity, he created the secret identity. Sorry this was kinda a big ramble but Superman will remain in DC.

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johnny_spam

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Edited By johnny_spam

I don't understand this and I hope Superman isn't removed from DC Comics and the DCU I don't want Superman's origins forgotten or rewritten.
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gunswordfist

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Edited By gunswordfist
@EisforExtinction said:
" I don't even understand any of this. So Superman isn't from Krypton anymore if the Siegel estate wants to be jerks? Everybody sucks. "
And here we go ladies and gentlemen....@goldenkey said:
"

He's to big for D.C. to lose.  Somehow he isn't goning anywhere.  It would be like taking Jesus out of the Bible.

"
HAHAHAHAHA! Good point.
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gunswordfist

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Edited By gunswordfist
@Nelsonalot said:
" Just Let Mark Millar do a ongoing Red Son series, i dont think anybody would be mad about that. "
 *SPOILERS*
 
 
 
 
 
 
But isn't Superman already dead/stuck in a time paradox in that story? lol
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Tmul501

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Edited By Tmul501

can the Siegel's, if they eventually retain all the rights to Superman, sell the rights back to DC? I guess I'm curious as to why they're attempting to secure the rights to the character now rather than having this dispute earlier. Are the original creators even still alive? Or is this whole thing solely about money?

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No_Name_

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@Tmul501 said:
" can the Siegel's, if they eventually retain all the rights to Superman, sell the rights back to DC? I guess I'm curious as to why they're attempting to secure the rights to the character now rather than having this dispute earlier. Are the original creators even still alive? Or is this whole thing solely about money? "
Absolutely! I bet that's what they'll do, too; unless someone say like Marvel beats them on the $$
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Tmul501

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Edited By Tmul501
@Babs said:
" @Tmul501 said:
" can the Siegel's, if they eventually retain all the rights to Superman, sell the rights back to DC? I guess I'm curious as to why they're attempting to secure the rights to the character now rather than having this dispute earlier. Are the original creators even still alive? Or is this whole thing solely about money? "
Absolutely! I bet that's what they'll do, too; unless someone say like Marvel beats them on the $$ "
I would honestly lose a lot of respect for Marvel if they did that.
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FoxxFireArt

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Edited By FoxxFireArt

How the bloody hell do you 'retell' the origin of Superman? That would be like rewriting the story of my own birth. It is what it is.

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Tmul501

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Edited By Tmul501
@FoxxFireArt said:
" How the bloody hell do you 'retell' the origin of Superman? That would be like rewriting the story of my own birth. It is what it is. "
Right. And how is this going to affect Johns' secret origins that is supposed to be coming out soon?
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Alexander Anderson

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This is a very interesting situation.  Maybe it will light a nice fire under DC's bum and teach them to stop relying so much on Superman.  52 proved that the B-listers deserve just as much time in the sun as the Big Three, if not more.
 
As for where Superman will go, that's easy: he'll go to the highest bidder.

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No_Name_

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Edited By No_Name_
@FoxxFireArt said:
" How the bloody hell do you 'retell' the origin of Superman? That would be like rewriting the story of my own birth. It is what it is. "
What you thought you knew, never really happened
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The Sadhu

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Edited By The Sadhu

Looks like Superman has another weakness other than Kryptonite... the all might dollar! 
 
So sad. I hope they can sort this all out!
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Kalossus

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Edited By Kalossus

Superman: Secret Origin will take place from Smallville onward, skipping over the Krypton parts.  I guess they saw this coming?

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Tmul501

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@Kalossus said:
" Superman: Secret Origin will take place from Smallville onward, skipping over the Krypton parts.  I guess they saw this coming? "
I thought so based on what I've seen in the back of other comics, but that also means there can be no references to the krypton stuff which might be kind of weird.
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burr787

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Edited By burr787
@goldenkey said:
"

He's to big for D.C. to lose.  Somehow he isn't goning anywhere.  It would be like taking Jesus out of the Bible.

"
LOL, best comparison I've ever heard.
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FoxxFireArt

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Edited By FoxxFireArt
@Babs said:

" @FoxxFireArt said:

" How the bloody hell do you 'retell' the origin of Superman? That would be like rewriting the story of my own birth. It is what it is. "

What you thought you knew, never really happened "
Uhg. Someone, please. Stop Krypton. I wanna get off.
Are we 100% sure that Joe Quesada isn't working for DC as well?
 
Oh, maybe next thing we know Peter Parker didn't really get his powers from the radio active spider in the labs, but while he was asleep that night a mystical spider that was sent by Mephisto was what bit him and gave him the powers he has. It was all an elaborate plot to trick him into marrying a hot red head. Just for the pleasure of taking it all away later.
 
By the way, your reporting on the store was well done. You cited the legal part of the case quite well and did an evqually good job of breaking it down into the basic ruling for what it means for the story.
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Alexander Anderson

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@burr787 said:
" @goldenkey said:
"

He's to big for D.C. to lose.  Somehow he isn't goning anywhere.  It would be like taking Jesus out of the Bible.

"
LOL, best comparison I've ever heard. "
And this is half the problem.  DC should not be the 24/7 Superman show.  They have such a huge stable of excellent characters at their disposal, but so many of them sit gathering cobwebs because there's this ludicrous focus on Superman and the Big Three.  I'd happily see Superman leave if it gave me more of what I saw in 52.
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MajinBlackheart

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Edited By MajinBlackheart  Moderator

hey I got it. Superman is really from the (insert planet here) and is the son of (insert mother here) and (insert father here). He was sent from his planet right before it's destruction and his memories/information changed to hide him from (insert new overpowered villain here)
 
problem solved

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burr787

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Edited By burr787
@Alexander Anderson said:
" @burr787 said:
" @goldenkey said:
"

He's to big for D.C. to lose.  Somehow he isn't goning anywhere.  It would be like taking Jesus out of the Bible.

"
LOL, best comparison I've ever heard. "
And this is half the problem.  DC should not be the 24/7 Superman show.  They have such a huge stable of excellent characters at their disposal, but so many of them sit gathering cobwebs because there's this ludicrous focus on Superman and the Big Three.  I'd happily see Superman leave if it gave me more of what I saw in 52. "
Not all of DC revolves around the big 3 anymore. For example look at the new Justice League all that's the same is the new Batman but he's completely different to Bruce. DC's not even using Superman that much anymore, all that he's been in for the past months outside of new Krypton is Superman/Batman and Trinity, and who reads those comics anymore. Also in Blackest Night what has Superman been doing, all he's done so far is morn at his father's grave. A lot more focus is being done on Flash, the Green Lantern, and the Core.
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gunswordfist

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Edited By gunswordfist
@Tmul501 said:
" @Babs said:
" @Tmul501 said:
" can the Siegel's, if they eventually retain all the rights to Superman, sell the rights back to DC? I guess I'm curious as to why they're attempting to secure the rights to the character now rather than having this dispute earlier. Are the original creators even still alive? Or is this whole thing solely about money? "
Absolutely! I bet that's what they'll do, too; unless someone say like Marvel beats them on the $$ "
I would honestly lose a lot of respect for Marvel if they did that. "
Me too. Superman wouldn't even fit in their universe.@FoxxFireArt said:
" How the bloody hell do you 'retell' the origin of Superman? That would be like rewriting the story of my own birth. It is what it is. "
Dave Chappelle did it. lol
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Anderson: Agent of SMITH

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@TheRichestManinTown said:
"The court is making DC and Warner submit to a copyright law retroactively, which is unconstituational, especially if that law is passed fourty five years in the future from when the rights over the character were decided.   "

Yeah, the Grandfather Clause I think it's called. So if I were eighteen and drank a beer before the drinking age was changed to 21, I can't be held accountable for it after it is illegal because it wasn't a crime when I did it. I had that rumbling in the back of my head, thanks for reminding me. 
 
Here's how you not mention the origin from here on in: 
 
Superman dies in Blackest Night (but doesn't get resurrected somehow). Months later, you have a new hero flying around who is super-strong, durable, has heat vision, and superbreath, among other abilities but he's wearing a mask that covers his entire face, so nobody can figure out who it is. You even have an origin story explaining how he became a superhero. But it's really Clark! Poor old Superman just bumped his head (on kryptonite?) and forgot who he was. He even wears an icepack in his helmet to ease his headaches, and there's a dispenser that gives him advil.   
 
And there you have it, now DC doesn't have to mention his origin at all.  
 
Or you could just kill him off, but so soon after Batman would seem forced.
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Kalossus

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Edited By Kalossus

This story made me remember this:

No Caption Provided
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Cezar_TheScribe

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Edited By Cezar_TheScribe

Superman has been in the DC Universe for too long for this to be happening. 
 
If they win and Superman has to be changed in any way or is taken away from DC, the Siegel name will be one of the most hated names in history. 
Just imagine their life if this happens.  
  
They should think this through and fear for their lives.   MUAAAH!  :P

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Luthorcrow

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Edited By Luthorcrow

DC is needs to man up and just make a deal with the family.  They stole Superman and left he creater poor.  Its only fair.  DC can't afford to either lose Superman or jack his origin story.  Sheeding Sups Krypton past would just not fly.

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ARMIV

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Edited By ARMIV

No Superman,No DC.
If Superman goes...I won't touch anything DC anymore.
I'm not his biggest fan,but I have alot of respect for him and what he's done for the industry. The books,the stories,the events...they'll mean nothing if Superman goes.
So like I said earlier,Warner Bros. and DC need to leave Batman alone for a while and redeem Superman. 
 
 
Warner Brothers,make the Superman movie.

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Emerald_General_Jai

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Honestly this is truly sad and pathetic on the parts of the Heirs. They are willing to destory a charachter that's supposedly sooo important to them, simply bc they're just as greedy as the company they want to villify. The difference being, DC paid the men responsible for Superman, i don't feel (and if u disagree that's ur right an ur perogitive) that his children really deserve that much more than they've already gotten. If they do win Supes back, between waht DC does still own, and the legal loop-holes and arguements possible DC will simply keep them tied up in court for years, and all that will suffer will be the fans.
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Omega Ray Jay

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Edited By Omega Ray Jay

As much as i Disslike Superman, this is indeed a sorry state of affairs

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Psychotime

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Edited By Psychotime
@DH69 said:
" lmao that  sucks, never been a fan of super man but that is pretty sad "
What's sad about it? You don't want the original maker of the character to receive the credit that's due to him?
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Tmul501

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Edited By Tmul501
@Psychotime:
Jerry Siegle died 13 years ago
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SerjShelldrake

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Edited By SerjShelldrake
@Psychotime:
they got their money and at the time that's what they felt was fair for their creation. But now because Superman is the biggest superhero of all time they expect oh now we who had no real part in our fathers creation feel that we need more money for it f**k no you guys got what your dad felt was adequate at the time, the original maker has no hand in this
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Jotham

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Edited By Jotham

Everyone just chill. Nothing's gonna happen to Superman. There's probably nobody on the planet who wants to keep Superman around as much as Siegel's heirs. I'm sure they are incredibly proud of him. They just want their fair amount of money, something any of us would want, and they'll get it.

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King_Saturn

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Edited By King_Saturn
wow... this is some Heavy Sh!t here...
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Donovan Montgomery

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@Luthorcrow said:
"DC is needs to man up and just make a deal with the family.   "


The problem with that is the family could find another "loop hole" ad go for more because DC "caved".  And by the sound of things they probably would.  The families been finding new stuff at evey turn.  They find one ting, lose, find another, lose and another, win, then another, win.....u get the point.  I've been hearing of these things for a few years now. 
 
As has been pointed out, they were paid, they get the credit for creating Superman and have since I can remember (and thats a long time).  Since this is about losing the origin I doubt it will happen completly. 
 
Marvel would not know what to do with Superman besides hide him till he's forgotten, or get Bendis to write him which would be worse. 
 
So much more to say, a lot of it already said by others. 
 
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defaultdefaultdefault

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i hate it when courts and comics mix.
its Superman, everyone knows that. I really dont think judges
read comics based on all of the outcomes i've seen.

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Mr. Punisher

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Edited By Mr. Punisher
@EisforExtinction:
Yeah he could still be an alien from another planet, and I think it said they lost his regular costume
 but I'm open for change.
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jimmyjames

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Edited By jimmyjames

This is what DC gets after using something they didn't actually own in the first place. Oh well, it's been fun Supes.

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MoonKnightFan123

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Edited By MoonKnightFan123
@G'bandit said:
" Ooooh yeah, I can see it now!
C'mon Marvel play a fast one!
C'mon Marvel play a fast one!
"
LOL
 
but still this is not good. greedy assholes
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Tmul501

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Edited By Tmul501
@Jotham said:
" Everyone just chill. Nothing's gonna happen to Superman. There's probably nobody on the planet who wants to keep Superman around as much as Siegel's heirs. I'm sure they are incredibly proud of him. They just want their fair amount of money, something any of us would want, and they'll get it. "
See that's what I don't understand about the whole thing. Why isn't DC settling this out of court? If they have to buy supes back from the Siegel's it will almost undoubtedly cost them more money. 
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WARLOCK2792

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Edited By WARLOCK2792
@Babs: What are they doing this for exactly?  It's too stupid for me to really want to look through all of their legal crap 
 
Why would anyone want to screw with the best-known Superhero of all time?  Why now?  I don't even like him, but I know that I wouldn't ruin him for other people that do.  How do you take away a character's freakin ORIGIN?
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Emerald Lantern

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Edited By Emerald Lantern

I think it's amazing that you can sell an idea and then retain the rights to it. What do Siegel's family have to do with it anyway? If they want money for inventing characters they should go invent some and stop mooching.

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DEGRAAF

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Edited By DEGRAAF

this would actually help Marvels case, they could put him in real life settings.
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Nelsonalot

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Edited By Nelsonalot
@gunswordfist:
Mark Millar doesn't care