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#1 Edited by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

Hate might be a tad strong of a word, but it seems at best many comic fans are fairly indifferent to IM. I've even seen him referred to as being a rather insignificant or boring character who only matters now because of the films. Aside from the current ongoing series, which I myself dont even read, I struggle to understand the animosity towards him on here.

He's a founding member of the Avengers. He's one of the absolute smartest characters in the entire Marvel Universe. He's the best engineer in the Marvel Universe. More simply, he's heroic. Yet considering all these things comic fans still seem to prefer Cap, Thor or any other Avenger. As a somewhat new fan of comics I'd like to think I have a fresh take on these characters and I always admired him in the comics and considered him maybe even the most important Avenger considering he represents all that a human can achieve with his smarts. Fraction's run on the character really solidified this feeling for me, along with his current appearances in Hickman's New Avengers.

At any rate, I'd like to hear from those who don't like the character. Is it because of the events in Civil War? Or is it because of the success of the films that drive people away? Don't hold back, I'm just interested to understand and I'm not here to judge anyone.

#2 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio

Iron Man's a pr*ck, always has been.

You know Armor Wars, one of the character's defining arcs? He beats the crap out of Stingray because he thinks Stingray might possibly have some Stark Tech in his suit. Now Stingray is just about the nicest guy in Marvel, and would never steal anything, let alone then lie about it. He tells Stark he doesn't have any and then tries to run away when Stark turns on him. What's Iron Man do? Chase after and gun down Stingray, then scans his armour, realises there is no Stark Tech, and then leaves an unconscious Stingray on a beach-front.

And doesn't apologise.

Just an example of a guy Marvel treats as their biggest "hero"

People like to act like Civil War was out of character, when the reality is it was completely in-character for Iron Man.

#3 Posted by novi_homines (1338 posts) - - Show Bio

I love IM! =)

#4 Edited by PeppeyHare (4310 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't understand these threads. I haven't seen much hate for IM at all lately so I don't get where you're getting this from. People hated the character around the CW time but I think he's pretty popular today

#5 Posted by guttridgeb (4831 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't hate him, just dislike him. A bit too much of a jerk for my taste, I don't find him likeable enough.

#6 Posted by novi_homines (1338 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't understand these threads. I haven't seen much hate for IM at all lately so I don't get where you're getting this from. People hated the character around the CW time but I think he's pretty popular today

Also this. Never really noticed the hate for him.

#7 Posted by Akindoodle (1012 posts) - - Show Bio

He's kind of an as#hole.

#8 Posted by BR_Havoc (1286 posts) - - Show Bio

Civil War killed most peoples opinion of Iron Man but he was not the only casualty in that department Reed Richards was another. Yet Reed Richards has been redeemed over the years in the Fantastic Four book and I think Hickman made a lot of people forgive him completely. Where Iron Man never has been, In the movies he is a jerk but he is charming so you can forgive most of it. In the Marvel universe when Tony is being a jerk you just think it's his nature and you think of all the horrible stuff he did in Civil War and all the lives he ruined.

#9 Posted by Doomnaut (1993 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm a comic fan and I love Iron Man. Hes definitely cooler than Batman.

#10 Posted by Perethorn (3346 posts) - - Show Bio

I dont hate it, i just think he is an ass that betrayed his friends

#11 Posted by Guardian_of_Gravity (2979 posts) - - Show Bio

Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel.

#12 Edited by X35 (5981 posts) - - Show Bio

How about when he went on a one-man crusade against everyone, betrayed all his friends, severely beat up two Avengers, caused a jailbreak and broke several other laws? How about when he lied about not being Tony Stark so the Avengers would let him join again? How about when he faked his own death and screwed his friends over? How about when he tossed the West Coast Avengers under a bus for his own negligence of duty? How about when he killed a whole bunch of people in cold blood? How about when he bankrupted Janet just for lols? How about when he framed Hawkeye for murder? How about when he pulled a teenager's heart out with his barehands? How about when he lied and said that he couldn't finance the Avengers anymore? How about when he decided he was worthy of being one of the "smartest people" in the world to police the world? How about when he let Maria Hill guilt trip him into doing something about the Hulk? How about when he followed up by coming up with the idea to send the Hulk into space? How about the time he paid Titanium Man to attack Washington just to make a point? How about when he turned on all his friends in support of a bill? How about when he beat the crap out of Spider-Man and then set a bunch of murderers after him for having regrets? How about when he nearly orchestrated a war between humans and Atlanteans to make everyone be happy? How about when he tricked Norman Osborn into assassinating a royal ambassador and in response put him in charge of the Thunderbolts? How about when he tricked the New Avengers into thinking Cap was alive and used his body as bait? How about when he spent most his time as Director of S.H.I.E.L.D. hunting his "friends" rather than doing anything worthwhile? How about when his arrogance and belief that he could single-handedly prevent a Skrull invasion only aided it? How about when he instantly showed up, put down Hank Pym and took away two of his Avengers claiming that that was all he needed from them? How about when instead of fighting alongside Avengers or heroes, he went into hiding during Dark Reign? How about the fact he makes every damn tragedy ever about how he is a recovering alcoholic?

And he was sober for every single one of them.

#13 Posted by Veshark (9058 posts) - - Show Bio

Civil War and his entire tenure as Director of SHIELD. Basically all of his guest appearances during this time had him come off as a jerk in the wrong. Much like Cap in AvX and anything present X-Men, actually.

#14 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

@peppeyhare said:

I don't understand these threads. I haven't seen much hate for IM at all lately so I don't get where you're getting this from. People hated the character around the CW time but I think he's pretty popular today

Also this. Never really noticed the hate for him.

apparently you guys arent reading the responses haha

#15 Edited by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

"Why do comic fans hate Iron Man?" Here's what we got so far:

Detractors:

- "Iron Man's a pr*ck, always has been."

- "He's kind of an as#hole."

- "Civil War killed most peoples opinion of Iron Man but he was not the only casualty in that department Reed Richards was another."

- "I don't hate him, just dislike him. A bit too much of a jerk for my taste, I don't find him likeable enough."

- "I dont hate it, i just think he is an ass that betrayed his friends"

- "Civil War and his entire tenure as Director of SHIELD. Basically all of his guest appearances during this time had him come off as a jerk in the wrong."

- "How about when he went on a one-man crusade against everyone, betrayed all his friends, severely beat up two Avengers, caused a jailbreak and broke several other laws? How about when he lied about not being Tony Stark so the Avengers would let him join again? How about when he faked his own death and screwed his friends over? How about when he tossed the West Coast Avengers under a bus for his own negligence of duty? How about when he killed a whole bunch of people in cold blood? How about when he bankrupted Janet just for lols? How about when he framed Hawkeye for murder? How about when he pulled a teenager's heart out with his barehands? How about when he lied and said that he couldn't finance the Avengers anymore? How about the time he paid Titanium Man to attack Washington just to make a point? How about when he turned on all his friends in support of a bill? How about when he beat the crap out of Spider-Man and then set a bunch of murderers after him for having regrets? How about when he nearly orchestrated a war between humans and Atlanteans to make everyone be happy? How about when he tricked Norman Osborn into assassinating a royal ambassador and in response put him in charge of the Thunderbolts? How about the fact he makes every damn tragedy ever about how he is a recovering alcoholic?

And he was sober for every single one of them."

Supporters:

- "I love IM! =)"

- "Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel."

- "I'm a comic fan and I love Iron Man. Hes definitely cooler than Batman."

- "People hated the character around the CW time but I think he's pretty popular today"

So as I predicted, a pretty polarizing character so far.

#16 Posted by PeppeyHare (4310 posts) - - Show Bio

Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel.

This. ATM I'd say Iron Man is Marvel's most popular character

#17 Posted by Z3RO180 (6458 posts) - - Show Bio

He's a great character, but the character of Tony Stark/Iron-man is and always will be a prick of the highest degree

#18 Posted by RulerOfThisUniverse (6274 posts) - - Show Bio
#19 Edited by longbowhunter (7047 posts) - - Show Bio

Civil War was what made me take interest in Iron Man. Before that I didn't care about the character one way or the other. I started reading a ton of pre-Disassembled Iron Man back issues along with anything current he was in. Not all the stories were good but I did really grow to love Tony Stark. He still stands as one of my all time favorite Marvel characters.

#20 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio
#21 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

@longbowhunter: nice did you ever read Matt Fraction's run on the character? Five Nightmares was a great storyline.

#22 Posted by Veshark (9058 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis said:

"Why do comic fans hate Iron Man?" Here's what we got so far:

Detractors:

- "Iron Man's a pr*ck, always has been."

- "He's kind of an as#hole."

- "Civil War killed most peoples opinion of Iron Man but he was not the only casualty in that department Reed Richards was another."

- "I don't hate him, just dislike him. A bit too much of a jerk for my taste, I don't find him likeable enough."

- "I dont hate it, i just think he is an ass that betrayed his friends"

- "Civil War and his entire tenure as Director of SHIELD. Basically all of his guest appearances during this time had him come off as a jerk in the wrong."

- "How about when he went on a one-man crusade against everyone, betrayed all his friends, severely beat up two Avengers, caused a jailbreak and broke several other laws? How about when he lied about not being Tony Stark so the Avengers would let him join again? How about when he faked his own death and screwed his friends over? How about when he tossed the West Coast Avengers under a bus for his own negligence of duty? How about when he killed a whole bunch of people in cold blood? How about when he bankrupted Janet just for lols? How about when he framed Hawkeye for murder? How about when he pulled a teenager's heart out with his barehands? How about when he lied and said that he couldn't finance the Avengers anymore? How about the time he paid Titanium Man to attack Washington just to make a point? How about when he turned on all his friends in support of a bill? How about when he beat the crap out of Spider-Man and then set a bunch of murderers after him for having regrets? How about when he nearly orchestrated a war between humans and Atlanteans to make everyone be happy? How about when he tricked Norman Osborn into assassinating a royal ambassador and in response put him in charge of the Thunderbolts? How about the fact he makes every damn tragedy ever about how he is a recovering alcoholic?

And he was sober for every single one of them."

Supporters:

- "I love IM! =)"

- "Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel."

- "I'm a comic fan and I love Iron Man. Hes definitely cooler than Batman."

- "People hated the character around the CW time but I think he's pretty popular today"

So as I predicted, a pretty polarizing character so far.

I'm not a detractor :( I love Iron Man, he's one of my favorite heroes (Number 8 or 9, if memory serves).

It's just my observation on why others seem to dislike the character.

#23 Posted by RulerOfThisUniverse (6274 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis: I was kidding.

...

...

...

Though his opinion IS wrong.

#24 Posted by tupiaz (2180 posts) - - Show Bio

I like him. However I like flawed characters. People seem to forget that 1. Iron Man stand for in many ways what a normal society we do if he had superheroes. Would you guys really want to have superheroes you don't know who are? Do you really trust them to always do good and the right thing? 2. Iron Man doesn't want to be a jerk and do love his friends and so on.

@guardian_of_gravity said:

Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel.

This. ATM I'd say Iron Man is Marvel's most popular character

His book is not selling that good so clearly he isn't.

Online
#25 Posted by lykopis (10752 posts) - - Show Bio

I never really followed Iron Man (or most of the Avengers) for a long while and the only time I got a feel for the character was during Civil War which fans of him tell me was a complete destruction of Tony.

General feeling towards Iron Man is one of indifference from me, leaning towards distaste. He never came across as a compelling character and playboys in fiction I think are a tired cliche. He's still doing the same thing in Guardians of the Galaxy -- just not much substance and this feeling is carried over to the Indestructible Hulk.

Plus, he's a pompous @ss.

#26 Edited by knighthood (1693 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis: What you talking about? Iron Man is my favorite non-mutant Marvel character.

#27 Posted by Aiden Cross (15562 posts) - - Show Bio

Because he's not Robert Downey Jr. That's the only version of him i like really..

#28 Posted by PeppeyHare (4310 posts) - - Show Bio

@tupiaz said:

I like him. However I like flawed characters. People seem to forget that 1. Iron Man stand for in many ways what a normal society we do if he had superheroes. Would you guys really want to have superheroes you don't know who are? Do you really trust them to always do good and the right thing? 2. Iron Man doesn't want to be a jerk and do love his friends and so on.

@peppeyhare said:

@guardian_of_gravity said:

Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel.

This. ATM I'd say Iron Man is Marvel's most popular character

His book is not selling that good so clearly he isn't.

His book isn't selling well because it's not very good. By that logic Peter Parker wasn't Marvel's mascot for years due to book sales

#29 Posted by novi_homines (1338 posts) - - Show Bio

Why did people hate him in civil war? In my opinion, he definitely was in the right. And I was on his side all the way through.

#30 Posted by Doomnaut (1993 posts) - - Show Bio

Well he did shoot Hulk into space...

#31 Posted by novi_homines (1338 posts) - - Show Bio

@doomnaut said:

Well he did shoot Hulk into space...

him or the Illuminati?

#32 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

@veshark: gotcha I'm not saying YOU are a detractor I was jut putting down reasons that detractors don't like him, which as you said you were pointing out in your statement. I just added it to the reasons why. Sorry If that came off like it was meant to single you out I wasnt trying to.

#33 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

@aiden_cross: yeah but what I'm driving at is why you don't like him in the comics?

#34 Edited by Guardian_of_Gravity (2979 posts) - - Show Bio

@tupiaz: Book sales are ultimately fairly meaningless due to how few people they reach and how little money they make in the grand scheme of things. Iron man 1 grossed more money than pretty much every marvel book combined for like five years or so.

The god damn batman's books make maybe a million per year put together,

#35 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

@guardian_of_gravity: that doesn't make them meaningless. The only reason these characters are household names is because of the fans who supported the comics. Movies making more money doesn't change that. They're different mediums.

#36 Edited by novi_homines (1338 posts) - - Show Bio

@guardian_of_gravity said:

Book sales are ultimately fairly meaningless due to how few people they reach and how little money they make in the grand scheme of things. Iron man 1 grossed more money than pretty much every marvel book combined for a decade. The god damn batman's books make maybe a million per year put together,

Lol that really puts things into perspective doesn't it? Add that billion dollar grossing from Iron Man 3, the only marvel solo character to do so, and one can easily make a case that he's marvel's most popular hero.

#37 Posted by novi_homines (1338 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis said:

@guardian_of_gravity: that doesn't make them meaningless. The only reason these characters are household names is because of the fans who supported the comics. Movies making more money doesn't change that. They're different mediums.

I don't think guardian means completely meaningless in not having a factor at all. I think she meant meaningless in determining how popular a character is to not only comic book fans, but the general audience as a whole.

#38 Posted by Aiden Cross (15562 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis: arrogance (not the funny kind), his whole lifestyle just doesn't appeal to me in the slightest, the choices he made in regards to people who trusted him. I don't even see him as a 'hero' to be honest.

#39 Posted by BR_Havoc (1286 posts) - - Show Bio

Why did people hate him in civil war? In my opinion, he definitely was in the right. And I was on his side all the way through.

IMO he was in the wrong he got a bunch of his friends to follow him blindly and thought he could do anything immoral because he was fighting for a good cause. He betrayed all he was supposed to stand for and bullied people into thinking his way was the right way with force. I hated him during the Civil War because he stood for blind idealism and machiavellism (the ends justify the means).

#40 Posted by TheAcidSkull (18010 posts) - - Show Bio

Simple, he is an assh*le.

Robert Downey Jr's version is superior.

#41 Posted by Avenging-X-Bolt (12943 posts) - - Show Bio

Iron Man's a pr*ck, always has been.

You know Armor Wars, one of the character's defining arcs? He beats the crap out of Stingray because he thinks Stingray might possibly have some Stark Tech in his suit. Now Stingray is just about the nicest guy in Marvel, and would never steal anything, let alone then lie about it. He tells Stark he doesn't have any and then tries to run away when Stark turns on him. What's Iron Man do? Chase after and gun down Stingray, then scans his armour, realises there is no Stark Tech, and then leaves an unconscious Stingray on a beach-front.

And doesn't apologise.

Just an example of a guy Marvel treats as their biggest "hero"

People like to act like Civil War was out of character, when the reality is it was completely in-character for Iron Man.

@x35 said:

How about when he went on a one-man crusade against everyone, betrayed all his friends, severely beat up two Avengers, caused a jailbreak and broke several other laws? How about when he lied about not being Tony Stark so the Avengers would let him join again? How about when he faked his own death and screwed his friends over? How about when he tossed the West Coast Avengers under a bus for his own negligence of duty? How about when he killed a whole bunch of people in cold blood? How about when he bankrupted Janet just for lols? How about when he framed Hawkeye for murder? How about when he pulled a teenager's heart out with his barehands? How about when he lied and said that he couldn't finance the Avengers anymore? How about when he decided he was worthy of being one of the "smartest people" in the world to police the world? How about when he let Maria Hill guilt trip him into doing something about the Hulk? How about when he followed up by coming up with the idea to send the Hulk into space? How about the time he paid Titanium Man to attack Washington just to make a point? How about when he turned on all his friends in support of a bill? How about when he beat the crap out of Spider-Man and then set a bunch of murderers after him for having regrets? How about when he nearly orchestrated a war between humans and Atlanteans to make everyone be happy? How about when he tricked Norman Osborn into assassinating a royal ambassador and in response put him in charge of the Thunderbolts? How about when he tricked the New Avengers into thinking Cap was alive and used his body as bait? How about when he spent most his time as Director of S.H.I.E.L.D. hunting his "friends" rather than doing anything worthwhile? How about when his arrogance and belief that he could single-handedly prevent a Skrull invasion only aided it? How about when he instantly showed up, put down Hank Pym and took away two of his Avengers claiming that that was all he needed from them? How about when instead of fighting alongside Avengers or heroes, he went into hiding during Dark Reign? How about the fact he makes every damn tragedy ever about how he is a recovering alcoholic?

And he was sober for every single one of them.

this pretty much. i like pretty much the entire Iron Man mythos except for Tony Stark himself. the movie version is ok though,

#42 Posted by IrishX (2354 posts) - - Show Bio

There's been plenty of reasons given not to like him but all characters at least the major ones will experience bad writers and stories or just ones that make them easier to dislike. On a personal level I just do not relate to his character. I am not a genius, rich, a playboy, arrogant, and I don't drink so I don't really care for his alcohol issues.

Comparing Captain America the man who represents all heart and courage as well as true leadership to Stark is kinda silly to me.

#43 Posted by HeraldofGanthet (3368 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis:

How about when he went on a one-man crusade against everyone, betrayed all his friends, severely beat up two Avengers, caused a jailbreak and broke several other laws? How about when he lied about not being Tony Stark so the Avengers would let him join again? How about when he faked his own death and screwed his friends over? How about when he tossed the West Coast Avengers under a bus for his own negligence of duty? How about when he killed a whole bunch of people in cold blood? How about when he bankrupted Janet just for lols? How about when he framed Hawkeye for murder? How about when he pulled a teenager's heart out with his barehands? How about when he lied and said that he couldn't finance the Avengers anymore? How about when he decided he was worthy of being one of the "smartest people" in the world to police the world? How about when he let Maria Hill guilt trip him into doing something about the Hulk? How about when he followed up by coming up with the idea to send the Hulk into space? How about the time he paid Titanium Man to attack Washington just to make a point? How about when he turned on all his friends in support of a bill? How about when he beat the crap out of Spider-Man and then set a bunch of murderers after him for having regrets? How about when he nearly orchestrated a war between humans and Atlanteans to make everyone be happy? How about when he tricked Norman Osborn into assassinating a royal ambassador and in response put him in charge of the Thunderbolts? How about when he tricked the New Avengers into thinking Cap was alive and used his body as bait? How about when he spent most his time as Director of S.H.I.E.L.D. hunting his "friends" rather than doing anything worthwhile? How about when his arrogance and belief that he could single-handedly prevent a Skrull invasion only aided it? How about when he instantly showed up, put down Hank Pym and took away two of his Avengers claiming that that was all he needed from them? How about when instead of fighting alongside Avengers or heroes, he went into hiding during Dark Reign? How about the fact he makes every damn tragedy ever about how he is a recovering alcoholic?

And he was sober for every single one of them.

Very eloquently put, @x35. And quite accurate. Not to mention the fact that I have seen so many lives destroyed due to alcoholism and womanizing that I have absolutely no use for the character. They could kill him off tomorrow morning (not "comic book death", but "never draw him again death") and I doubt I'd even notice.

#44 Posted by longbowhunter (7047 posts) - - Show Bio

@extremis: Oh you bet. I loved that book for a long time. I read everything up to and slightly after the Fear Itself stuff.

#45 Posted by Extremis (3344 posts) - - Show Bio

People always mention how Tony betrayed people with Civil War or how he isnt heroic and this and that, but yet don't mention how he had his own mind wiped to follow thru with his vision and subjected himself to possibly becoming brain dead forever to protect his friends' identities. Maybe some detractors didn't know this, but its hardly mentioned. That's heroic if you ask me. The dude sacrificed his greatest gift, his mind, to save the world and protect the identities of his friends.

#46 Posted by CosmicBootyCall (3 posts) - - Show Bio

BOOTY!

#47 Edited by tupiaz (2180 posts) - - Show Bio

@tupiaz said:

I like him. However I like flawed characters. People seem to forget that 1. Iron Man stand for in many ways what a normal society we do if he had superheroes. Would you guys really want to have superheroes you don't know who are? Do you really trust them to always do good and the right thing? 2. Iron Man doesn't want to be a jerk and do love his friends and so on.

@peppeyhare said:

@guardian_of_gravity said:

Iron Man hate died with the first movie. Now he's like the face of marvel.

This. ATM I'd say Iron Man is Marvel's most popular character

His book is not selling that good so clearly he isn't.

His book isn't selling well because it's not very good. By that logic Peter Parker wasn't Marvel's mascot for years due to book sales

Spider-Man has sold many copies for years even though not selling in the topone of the few characters that had several titles. Also the spider-man franchise has many titles. All due to PP/Spider-man so spider-man was a msacot even when it had "bad" sales.

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#48 Edited by ThatGuyWithHeadPhones (10874 posts) - - Show Bio

@doomnaut said:

Well he did shoot Hulk into space...

and did his cousin afterword, but seriously though everything during and after the cilvil war sorta killed his image with Comic fan.

#49 Posted by tupiaz (2180 posts) - - Show Bio

@guardian_of_gravity said:

Book sales are ultimately fairly meaningless due to how few people they reach and how little money they make in the grand scheme of things. Iron man 1 grossed more money than pretty much every marvel book combined for a decade. The god damn batman's books make maybe a million per year put together,

Lol that really puts things into perspective doesn't it? Add that billion dollar grossing from Iron Man 3, the only marvel solo character to do so, and one can easily make a case that he's marvel's most popular hero.

Maybe he is Marvel's most popular character put I don't think he is the most popular character among the readers nor those how like Marvel movies.

Online
#50 Posted by TDK_1997 (14686 posts) - - Show Bio

Civil War ruined Iron Man almost completely but the fact is that Civil War wasn't out of character at all and Tony would actually do such a thing.But the fact that he is a douche and acts like an asshole with everyone doesn't mean that people should hate him.There are a lot of douches that people actually love,like:Guy Gardner,Hal Jordan and there are even people that actually like Namor.So in comic books there should always be guys like him and there will always be people who love them and people who hate them.I on the contrary really like him and I think he is a really interesting character.