#1 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Peter, Osborn, and Miles. All are working together.

Spock, Lizard, Spidercyde. All are working together.

Battle in New York.

In character. Death or KO.

#2 Posted by Bronze_Surfer (2987 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: How old was Ult. Pete when he bit the dust.

#3 Posted by laflux (17647 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Edited by laflux (17647 posts) - - Show Bio

Oh and Team Spider-Man, with Lizard being the MVP.

#5 Posted by nickzambuto (15467 posts) - - Show Bio

Nobody gives a crap about Spidercyde. Was this your way of giving the Ultimate team an edge? :P

#6 Posted by Bronze_Surfer (2987 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: Well then.... I think normal Spider Man team has this.

#7 Posted by laflux (17647 posts) - - Show Bio

Nobody gives a crap about Spidercyde. Was this your way of giving the Ultimate team an edge? :P

nobody really gives a cr@p about the Clone Saga, apart from @strider92 >:P

#8 Posted by Bronze_Surfer (2987 posts) - - Show Bio
#9 Posted by nickzambuto (15467 posts) - - Show Bio
#10 Posted by Bronze_Surfer (2987 posts) - - Show Bio

@nickzambuto: What I mean is that Spidercyde is IMO better than normal 616 Pete. I don't know where to put Spider Ock.

#11 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Nobody gives a crap about Spidercyde. Was this your way of giving the Ultimate team an edge? :P

.... you see right thru me :)

@laflux said:

Oh and Team Spider-Man, with Lizard being the MVP.

Venom Sting. "Whistles away...."

#12 Edited by Shawnbaby (10871 posts) - - Show Bio

Team Spider-Man handles these rookies pretty easily.

I can just imagine Ock's Glee when he finds out he gets to kill "Peter Parker" Again.

#13 Edited by laflux (17647 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: Yep I considered that lol. Lizard should honestly be the fastest person here, considering he was effortlessly Speed-Blitzing Peter Post Spider-Island (who would be faster than anyone else if he was placed here) as well as pretty much stomping him to boot. Miles has some nice agility feats, but he has been tagged pretty frequently. Also, Miles doesn't tend to employ the Venom Sting right off the bat, especially with standard Morals, and considering how Fast and Strong Lizard is, I don't think he would have an opportunity to do so. And even if he was too, he's dealing with someone who has a healing factor strong enough to take being stabbed through the face. Miles' sting has been most effective against Machinery (ala Prowler's suit). It took him two stings to take down Peter (who was suffering with Flu IIRC), and his sting didn't K.O Giant Woman, his physical blows did. Lizard is bulletproof to begin with, and heals alot faster.

If we make the assumption that Ult Pete, Spidercide, Ult GG and Miles can hang with eachother- which is reasonable enough I think Lizard makes a big enough impression to seal it from his team.

#14 Posted by jashro44 (26523 posts) - - Show Bio

Iirc spidercyde had control over his body on a molecular level making him immune to physical attacks. If I am remembering correctly he solos everyone here, including his own team. Then there is current lizard...

#15 Edited by jashro44 (26523 posts) - - Show Bio

Just checked spidercides comicine page and turns out I was right. He can turn his body into liquid. Replace him with cardiac and it would be more fair.

#16 Posted by laflux (17647 posts) - - Show Bio

@jashro44 said:

Iirc spidercyde had control over his body on a molecular level making him immune to physical attacks. If I am remembering correctly he solos everyone here, including his own team. Then there is current lizard...

I checked it too, if that's true than its probably more unfair.

I'll check with @strider92 (get us some scans!!!)

#17 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux said:

@cadencev2: Yep I considered that lol. Lizard should honestly be the fastest person here, considering he was effortlessly Speed-Blitzing Peter Post Spider-Island (who would be faster than anyone else if he was placed here) as well as pretty much stomping him to boot. Miles has some nice agility feats, but he has been tagged pretty frequently. Also, Miles doesn't tend to employ the Venom Sting right off the bat, especially with standard Morals, and considering how Fast and Strong Lizard is, I don't think he would have an opportunity to do so. And even if he was too, he's dealing with someone who has a healing factor strong enough to take being stabbed through the face. Miles' sting has been most effective against Machinery (ala Prowler's suit). It took him two stings to take down Peter (who was suffering with Flu IIRC), and his sting didn't K.O Giant Woman, he physical blows did. Lizard is bulletproof to begin with, and heals alot faster.

If we make the assumption that Ult Pete, Spidercide, Ult GG and Miles can hang with eachother- which is reasonable enough I think Lizard makes a big enough impression to seal it from his team.

Ultimate Goblin is insane powerful as well. Was he killed by Peter? Yes. However it took Human Torch going Nova on him twice and a Truck exploding in his face. He was in bad shape before he died.

Meanwhile Green Goblin was taking on the whole Ultimate Team.

Ultimate Green Goblin is pretty bad.

Even with a Power Dampener Collar on his neck, he overpowers it, tanks the lobotomy shock, Tranks, and the Hank Pym hand slap of doom.

Green Goblin is pretty bad.....

#18 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: You do not think the Venom Sting will Ko Lizard!!!

Took out both Venom and Rhino......

#19 Edited by Shawnbaby (10871 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: I have a couple for you:

#20 Edited by Strider92 (16908 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: You do not think the Venom Sting will Ko Lizard!!!

Current Lizard has an insane healing factor he got stabbed through the head by a foot-long blade and wasn't KO'd. Venom sting isn't going to do much apart from hurt him a little.

@laflux said:

nobody really gives a cr@p about the Clone Saga, apart from @strider92 >:P

Thin ice!!!! Very thin ice!!! I'll see if I can find some Spidercide scans. The guy was slugging it out with Classic Kaine at one point and was strong enough to toss oild tankers around as well as what is basically intangibility.

#21 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2 said:

@laflux: You do not think the Venom Sting will Ko Lizard!!!

Current Lizard has an insane healing factor he got stabbed through the head by a foot-long blade and wasn't KO'd. Venom sting isn't going to do much apart from hurt him a little.

GG blows a M1-A1 Tank to pieces with one blast.

How does Lizard heal when blown to pieces?

#22 Posted by Strider92 (16908 posts) - - Show Bio


GG blows a M1-A1 Tank to pieces with one blast.

How does Lizard heal when blown to pieces?

The same way Ultimate Peter won when he beat Osborn down before dying? Current Lizard stomped 616 Peter. Ult Peter is almost on par with 616 Pete and he's beaten Osborn before. Someone who outclasses Spider-man by that much should have much trouble taking out another character Spider-man can beat in a random encounter.

#23 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2 said:

GG blows a M1-A1 Tank to pieces with one blast.

How does Lizard heal when blown to pieces?

The same way Ultimate Peter won when he beat Osborn down before dying? Current Lizard stomped 616 Peter. Ult Peter is almost on par with 616 Pete and he's beaten Osborn before. Someone who outclasses Spider-man by that much should have much trouble taking out another character Spider-man can beat in a random encounter.

Yet Ultimate Green Goblin could not be taken down by force of Iron Man, Ultimate Cap, Hawkeye, and Wasp together!

I mean your saying 616 Spidey > Cap, Hawkeye, Iron Man, and Wasp!

GTFO!

#24 Posted by dondave (39000 posts) - - Show Bio

Team Spider-Man ftw

#25 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

Your all a bunch of haters.

#26 Edited by Veitha (3362 posts) - - Show Bio

How will they detect Miles while he is invisible? He can avoid Peter's spider-sense, so he will be able to use his venom sting on Spock at the start of the battle, a single touch will KO him.

He's beaten Peter, he can beat Spock, too.

This will leave Peter, Miles and Norman against Spidercide and Lizard, and the three of them can take them out. Miles' venom sting can take out a Giant Woman and Venom, who can also regenerate, it will also be effective on Lizard. And then Goblin is very strong.

I think that Ultimate Spider Team could win this, not easily but they could.

#27 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@veitha said:

How will they detect Miles while he is invisible? He can avoid Peter's spider-sense, so he will be able to use his venom sting on Spock at the start of the battle.

This will leave Peter, Miles and Norman against Spidercide and Lizard, and the three of them can take them out. Miles' venom sting can take out a Giant Woman and Venom, who can also regenerate, it will also be effective on Lizard. And then Goblin is very strong.

I think that Ultimate Spider Team could win this, not easily but they could.

There haters. I made a new one. Check that one out.

#28 Edited by Veitha (3362 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: hahahaha, and I've also had some scans :P Actually I have to thank you for starting reading some Ultimate Spider-Man and Ultimates stuff, your Ultimate Universe battle threads made me more and more interested about that Universe :)

#29 Edited by laflux (17647 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: First off, I'm not hating >:D

@veitha: IIRC, the Venom's Sting didn't K.O the Giant, it just stunned her long enough for Miles to K.O him with a punch. The Venom scan is a good point admittedly, given he's bulletproof and has regeneration, but Lizard is alot, alot faster- Miles was dancing around Venom- Lizard was dancing around Peter, who is definitively faster than Miles given the Way of the Spider Training. That also has to countered against his Venom Sting against Peter. It took two to take him down (and he had Flu IIRC), and Peter is all round less resilient than Lizard is.

Rhino and Prowler are note worthy, but its more a case of Miles sting effecting the electronics, and they don't have healing factors. And from what I've seen K'Oing giants (which Miles failed to do with his sting, it was his strength) isn't enough to say he could sting Lizard into submission with one or even two hits. Spider-Man was nonchalantly KO'ing multiple giants, while making jokes and he failed horribly against the Lizard physically. I do think Miles could wear down Lizard eventually with stings, but Lizards overwhelming physical advantage will make that really tough.

Concerning Miles invisibility, it isn't foolproof, as shown by his fight with the Giant. Lizard has Enhanced Senses if I recall correctly, and as for Miles being immune to Peter's SS, this is because Spiders tend to be immune to eachother's Spider-Senses. It was a major plot-line of the clone wars. Point being, that while the the 616 Spiders SS will be disabled against the the Ultimate team, likewise can be said for the Ult Team.

And this is without bringing in Spidercide's intangibility.

#30 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@veitha said:

@cadencev2: hahahaha, and I've also had some scans :P Actually I have to thank you for starting reading some Ultimate Spider-Man and Ultimates stuff, your Ultimate Universe battle threads made me more and more interested about that Universe :)

Im glad then I could get some people into it :)

#31 Posted by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: Your a Traitor and a Hater! I challenge you to challenge a viner! I will take it to a grand jury!

#32 Posted by Strider92 (16908 posts) - - Show Bio

Yet Ultimate Green Goblin could not be taken down by force of Iron Man, Ultimate Cap, Hawkeye, and Wasp together!

I mean your saying 616 Spidey > Cap, Hawkeye, Iron Man, and Wasp!

GTFO!

And yet Peter has held his own against Ultimate Green Goblin almost 3 times by my count and beaten him once. Which one is more inconsistent? Spider-man holding his own on multiple occasions against Osborn or Osborn taking on and the Ultimates. Sounds like PIS unless your saying that Ultimate Peter could also replicate what Osborn did to the Ultimates.

@veitha said:

He's beaten Peter, he can beat Spock, too.

Peter was not fighting seriously. For one he kicked Miles off a building and tried to go after him afraid he'd hurt the kid. He then saved Miles from falling in the very scan you posted. He wasn't treating Miles as a threat. During that whole encounter he didn't even throw one punch. This was a combination of Peter holding back to a point he even tried to save Miles from hurting himself and plot.

#34 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: @laflux:

Just thought I leave this before the Thread dies.

.

Just Saying.... Venom sting.

Works on Peter.

@strider92 said:

And yet Peter has held his own against Ultimate Green Goblin almost 3 times by my count and beaten him once. Which one is more inconsistent? Spider-man holding his own on multiple occasions against Osborn or Osborn taking on and the Ultimates. Sounds like PIS unless your saying that Ultimate Peter could also replicate what Osborn did to the Ultimates.

Held his own? You mean Peter nearly died all 3 times before being saved by SHIELD or Outside Interference. The only time he killed Green Goblin was when Goblin was Nova twice by Human Torch, Hit by a 9+ ton Truck head on, and then had said truck slam on his skull till it blew up! Goblin is a beast and never had really a low showing.

Pete holds his own vs Green Goblin. Seriously!

.

Blows up a Tank.

Blows Reinforces Steel Doors down.

GG Blows up 1/10th of the Trisklen!

That is Fire Power.

As for Green Goblin Durability!

.

Tanks Anti Vehicle Fire from Attack Copters!

More attacks from Attack Copters!

After being hit with a Genetic Disruptor from iron man, GG still requires the combine attacks of Iron Man, Fury, Cap, and Hawkeye to bring down.

Here Goblin Tanking hits from Cap and Iron Man before being hit with the Genetic Disruptor.

GG tanks a very angry Torch.

Does it again, and absorbs the attack as well.

Gets hit with a large Moving truck at high speeds.

This is how every battle with Green Goblin ends in without Interference!

To say Lizard will beat GG is highly Doubtful.

#35 Posted by Deranged Midget (17989 posts) - - Show Bio

That scan is practically useless. Peter clearly has shown no intentions of hurting Miles and is more concerned with who he is and why he's there. He's attempting to question him the entire time.

As for the battle itself, Team 616 should have the advantage here just with two of their fighters.

Peter is physically superior to his Ultimate counterpart. It might not be by a large margin but it is evident and he's far more skilled than he his due to his time with Shang Chi and establishing his own fighting style in the form of "Spider-Fu" which synchronizes his technique with his spider sense, essentially making it second nature as shown in Spider-Island. Additionally, he's shown to be more consistently skilled with webbing and he's tactically smarter.

As for Miles, he lacks the experience to keep up with either Ultimate or 616 at this point. His venom sting is a factor and it has been utilized to take down his Uncle and the Rhino, but both had suits that were dependant on electronics, which essentially short-circuited and caused an explosion in both cases. That won't help much against The Lizard who was effortlessly stomping Peter in regards to physicals and his healing factor is ridiculous now. If Miles gets a chance to hit him, it won't have a lasting effect and would be less effective than it was on Peter. On top of that, he's several leagues above anyone else here in terms of speed and strength.

Spidercide is the only character here I'm not too knowledgeable on so that's a mix-up.

#36 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@deranged_midget: @strider92: Look at my above posts.

I edited in GG feats.

Seriously tho, Venom Sting can and has KO Pete, it can Spock, added in the Stealth Suit, makes Miles a contender.

Peter is physically superior to his Ultimate counterpart. It might not be by a large margin but it is evident and he's far more skilled than he his due to his time with Shang Chi and establishing his own fighting style in the form of "Spider-Fu" which synchronizes his technique with his spider sense, essentially making it second nature as shown in Spider-Island. Additionally, he's shown to be more consistently skilled with webbing and he's tactically smarter.

Spock has shown no Way of the Spider retention at all. Ultimate Pete has beaten better villains than Spock for the most part in "Random" Fights. Spock with Prep is sick, Ultimate Pete in random Fights is sick. 150 issues of comics show it.

Ultimate GG is recockulas powerful as I showed above. Lizard could take Green Goblin? I don't know....

#37 Edited by Deranged Midget (17989 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: Venom Sting KO'ed Peter for a few seconds and that was because he wasn't exactly intent on fighting, but clearly looking for answers. He made a fool of Miles without even trying.

My bad, I completely misplaced my thoughts. I thought this was against 616 Peter, not SpOck. That changes things a bit, especially in a random encounter. Although, I won't disagree to the fact that Ult. Pete has fought and defeated better villains but that's also because SpOck has only had maybe twenty issues if you consider both Avenging and Superior. That's over seven times less than Ultimate Pete so that's not exactly a fair comparison to make IMO.

But yes, SpOck does lack Peter's skill with his powers and experience overall, but he seems to make up for it somewhat with brutal tactics and complete disregard for safety. It's a tighter match than 616 Pete vs Ult. Pete that's for sure.

Lizard in his first mutation was roughly a fifteen tonner, who still embarrassed Peter. In this one, his healing factor is absolutely ridiculous, allowing him to be stabbed with little to no damage done. He's also insanely fast, even to Peter and his strength looks to be even greater than before. It's a tough one to call but I don't see Osborn getting past that healing factor or speed.

EDIT: Regarding Miles' camo capabilities, I'm not sure if SpOck's sensors in his eye pieces can pick up a heat signature from Miles. I mean, Giant woman or whatever her name was able to spot Miles, I don't see SpOck having much trouble or especially Lizard.

#38 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@deranged_midget: I think Osborn has Durability that surpasses Lizards IMO. I showed his Durability above, but read through this.

Here Green Goblin Tanks all the killing Firepower of Anti Tank weapons and Hulk Buster suits. He then beats down and kills his Son Harry the Hob Goblin. Through the whole fight Peter is unable to do anything. In the end Green Goblin gave up because he felt horrible killing his son.

He took Hulk Buster weapons and Anti Tank Missils with no sweat!

Lizard doing enough damage to this guy? Can Lizard tank a blast that blew apart 1/10th of the Triskelen?

I think after just finishing reading Issue 117 of USM, I have to say GG is the MVP in this whole match which leads to a good chance for team Ultimate.

@strider92 Really, check this out! As well the postings above.

#39 Posted by Deranged Midget (17989 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: I never stated that the Lizard has superior durability and those scans are impressive, I can admit to that. I stated that the Lizard has a superior healing factor. Additionally, I wouldn't say he took those missiles with "no sweat". I don't know the exact context of the fight so I won't make much of a judgement on it, but Ult. Green Goblin seems incredibly inconsistant as it's fluctuated between him being able to get up from attacks like that to being beat down by a Spider-Man that was nearly bled out and on death's door. There's a huge gap in those different instances.

#40 Edited by Pokergeist (22351 posts) - - Show Bio

@cadencev2: I never stated that the Lizard has superior durability and those scans are impressive, I can admit to that. I stated that the Lizard has a superior healing factor. Additionally, I wouldn't say he took those missiles with "no sweat". I don't know the exact context of the fight so I won't make much of a judgement on it, but Ult. Green Goblin seems incredibly inconsistant as it's fluctuated between him being able to get up from attacks like that to being beat down by a Spider-Man that was nearly bled out and on death's door. There's a huge gap in those different instances.

Im glad you mention the Inconsistent theme. I thought so as well. However it is not. It is rationally explain why Green Goblin was sort of tough (First Appearance) to the Beast he was in the end.

He was constantly evolving to be more powerful. Examples.

First he needed Formula to Transform. Then he realize he could do it without Oz Formula. He also receave a Power Increase during that time fighting the Ultimates.

Then here if you zoom in on the talk, he describes he is still evolving and through this arc up to Death of Spidey gets another Power boost!

He may seem Inconsistent to the NON Ultimate Spider Man reader. He is in fact just getting more power boost with each new Arc.