Optimus Prime (movie) vs Hulk (Movie)

Hulk is strong (that's pretty much his character) but I do remember him being dazed after getting hit the first time by Abomination. I don't know how hard Prime punches, but I doubt it would tickle. Also, Hulk can jump around (jump good. Heehee) how agile is he in mid-jump though? Factor in prime is fast and even with morals has no issue killing an enemy. If he gets cut in half, pretty sure that would be game over.

At no point did any Transformer show off the strength of Hulk. As far as durability goes, there was LITTLE durability shown. In pretty much every fight, parts were falling off the robots after every blow. And since we are using the Prime from the end of transformers 2, he got suped up and then got shot out of sky by one shot of the fallen. Then he proceeded to fight with starscream for a second, where he handled him easily, then fought Megatron. They power struggled for a second until Prime dominated him with his new parts. Then he fought the fallen, who almost immediately ripped the jet engine off his back, with little effort. Prime ended up destroying him too, but parts were flying everywhere.

How are these shows of durability at all, especially for a guy who rips metal apart all the time. I.E the metal in the park against military, the cop car, the jet wing against Thor, the actual jet. How is that relevant? If you rip out the spark, bye bye Transformer. Heck, if you shoot the spark, its pretty much done for. Not only that, but what has Hulk done numerous times? Use his opponent against itself. Used Abominations own bone against him, tried to use Thors hammer on him, used the leviathans own shield against him, etc. How is that relevant? You say his blades can cut through Cybertronian armor easily (which isn't really a feat as well placed bullets did the trick too), well Optimus and other transformers have had their arms and legs cut or ripped off many times. Hulk could easily use his own sword against him.

The hulk dominates, EASY! He could effectively win in One well placed punch.

@sachmoo: the parts falling is a showing of strength. they have tanked tank blasts, extreme temperatures, being blown through buildings...they handled those things easily.

after all the fights, they were still as complete and shiny, which can only prove two things, that they have either extreme healing abilities, or the parts were only rocks and stuff in their crevices, which they have many.

how will hulk know to rip out the spark? the things are embedded deep in their chests, this is like saying shoot their hearts, rip their hearts out. I do not see how that is a solution. we know for a fact that hulk is weak against piercing and slashing attacks, and that primes weapons are more powerful than the weapons that has pierced him in the past, and the force behind these attacks from prime is going to be devastating.

PS: A guy who rips metal all the time, well, here's a news flash, hulk has never even seen metal as durable as the transformers armor before.

As i said, their not durable. Legs and arms were ripped or cut off ALL THE TIME. Heck, jazz was just flat out pulled apart. And I get you are trying to Prove a point, but saying the hulk feat of him punching the levitation as weak and then saying the parts falling of is a showing of strength is funny. Sam witwicky killed starscream with a grapple and a bomb. The mitary took out other decepticons with bombs and sniper bullets. Those are VERY bad showings of durability. At no point is is said that they are made of a different metal. The basic military weapons were effective against them in most cases. Also, hulk had his skin pierced one time if i remember. Enlighten me of his extreme weakness to pointy objects?

Even prior to the upgrade Optimus was able to survive falling through the Earth's atmosphere. So with his durability set to withstand that much pressure, flying parts from damage is more from the strength of the other TFs than low durability.

@sachmoo: jazz was pulled apart by megatron. that proves nothing.

when did I say hulk punching the whale as weak? do not put words in my mouth.

the military killed a half dead one with bombs, grenade launchers. the snipers did not do anything.

when did I say extreme? I pity you, having to put words in my mouth to contend.

are you actually comparing other transformers with prime? that is ridiculous. you did not mention prime even once in your entire post.

I don't see how Prime could win this.

Optimus gets smashed into a little metal cube.

Hulk can throw cars at him as distraction them come up on him and destroy him

@mattnyyn123: 1. hulk is not much of a strategist. 2. cars and trees as wide as tables are nothing to them

@baron_von_santa: true didn't think of that

He was weak in the incred hulk movie because they drained the gamma radiation from his body (trying to cure banner), and his mid-air jump is Spot on.

@sachmoo: lol, post the whole conversation instead of one post which has nothing to what you accused me of.

#99 Posted by Donnergeist (829 posts) - 3 hours, 12 minutes ago - Show Bio

@baron_von_santa said:

@donnergeist: the indestructible shell was destroyed easily. statements are pretty useless

That dosent negate the size and velocity or anything els i said so...

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#100 Posted by Baron_von_Santa (3508 posts) - 2 hours, 45 minutes ago - Show Bio

@donnergeist: he killed it, but it did not stop moving did it? that only shows how weak the whale is

see? kid, when I was talking to you, you accused me of calling hulk weak when he did that, but here, clearly I did not. (shakes head) kids these days.....

the other sentences are all like this one too. you begin to attack me with this:

At no point did any Transformer show off the strength of Hulk. As far as durability goes, there was LITTLE durability shown. In pretty much every fight, parts were falling off the robots after every blow. And since we are using the Prime from the end of transformers 2, he got suped up and then got shot out of sky by one shot of the fallen. Then he proceeded to fight with starscream for a second, where he handled him easily, then fought Megatron. They power struggled for a second until Prime dominated him with his new parts. Then he fought the fallen, who almost immediately ripped the jet engine off his back, with little effort. Prime ended up destroying him too, but parts were flying everywhere.

How are these shows of durability at all, especially for a guy who rips metal apart all the time. I.E the metal in the park against military, the cop car, the jet wing against Thor, the actual jet. How is that relevant? If you rip out the spark, bye bye Transformer. Heck, if you shoot the spark, its pretty much done for. Not only that, but what has Hulk done numerous times? Use his opponent against itself. Used Abominations own bone against him, tried to use Thors hammer on him, used the leviathans own shield against him, etc. How is that relevant? You say his blades can cut through Cybertronian armor easily (which isn't really a feat as well placed bullets did the trick too), well Optimus and other transformers have had their arms and legs cut or ripped off many times. Hulk could easily use his own sword against him.

which is good, but then, I countered with by saying that is a showing of strength, not durability. you clearly responded with a bunch of useless feats that has nothing to do with prime.

pulling up a bunch of half posts is as useless to this debate as just saying who wins. go read the whole conversation between me and the other guy, because you clearly do not know anything about looking at the whole picture.

boing boing boing

Uhhhh..... Sorry. But, really? In the movies, yeah sure Prime is cool and strong and all that but.... Have you seen Hulk in the movies? He is a BEAST. He has TAKEN DOWN AN ALIEN. A CHITAURI alien. He went on a HUGE rampage and started taking them out left and right. He could take Prime. Even Morals off, Prime would keep coming, and Hulk would get Inside Prime or just start tearing him apart from the outside. AND he could totally take down Prime by simply putting GINOURMOUS dents in Prime's Head/chest/legs/arms.

This will be a close fight, considering both movie Transformers and movie Hulk seem a lot less powerful than other comics/tv versions. I think Prime's firepower will be enough to daze the Hulk long enough for Prime to fly down and spear him. Hulk was dazed in the Avengers movie after an onslaught of chitauri firepower, who says the same cannot happen here?

Or the Hulk quickly attacks Prime before he can react and rips Prime apart.

I'm pressed for time right now and will be back with a better argument.

Humans with sabot rounds can hurt the transformers. Cybertronian "Armor" wasn't all that in the live action films. Hulk has much better feats even if he was annoyed at being shot at.

Hulk would be punching Optimus to bits. Hulk has better strength feats by a long shot and he was shredding Decepticons. (tore Starscream's arm off and killed a few in the Revenge of the Fallen, also "Give me your Face!" ) Hulk was tanking a metric crapton of Chitauri energy weapons and got a bloody nose for his troubles.

Prime is fast, but Avengers showed so is the Hulk.

Hulk wins because he is stronger, in the same neighborhood speedwise, more durable and so on. The only thing he lacks is energy projection and he sorta gets around that by tossing big objects around or launching himself at his foe.

Optimus looks like those Decepticons he tore apart at the end of this battle.

I vote for Grimlock Prime!

@baron_von_santa:

see? kid, when I was talking to you, you accused me of calling hulk weak when he did that, but here, clearly I did not. (shakes head) kids these days.....

Well, if you want me to quote you directly, please extend me the same courtesy. I Said, "And I get you are trying to Prove a point, but saying the hulk feat of him punching the levitation as weak and then saying the parts falling of is a showing of strength is funny." At no point in there did i say you called the hulk weak. Its clear that i said you called his punching the leviathan feat weak. Again, saying the whale was weak is downplaying the feat. I don't know why you are getting caught up in the verbiage, whether than trying to prove your point.

But ok lets focus on prime and hulk then. As i stated, throughout the series parts were falling off during fights, including having his arm cut off, and in the form used here, had his jet engine ripped right off. He also has been killed by a blow through the chest. Hulk has yet to be killed or have a limb fall off. I'm still waiting on the times that showed Hulk was, "weak against piercing and slashing attacks". I recall one instance where his skin got pierced.

@sachmoo: wow, now your quoting entirely irrelevant things.

thor killed a bunch with one lightning blast, iron man completely destroyed one. how is that downplaying when the whales ARE that weak?

and i think you do not need to keep asking a question that me and others have already answered.

normal primes durability:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9the6PLLuVc

upgraded prime is even more durable:

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0kognysmDBE

was it ever said how strong those blasts are in the movie? I am curious

@w0nd: prime was able to tank crashing into the earth from space, hits from transformers, crashing through buildings and he tanked those things like playing. the blast could harm him and send him flying. that really is some feat. it could level a building with ease at the very least

This lightning blast looks pretty strong to me and it kills one and a bunch of Chitauri.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbLI-mk6R-0

Iron Man flew in its mouth and killed it from the inside. That's not weak durability from the space whale.

And for the last time, noone has given any times that The Hulk was "weak against piercing and slashing attacks". Ive read through all the comments many times and nowhere does it support your claim. Like i said, Optimus prime has been killed, lost many small parts and lost a full limb. None of which has happened to The Hulk.

@sachmoo: iron man destroyed the one hulk killed and it was still intact. why prime lost small parts and why was he damaged was already answered many times. are you trolling right now? why do you keep avoiding that?

Hulk punched it causing it to lose almost all its forward momentum, also caused the armor to fall off, which allowed Iron man to blow it up. It wasn't in tact, its head was still there because they were so big, you could blow it up in the middle (which iron man did) and have its head still intact.

And no, the only explanation anyone gave for why prime lost parts and was damaged was, " Even prior to the upgrade Optimus was able to survive falling through the Earth's atmosphere. So with his durability set to withstand that much pressure, flying parts from damage is more from the strength of the other TFs than low durability"

That's not necessarily a explanation rather than an opinion. And Optimus didn't "fall" from space, They flew here. That's like saying all spaceships can withstand a punch from hulk because they go through the earths atmosphere.

Edit: If i missed a different explanation somewhere else, please point it out and my bad.

@sachmoo: I watched the vid before I commented, the armor did not fall off.

they flew here? they crashed here. are you seriously comparing their landing to spaceships? that is pure fanboyism

obviously your a guy who downplays all the transformer feats and exaggerates hulks feats. and arguing with you will get no one nowhere.

Also, the blasts from the chitauri speeders were enough to blow up a car if it was a direct hit, and lift and send cars in the air if landed next to them.

I counted 20 ships which were all letting off continuous shots at the Hulk. I literally tried to count the shots, and although i couldn't manually freeze frame it fast enough to count them all, i did get up to 60. And as @risingbean said earlier, he "got a bloody nose for his troubles. So safe to say, none of Optimus primes energy shots will do anything unless he can replicate the chitauri ships. We have seen him survive explosions, that wont do much as far as killing or Koing him. Could deal some knockback, but thats it. We have seen him tank bullets, so all of Primes bullets would do even less. And the only time The hulks skin was pierced was after he was drained of gamma radiation or supposedly cured. He was weakened.

Im not sure why your popping off at me right now.Chill, these are mere arguments.

But i just watched the scene literally a minute ago. Its playing in the background as i type. He punches it, they slide back a few more feet, the things back body keeps going forward cause of the momentum, the armor begins to separate, some pieces fall off, and iron man shoots a rocket in some open wound under the armor. that is exactly what happened.

Yes, the autobots flew here and then crash landed here. I mean, am i missing something? The guy stated they survived 'falling' through the atmosphere. I was stating that they didn't just 'Fall', they flew here by whatever means of travel they use to launch themselves here. They did survive the crash, that's all good and well.

@sachmoo: You may want to note Abomination was the one piercing Hulk's skin. It wasn't just some random foe, it was a guy outmuscling Hulk at the time.

I can downplay too.

hulk punching the whale is nothing, the whale was already dipping, he just crushed its head which obviously can kill it adding to its downwards momentum. that is not much of a feat too if you add to the fact that it was moving as slow as hell

when the chi whatever we're firing at hulk, not all of the shots were on target, many hit the rooftop hulk was standing on and it only cracked it. that many shots only put a hole through.

@sachmoo: now your splitting hairs. though they did fall through the atmosphere, go watch it again. if a rocket can completely destroy a whale, then hulks punching feat is nothing.

and I am baron Von Santa, I'm just editing a list which I keep on this account.

@van_cere: I guessed as much based on how you vulgar, and aggressive you argue. And I'm not splitting hairs. They had to of been launched here. The auto bots cannot fly in base form, they need to copy jets when they get here. They also intended to come here because Bubble Bee called them here. They didn't just fall off their planet and land here. Plus they weren't the first to come here coupled with they are seemingly more advanced THan regular humans. They must have known about space travel, so going through the atmosphere was in their calculations. The crash landing could be somewhat of a feet, but that doesnt translate to a battle. And no, stopping the huge leviathan which had a ton of momentum, with one punch by the much smaller hulk who had minimal momentum is the feat. Try and downplay all you want, your just denying what happened in the movie. Either way, I am Still waiting on why hulk is weak when it comes to piercing and slashing attacks. Until that is proven, I don't see a way for Optimus to out down Hulk.

Oh, and as far as some of the shots missing but landing next to him, I addressed that. Even the shots that landed near cars were able to lift them several feet in the air. The hulk resisted those too.

@sachmoo: did it? you really should watch the movie again.

- Even a little doctor decepticon was able to survive in the crushing depths of the abyss. Their cybertronian armour is pretty darn tank. Scorponok was able to survive and A-10 and AC-130 assault. Megatron was able to survive an assault from F22's, Prime and Autobots before Sam shoved the cube in his chest. Brawl survived an Autobot assault and repeated assaults from soldiers and finally dies by Bumblebee. Prime himself survived energy shots from Megatron who's energy shots tore through Sentinel Prime. Their armour is far superior than anything on Earth.

- Chitauri weaponry did lackluster damage, couldn't even put Iron Man down or Captain America. So Hulk tanking a crapton of that isn't very impressive. Chitauri tech wasn't even as good as Earth tech. And Cybertron tech >>> Earth tech. Hulk isn't tanking their weaponry.

- Prime would be Mach 3 considering Jetfire was a Blackbird Jet. Prime is far more agile.

- Hulk is stronger, not as fast or agile, and isn't durable enough.

Prime's offensive output would tear Hulk up easy.

@monsterstomp: agreed, though hulks healing can help with Optimus's cannon, which is not that powerful. it hit megatrons shoulder and all it did was spin him around. though it IS megatron, who then blasted prime several blocks away and into a building lol. his fighting abilities, speed, and sword and hook combo is going to be the deciding factor here.

@baron_von_santa: Prime didn't get a good shot on Megatron then. But when Prime saved Sam from a doctor that was about to saw his head off, Prime sent both Megatron and Starscream flying with his cannons.

@monsterstomp: then proceeded to fight all three, including that hugeass helicopter whom he later killed. guys wicked powerful

@baron_von_santa: Prime was a boss. Can't wait to see what he's capable of in Age of Extinction.

@monsterstomp: yeah, he sure is, people often underestimate him because he looks fragile, and looks like he is made of some crappy earth metal.

wonder if I should take a girl out to see that movie.

@monsterstomp: Scorpinok may have survived the attack by air support but he was falling apart. It's unclear if he even took a hit because they blanketed him with fire. Odds are most of the damage was done by shrapnel.

Jazz got torn in half by Megatron. Optimus tore apart Grindor, and removed Star Scream's arm before he was impaled by Megatron. The Fallen had Optimus tear off his face. The Military took some decepticons down with earth weapons. It's not like the Transformers were impervious. Calling them far superior is giving them too much credit. And while Cybertronian plasma may be better then Earth tech, Earth tech worked well enough.

Iron Man's Armor (with the exception of IM 3 which was all test stage stuff) has been shown to be pretty beasty. It's taken fire from F-22's, it tanked a cannon round from a tank. It held up for a time against Thor and resisted Vanko's energy whips which was cutting through cars like it was a lightsaber. So he got banged up a bit by the chitauri. As for Cap, we don't know what his armor was made of, only that it resisted a single blast which knocked him down and obviously hurt him. Iron man took five or more blasts and while getting knocked around, Stark wasn't seriously injured. Starktech is pretty high end most of the time. It's actually shown more durability then the Transformers.

Prime may be more agile. But Hulk doesn't have to hit him as often. One good shot by ol' Green Genes is a tide turner. Moving in close will all but assure Hulk lands hits. We've already seen Hulk tank energy weapons so that won't work.

As for Hulk's durability, in his two outings he has had four times where he seemed to feel any pain. The sonic generator hurt, but caused no damage. Abomination (who is on Hulk's level) put the hurt on him until Hulk got mad. Thor did a bit and the Chitauri gangbang incident. The worst actual damage Hulk took was when Blonksy put his elbow spike into Hulk's chest. He got a bloody nose from the Chitauri. Prime got stuck in the chest and died. I'm sure Hulk could recreate that showing with an I beam from the local construction site.

- Its unclear if he took a hit because that blanketed him with fire? Have to ever seen what an A-10 jet could do? They can bust tanks and bunkers with ease. Scorpnok was unfazed by that assault, but as soon as an AC-130 assault came, yes Scorpnok evaded. Moreover, those pilots had pretty accurate aim since it was danger close. I don't see Hulk tanking all that punishment.

- Jazz was torn apart by Megatron. Strength feat for Megatron. Optimus tore Grindor's head apart and lobbed Starscream's arm off with Cybertronian weapons. Most feats you listed were feats other Cybertronians achieved on another. Which Decepticon's were taken down by Earth weapons? Every Decepticon that faced Earth's weaponry took a ton of punishment before falling. Far more punishment than Hulk could tank.

- Stark's tech is more durable than Transformers? Please. Chitauri energy weapons that did lacklustre damage knocked him around, F22's actually shredded him up, a tank shell knocked him out of the sky, heck even fireworks knocked Iron Man back. Prime crash landed from space, tanked energy weapons from Megatron, tanked missiles from Shockwave just off the top of my head. That is far more high-end than what Iron Man has tanked.

- Hulk hasn't tanked anything as powerful as Prime's weaponry. Those energy weapons did jack all. To be honest, Hulk wouldn't last long against Prime's bullets. He'll tank a few, but Prime's tech >> Earth's.

- Megatron stuck Prime with a cheap shot and with Cybertronian grade equipment. You say Hulk got a bloody nose from Chitauri weaponry and has a bone stuck in his chest... That's low-end. Prime takes Hulk out.

@monsterstomp There was so much dust you don't see if Scorpinok takes it directly. Tanks don't move like Scorpinok (not that it matters because rounds landing in the same area would dust a tank) and bunkers do not move at all. I'm saying we don't see if the Decepticon actually tanks a direct hit. As for danger close, they were aware of where their own guys were and where not to shoot so as to avoid area of effect casualties. That does not mean they are using magic sights to ensure they hit their target. That fact may also be what allowed Scorpinok to survive, wounded as it was.

The Decepticons did take more effort to damage from Earth weapons then they did from Cybertronian weapons. The problem we are having is that although it took a greater effort to hurt Decepticons, they did get hurt. Hulk took no damage from the attacks the Army hit him with. The closest we have is that the sonic generator caused pain without damage. Your opinion that Hulk can't tank what the Decepticons did is your opinion and based on what I just stated backwards.

Chitauri weapons were blowing up cars, knocking over skyscrapers. Did they kill the heroes of the story? Nope. But you're underselling them. Based on Iron Man's previous showings, the fact he was getting ragdolled speaks volumes. The miniguns and Tankround did minimal damage. He wasn't shredded too much beyond the cosmetic. He had some issues with his repulsors during his run in with the F-22's, but that was an early model he was testing.

Prove he won't last long against Primes weapons. I can show Hulk tanking a ton of weapons. If you want to shortsell the blasters from the Chitauri sleds, explain why they are weak. It's easier for me to deal with that burden of proof as Prime went down to a guy who hasn't shown the strength feats Hulk has pushing a sword into Prime, and simply tearing Jazz in two. Sure Megatron is tough, but Hulk has outdone him. And then when I think back to the trilogy and how many broken, shredded, destroyed Transformers there were. It was the rule, not the exception for them to dismember each other.

Hulk had a gamma strengthened bone spur lacerate him when stabbed by the Abomination. A guy who was stronger then Hulk for 90% of their fight. I wouldn't call that a low end feat. Not as low as Transformers losing to the military and Shia Labueouf. Outside of that he really hasn't been pushed too hard.

Lets just hope the All Spark can bring Prime back so he can make Micheal Bay more money.

Edit to clarify a few points.

He was the car that Stark and Bruce rode off at the ending of the Avengers, they're friends.

:-)

- That much firepower shot in a 10 meter radius is bound to hit something. You aren't assuming Scorpnok dodged a majority are you? The planes shot in a pretty clean area. I'd hate to use another film as a reference point but Nam-Ek took one bullet from an A-10 which sent him flying. Scorpnok was completely unfazed by that assault, then he eventually evaded after the AC-130's assault. I doubt even Spider-Man would dodged every bullet in the area of effect.

- You still haven't shown an instance when Earth weaponry alone has taken out a Transformer. Aside from the huge Rail-Gun that took out Devastator by firing a huge shot at Mach 7, not one Transformer has fallen by Earth's tech alone. As for it being my opinion that Hulk couldn't take likely punishment as the Transformers--we go by what they've shown here. Just because Hulk was unfazed by F22 minguns, 50 cals, and chitauri weaponry that did jack all, doesn't mean he could tank a rain of missiles, bullets and other gunfire. Hulk was reverted back to his norm when falling from 30,000 feet or so. Optimus Prime tanked a fall from space.

- Speaks volumes? I've already proven what Cybertronian armour has taken. That alone dwarfs anything Iron Man has shown.

- Again, we've been over this. Hulk hasn't faced the firepower Prime has. You can't exactly prove that Hulk can tank it, because he has jack all to show for it. By feats, the Transformers are more durable than Hulk. By feats, Cybertronian tech can and has torn through that durability. So by feats, Prime's armaments can shred Hulk up. As for the Chiaturi weapons, they didn't even take down the building Hulk was standing on. A few missiles can do more damage than that. In regards to Megatron tearing Jazz into two, Jazz was one of the smaller robots, moreover he is much harder than steel. That's actually an impressive feat for Megatron, the same Megatron who pushed a submarine flying out of the ocean. Whilst Hulk couldn't even tear a jet into two.

- You still haven't proven the Transformer's being beaten by military alone. So I'd stop brining that up.

@baron_von_santa: @donnergeist@monsterstompI think Hulk takes this due to speed. I know that sounds ridiculous, but his reactions to catch that pilot that tried to emergency escape the fighter jet show that he can probably dodge a lot of the attacks movie Prime has to offer. It's been a while since I watched the films but I don't recall any impressive combat speed feats for Prime.

And I think we can all agree, if Hulk gets close enough to grab hold and start smashing and tearing pieces off of Prime it's game over.

@rick_grayson: he saw the pilot pulling the chord. and he was right on top of him too.

prime has casual strength, enough to be able to ignore huge trees, cars, and tear entire walls off buildings. stopping a truck just by placing his foot in front of it is a pretty cool feat too. he may not be as strong as hulk, but he is close.

@rick_grayson: Catching a jet? Jets don't have that much speed or manoeuvrability when put in that situation. Hulk is fast but no faster than Prime, who's Blackbird attachments can clock Mach 3.

I don't think the .50 cal bullets hurt him, I think they just made him mad. (Kind of like if a bunch of flies kept landing on you.) They haven't showcased hulk's healing factor much in the movies yet but we also haven't really seen hulk with any abrasions or contusions either. I am not convinced that the weaponry of Optimus would do any crippling damage...hell they would hurt him for sure, but we all know what happens to the hulk when he gets hurt. He is kind of a no limits fallacy character which could overpower Optimus. Morals On means Optimus would be holding back which is something you don't want to do to an enraged hulk.

Solid fight, would take quite a long time and Optimus would put up a valiant effort but I think Hulk would incap him eventually...(Tear off a leg, rip out an engine, etc.)