Comic Vine News

121 Comments

Five Biggest Ways DC's 'The New 52' Has Changed the Superman in Action Comics

The DC Universe is no longer the one that we knew. Here are some of the big changes with the Superman. There will be some spoilers.

In the second week of DC's 'The New 52," Action Comics #1 arrives and gives us a very different looking Superman. Set in a his early days, we don't start from the very beginning of Superman's career but in a time before his first run-in with Batman and Green Lantern in last week's Justice League #1.

Grant Morrison and Rags Morales have taken over the reigns on guiding us along Superman's journey to becoming one of the world's biggest superheroes. The stage is being set and this clearly isn't the Superman we've gotten used to over the last couple decades.

No Caption Provided

If you've never read a Superman comic or if you've been reading for years, this is a perfect jumping on point. There will be some minor spoilers below. It's strongly suggested you read the issue to get the full feel of the new experience (I gave the issue a five out of five). Here are the biggest changes Action Comics #1 has given Superman.

== TEASER ==

The costume

No Caption Provided

This isn't the Superman costume we've seen many times. It makes sense that Superman in his early days might have a make-shift costume. He simply is concerned with fighting evil and corruption. He doesn't need a skin tight costume. It always felt odd how easily he got his costume. We know he's going to somehow end up with his Kryptonian armor suit but for now, this makes sense. It adds a tiny bit of realism rather than witnessing him in full costume from the beginning.

Superman's a bit of a jerk

No Caption Provided
No Caption Provided

There's been ongoing commentary that Superman's been a jerk over the years. That was pretty much how he was during the Silver Age. Countless covers have been commented on showing absurd scenes where Superman appeared to have little concern over others.

In the "New 52," Superman is fighting for good. He is determined to put a stop to crime. His methods aren't the ones we've seen lately. Superman has done things by the book. He's a boy scout. He follows the letter of the law.

This Superman does things his own way. He'll barge in and intimidate the bad guys. He'll use his strength and bully those that normally bully others. The biggest change is he doesn't work with the police department. He is a vigilante. He is on the run from them because he chooses to think of himself as above the law. Ironically, Superman was a bit of a super-powered jerk in his very first appearance as well.

Superman can't fly

No Caption Provided

Similar to being a jerk, Superman is back to not being able to fly. Originally Superman could only leap tall buildings in a single bound. Eventually he gained the ability to fly. With that, he was soon flying out into space and doing all sorts of other things he originally couldn't. This is where Superman's character started to decline. Being too powerful made him boring. He had the ability to take on anyone. Writers had to come with new ways month after month. He was depowered slightly but the ability to fly at super-speed still gave him an edge that should make him more than the villains can handle.

There's also the question of how can he fly. How is he able to defy the laws of gravity. Being able to only leap makes more sense. He'll most likely regain the ability to fly. For now, leaping is all he needs.

Superman can be injured

No Caption Provided

If Superman can't be hurt by anything other than Kryptonite, again, the stories can get repetitive. Writers had to resort to creating different varieties of Kryptonite just to add more obstacles in his path. After defeating Lex Luthor and Brainiac time and time again, it took the creation of Doomsday to finally give Superman a real challenge. Even the state of dying was something Superman could easily overcome. We want tough heroes but we need ones that are actually risking their lives when fighting evil. Otherwise it's a given that they will always win and the suspense is thrown out the window.

Lois and Clark aren't working together

No Caption Provided

Shouldn't Lois and Clark always be working together? Isn't that how their relationship develops? They have the competition between each other to try to get the big scoop. Clark also has to sit back and watch Lois swoon over Superman. How well do they even know each other? Clark is clearly friends with Jimmy but Lois seems bitter towards him, most likely because they are not working together. How will Lois eventually fall for Clark if they aren't both working at the Daily Planet?

We have seen a preview for Superman #1, presumably set in the present. Lois and Clark are working together only...Lois now has a new boyfriend. We'll have to keep reading to see how long these differences stick and if Superman will eventually become closer to the version we've had the last few decades.

121 Comments

Avatar image for GunGunW
GunGunW

1027

Forum Posts

5

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 5

Edited By GunGunW

The New 52 has managed to turn me away from my all time favorite super hero... how sad

Avatar image for aero_gt
Aero_gt

846

Forum Posts

3

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Aero_gt

I love everything so far minus the cape.^3^
Avatar image for knightofcydonia
Noctis

1415

Forum Posts

30

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Noctis

This Superman is AWESOME!!!

Avatar image for azune
Azune

1

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Azune

It would appear to me that they have decided that the way to make Superman move forward is to make him decided LESS super. If he can be wounded so easily and can't fly then he is much less than he was before. I am more of a marvel guy but did enjoy watching Smallville that incorporates many of these type of changes routinely. However in a comic I'm not so sure it will be popular. I have always followed Hulk and one of things that really made it worse was when they went through a stage of making him weaker...discounting Grey Hulk...I kinda liked him :)

Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@Postacrat:  
Yeah, no worries. DC has not done a good job of making sure that people know that this story takes place in the past and Superman will gradually power up.  
Avatar image for primmaster64
Primmaster64

21668

Forum Posts

16273

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Primmaster64
@Postacrat: This is only temporary dude. He'll be powerful soon enough. :D
Avatar image for postacrat
Postacrat

720

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Postacrat
@Jekylhyde14: Oh...well that's not so bad...
Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@Postacrat:  
 
People, people, people... He's only at this weakened power level temporarily. Remember that the first issue takes place 5 1/2 years before current continuity. He will be powered back up to full Superman strength by the time Action Comics reaches the present. Hell, he may even be more powerful by then. Morrison is a fan of the Silver Age, after all. But, don't worry, he'll have all his powers back soon. 
Avatar image for phillipjpark
phillipjpark

7

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By phillipjpark

I guess I never have to read any comic cause comicvine will spoil the whole thing for me.

Avatar image for untammed
untammed

466

Forum Posts

208

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

Edited By untammed
@Jordanstine said:
So basically they turned young Superman into Batman...  
 
No Caption Provided

Or actually, they turned young Superman into another Hal Jordan.
 
What young Superman is growing up to be in an alternate non-flashpoint universe.  Maybe in this alternate world, Hal Jordan is the big green boy scout.
What young Superman is growing up to be in an alternate non-flashpoint universe.  Maybe in this alternate world, Hal Jordan is the big green boy scout.


sweet!
Avatar image for cancer_the_conqueror
Cancer the Conqueror

83

Forum Posts

8

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1


Perhaps it was just a summer of having nothing to do that grew some otherwise over-inflated expectations for the New 52, but out of all the issues I have managed to collect so far, ACTION COMICS really fufilled my desires for a new kind of Superman. The improvosational look--T-Shirt, jeans, and boots--is a great look for a Supes just starting out, and while there was a debate over Clark Kent's worry about alienating himself due to his fantastic powers, Grant Morrison doesn't seem to write or think the same way as J. Michael Kryzinski (Did I spell his name right?). 
 
This was a very gug-ho adventure, the kind that comicbooks are supposed to be. I've come to realize that my high school years of reading comics has been spoiled; I've always read story arcs in paperback collections, where the anticipation to getting to the conclusion came only as fast as i could turn the page. As a result, even though some books I've gotten, such as STORMWATCH or BATWING have been excellent, they were very short and didn't seem to fufull a whole summer of speculation. ACTION, on the other hand, worked great: We get a glimpse of Superman that's new yet familiar, we see the constrasts of how this new universe will play out, and there is, in my opinion, a great balance of action and dialouge that satisfies the script (I've always found that in some action-heavy books, such as SUPERMAN, weren't as satisfactory). Right now, my library computer clock is blinking, so I just want to say I like Morrison's new direction, and can;'t wait to see where it will go next.
Avatar image for postacrat
Postacrat

720

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Postacrat

At last finally every one get's their wish, a weaker superman has finally been made to please fan's.  Now they can openly make him the heel and loser of all battle threads, He is now completely inferior to someone like Thor or Hulk that should make a lot of people happy, and he can now be hurt wow what an amazing feat....I cannot believe the guy I grew up with from pencil to Christopher Reeves is being turned into a complete weakling now because for some reason his strength level, makes him a bad character.  No don't create better villains, don't create better issues for superman or find better writers for the character let's just de-power him so he can get his a** kicked so people can have a better story?  How about we do away with the Lame Lois Lane thing, how about we give him different threats instead of Lex Luthor and Darkseid all the time?  How about we stop making him weaker with the Justice League but unstoppable alone, be more consistent.  I mean there are ton's of reason that Superman should have been rebooted but taking away his power is not one of them.  He can't fly now, he just jumps around like the Hulk.  How is this guy to be considered a savior for earth if he can't even get around it, I guess there will be no more last minute saves half way around the world by superman the next time a Volcano blow's up.  He's no longer the world class hero anymore personally with this new whack power setting I can't see him handling any issues outside of a 400 mile radius from Metropolis.  Everyone want's superman to be injured why?  I mean I personally feel like anybody who is as old as I am and have been following Superman since the made him better than his building leaping counterpart should view this as a set back for superman.  He evolved from the building leaping in the 80's nobody cared about why superman could fly or why he was so invincible or strong, it was superman and that's all there was to it no reality induced complaints about a fictional comic book character could change that.  Now for the new age people don't mind the whimsical fantasy exploits of the characters they like(Thor, Wolverine, Pheonix, Gladiator, Sentry, Blue Marvel, Hyperion etc), and demand reality and logical reasoning for the "overpowered characters" the don't(Superman mainly).  If this is how they are going to reboot superman then I'll just remember his greatness as it was, have your good stories at the expense of a legendary hero with legendary power.  Everyone swears Thor can beat superman and boast about all these extreme things Thor has done, but I've never heard one complaint about him being over powered the way they go on about Supes.  In closing this is all just my opinion and if this is the new Supes the only thing I like is the new Kryptonian armor looking suit, other than that as far as I'm concerned Superman can now RIP.  There I vented....

Avatar image for tbone1225
tbone1225

277

Forum Posts

147

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 20

User Lists: 3

Edited By tbone1225

Let's not forget that Morrison's Superman pits truth and justice against the American Way. This is a post-Nixon Superman that is not the lapdog of the federal government (ie. Miller's Superman).

Avatar image for nonnu
nonnu

6

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By nonnu
@Jekylhyde14: You funny.
Complaining so much about "possible but not likely" personal attacks from me, when you started it. Funny. But in deed, it is my fault to waste so much time on you. Stop going to Comicon with "uniform" and grow up.
As I said I find this lack of creativity disturbing as well as your lack of vision and reason.
Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@nonnu said:

@Jekylhyde14:   Where do you think Morrison's will be in 10/15 years time, if not in the 50-cent bin?
And i never said "that Morrison should be doing things Byrne's way instead of doing this revamp"
 
and bye the way,  if you "studied creative writing" and "have no idea what point (i'm) trying to make with that "briefing" mumbo jumbo." then you have just told me why you really cant even imagine what I am saying. Even more, you don't know how to work as a creative writer commercially. That's plain sad. 
Get this through your thick skull, i'm not even saying that Morisson is a good or a bad wrighter, or even that the story is crap. What I saying, and that you clearly don't understand, is that it could have been much better. 

Besides regarding DC management your Mr Morisson says I'm right in that interview:

"DC is relaunching its entire line – is there some desperation there?
There's always going to be a bit of that because comics sales are so low, people are willing to try anything these days. It's just plummeting. It's really bad from month to month. May was the first time in a long time that no comic sold over 100,000 copies, so there's a decline."
 And I'll end the way I've started with an upgrade: I find this lack of creativity disturbing as well as your lack of vision and reason.
OOOH! You wound me with your personal attacks! Maybe if I respected you in any way, shape, or form your insults would mean something. As it is, they're just funny to me. Maybe I can't understand what you're saying because you can barely "wright." Your points are short, muddled, and they lack clarity. You left a big empty space in quotations after you said "where there's a briefing there's '                         '". What "                      " is only you and God know (money? orders? women? your grammar?). If I feel embarrassed about anything it's spending so much time arguing with you. You don't respond to my points, you can barely make your own, and I'm starting to wonder if you really can read in a traditional sense of the word.  
 
Unfortunately, that quote you posted at the end is true. Comic sales are in the toilets and the industry is in big trouble. Part of the problem is the Internet because people can just download the weekly books for free due to pirating. The other part of the problem is semi-literate fans like you who wouldn't know a good comic if it bit them on the ass and who are frightened by change like a gopher running from its own shadow. You should feel proud to be a large part of killing something we all enjoy!
Avatar image for brit
Brit

419

Forum Posts

5384

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

Edited By Brit

they ripped off Superboy's costume design!

Avatar image for nonnu
nonnu

6

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By nonnu
@Jekylhyde14:   Where do you think Morrison's will be in 10/15 years time, if not in the 50-cent bin?
And i never said "that Morrison should be doing things Byrne's way instead of doing this revamp"
 
and bye the way,  if you "studied creative writing" and "have no idea what point (i'm) trying to make with that "briefing" mumbo jumbo." then you have just told me why you really cant even imagine what I am saying. Even more, you don't know how to work as a creative writer commercially. That's plain sad. 
Get this through your thick skull, i'm not even saying that Morisson is a good or a bad wrighter, or even that the story is crap. What I saying, and that you clearly don't understand, is that it could have been much better. 

Besides regarding DC management your Mr Morisson says I'm right in that interview:
"DC is relaunching its entire line – is there some desperation there?
There's always going to be a bit of that because comics sales are so low, people are willing to try anything these days. It's just plummeting. It's really bad from month to month. May was the first time in a long time that no comic sold over 100,000 copies, so there's a decline."
 
And I'll end the way I've started with an upgrade: I find this lack of creativity disturbing as well as your lack of vision and reason.
Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@nonnu said:

@Jekylhyde14:  
Really who are you? Are YOU Morrison? Do know Morrison? Because you seam to be taking this to personal.
I never said "Morrison doing this version of Superman for money", and you can not BELIEVE in good  faith that he would say that he was "told" to do so. wouldn't that jeopardize his career as a creative? 
How dumb you think , that I think, that he is? I'm not saying he's a genius but i sure he is not dumb.
Maybe you didn't understood, what I meant, so i'll keep it simple: DC had to know what was wrong to ask a revamp, so there had be a "briefing", and were there is a briefing there is "______________". 
Therefore when Morrison said he "Wanted" to do, it had to be according to that briefing. And DC comics either would say yes or no. Period!  
Or Morrison is God almighty at DC Comic and what ever he S**** is law?
I gess not.
Regarding my Byrne point of view, you can blame him for what happened when he left the character. Other writers (and DC creative staff) if they were good enough SHOULD have started an organic evolution on the character (you were not the same person you were 5 years ago or were you?), even with Byrne at the helm. Don't blame Byrne, blame DC Comics creative direction, and thats why the killed him in the first place, the needed a big bang to see if people would care. And if you don't understand that, you should not be ranting like you have been.
 
You might be a fan,  great fan, and you are looking at this with a fan's eye. I'm looking it as a creative exercise. So, when you use sarcasm, (Jekylhyde14"Alright, Mr. Creative, since you think you know better than men who have been working with and thinking about these characters for years then how would you creatively write Superman?")  like you have, andyou still don't have a clue to what I am saying, it almost seams that you have an agenda on protecting you precious "Morrison's Superdude". Well.. why continue?   One last try: Please, take your eyes out of comic books. Stop  bowing to Mr. Morrison. And look with a critic eye to what as happen at DC Comics and at Marvel in the last ... say 30 years. Compare them with cold critic eye, and you will see that history repeats its self. If you still cant see what I mean, you might as well keep calling me stubborn, as I might as well call def, dumb and blind. Sorry. And bye-the-way... let's see in 10/15 years time how is awesome Morrison's Superdude evolving.

Honestly, I have no idea what point you're trying to make with that "briefing" mumbo jumbo. That "briefing" only happened in your paranoid imagination. I'll repeat what I said before, I don't believe DC at all dictated to Morrison how this version of Superman should be. I'll quote from that interview I posted in my last reply since you obviously didn't read it. Morrison said about his version of Superman: " I'm not using the costumes, just jeans and t-shirt, a Bruce Springsteen Superman. The original champion of the repressed Superman, the socialism and stuff, I wanted a bit of that. ... and I was quite surprised that they let me do everything and let me change it so radically."  This says, to me, that Morrison was allowed to have his way in this Action Comics revamp because he was surprised the editorial staff let him do the things he wanted to do. Maybe this is because DC knew what was wrong and what needed to change as you suggested, but from appearances this looks like all Morrison's idea. If he lied about that then why wouldn't he also lie when they asked him if he thought there was any desperation on DC's part with this revamp? He gave them an honest reply. If he was DC's lapdog like you think he is wouldn't he have answered: "Oh no, sir, everything's just fine over here at DC." A lot of his Action Comics stuff also mirrors his Superman 2000 pitch from back in 1999 which I also mentioned earlier and you ignored as if it was of no consequence. Your best tactic in this argument seems to be ignoring my points and all the facts while just reiterating whatever it is you believe.  
 
Let me repeat myself a THIRD time: I DO NOT LIKE JOHN BYRNE'S VERSION OF SUPERMAN. I'm not just blaming Byrne for the material that came after him. I'm also blaming him for the material HE WROTE. I thought it was dull, overrated, and set a bad precedence for the character of Superman which was forced on all the other writers that took the character on afterwards. Mark Waid, who did such a brilliant job on Kingdom Come, was kept far away from Superman by the DC editorial staff because he had no interest in doing a rendition of Byrne's version. The Superman 2000 proposal that I mentioned earlier was dismissed by the DC editorial board because it changed the character that Byrne had developed too drastically. Now, doesn't that sound like the kind of editorial mandate that you were accusing Grant of following just a little while earlier?  
 
Now getting to your bit about looking at all this with a (ahem) "critic eye," I don't feel like I've ever done anything but use my critical sense when trying to determine which comics I like and which I just hate. I studied creative writing, literature, and theater when I was in college (not bragging, but it's the truth). I understand literary criticism. When I look at the work Grant Morrison accomplishes, I'm always impressed. He delivers layered stories with action, intelligence, symbolism, and an eye towards meta-fiction (a personal favorite of mine). When I show off his work to friends of mine who are into literature and have no background in comics they are always impressed and want to read more. When I show them Post-Crisis Superman their eyes go dim and I find myself explaining how a lot of comic books simply turn into science fiction soap operas after awhile. As an English major I will tell you without hesitation that none of the Post-Crisis Superman material (including your precious John Byrne's work) even touches Morrison's writing in complexity, maturity, and creativity. Let me point out, that it's a much more creative endeavor to look at a character, find out what he means to you, and do him your own way rather then just trying to pick up where the last guy left off. That's just what Morrison is doing here. Let me also point out the hypocrisy inherent in your argument that Morrison should be doing things Byrne's way instead of doing this revamp. Didn't Byrne's version COME FROM A REVAMP? 
 
So I'll admit, I'm a fan of Morrison. A big fan. He's my favorite comic book writer who still works in the mainstream. Superman is my favorite character. I've argued for years that Superman needed a change in characterization from what he's been like since 1987. I'll admit I've invested more time and effort into this then is probably necessary. As a result, I'm very pleased that they let Morrison do his version of Action Comics. So, yeah, I do take it personally when people waltz into a message board without even reading the issue, without reading the rest of the comments, probably without knowing too much about the background of the issue at hand, and drop some smarmy comment about my favorite comic book writer needing to be "more creative." I'm pretty sure you're not even reading all of my arguments anymore which probably makes this a supreme waste of time, but here we are. You should be reading Action Comics because it's a damn good comic book, but since you're so hung up on the past and Byrne's super yuppie: You can find his entire run in the 50-cent bin. 
Avatar image for nonnu
nonnu

6

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By nonnu
@Jekylhyde14:  
Really who are you? Are YOU Morrison? Do know Morrison? Because you seam to be taking this to personal.
I never said "Morrison doing this version of Superman for money", and you can not BELIEVE in good  faith that he would say that he was "told" to do so. wouldn't that jeopardize his career as a creative? 
How dumb you think , that I think, that he is? I'm not saying he's a genius but i sure he is not dumb.
Maybe you didn't understood, what I meant, so i'll keep it simple: DC had to know what was wrong to ask a revamp, so there had be a "briefing", and were there is a briefing there is "______________". 
Therefore when Morrison said he "Wanted" to do, it had to be according to that briefing. And DC comics either would say yes or no. Period!  
Or Morrison is God almighty at DC Comic and what ever he S**** is law?
I gess not.
Regarding my Byrne point of view, you can blame him for what happened when he left the character. Other writers (and DC creative staff) if they were good enough SHOULD have started an organic evolution on the character (you were not the same person you were 5 years ago or were you?), even with Byrne at the helm. Don't blame Byrne, blame DC Comics creative direction, and thats why the killed him in the first place, the needed a big bang to see if people would care. And if you don't understand that, you should not be ranting like you have been.
 
You might be a fan,  great fan, and you are looking at this with a fan's eye. I'm looking it as a creative exercise. So, when you use sarcasm, (Jekylhyde14"Alright, Mr. Creative, since you think you know better than men who have been working with and thinking about these characters for years then how would you creatively write Superman?")  like you have, andyou still don't have a clue to what I am saying, it almost seams that you have an agenda on protecting you precious "Morrison's Superdude". Well.. why continue?
  
One last try: Please, take your eyes out of comic books. Stop  bowing to Mr. Morrison. And look with a critic eye to what as happen at DC Comics and at Marvel in the last ... say 30 years. Compare them with cold critic eye, and you will see that history repeats its self.
If you still cant see what I mean, you might as well keep calling me stubborn, as I might as well call def, dumb and blind.
Sorry. And bye-the-way... let's see in 10/15 years time how is awesome Morrison's Superdude evolving.
Avatar image for cincyducksfan35
cincyducksfan35

131

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 0

Edited By cincyducksfan35

Is this a 3 or 4 dollar book?

Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@nonnu said:

@Jekylhyde14:   Clearlly you didn't understand what I said, or don't want to understand. 

You said: "Leave him the way John Byrne made him. That character was a stiff, boring yuppie and is played out. If you've been reading Superman for the last few years then you'd know how bad its gotten." 
 
well.. that's precisly my point. The evolution form of Superman before Crisis to After Crisis was great, but as you said very well and I quote: "that character was a stiff, boring yuppie (...) (and in) the last few years (..) how bad its gotten."
And why is that? Crative righting any one?
Byrne give great the guide lines, now it was up to DC and their writers to start the evolution of the character, if they were not able to do the job, don't blame Byrne. This is like blaming a map maker because you missed an exit while you were talking one the phone while driving. 
Regarding the fact that I wrote something about. "focus groups" and that it is "laughable", let me tell you something, if you work in a creative environment you know what I meant, If you don't I'll explain... money. That is what it's all about. Not good characters nor great storys, it's about money: Marketing numbers (selling less), formal or informal focus groups or forums (People don't identify with a "self righteous" Superman, because people are bitter), this is how writers end up "appeasing" the mob and their job.
I can not care less what the Grant Morrison has done before Superman, because the specificity of that work is complete different. Yes he did a great job then because his "worries" were completely different. But no one is able to do great job all the time, and this is one of those cases, were e completely missed the ball. For instance if you were to get Alan Moore, I would not expect him to make a Watchmen-Superman or a V-Superman, I would expect him or any other, Morrison included, to take those 80 years of history and make some sense out of this.  
 
You said: "He CREATIVELY wanted to toss the dull character that Byrne left us with in 1987 and create a new man in his place." and I say "DO IT! BUT DO IT WELL!"
Regarding you saying that I'm "being stubborn because (I'm) afraid of change. (...) It's happening no matter what." Let me use irony to say  that, that makes perfect sense for from someone who likes the character. That "no matter what" will end on a second "death of Superman" within 10 years time. And that's what happens when you don't know what else to do with a character... or why do you think he was killed the first time?   And if you reply that marketing didn't had any part his "Death" then I won't reply because clearly we are speaking two different languages and my stubbornness realizes that is useless against someone who refuses to see the big picture beyond the comic books.
Byrne did not give great guidelines. Byrne is the one who made Superman a stiff, boring yuppie. I've read Man of Steel, I've read most of Byrne's run after it. So far no one has been able to convince me of why it's so great. Byrne's Superman has no real personality. The man has no hobbies, no politics, and his only distinguishing character trait (as I mentioned before) was that he was conflicted over being an alien and over everything he did as Superman. He couldn't lift a finger while he was in his tights without bursting into hysterics over some wrong he felt he may have committed. Meanwhile, that colorful braggart I liked so much in Golden and Silver Age stories was nowhere in sight because Byrne didn't think it was "relatable" enough. His Superman stories really weren't that good. Especially compared to Morrison's whose All-Star Superman won Eisner, Harvey, and Eagle awards. Jurgens and his ilk were only following the path laid out for them by Byrne. They gave us a really stiff and closed minded Superman. I remember in Justice League of America #66 he was snapping at Maxima to dress more conservatively, in Superman: The Man of Steel #37 he suggests a rock concert is going to draw "an unlawful element," and just recently in Grounded he was telling poor, alien refugees that if they wanted to stay on the planet then they'd have to start pulling their  weight. Yeah, lets bring that life of the party back... Believe me, I've read A LOT of Superman. The Byrne and Post-Crisis version is my LEAST favorite. People blame the writers all the time, but part of the problem was so many of them tried to avoid writing this character that they just didn't connect with. Morrison's version is so much more fun, and could possibly rally people behind current social issues.  
 
I still don't buy what you're selling about Morrison doing this version of Superman for money. The man already owns four houses from writing critically acclaimed material (most of which was for Vertigo). He even said in a recent interview that he only took the Action Comics job because they told him they were starting over and that he'd have to creative room to do what he wants: http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/grant-morrison-on-the-death-of-comics-20110822. In that interview he flat out states what he WANTED to do and not what he was TOLD to do or what he thought would sell. In fact, the idea of him writing a socialist Superman is pretty controversial. Not really a market minded decision, wouldn't you say? You feel that DC is doing the revamp to sell more issues, and, yeah, that's probably true. I would never accuse Grant Morrison of selling out like that, though. I respect him on the same level as Alan Moore. 
 
 It's funny that you think they'll pull parachute on this Superman by killing him again since that was the answer they came up with when Byrne's version got so dull (not five years after his debut, I might add). Couldn't have been that great a character if they had to kill him off just to keep things interesting, like YOU suggested, huh? Honestly, I don't think they'll kill off Morrison's Superman. They're keeping the original "Death of Superman" in continuity, so I doubt they'll kill the man off twice. Morrison already wrote his Superman death story in All-Star Superman and it was one of the best series written in the Modern Age. I think Morrison's Superman will stick around for some time. The first issue sold extremely well with the first and second prints selling out. The reception has been mostly positive and it's seemed to bring in a lot of new fans for Superman. I haven't read a more interesting version of the character in the continuity books for years. That says to me Morrison did it right. It's only stubborn, cranky Post-Crisis hold-outs like you that continue to complain over losing a mostly bland character. The funny thing is I bet most of you haven't even given Morrison's version a read. It's a sad state, that. 
Avatar image for praetor_fenix
Praetor_fenix

227

Forum Posts

14

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 2

User Lists: 1

Edited By Praetor_fenix

It's been a while since i cared about a superman story, but this is definitley worth it, he's much more belivable than the big blue boyscout, and now that he's not impervious to damage superman really make you care about what he's doing.

Avatar image for mathematicscore
mathematicscore

172

Forum Posts

10110

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By mathematicscore
@suuperman:   Well said, sir.
Avatar image for mathematicscore
mathematicscore

172

Forum Posts

10110

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By mathematicscore
@Jordanstine: You're outta your depth, son.  Superman was doin' this gig before both of those losers. Go read Superman Chronicles Vol 1 and you'll see what I'm talking about. 
 
This wasn't a change, this was a return to form.
Avatar image for neuron
Neuron

105

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

Edited By Neuron
@Jekylhyde14 said:
@Neuron said:
It's fascinating to see so many people rail against the "boring Boy Scout" Superman that always had the strength to do the right thing.  That's not easy, and you'd better be superpowered if you're going to try it.  More than that, it's the reason that he WAS the icon and symbol he was (and is).  Using intimidation, interrogation, and light torture is Batman's realm.  It's too early to see why Clark's okay with using those methods, but I do give Grant Morrison credit and I'm really curious to see where it goes.  I thought it was a great issue.  But I find it really interesting and more than a little unsettling that so many people are eating up this new Jack Bauer type of guy, willing to go as far as necessary to get what he sees as justice.  Is that really the best possible hero?  Do it to them because they can and will do it to us?  No thanks.  I had no problems with the "old" Superman, but I'm also liking this new take and definitely intend to check out more.
But IS he acting like a Jack Bauer type who's "willing to go as far as necessary"? So far we've only seen him interrogate a guy by scaring the bejesus out of him. It's not like he was electrocuting or water boarding the guy. So far he hasn't killed anybody. Yeah, he's taunted and evaded the police and gone head to head with military tanks but that was more in self-defense and in the interest of protecting civilians. I see this more as a cocky, brash Superman who bucks authority and is actually willing to hold the people in charge accountable. I don't see the ruthless vigilante who's willing to cross lines quite yet.
True, he doesn't kill anyone.  But dropping a guy so that it feels like he's falling to his death is not unlike pouring water over his face so that it feels like he's drowning.  And again, interrogations don't really reconcile with Superman's usual mode of operation and stated beliefs, at least in the past few decades.  The thing with holding people accountable is that one person shouldn't determine who that person accountable is.  Or provide punishment.  He actually is a vigilante now, if he's not working with the police.  How ruthless he becomes remains to be seen.
Avatar image for higher_evolutionary
higher_evolutionary

2127

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

he is not untouchable yaaaaaaaaaay

Avatar image for nonnu
nonnu

6

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By nonnu
@Jekylhyde14:   Clearlly you didn't understand what I said, or don't want to understand. 
You said: "Leave him the way John Byrne made him. That character was a stiff, boring yuppie and is played out. If you've been reading Superman for the last few years then you'd know how bad its gotten." 
 
well.. that's precisly my point. The evolution form of Superman before Crisis to After Crisis was great, but as you said very well and I quote: "that character was a stiff, boring yuppie (...) (and in) the last few years (..) how bad its gotten."
And why is that? Crative righting any one?
Byrne give great the guide lines, now it was up to DC and their writers to start the evolution of the character, if they were not able to do the job, don't blame Byrne. This is like blaming a map maker because you missed an exit while you were talking one the phone while driving. 
Regarding the fact that I wrote something about. "focus groups" and that it is "laughable", let me tell you something, if you work in a creative environment you know what I meant, If you don't I'll explain... money. That is what it's all about. Not good characters nor great storys, it's about money: Marketing numbers (selling less), formal or informal focus groups or forums (People don't identify with a "self righteous" Superman, because people are bitter), this is how writers end up "appeasing" the mob and their job.
I can not care less what the Grant Morrison has done before Superman, because the specificity of that work is complete different. Yes he did a great job then because his "worries" were completely different. But no one is able to do great job all the time, and this is one of those cases, were e completely missed the ball. For instance if you were to get Alan Moore, I would not expect him to make a Watchmen-Superman or a V-Superman, I would expect him or any other, Morrison included, to take those 80 years of history and make some sense out of this.  
 
You said: "He CREATIVELY wanted to toss the dull character that Byrne left us with in 1987 and create a new man in his place." and I say "DO IT! BUT DO IT WELL!"
Regarding you saying that I'm "being stubborn because (I'm) afraid of change. (...) It's happening no matter what." Let me use irony to say  that, that makes perfect sense for from someone who likes the character. That "no matter what" will end on a second "death of Superman" within 10 years time. And that's what happens when you don't know what else to do with a character... or why do you think he was killed the first time?  
And if you reply that marketing didn't had any part his "Death" then I won't reply because clearly we are speaking two different languages and my stubbornness realizes that is useless against someone who refuses to see the big picture beyond the comic books.
Avatar image for innervenom123
InnerVenom123

29886

Forum Posts

1786

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 11

User Lists: 1

Avatar image for jonesdeini
JonesDeini

3874

Forum Posts

224

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 212

User Lists: 9

Edited By JonesDeini
@spiderbat87 said:

Something people should take note of is that Superman is only a jerk to the bad guys and the people that are trying to stop him from helping, your average Joe one the street still see him as a hero its only the government that doesnt trust him.

Bingo, Luthor thinks that "THE" Superman is a jerk as does well...most of rogues so what's the big issue?
Avatar image for i_am_dark
I_Am_Dark

161

Forum Posts

400

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By I_Am_Dark

Glad that they're toning down his invulnerability a bit; he still has to be bullet-proof, though.
Avatar image for sergotron
Sergotron

108

Forum Posts

3

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Sergotron

I wasn't really too much of a fan of the new Superman. Unlike many here I actually liked the old boy scout personality. I am hoping in time he is humbled by future experiences and maturity to turn him back into the character I enjoyed for so many years.

That being said I may have not been a fan of the new Superman, but I did enjoy the writing and art.

Avatar image for primmaster64
Primmaster64

21668

Forum Posts

16273

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Primmaster64

AY....

Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@nonnu said:

@Jekylhyde14: certeinly I did not "work" and "think"  "these characters for years" (your words) but I've been a fan for many years and so to see Superman "reworked" this way makes me wonder if DC Comics has a perfect character (like many on the DC portfolio) but does not know what to do with it. And it's not in the 5 minutes that will take me to write this post that I will solve the problem that the DC writers and artists could not, or would not or were not authorized to figure out in the right way.  That said, i think that, when Superman was created, it was SUPER because there was nothing like him in comic books.  But now there are hundreds like him (Shazam was almost his replica), and if DC continues do "downgrade" Superman, then in the near future it will be senseless to still call him Super.  Superman is one of those characters, like Dr. Manhattan in "The Watchmen", that can afford to look like a jerk without being one because they are "God-like" perfect, unbeatable. What infinite Crisis did a few years ago, and very well, was to retain does God like features but give it some humanity (I bow to Mr. John Byrne).   Remember this: the guy is an Alien!   Why not making him a protector of the earth, like the Green Lanterns for instance. It would be more interesting then making him another Batman.  I recently saw a movie about the CIA onde of the things the said was something like this: "Our failures are known to all, but our successes aren't"... so why not make this the "new tag line" for superman, a silent protector?   Imagine Jor-El would say that he was intended to come to Earth to protect it from a greater "evil", that his infancy and adolescence was the preparation for something dreadful, making him an hero more detached form society like a spy, but and alter-ego still working journalist or as an hot-dog stand seller, whatever.What this is, is the oblivion of  79 years of history and story, and a victory of the marketing department and focus groups. And if look at it, is the same thing happing to Spiderman at Marvel.  And if all of this is not enough, I ask you: if it was you, would you run up and down the street fighting crime wearing jeans and a red cape or would you do it Batman style?

So that's what you would do? Leave him the way John Byrne made him. That character was a stiff, boring yuppie and is played out. If you've been reading Superman for the last few years then you'd know how bad its gotten. This is the first time I've seen his personality become interesting and develop a little flare. It's more in tune to the vigilante he was in the Golden Age, the arrogant braggart he was in the Silver Age, and the champion he was in the Bronze. John Byrne's Superman never had anything interesting about him besides the fact that he hated being alien and was afraid to be Superman. If you want to see good balance between Superman's god-like personality and his more down to Earth roots then read All-Star Superman or at least the Silver Age. I can't think of anything more dull than John Byrne and Dan Jurgen's version of Superman forever. To think that Grant Morrison developed his Superman from focus groups is also laughable. This is the man who wrote the Invisibles as an ode to counter-culture and a surreal superhero epic in the Doom Patrol. He would not have his Superman dictated to him by the publisher or the market. If you knew anything about Grant and his work on Superman, you'd know he did a pitch back in '99 called Superman 2000 where he wanted to start Superman off as a brash, young hero with low power levels and eventually evolve him into a superior being with Silver Age like power levels. I believe he's doing something like that here. Mark my words. He CREATIVELY wanted to toss the dull character that Byrne left us with in 1987 and create a new man in his place. That's what he's doing. Your side is just being stubborn because you're afraid of change. Too bad. It's happening no matter what. 
Avatar image for artisticneedham
ArtisticNeedham

2731

Forum Posts

5732

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 1

Edited By ArtisticNeedham

I also like how Clark's journalism career seems more connection, a natural step, in his superhero career.
Being a journalist who, as they mention, reports about crime and corruption and intergang and risks brutal retaliation, showing him to be more like Lois Lane.  I like that.
I also like how he was portrayed as Superman here, being a bit of a jerk, a hero for the common man, having the comic reference old comic stories from the original series where he stopped Nazis, Domestic Abuse, Crooked Bosses, etc.  I like it.
His costume may be more to show him as a blue collar hero or maybe to connect him to his Smallville parents and his roots there.
 
In JLA he clearly is more powerful, so here he is (more like Superboy than Man) with his powers still developing.  I love it so far.  Not too sure about Lex's motives though.
 
As far as he and Lois, maybe something this New 52 is doing by breaking them all up is to restart their relationships.  Maybe before he starts dating Lois fans will get to see Superman date Wonder Woman.  Then he dates Lois and (them both being daring news reporters who take great risks) they have more in common than before.
Maybe the creators want to get a chance to give their spin on these super relationships.  But eventually I would hope that Flash ends up with Iris, Superman ends up with Lois, etc.
However if they aren't restarting (eliminating past stories where Lois and Clark were dating/married) then they might be implying that Lois and Clark divorced.  Which would suck I think.  But I'll have to wait and see.

Avatar image for nonnu
nonnu

6

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By nonnu
@Jekylhyde14: certeinly I did not "work" and "think"  "these characters for years" (your words) but I've been a fan for many years and so to see Superman "reworked" this way makes me wonder if DC Comics has a perfect character (like many on the DC portfolio) but does not know what to do with it. And it's not in the 5 minutes that will take me to write this post that I will solve the problem that the DC writers and artists could not, or would not or were not authorized to figure out in the right way.
 
That said, i think that, when Superman was created, it was SUPER because there was nothing like him in comic books. 
But now there are hundreds like him (Shazam was almost his replica), and if DC continues do "downgrade" Superman, then in the near future it will be senseless to still call him Super. 
Superman is one of those characters, like Dr. Manhattan in "The Watchmen", that can afford to look like a jerk without being one because they are "God-like" perfect, unbeatable. What infinite Crisis did a few years ago, and very well, was to retain does God like features but give it some humanity (I bow to Mr. John Byrne). 
 
Remember this: the guy is an Alien!  
Why not making him a protector of the earth, like the Green Lanterns for instance. It would be more interesting then making him another Batman.  I recently saw a movie about the CIA onde of the things the said was something like this: "Our failures are known to all, but our successes aren't"... so why not make this the "new tag line" for superman, a silent protector?  
Imagine Jor-El would say that he was intended to come to Earth to protect it from a greater "evil", that his infancy and adolescence was the preparation for something dreadful, making him an hero more detached form society like a spy, but and alter-ego still working journalist or as an hot-dog stand seller, whatever.

What this is, is the oblivion of  79 years of history and story, and a victory of the marketing department and focus groups. And if look at it, is the same thing happing to Spiderman at Marvel. 
And if all of this is not enough, I ask you: if it was you, would you run up and down the street fighting crime wearing jeans and a red cape or would you do it Batman style?
Avatar image for cosmo111687
cosmo111687

1583

Forum Posts

3311

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 23

User Lists: 15

Edited By cosmo111687

I was taken aback by Superman's actions towards Glenmorgan as well, even though it was for the greater good. But, I warmed up to it when I realized that Clark was working with Detective Taylor to bring Glenmorgan down, but they needed a confession from him, so Clark donned his Superman costume to force the confession out and seal the deal. That showed that he was trying to work with the law, at least. (Even though I still am kind of irked by it because the means shouldn't justify the end. For Batman, it works, but not so much with Superman who should be above that. But it's Grant Morrison. So maybe it's important for Superman to be rash in the beginning in order to show his transformation, or some odd twist, at the end?) Still, it was great seeing all of Glenmorgan's goons tossed around like Keystone cops.

Avatar image for labeeb
Labeeb

22

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By Labeeb

Great article. Other than the silver age, the good thing about the 'jerk' superman is that we can relate to him more. People can't be all "goody goody" & perfect. That's unrealistic. The more a character is like an anti-hero, the more we find them realistic. I don't like the new costumeS though. I just like him in his old underwear thing. As far as 'super man can get injured' is concerned, I agree that the stories would be less repetitive but I think it's just a reason DC needs for his new armor suit :(

Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@Neuron said:
It's fascinating to see so many people rail against the "boring Boy Scout" Superman that always had the strength to do the right thing.  That's not easy, and you'd better be superpowered if you're going to try it.  More than that, it's the reason that he WAS the icon and symbol he was (and is).  Using intimidation, interrogation, and light torture is Batman's realm.  It's too early to see why Clark's okay with using those methods, but I do give Grant Morrison credit and I'm really curious to see where it goes.  I thought it was a great issue.  But I find it really interesting and more than a little unsettling that so many people are eating up this new Jack Bauer type of guy, willing to go as far as necessary to get what he sees as justice.  Is that really the best possible hero?  Do it to them because they can and will do it to us?  No thanks.  I had no problems with the "old" Superman, but I'm also liking this new take and definitely intend to check out more.
But IS he acting like a Jack Bauer type who's "willing to go as far as necessary"? So far we've only seen him interrogate a guy by scaring the bejesus out of him. It's not like he was electrocuting or water boarding the guy. So far he hasn't killed anybody. Yeah, he's taunted and evaded the police and gone head to head with military tanks but that was more in self-defense and in the interest of protecting civilians. I see this more as a cocky, brash Superman who bucks authority and is actually willing to hold the people in charge accountable. I don't see the ruthless vigilante who's willing to cross lines quite yet.
Avatar image for _zombie_
_Zombie_

10572

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By _Zombie_

I never had a real problem with him being the boy scout myself.  I just HATED that he was pretty much invulnerable in a fight unless the opponent just conveniently had kryptonite on their person.  So yeah, I kind of like that he's not invulnerable, and the whole edgy take on him doesn't bother me that much.  It's probably because I was just never a huge fan of Supes.  I liked his fight scenes and knew enough about him, but I never got into his comics that much.  So I'm liking the rebooted Superman so far.
Avatar image for neuron
Neuron

105

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 3

Edited By Neuron

It's fascinating to see so many people rail against the "boring Boy Scout" Superman that always had the strength to do the right thing.  That's not easy, and you'd better be superpowered if you're going to try it.  More than that, it's the reason that he WAS the icon and symbol he was (and is).
 
Using intimidation, interrogation, and light torture is Batman's realm.  It's too early to see why Clark's okay with using those methods, but I do give Grant Morrison credit and I'm really curious to see where it goes.  I thought it was a great issue.  But I find it really interesting and more than a little unsettling that so many people are eating up this new Jack Bauer type of guy, willing to go as far as necessary to get what he sees as justice.  Is that really the best possible hero?  Do it to them because they can and will do it to us?  No thanks.
 
I had no problems with the "old" Superman, but I'm also liking this new take and definitely intend to check out more.

Avatar image for shamelesslysupportinaznballers
Shamelesslysupportinaznballers

553

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

If Superman did not kill, then he probably brutally disfigured or paralyzed a few people in AC#1. If anything there is a clear disregard for human life from him. If something like a Terminator throws someone through a wall head first, the guy is going to be seriously hurt, maybe paralyzed if not dead. Superman doing it, dude is dead. He smashes a tank which causes an explosion with what looks like at least 1 guy still inside. What happened to just twisting the cannon of the tank so it can't fire?  
 
But who knows, maybe Superman just punched the hole in the wall first then simply put the guy in the, letting him rest & he waited for the 2 guys inside to get out of the tank and run a safe distance away from the area of explosion before smashing it. 
 
I'm just wondering where Pa Kent is in all of this? 
 
Anyone also notice how in DC #1, Batman played the boy scout role?

Avatar image for deactivated-60d8e8271946e
deactivated-60d8e8271946e

11901

Forum Posts

2488

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 6

User Lists: 5

@Ulviar said:
That's just great! Action Comics #1 is the best Superman comic I've ever read!
Really? Better than Kingdom Come, Infinite Crisis, etc?
Avatar image for omega_man_
Omega-Man

828

Forum Posts

17

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 10

User Lists: 0

Edited By Omega-Man

What I don't get why do people hate the boy scout image so much? Someone THAT powerful wearing his heart on his sleeve should be a given, think about it in real life if a guy could do all these things and was pretty much a jerk about it like this, all normal people would be scared of him and really that sounds more like Batman wanting fear than Superman. I know this is just pretty much the start of his story since from previews of Superman #1 he seems simlar to his old self in battling monsters and aliens etc. I don't understand why people don't like Superman being Superman taking down meta humans and creatures with his super powers and stopping major desasters such as earthquakes and volcanoes erupting.
 
As for people saying he was overpowered well thats bullspit, the thing about superman he has all this power but not even he can be everywhere at once, in fact he fears being seen as a god abled to do anything which he obviously can't, but the stuff he can do like save the planet from distruction from alien menaces thats what he does. Saying he was perfect and he beats everyone is a load of crap because that can be said about every character in DC comics including batman facing down odds no man could over come yet he does simply because he's batman.
 
When people say they hate Superman or think he's boring just because he is to them overpowered I can ask them how and why and prove them wrong it's because they don't understand Superman at all. In fact alot of other characters such as Martian Manhunter and even Captain Atom are more powerful than Superman and have more powers than he does.
 
Now the whole thing said here his only weakness is Kryptonite well THAT WRONG, he's weak against Magic also and to be honest if a force is much stronger than he is he can be beaten to a pulp, so he isn't perfect at all and can't be beaten. And Doomsday wasn't the start of that trend either as Silverage Superman has gotten his a** handed to him by Darkseid also who is much more powerful than Doomsday and even Superman.

Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@nonnu said:
As a designer and illustrator, if find this lack of creativity (from DC Comics) disturbing.
That said, I think @Jordanstine is right:  "...they turned young Superman into Batman" .. "Or actually, they turned young Superman into another Hal Jordan."

 


Alright, Mr. Creative, since you think you know better than men who have been working with and thinking about these characters for years then how would you creatively write Superman?
Avatar image for nonnu
nonnu

6

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By nonnu

As a designer and illustrator, if find this lack of creativity (from DC Comics) disturbing.
That said, I think @Jordanstine is right:  "...they turned young Superman into Batman" .. "Or actually, they turned young Superman into another Hal Jordan."


 


Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@labarith said:

No, I think you missed my point.  DC - however convoluted - actually had a pretty nifty continuity.  Things happened in multiple universes, those universe merged and disappeared, and blah blah blah.  Once things merged, it let DC tell some more serious stories.  For all intents and purposes, Lois still tried to brainwash superman, and Comet was still in love with Supergirl... but those worlds were destroyed because of some baddie, and we got a new world.  It also happened to be a world where crazy &*(% didn't happen quite as often, and characters acted like they were written as serious fiction more than as jokey one-shot stories.  It's a change of audience, and - fortunately for continuity - an actual change of the world. 
 
I could point out how DC did a less-than-stellar job in their worldbuilding, but over the years again and again they would try to repair it, taking quality from DC inspired tv shows/etc., and leaving junk behind.  The DCAU was a great example of continuity, and DC should be horrified that they have since failed to live up to the standard of a weekday afternoon cartoon show. 
 
You want a world where Superman can't fly, kryptonite doesn't exist, and Barry Allen is the Flash?  Give us "Earth One"-style stories - see, that's a reference to DC actually knowing how to tell a reboot story halfway well, even if they did completely mishandle the project. 
 
What's even more astounding is that DC had all the tools to do this - they actually gave themselves 52 worlds, with ^&*$&$ happening on each.  They could have said "DCAU is world 12, we'll do some kids comics featuring it.  Young Justice takes place on world 24.  Superfriends world 45, DC "main universe" on world 1, and on world 'X" we'll do a reboot - we'll do "ultimate" characters for Superman, Batman, and our main cast.  We'll go slow... letting us keep telling our successful Superman, Batman, and GL stories in world 1, and let us tell exciting new, steamlined, "fresh" stories that we wouldn't be able to tell in world X.  And heck, we'll even put a little continuity note in the form of a "World #" somewhere on the cover/credits page of each comic, so you can know that this week's ACTION COMICS takes place in World X... because, you know, we're DC - we like telling elseworld stories in main books for no reason all the darned time - Batman and Superman, Trinity... all noncontinuity bull%$&^ 
 

Hypocrisy. Plain and simple. People with your arguments always bring up this idea that the creators weren't able to get down to "serious story telling" until the multiverse was out of the way. But, kid, let me tell you that the story-telling wasn't all that serious. Bizarro exploded at the end of Man of Steel and his ashes cured Lucy Lane's blindness on contact; Power Girl had an immaculate conception from a chaos demon; aliens and giant monsters were still your got-to villains; and there were clones everywhere. Yeah, that all sounds really "serious." They lost serious hold of it over time. They needed to make room in the Green lantern book, so they have Kyle Rayner overreact out of character to a friend of his getting killed so he goes into space to do some soul-searching. Some creators hate Hal Jordan so they make him evil only to have another creator want to redeem Hal so they write up some excuses for him a decade later. Most of the time they make this continuity thing work by cherry picking their favorite stories from it and pretending everything else didn't happen. Oh, we like Batman: Year One so that stays, but in Year Two he carries a gun and we hate that so that's out. Or Gerard Jones' run on the Justice League was really bad and Power Girl's kid was a stupid idea so lets just pretend they never happened. Or all of our characters are fine except Hawkman so let's have a time-event to fix him. And it's all just hypocrisy because you're pretending an entire comic book universe makes complete linear sense when it really doesn't. 
 
If you think about it, you'll realize some of the best stories were written with no sense of continuity in mind. The Dark Knight Returns, The Watchmen, Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow, All-Star Superman, Kingdom Come, and Gotham Under Gaslight were all written out of continuity and they are all critically acclaimed, top-sellers for DC. Most of the best Silver Age Superman stories were "Imaginary Stories" where the writers could do things the editors wouldn't let them in regular continuity. The Amazing Story of Superman Red and Superman Blue is beautiful and influential. The Sons of Superman told a very realistic tale of what parents go through when one child seems more talented than another. And the story of "Clark Kent's Brother" where Lex is re-imagined as Superman's adopted brother is just great, engaging story telling. In the Silver Age they knew that sometimes you'd have to suspend continuity to tell a great story. The Modern Age was always just making excuses.  
 
That's another thing I hate about your theory. Fans like you degrade the Golden and Silver Age as jokes when some very serious story-telling was going on. The Golden Age Superman was Siegel and Shuster reacting to what they saw in depression era America and making it mythology. The Silver Age Superman stories had editor Mort Weisinger going through a very mature nervous breakdown and channeling the anxieties and fears he was experiencing from it into innocent science fiction stories. These stories were not jokes. They were great, built Superman's myth, and kept the character going for the first 50 years of his history (which you Post-Crisis guys are constantly trying to forget). Grant Morrison always proves your stance wrong by resurrecting things from the old continuity and showing them off to be truly weird and serious. He does it again in Action Comics #1 by making Superman a social crusader once again. Unless you don't think rich criminals devaluing the lives of the poor is a real-world problem... How can you get more "serious story-telling" than that? 
 
You bring up the DCAU. Honestly, I don't watch too many cartoons anymore, but I hear it's good. So what? The DCAU continuity has to deal with the storylines of a handful of cartoons that are on the air for three maybe four years max. The DC comic book  continuity has to deal with 73 years worth of stories of who can tell how many comic book titles with god only knows how many creators. That's a lot harder to do. The DCAU just isn't up against those kinds of expectations. Finally, if you look back at all your great continuity stories in comics, I think you'll find most of them are appealing in a soap opera sense. "Gasp, Perry White has cancer!" "Oh my, Green Arrow has an illegitimate child!" "Who will Cassie choose, Conner or Tim?" It's all a lot of fun. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed it. But you can go through all of it again in this new continuity. Sorry, man, you're just wrong. The DC universe will survive this, if you give it a chance I know you'll like it, and everything's going to be fine. 
Avatar image for jekylhyde14
Jekylhyde14

907

Forum Posts

5322

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 28

User Lists: 10

Edited By Jekylhyde14
@UltimateSMfan said:
@Jekylhyde14 said:
@ltbrd said:
****HEAVY SPOILER ALERTS*****HEAVY SPOILER ALERTS******  Had to reread this again today and have to say I'm surprised at all the subtle hints I missed paying homage to the 1938 Action Comics #1 as well as Superman's early history before some of the major changes made in the radio series. Everything from the way Superman acts, to the reference of the wife beater (which was shown in Action Comics #1), to farther into his contuinity with Lex being a straight scientists than a billionare (at least that's what I'm assuming from the way Lex's consulting job is being described), to even later with the crumbled train looking like Doomsday's arm......these small details made the second read even better than the first.  But here's my question for all playing the home version......do you think Kara Zor-El is going to be older than Kal-El in this revamp? This is just a complete wild guess on my part, but I'm wondering if the two men and blonde woman the landlady spoke about and the "object around Neptune getting bigger" that Lex spoke about are tied to the arrival of Kara Zor-El and possibly other Kryptonians or something these three have arrived in advance of. That would be an interesting twist on their relationship if it turned out Kara (who has always been portrayed as being born before Kal-El and technically older though placed in suspended animation) was the one to introduce Kal to his kryptonian heritage and give him the armor he'll eventually wear.  Like I said complete guess on my part but given how close all the other books are coming out and since I can't really see Action Comics going on for years with Superman wearing boots, jeans, t-shirt and a short cape I expect Morrison to move through this arc in about 5 or 6 issues before possibly jumping to have the same timeline as the Superman series.
Huh... I never thought of that.  It would be REALLY interesting if the blonde woman was Kara. That would drastically change Supergirl's origin and arrival. I guess we'll find out soon enough...  We should keep our eyes on that object around Neptune. 
the two guys and blonde woman are cosmic boy,lightning lad and Saturn girl......Grant morrison sed in one of his interviews that the legion would be makin an appearance in issue one(who knew it was only goin to be a description appearance)
HA! That's it! So obvious... Thanks for pointing it out.
Avatar image for _o0johnny0o_
.o0Johnny0o.

770

Forum Posts

904

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 3

User Lists: 2

Edited By .o0Johnny0o.

I was reading it thinking 'Any page now, there's gonna be a 'Hold the car over the head' nod to Action Comics #1.. it never came.  I felt a bit bummed about that.

Avatar image for eyz
Eyz

3187

Forum Posts

304

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 2

Edited By Eyz

This Supes kinda reminds me how Bruce Wayne would act if he was the one with the Kryptonian powers. Being above the law, doing as he pleases for the greater good, etc.

Avatar image for ultimatesmfan
UltimateSMfan

2377

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

0

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Edited By UltimateSMfan

Action Comics #1.....Awesome, But few problems,now supes has gotta be just outta college or something  cuz i kno hes depowered n stuff which is fine to attend to all those "hes too powerful"(i mean come on he SUPER man) people anyway......but he seems Too depowered,even if their trying to match the golden age stories, hes still built from alot of the superman weve had for the last 20 yrs,he cant be twenty or above n wat suddenly 5 yrs later hes flying,(Much)faster than bullets(quite pissed to see supes dint out run the bullets when they were fired at him) and stuff.id like to see him have the power levels their showing currently when hes around fifteen or sumthing,this doesnt make sense n i loved the writing but really want to see how Grant gets him up to full "speed"( - which is second in the DC universe to flash) and strength(strongest!!) and was wondering it cant be becuz hes not aged enuf or anything unless he really is fifteen,cuz if and when kara comes to earth shes still a teenager (in the new universe,isnt she?) and she has powers almost rivaling Supermans as its been shown in the solicits for Supergirl #2........So i really want an explanation behind that and also if they introduce zod,unless hes in hiding for a couple of yrs or has some advanced solar tech i think it'd be pretty stupid gettin him to full power to take on Supes.So im a really die hard Superman fan n stay loyal no matter wat but i really wanna see how they address this cause it should be something big, its not like a growth spurt where he suddenly grows so much more powerfull in five yrs (maybe its the armor like SB prime OMG!! lol) cuz one would think he'd have absorbed alot more solar power in the Twenty yrs he been on this planet!! Bring on Issue 2!!!!