Who Else Feels Like Marvel Pansied Out?

#1 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio

I feel like Xorneto (Magneto as Xorn) was this seriously bad@ss character who did insanely bad@ss things. He killed tonsss of civilians, he killed Jean Grey, he re-crippled Xavier, there was the whole Kick frenzy, etc. There are tons of things. I feel like Marvel got scared, that they couldn't do what they wanted with Magneto when he had all these things tied to him, so they pansied out and retconned the entire Xorneto "incident". 

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#2 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio

HELL YEAH! DAMN WEAK, MARVEL EDITORIAL STAFF!
 
@The Dark Huntress:
RAGE HIGH FIVE

#3 Posted by Sexy Merc (42075 posts) - - Show Bio

Morph is your go to guy for this.

#4 Posted by CATMANEXE (17052 posts) - - Show Bio

they pansie out a lot due to fan criticism on alot of things, and i'll say yes to this.
even if things aren't going over well i would rather a comic company see it through
then sweep it under the rug.

#5 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio
@Sexy Merc: I'm offended, Merc.  A Grant Morrison book and an opportunity to bag Marvel? I felt this was my niche :( haha
#6 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio

In fairness, this was DC's GL: Rebirth. Fans bitched, so the company yielded and changed everything.

#7 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@FadeToBlackBolt Woohoo!

@Sexy Merc He and I have discussed it in he past before I ever read New X-Men. Somebody mentioned Xorneto and I was like WTF and Morph told me to read it, so I did.
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#8 Posted by Sexy Merc (42075 posts) - - Show Bio
@FadeToBlackBolt: : p
 
@The Dark Huntress: I talked to Morph about it too. He isn't my favorite X-Man but he was always cool to me.
#9 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@Sexy Merc I think he was horrible as a hero. I liked him much better as a villain.
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#10 Posted by Sexy Merc (42075 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Dark Huntress: Oh, you're talking about that Xorn..
#11 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@Sexy Merc I was talking about Xorneto. xP
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#12 Posted by Sexy Merc (42075 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Dark Huntress: Yeah, I just realized it after reading the OP. I usually base my first post of the thread title, or skim through it.
#13 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@Sexy Merc I see that, now.
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#14 Posted by Morpheus_ (29873 posts) - - Show Bio
Xorn worked perfectly as a unique hero, to be honest, whether you choose to view him as a character of his own, or as Magneto's "inner star", as Morrison referred to him during Planet X. 
 
Since I read the stories years after they were published I am somewhat amazed that the actual story was published. They retconned it away a few months afterwards, with Claremont's Excalibur volume 3, but I am surprised it even got to that.
 
On a sidenote, be it Xorn, or Magneto posing as Xorn, neither would have done any of those things under their own mind. Sublime controlled them, as it controlled Beast during Here Comes Tomorrow.
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#15 Posted by xerox_kitty (15762 posts) - - Show Bio

While I agree that Marvel did wimp out of the dramatic death of Magneto, this is a surprising rant for 2010... when this happened what?  8 or 9 years ago??

 

To be honest, I'm surprised that more things didn't revert to the way they were pre-Grant Morrison.  The costumes & the over-all darker tone of the X-Titles quickly disappeared... but Jean has stayed dead, Beast has stayed Cat-like, Cyclops & Frost have stayed a couple, etc.  So considering how those things stayed the status quo then it is surprising that they retconned Magneto back into Xorn.

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#16 Posted by Morpheus_ (29873 posts) - - Show Bio
It was 6 years ago. Morrison took over New X-Men in 2001, and his run ended in 2004. A minor correction of course, it does not take anything away from your point.
 
 
But then again, killing off Magneto in a way that (to Marvel) seemed impossible to make a feasible way of making usable in the future (because let's face it, one of the points of Planet X was that the X-Men universe is stale, hence why Morrison had Magneto being killed by Wolverine, much like Scott Lobdell had Wolverine stab Magneto in the run immediately preceding Morrison's during Eve of Destruction), is not the same, or as significant as changing the costumes, or altering Beast's form. Magneto is an integral character to the X-Men mythos so I am not surprised in the least that Marvel wanted to preserve the character for future use, and also "redeem" him in the minds of the fans for throwing people into crematoria during Planet X (even though he was being mind controlled, but nobody seemed to notice back then).


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#17 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@xerox-kitty: It was a good few years ago, but the topic was brought on by me organizing my trades and finding and subsequently re-reading the three New X-Men ultimate collection trades.
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#18 Edited by AMS (1387 posts) - - Show Bio

Seriously they should of blamed it on a revived and brainwashed Joseph if they wanted to cop out as badly as they did. 
 
The convulted mess they left behind trying to do backflips out of it all made it even worse in the end.
#19 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@AMS said:
" Seriously they should of blamed it on a revived and brainwashed Joseph if they wanted to cop out as badly as they did.  The convulted mess they left behind trying to do backflips out of it all made it even worse in the end. "
WIN. 
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#20 Posted by CaptainCockblock (3672 posts) - - Show Bio

I just finished re-reading the Planet X arc. How did they retcon it? I'm already pissed off, but I want to know.

#21 Posted by Mercy_ (92709 posts) - - Show Bio
@CaptainCockblock said:

" I just finished re-reading the Planet X arc. How did they retcon it? I'm already pissed off, but I want to know. "

I'm horrible at explaining it because frankly I don't entirely understand it myself. Morph would be the person to ask though. But they basically said that it wasn't Magneto, it was actually an entirely different person. If I understand correctly.  
 
From his page: 

Another Xorn appeared named Shen Xorn and says that the one Wolverine killed was his twin brother Kuan-Yin Xorn, who was being controlled by Sublime into thinking that he is Magneto. This was confirmed by Emma Frost when she telepathically read his mind.     

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#22 Posted by SC (13133 posts) - - Show Bio

Honestly? No, Marvel pansied out by allowing Morrison so much freedom, in the first place because its Grant Morrison and Grant Morrison draws numbers, and he did and then they tried to seqway what he did back to basics. I liked Xorn, I wished Morrison would have just created him from scratch and then he could have gone on to be his own iconic X-villain. 

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#23 Posted by SC (13133 posts) - - Show Bio
@CaptainCockblock said:
" I just finished re-reading the Planet X arc. How did they retcon it? I'm already pissed off, but I want to know. "
 
Morrison wrote and intended the original Xorn, to have been a ruse set up by Magneto, so Xorn was Magneto. Morrison had a pretty polarizing idea of Magneto, and was outspoken about it, in any case, many found his take on Magneto... interesting. So Xorn revealed finally as Magneto under Morrison's pen, is killed and done with.  
 
Magneto pops up again much later, i can't recall whether it was in Legacy or New Avengers, but in New Avengers the Collective, composed of many mutant powers and essences finds Magneto, and 'Xorn' makes himself known and explains some of the why he was Magneto, or pretending to be Magneto, pretending to be Xorn.  
 
Then later on, the brother of Xorn shows up Xorn the Second as I like to call him, or Xorn II (or Shen Xorn) and explains again, how his brother was pretending to be Magneto. Emma "confirms" by using her telepathy. Essentially all this was to stamp on the idea clearly that Morrison had essentially not been writing Magneto at all.  
 
Same fans though this was necessary, some thought it wasn't, but both types of those fans, generally agree they way the 'problem' was fixed, was a bit clunky, and could have been better.
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#24 Posted by AfternoonWalker (56 posts) - - Show Bio

I know this is rehashing an old post about an older storyline, but I swear I was so hoping that Sentry was going to turn out to be connected to Xorn. I thought the star-for-a-brain was in lines with cyclops, nightcrawler and wolverine (originally) in senses of unique powers and a potential destroyer of worlds but decides to save it instead was amazing. Also he had a unique look and outlook on the world. C'mon, the dude had such a sweet, ambiguous power set. So rare these days. Yay Physics!

#25 Posted by NX (307 posts) - - Show Bio

ME... Marvel needs to pick things up.

#26 Posted by COBRAMORPH (1562 posts) - - Show Bio

Xorn always should have just been Xorn. The franchise needs new characters, not old characters repackaged.

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