What has been Cyclops worst decision, when it comes to the X-Men

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#1 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio


#2 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

This one is a really tough choice. I would pick, letting the Avengers beat Cable to death. I think it's one of the most disgusting things I have ever seen in Cyclops do.

#3 Posted by AgeofHurricane (7264 posts) - - Show Bio
#4 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@AgeofHurricane said:

Yes, he is a douche after all. You can't say you agree with all his decisions.

#5 Posted by AgeofHurricane (7264 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

Yes, he is a douche after all. You can't say you agree with all his decisions.

What you'll find is that i agree with none, but some of what you've listed up there have been blown out of propotions imo.

#6 Posted by Twentyfive (2843 posts) - - Show Bio

I can't believe that I have come to hate what used to be my favorite X-Man. He's not even my top 10. I chose opinion L.

#7 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

Yes, he is a douche after all. You can't say you agree with all his decisions.

What you'll find is that i agree with none, but some of what you've listed up there have been blown out of propotions imo.

like

#8 Posted by SoA (4695 posts) - - Show Bio

i went with cyclops having the affair bc my opinion of him dropped from there and have been the reason why everything else in the poll happened lol

#9 Posted by AgeofHurricane (7264 posts) - - Show Bio

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

#10 Posted by Blood1991 (8098 posts) - - Show Bio

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

Yes, he is a douche after all. You can't say you agree with all his decisions.

What you'll find is that i agree with none, but some of what you've listed up there have been blown out of propotions imo.

I agree with AOH in all regards. I can't say I've agreed with Scott's choices, but he did what he felt he had to do.

#11 Posted by Dark_Vengeance_ (14587 posts) - - Show Bio

M.all of the above.

#12 Posted by Crimsonlord53 (1300 posts) - - Show Bio

Come on believing the phoenix could lead to anything but tragedy is his worst by a lone mile. He and emma have lost the most to the phoenix they should have known better.

#13 Edited by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

@SoA said:

i went with cyclops having the affair bc my opinion of him dropped from there and have been the reason why everything else in the poll happened lol

That would be my second choice.

#14 Posted by Backflip (2256 posts) - - Show Bio

Cyclops has been an exceptional leader and has consistently put his arse on the line for a job that comes with a lot of heat. All things considered, the fact he managed to raise his race out of near devestation from House of M, carry them against consistent pressure from anti mutant hate groups (Purifiers, Council of Humanity, Leper Queen), provide them with a home (Utopia), fend off against the might of the US government and Osborn (Utopia again), save the Messiah from an almost unstoppable force (Second Coming) and finally as thanks, he has the Avengers come an encroach on his territory and violently oppress his team, leading to a cataclysmic confrontation where the Avengers want to pretend that they are innocent, and act surprised after Cyclops fights back after being hunted for so long.

Cyclops is the best leader the X-Men will ever have. He's overcame far more troubles than Storm, Wolverine, and Xavier combined.

#15 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

Add the "Abandon my wife and child to be with Jean" then I'll vote.

Jean and Logan had a thing going before Scott ever got with Emma. And even then Scott forced Jean to look into his mind to see nothing actually came of him and Emma.

#16 Posted by AgeofHurricane (7264 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

Lol no. Where the marriage is concerned, they were both in the wrong. There's no evening it out or dishing more of the blame on anyone else, Scott is just as guilty as Jean and vice versa. Regarding the kiss, naive little Jean succumbed to that hairy hypocrite. She could have used her telekinetic powers to fly herself out of that mess, yet she stayed. She stayed because she wanted him just as much as, if not more, than he wanted her. Even if he forced himself, like he always has, she could have left, but she didn't.

#17 Edited by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

Add the "Abandon my wife and child to be with Jean" then I'll vote.

Jean and Logan had a thing going before Scott ever got with Emma. And even then Scott forced Jean to look into his mind to see nothing actually came of him and Emma.

To be honest, Scott should of never gone to Emma in the first place, he should of open up to his wife. Jean and Logan had nothing going on.

I wanted to include, abandoning his child and wife, but I wanted to do something within last couple of years.

#18 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

A. Morally wrong yes but it was necessary. Let's not forget that Logan is continuing X-force

B. This decision worked out fine didn't it? (Struggling to remember)

C. He did care, otherwise he wouldn't have even bothered to rescue them. He assembled his best team (x-force) and sent them to rescue them immediately

D. He did use X-23 to kill but it's not like he forced her it was her decision to be a member. Logan even tried to convince her out of joining but she made the decision on her own. He did not "use" Idie at all he literally said "Do what you feel you have to". It was Idie that made the decision to kill she could have stayed hidden or even escaped but SHE did what SHE felt like SHE had to. If Jubilee were in Idie's place do you think she would have killed?

E. Finding out that he was messing with your mind warrants getting kicked out. Xavier preaches responsibility and control but doesn't follow his own teachings.

F. He could have just incapacitated him so Scotts reaction was extreme but he was acting in self-defence and he even gave Xavier multiple warnings about what would happen if Xavier didn't stop.

G. This was IMO his worst decision but Cable was acting crazy.

H. On the brink of extinction it's a smarter choice to defend yourself on Utopia than stay at a school.

I. Scott did try and stop the schism. He offered a change of leadership via election but Logan didn't want anything to do with it.

J. Being Naive about the phoenix? Unit proved Scotts faith to be right. If anyone was naive it was Tony for shooting the Phoenix and the Avengers/X-men for provoking Scott constantly until he became Dark Phoenix.

K. Because Jean never and I mean never disrespected her relationship with Scott right? How many times did she kiss Logan again? Hell if Logan didn't refuse her she would have had an affair with him. As for kissing on her grave I agree that it's a douche moment but it was because Jean altered his mind. He would have rejected Emma and left otherwise.

L. He doesn't use children as cannon fodder at all. He let's them be team members but he doesn't push them in front of the enemy. They have a choice he's not forcing them into anything. Schism showed that the kids are free to leave at any point. Just because Wolverine made a big deal about not wanting kids to fight it doesn't mean Scott was throwing them into the fire. Even during schism he was prepared to fight the sentinel by himself and didn't even ask the kids to fight, they volunteered.

#19 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

Lol no. Where the marriage is concerned, they were both in the wrong. There's no evening it out or dishing more of the blame on anyone else, Scott is just as guilty as Jean and vice versa. Regarding the kiss, naive little Jean succumbed to that hairy hypocrite. She could have used her telekinetic powers to fly herself out of that mess, yet she stayed. She stayed because she wanted him just as much as, if not more, than he wanted her. Even if he forced himself, like he always has, she could have left, but she didn't.

Logan didn't even force himself on her during New X-men (for once), Jean went up into the woods and kissed him. Logan rejected her.

#20 Posted by Dernman (14731 posts) - - Show Bio
@Twentyfive said:

I can't believe that I have come to hate what used to be my favorite X-Man. He's not even my top 10. I chose opinion L.

Is it because of AvX? Even if you don't like his portrayal there it doesn't mean you should stop liking him. I always liked Scott but anyone who has read my posts can tell you how strongly I disagree with him there.
#21 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@Osian2 said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

Lol no. Where the marriage is concerned, they were both in the wrong. There's no evening it out or dishing more of the blame on anyone else, Scott is just as guilty as Jean and vice versa. Regarding the kiss, naive little Jean succumbed to that hairy hypocrite. She could have used her telekinetic powers to fly herself out of that mess, yet she stayed. She stayed because she wanted him just as much as, if not more, than he wanted her. Even if he forced himself, like he always has, she could have left, but she didn't.

Logan didn't even force himself on her during New X-men (for once), Jean went up into the woods and kissed him. Logan rejected her.

She didn't kissed Logan, he kissed her and she went to Logan cause Cyclops was too busy with Emma.

#22 Posted by Twentyfive (2843 posts) - - Show Bio

@Dernman: Cyke is okay, but there are members that I like more than him.

Even Wolverine lol.

#23 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

@Osian2 said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

Lol no. Where the marriage is concerned, they were both in the wrong. There's no evening it out or dishing more of the blame on anyone else, Scott is just as guilty as Jean and vice versa. Regarding the kiss, naive little Jean succumbed to that hairy hypocrite. She could have used her telekinetic powers to fly herself out of that mess, yet she stayed. She stayed because she wanted him just as much as, if not more, than he wanted her. Even if he forced himself, like he always has, she could have left, but she didn't.

Logan didn't even force himself on her during New X-men (for once), Jean went up into the woods and kissed him. Logan rejected her.

She didn't kissed Logan, he kissed her and she went to Logan cause Cyclops was too busy with Emma.

Oh you're right look at how she's struggling there I mean she's even trying to knock him out by grabbing his neck right?

She went to him and told him how she was having relationship problems and then they kissed. Logan then told her it would never work for them.

She didn't go to him because Cyclops was busy with Emma at all. The affair didn't happen until later, the therapy session hadn't even started at this point.

#24 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@time: Fair enough.

Also Jean and Logan kissed before. Jean's rampage against Scott ended with her embarrassing herself remember, because she couldn't find any evidence of a true affair. Jean was so wrapped up with being headmaster and her own powers she didn't see Scott needed help readjusting from his ordeal with the Apocalypse merger. Emma was a "shoulder to cry on" who took advantage. I think, it's deadly genesis, that goes on to say had Cyclops and Emma not hooked up and restarted the School, the entire world would've been screwed.

#25 Posted by AgeofHurricane (7264 posts) - - Show Bio

In the end, i had to go for "Using students to kill" option, i couldn't care less about the X-23 situation, but i will never forgive his callous manipulation of Idie.

#26 Edited by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@Osian2 said:

@time said:

@Osian2 said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

Lol no. Where the marriage is concerned, they were both in the wrong. There's no evening it out or dishing more of the blame on anyone else, Scott is just as guilty as Jean and vice versa. Regarding the kiss, naive little Jean succumbed to that hairy hypocrite. She could have used her telekinetic powers to fly herself out of that mess, yet she stayed. She stayed because she wanted him just as much as, if not more, than he wanted her. Even if he forced himself, like he always has, she could have left, but she didn't.

Logan didn't even force himself on her during New X-men (for once), Jean went up into the woods and kissed him. Logan rejected her.

She didn't kissed Logan, he kissed her and she went to Logan cause Cyclops was too busy with Emma.

Oh you're right look at how she's struggling there I mean she's even trying to knock him out by grabbing his neck right?

She went to him and told him how she was having relationship problems and then they kissed. Logan then told her it would never work for them.

She didn't go to him because Cyclops was busy with Emma at all. The affair didn't happen until later, the therapy session hadn't even started at this point.

That rubbish, she went to Logan, could Cyclops wasn't bother about her, he was to busy going to Emma. He was having Sexual fantasies about Emma. Do we really need to talk about about this. Who acted wrongly towards there partner. Cyclops in the past has flirted with Revanche who pose as Psylocke and fantasize about her and kissed her, when he with Jean Grey and then he left Maddie and Son and lied to Jean Grey about it. As well as making out with Emma on Jean Grey grave, disgusting.

#27 Edited by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@time: You do know Jean was compelling them at the time right?(The makeout session at Jean's grave)

Cyclops was dealing with torture of being merged with Apocalypse at the time. He was the one in need of help, and Jean pretty much just dropped him. Emma showed up AFTER and started to help Scott with his mental trauma, she took advantage of his emotionally raw state but he kept her at a distance as well. Jean and Logan... well you see their "distance"

#28 Posted by lorex (946 posts) - - Show Bio
@Backflip said:

Cyclops has been an exceptional leader and has consistently put his arse on the line for a job that comes with a lot of heat. All things considered, the fact he managed to raise his race out of near devestation from House of M, carry them against consistent pressure from anti mutant hate groups (Purifiers, Council of Humanity, Leper Queen), provide them with a home (Utopia), fend off against the might of the US government and Osborn (Utopia again), save the Messiah from an almost unstoppable force (Second Coming) and finally as thanks, he has the Avengers come an encroach on his territory and violently oppress his team, leading to a cataclysmic confrontation where the Avengers want to pretend that they are innocent, and act surprised after Cyclops fights back after being hunted for so long.

Cyclops is the best leader the X-Men will ever have. He's overcame far more troubles than Storm, Wolverine, and Xavier combined.

I agree completely. Cyclops has faced a series of increasingly difficult challenges as leader of the X-Men and overcame them. After the Decimation he could no longer play nice because he know the hate groups out there would use this chanhe to wipe all mutants out. I mean not long after the Decimation the Purifiers attacked and killed many students that lost their mutant powers and also crucified several mutants on the lawn of the school. There are threats out there to mutants and Cyclops is awair of that. As for using children as cannon fodder that is pure crap. The young X-Men that chose to be part of the X-Man are no younger then he was when Xavier started him and the others out on missions years ago.
#29 Posted by Death Certificate (5438 posts) - - Show Bio

Option E was justifted, considering what Xavier did at that time.

#30 Edited by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

@time: You do know Jean was compelling them at the time right?(The makeout session at Jean's grave)

Cyclops was dealing with torture of being merged with Apocalypse at the time. He was the one in need of help, and Jean pretty much just dropped him. Emma showed up AFTER and started to help Scott with his mental trauma, she took advantage of his emotionally raw state but he kept her at a distance as well. Jean and Logan... well you see their "distance"

That such rubbish, whelther guys treat ladies poorly, they always make up some rubbish excuse, that its not there fault

Let's be honest here.

Cyclops was dealing with torture of being merged with Apocalypse at the time. He was the one in need of help, and Jean pretty much just dropped him.

After the merge with Apoclaypse in left a darkness in him right and instead of sharing his feelings with the one woman who can understand that, the one person who knows what's it liked to be control by a powerful force, which is full f darkness. He shares his feelings with Emma. Let's not forget it was Jean Grey who separated him from Apocalypse in the first place and she did this with the help of cable. Like I said before, if anyone could understand what he was going through, it's her.

Jean pretty much just dropped him.

More rubbish. Jean did ask him to open up, when she was resting in a bed, just before Charles went on tv and that was not the only time Jean ask Scott to open up.

Emma took advantage of his emotionally raw state.

Emma physic attack him once, where he was in the plane with Wolverine and Cyclops could of stop it at any point and he didn't. Just before Jean Grey found out, he didn't have to head into Emma Frost bedroom. He could of went to Jean grey instead. Like he could have, throughout the whole of Morrison run, but Morrison had no understanding of there marriage anyway.

It's could respect and Cyclops didn't have it.

I suppose your going to defend his actions. when he made out with Emma at Jean Grey grave.

#31 Posted by fodigg (6146 posts) - - Show Bio

So much editorializing and you leave off "kidnaps infant son and abandons wife for his ex-girlfriend?"

Online
#32 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@fodigg said:

So much editorializing and you leave off "kidnaps infant son and abandons wife for his ex-girlfriend?"

That's one of worst things he done.

#33 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

@TheCrowbar said:

@time: You do know Jean was compelling them at the time right?(The makeout session at Jean's grave)

Cyclops was dealing with torture of being merged with Apocalypse at the time. He was the one in need of help, and Jean pretty much just dropped him. Emma showed up AFTER and started to help Scott with his mental trauma, she took advantage of his emotionally raw state but he kept her at a distance as well. Jean and Logan... well you see their "distance"

That such rubbish, whelther guys treat ladies poorly, they always make up some rubbish excuse, that its not there fault

Let's be honest here.

Cyclops was dealing with torture of being merged with Apocalypse at the time. He was the one in need of help, and Jean pretty much just dropped him.

After the merge with Apoclaypse in left a darkness in him right and instead of sharing his feelings with the one woman who can understand that, the one person who knows what's it liked to be control by a powerful force, which is full f darkness. He shares his feelings with Emma. Let's not forget it was Jean Grey who separated him from Apocalypse in the first place and she did this with the help of cable. Like I said before, if anyone could understand what he was going through, it's her.

Jean pretty much just dropped him.

More rubbish. Jean did ask him to open up, when she was resting in a bed, just before Charles went on tv and that was not the only time Jean ask Scott to open up.

Emma took advantage of his emotionally raw state.

Emma physic attack him once, where he was in the plane with Wolverine and Cyclops could of stop it at any point and he didn't. Just before Jean Grey found out, he didn't have to head into Emma Frost bedroom. He could of went to Jean grey instead. Like he could have, throughout the whole Morrison run, but Morrison had no understanding of there marriage anyway.

It's could respect and Cyclops didn't have it.

I suppose your going to defend his actions. when he made out with Emma at Jean Grey grave.

Scott asked Jean to read his mind and he did tell her that he felt changed but he was scared that Jean would stop loving him if she knew just how much he'd changed. She told him that the bad feelings go away and all he needed was time. Grant Morrisson wrote her this way on purpose as in his opinion Jean is a character who ignores problems. After her Phoenix powers came back she said that all her negative feeling about her relationship with Scott had gone away but Scott was still having problems. So yeah she did drop him.

Let's not forget that Scott didn't show any sort of interest at all in Emma until after Jean and Logan had yet another makeout session. The affair and therapy sessions didn't star until after Jean and Logan kissed. I'm not saying Scott was justified to have an affair, I'll admit that he's a douche for doing so but don't act as if Jean is some sort of saint. There's a reason that the Scott/Jean/Logan relationship is famous.

Jean isn't a victim and neither is Scott. They both were acting out of character.

#34 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

@Osian2 said:

@time said:

@Osian2 said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

@time said:

@AgeofHurricane said:

"Disrespecting Jean Grey"

Did you forget Jean Grey snogging Wolverine before the infamous telepathic affair ?

That's actually rubbish, it was Logan who force himself on Jean Grey, not the another way around and he done it a couple of times too. The difference here is, Scott could of spent his time with his wife and he didn't, he choose to go to Emma bedroom instead.

Cyclops is not perfect and people need to stop making out that he is.

Lol no. Where the marriage is concerned, they were both in the wrong. There's no evening it out or dishing more of the blame on anyone else, Scott is just as guilty as Jean and vice versa. Regarding the kiss, naive little Jean succumbed to that hairy hypocrite. She could have used her telekinetic powers to fly herself out of that mess, yet she stayed. She stayed because she wanted him just as much as, if not more, than he wanted her. Even if he forced himself, like he always has, she could have left, but she didn't.

Logan didn't even force himself on her during New X-men (for once), Jean went up into the woods and kissed him. Logan rejected her.

She didn't kissed Logan, he kissed her and she went to Logan cause Cyclops was too busy with Emma.

Oh you're right look at how she's struggling there I mean she's even trying to knock him out by grabbing his neck right?

She went to him and told him how she was having relationship problems and then they kissed. Logan then told her it would never work for them.

She didn't go to him because Cyclops was busy with Emma at all. The affair didn't happen until later, the therapy session hadn't even started at this point.

That rubbish, she went to Logan, could Cyclops wasn't bother about her, he was to busy going to Emma. He was having Sexual fantasies about Emma. Do we really need to talk about about this. Who acted wrongly towards there partner. Cyclops in the past has flirted with Revanche who pose as Psylocke and fantasize about her and kissed her, when he with Jean Grey and then he left Maddie and Son and lied to Jean Grey about it. As well as making out with Emma on Jean Grey grave, disgusting.

Cyclops didn't take an interest at all until AFTER Jean and Logan kissed.

So when Logan and Jean kissed he forced himself on her but when Scott and Revanche kissed he's unforgivable. Jean went to Logan, kissed him and got rejected. Revanche went to Scott kissed him and got rejected.

Jean altered his mind otherwise he would have rejected Emma and left.

#35 Posted by God_Spawn (37318 posts) - - Show Bio

Is it just more or are a lot of these kind of twisted out of context?

Moderator
#36 Edited by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

Let's not forget that Scott didn't show any sort of interest at all in Emma until after Jean and Logan had yet another makeout session. He didn't know about Logan kissing Jean Grey. If he show more affection towards Jean Grey in the first place, Jean wouldn't gone to Logan.

Scott asked Jean to read his mind and he did tell her that he felt changed but he was scared that Jean would stop loving him if she knew just how much he'd changed. She told him that the bad feelings go away and all he needed was time. That maybe true, but Cyclops still should of spent more time with Jean Grey then Emma.

Just Imagine your married to someone and that person doesn't spend any time with you and then you find out there spending time with some else. No wonder why Jean Grey was angry. Then Morrison killed Jean Grey off and didn't give her time to deal with the Emma and Scott thing.

So yeah she did drop him. No she didn't drop him, show me a scan of that. She wanted him to open up and he didn't, not with her any way.

I'm actually surprised Cyclops still dating someone. His treatment to the ladies, is really bad. Jean and Maddie.

They both were acting out of character. The one thing I actually agree with.

That's Morrisons bad writing.

#37 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

Let's not forget that Scott didn't show any sort of interest at all in Emma until after Jean and Logan had yet another makeout session. He didn't know about Logan kissing Jean Grey. If he show more affection towards Jean Grey in the first place, Jean wouldn't gone to Logan.

Scott asked Jean to read his mind and he did tell her that he felt changed but he was scared that Jean would stop loving him if she knew just how much he'd changed. She told him that the bad feelings go away and all he needed was time. That maybe true, but Cyclops still should of spent more time with Jean Grey then Emma.

Just Imagine your married to someone and that person doesn't spend any time with you and then you find out there spending time with some else. No wonder why Jean Grey was angry. Then Morrison killed Jean Grey off and didn't give her time to deal with the Emma and Scott thing.

So yeah she did drop him. No she didn't drop him, show me a scan of that. She wanted him to open up and he didn't, not with her any way.

I'm actually surprised Cyclops still dating someone. His treatment to the ladies, is really bad. Jean and Maddie.

They both were acting out of character. The one thing I actually agree with.

That's Morrisons bad writing.

So what if he didn't know about Logan and Jean kissing, If Jean never found out about Emma does that make it okay? Of course not.

Scott was the one suffering from being possessed by Apocalypse and was the one that needed help. Hell even Wolverine noticed and offered to talk about it with Scott. Jean asked him to open up, Scott told her to read his mind because he didn't know how to tell her. She said no and that all his bad feelings would go away in time. He was the one that needed affection not her, marriage is a partnership it's not all about what the wife needs. Later when her Phoenix powers came back she didn't care (as much) about Scotts problems.

Think about how poorly Jean treated Scott. She neglected him and his problems (morrisson intentionally wrote her like this), she kissed Logan and even accused Scott of sleeping with Emma in Tokyo when it was proven that he hadn't. All of this was before he went to Emma for therapy.

#38 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@Osian2 said:

@time said:

Let's not forget that Scott didn't show any sort of interest at all in Emma until after Jean and Logan had yet another makeout session. He didn't know about Logan kissing Jean Grey. If he show more affection towards Jean Grey in the first place, Jean wouldn't gone to Logan.

Scott asked Jean to read his mind and he did tell her that he felt changed but he was scared that Jean would stop loving him if she knew just how much he'd changed. She told him that the bad feelings go away and all he needed was time. That maybe true, but Cyclops still should of spent more time with Jean Grey then Emma.

Just Imagine your married to someone and that person doesn't spend any time with you and then you find out there spending time with some else. No wonder why Jean Grey was angry. Then Morrison killed Jean Grey off and didn't give her time to deal with the Emma and Scott thing.

So yeah she did drop him. No she didn't drop him, show me a scan of that. She wanted him to open up and he didn't, not with her any way.

I'm actually surprised Cyclops still dating someone. His treatment to the ladies, is really bad. Jean and Maddie.

They both were acting out of character. The one thing I actually agree with.

That's Morrisons bad writing.

So what if he didn't know about Logan and Jean kissing, If Jean never found out about Emma does that make it okay? Of course not.

Scott was the one suffering from being possessed by Apocalypse and was the one that needed help. Hell even Wolverine noticed and offered to talk about it with Scott. Jean asked him to open up, Scott told her to read his mind because he didn't know how to tell her. She said no and that all his bad feelings would go away in time. He was the one that needed affection not her, marriage is a partnership it's not all about what the wife needs. Later when her Phoenix powers came back she didn't care (as much) about Scotts problems.

Think about how poorly Jean treated Scott. She neglected him and his problems (morrisson intentionally wrote her like this), she kissed Logan and even accused Scott of sleeping with Emma in Tokyo when it was proven that he hadn't. All of this was before he went to Emma for therapy.

When did she neglected him problems.. What issue exactly?

#39 Edited by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time: In New X-men 116 Jean tells Scott that his bad feelings will go away with time and that their bond is too strong to break. Imagine if Scott said that to Jean after the Phoenix saga. Or if someone told Warren that he'd get over it after becoming Apocalypses horseman.

In New X-men 120 Jean tells Logan that all her bad feeling about Scott have gone away and that she feels amazing. Scott however is still having problems.

Edit: Jean and Logan also kissed in Uncanny X-men 394 which is before Emma even joins the X-men

#40 Posted by JoseDRiveraTCR7 (1005 posts) - - Show Bio

@Osian2 said:

A. Morally wrong yes but it was necessary. Let's not forget that Logan is continuing X-force

B. This decision worked out fine didn't it? (Struggling to remember)

C. He did care, otherwise he wouldn't have even bothered to rescue them. He assembled his best team (x-force) and sent them to rescue them immediately

D. He did use X-23 to kill but it's not like he forced her it was her decision to be a member. Logan even tried to convince her out of joining but she made the decision on her own. He did not "use" Idie at all he literally said "Do what you feel you have to". It was Idie that made the decision to kill she could have stayed hidden or even escaped but SHE did what SHE felt like SHE had to. If Jubilee were in Idie's place do you think she would have killed?

E. Finding out that he was messing with your mind warrants getting kicked out. Xavier preaches responsibility and control but doesn't follow his own teachings.

F. He could have just incapacitated him so Scotts reaction was extreme but he was acting in self-defence and he even gave Xavier multiple warnings about what would happen if Xavier didn't stop.

G. This was IMO his worst decision but Cable was acting crazy.

H. On the brink of extinction it's a smarter choice to defend yourself on Utopia than stay at a school.

I. Scott did try and stop the schism. He offered a change of leadership via election but Logan didn't want anything to do with it.

J. Being Naive about the phoenix? Unit proved Scotts faith to be right. If anyone was naive it was Tony for shooting the Phoenix and the Avengers/X-men for provoking Scott constantly until he became Dark Phoenix.

K. Because Jean never and I mean never disrespected her relationship with Scott right? How many times did she kiss Logan again? Hell if Logan didn't refuse her she would have had an affair with him. As for kissing on her grave I agree that it's a douche moment but it was because Jean altered his mind. He would have rejected Emma and left otherwise.

L. He doesn't use children as cannon fodder at all. He let's them be team members but he doesn't push them in front of the enemy. They have a choice he's not forcing them into anything. Schism showed that the kids are free to leave at any point. Just because Wolverine made a big deal about not wanting kids to fight it doesn't mean Scott was throwing them into the fire. Even during schism he was prepared to fight the sentinel by himself and didn't even ask the kids to fight, they volunteered.

Great post.

The only mistake imo that Scott made was killing Prof X. Everything else I support.

#41 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

Let me get straight she goes to Logan and tells him that she feels amazing. Really she says that. She went to Logan cause she felt alone, cause Cyclops didn't show her any affection at all and cause he wasn't opening up to her.

You know what I have to double check, what you said in your above post. At the moment I'm organising my room and my comics are included in that.

Just for the record Cyclops has given Jean grey grief about the Phoenix too, in the past.

#42 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

Let me get straight she goes to Logan and tells him that she feels amazing. Really she says that. She went to Logan cause she felt alone, cause Cyclops didn't show her any affection at all and cause he wasn't opening up to her.

You know what I have to double check, what you said in your above post. At the moment I'm organising my room and my comics are included in that.

Just for the record Cyclops has given Jean grey grief about the Phoenix too, in the past.

He's showing more concern really. Like she said all he has are bad memories of that costume and he's worried about her.

#43 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

He more worried about himself and saying he can't cope with her being in that costume. Jean Grey wants to move on, she want them both to move on and be happy. Looking at this image above and people say Jean held Cyclops back, if anything it's the other around.

#44 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

How dare Cyclops who's just been through one of the worst hells imaginable be worried about his wife's corruption and death. How dare he seem distance and frayed from being possessed by one of the most evil beings in the MU.

#45 Posted by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@time:

You know I just thought of something... what if Jean sent the Phoenix? Specifically at Cyclops to burn away the taint that Apocalypse put in him. Naahhh Marvel doesn't have that kind of vision.

#46 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

How dare Cyclops who's just been through one of the worst hells imaginable be worried about his wife's corruption and death. How dare he seem distance and frayed from being possessed by one of the most evil beings in the MU.

Your talking about Apocalypse right. If anything it would of made more sense if he share his feelings with his wife in New X-Men, cause she understands what it likes to be control by powerful force, full of darkness.

A least now he gets a taste of what like being corrupted by the Phoenix

I think he held her back and she clearly state it in the post.

#47 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@time said:

He more worried about himself and saying he can't cope with her being in that costume. Jean Grey wants to move on, she want them both to move on and be happy. Looking at this image above and people say Jean held Cyclops back, if anything it's the other around.

He's afraid of what will happen to her. He watched watched as Jean killed herself in front of him because she couldn't handle the phoenix. He doesn't want to lose her again. If anything this shows his love for her.

#48 Posted by time (4845 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

@time:

You know I just thought of something... what if Jean sent the Phoenix? Specifically at Cyclops to burn away the taint that Apocalypse put in him. Naahhh Marvel doesn't have that kind of vision.

That's just lame. Why would she do that, she was in the white room.

#49 Edited by TheCrowbar (4286 posts) - - Show Bio

@time:

He's ashamed of it. It's pretty explicit in that explanation, he's ashamed which is what makes it hard for him to talk about. Just imagine how violating it would be for him to lose all control and be a tool of that psychopath.

@time said:

@TheCrowbar said:

@time:

You know I just thought of something... what if Jean sent the Phoenix? Specifically at Cyclops to burn away the taint that Apocalypse put in him. Naahhh Marvel doesn't have that kind of vision.

That's just lame. Why would she do that, she was in the white room.

To help Cyclops become the man he used to be?

#50 Posted by Osian2 (455 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheCrowbar said:

@time:

He's ashamed of it. It's pretty explicit in that explanation, he's ashamed which is what makes it hard for him to talk about. Just imagine how violating it would be for him to lose all control and be a tool of that psychopath.

@time said:

@TheCrowbar said:

@time:

You know I just thought of something... what if Jean sent the Phoenix? Specifically at Cyclops to burn away the taint that Apocalypse put in him. Naahhh Marvel doesn't have that kind of vision.

That's just lame. Why would she do that, she was in the white room.

To help Cyclops become the man he used to be?

Also Jean experience as the Phoenix has empowered her and it turned out that she never was the Dark Phoenix. Her memories of being possessed weren't bad hence why she was never really worried when ever her powers came back.

Scotts possession on the other hand was one of suffering only. He felt like a monster and that if Jean knew how much he'h changed she wopuld reject and hate him, something he wouldn't be able to handle. This again shows his love for her in that he would rather suffer alone than risk losing her.

It could make sense that Jean sent the Phoenix seeing as it was stated that she and the Phoenix were tied to each other. Plua now he would know how Jean felt and wouldn't be so concerned about her powers if she came back. Marvel hates Jean Grey fans though so it won't happen.

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