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    X-Men

    Team » X-Men appears in 13410 issues.

    The X-Men are a superhero team of mutants founded by Professor Charles Xavier. They are dedicated to helping fellow mutants and sworn to protect a world that fears and hates them.

    Rumor: Storm and Wolverine breaking up??

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    LightningBolt

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    @hawk2916 said:

    Its funny to me that there are some saying that Storm bed hopping is not degrading. And saying or implying, or maybe I misunderstood, that her being multiple relationships at the same time is just fine and dandy. I mean really if your girl was with you then jumping on to the next guy, I think most of us would calk her a whore and throw her out on her ass. In school,college or whatever theres always that girl that sleeps around and while you may get down with her, you dont make her your girl. Then in reality how is she viewed by most? Part of the point being made here at least as I see it is that Storm has always been presented as a strong female character. To present her now as jumping into one relationship after another turns into a needy, and seemingly insecure person. As if in order to be relevant she must defines by a male character in the picture.

    I think something that's important to think about is the double standard that exists when it comes to men and women's sex lives. Nobody seems to think that a man is degrading himself when he sleeps with multiple people and yet a woman is considered a slut.

    If Storm chooses to have multiple partners, to me, it's her being a strong female character because she won't conform to the societal expectations that create that double standard and doesn't care what people think of her. She's choosing to take control of her sexuality instead of not doing something for fear of how others might see her, and that's the opposite of insecurity, I think. She doesn't need a man to define her, she just does what she wants.

    In order for her to be degraded, by definition, she'd have to be doing something she felt like she shouldn't be doing, or something she didn't really want to do in the first place. But it seems to be other people who have a problem with what she is doing, not her or necessarily the people she's with.

    The only reason it should be a problem for someone to be with multiple people is if they gave the impression to someone that they were exclusive, but that's just because it's lying to someone, and I don't think anyone is under the impression that they are in a monogamous relationship with Storm. Some people are just happier in non-monogamous relationships, and as long as everyone involved knows that's what's going on and are ok with it, there's nothing wrong with that.

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    HAWK2916

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    @lightningbolt: Well I happen to think that the standard applies both ways. I try and pride myself on not being a hypocrite. A strong individual male or female shouldnt need a relationship to define them. Its weak. I dont care for any of the superheroes to constantly be defined by who they are in a relationship with. Neither do i want everybody bed-hopping and jumping into relationships all over the place. If I wanted to watch that i'd tune into reality tv or soap operas, which I dont. Having a relationship is fine but everytime I turn around in every different book if a character is in yet another relationship or bed-hopping at what point am I not reading a superhero book an have crossed into 50 shades of grey territory.

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    oldnightcrawler

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    @hawk2916 said:

    @oldnightcrawler: lol. Why even try its impossible. Sometimes this stuff just descends into arguing for the sake of arguing and thats ridiculous. Sometimes its ok to not be a liberal, its not a crime to have an opinion that doesnt please everyone.

    it's true, it's not a crime to be sexist.

    it's just exclusive and shitty.

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    oldnightcrawler

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    HAWK2916

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    @oldnightcrawler: let me get this straight, are you name calling now? I just want to know. Because if not then fine i misunderstood. If so then I think you need to actually read what I said because I included either gender in my statements

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    oldnightcrawler

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    @hawk2916: I did get where you said

    "To present her now as jumping into one relationship after another turns into a needy, and seemingly insecure person. As if in order to be relevant she must defines by a male character in the picture. Amazingly this is not being pushed on most single male superheroes, thats whats degrading."

    and I do sort of get your point about how it's a disservice to a character to have them defined by another character. But, by that same note, it shouldn't matter who a character is with. Which is why I take issue with statements like

    "I mean really if your girl was with you then jumping on to the next guy, I think most of us would calk her a whore and throw her out on her ass. In school,college or whatever theres always that girl that sleeps around and while you may get down with her, you dont make her your girl."

    which totally judges another human being for not meeting your personal value system in how they live their life. I mean, if you've been in a relationship where you felt like someone wasn't honest with you or somehow betrayed your trust, hey, I feel that, that is crap behavior. But the idea that women (or anyone) owe men (or society, or anyone) some justification for how they define love, or just want to feel good, you're stepping on a slippery slope.

    If someone isn't in a committed relationship, if they're single, or if they're in a non-monogamous relationship, why is who they choose to spend their time with anyone else's business?

    I mean, you're also saying you're just not into the whole soap opera aspect of that type of story, and, hey, to each their own. If that type of story isn't your thing, it isn't. But, that doesn't make women (or anyone) who define their own sexual boundaries to be of intrinsically less value as people.

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    HAWK2916

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    @oldnightcrawler: I also applied it to men which should quell the implied notion that Im being sexist.I gave an example from a male point of view because Im male. I think its actually kind of ridiculous for male charactees to exist for years with no real ties or relationship only thier heeiic actions defining them but a female has to be shown differently. People are people and what they do is what they do but it also doesnt make me less of a person because I dont always go along with conformist ideas. Im simply saying if thats not what should define a character then leave it out. An example of what I mean is take Psylocke in Uncanny Xforce. She was with Archangel then in grief she turned to Fantomex and then later in the Marvel Now era a whole book was hijacked focusing on her in a bisexual relationship with Cluster (a part of fantomex-more like a clusterf*ck if you ask me). Yet you have the tragedy of Cyclops killing his mentor and losing everything to gain everything and does he turn to a woman for a sexual relationship to get thru.... no. Why is Betsy written as needing this while the man doesnt? Im a fan of both yet I take that as a dig and a sly way of slighting her character in a way that wasnt done to Scott. If things cant be written right and portrayed properly and on equal footing then leave it out completely. Thats part of what im saying

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    poisonfleur

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    OKAY-- For the record. I have ALWAYS considered Wolverine a Man-whore since I can barely keep track of who he is sleeping with. For example when I saw the cover of X-force... was he boning Domino???????? Anyways, no double standards here. I just think it's off-putting to see Storm stoop to that level. Especially since she has had very deep relationships in the past-- Forge & Yukio. And mainly because she doesn't need a man! She actually works pretty well with out. :)

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    THUNDERBOLT30

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    I think something that's important to think about is the double standard that exists when it comes to men and women's sex lives. Nobody seems to think that a man is degrading himself when he sleeps with multiple people and yet a woman is considered a slut.

    If Storm chooses to have multiple partners, to me, it's her being a strong female character because she won't conform to the societal expectations that create that double standard and doesn't care what people think of her. She's choosing to take control of her sexuality instead of not doing something for fear of how others might see her, and that's the opposite of insecurity, I think. She doesn't need a man to define her, she just does what she wants.

    In order for her to be degraded, by definition, she'd have to be doing something she felt like she shouldn't be doing, or something she didn't really want to do in the first place. But it seems to be other people who have a problem with what she is doing, not her or necessarily the people she's with.

    The only reason it should be a problem for someone to be with multiple people is if they gave the impression to someone that they were exclusive, but that's just because it's lying to someone, and I don't think anyone is under the impression that they are in a monogamous relationship with Storm. Some people are just happier in non-monogamous relationships, and as long as everyone involved knows that's what's going on and are ok with it, there's nothing wrong with that.

    Exactly. I really don't see what the big deal is for some of the posters here.

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    oldnightcrawler

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    @hawk2916 said:

    @oldnightcrawler: I also applied it to men which should quell the implied notion that Im being sexist.I gave an example from a male point of view because Im male. I think its actually kind of ridiculous for male characters to exist for years with no real ties or relationship only thier heroic actions defining them but a female has to be shown differently. Im simply saying if thats not what should define a character then leave it out.

    Again, I'm not disagreeing with this point, but we do define a lot of characters, male and female, at least partially by their romantic relationships: Cyclops, Jean Grey, Reed and Sue Richards, Hank Pym and the Wasp, etc, are all characters who, by their actions, have chosen to define their personal boundaries by the relationships they're in, and no one seems to have a problem with that.

    What we're talking about with characters like Wolverine or Storm, however, are characters who traditionally haven't defined themselves that way, and that's what people seem to have a problem with. For me, the X-men have actually been much better about what you're talking about than most superhero characters if you consider that Storm, Kitty, Rachel, Rogue, Psylocke, Jubilee, Emma, etc, were all defined as strong, independent characters for years before any of them were involved in romantic relationships at all.

    An example of what I mean is take Psylocke in Uncanny Xforce. She was with Archangel then in grief she turned to Fantomex and then later in the Marvel Now era a whole book was hijacked focusing on her in a bisexual relationship with Cluster (a part of fantomex-more like a clusterf*ck if you ask me). Yet you have the tragedy of Cyclops killing his mentor and losing everything to gain everything and does he turn to a woman for a sexual relationship to get thru.... no. Why is Betsy written as needing this while the man doesnt? Im a fan of both yet I take that as a dig and a sly way of slighting her character in a way that wasnt done to Scott. If things cant be written right and portrayed properly and on equal footing then leave it out completely. Thats part of what im saying

    I think this is a fair point, and I do agree in general, but it's maybe not the best example.

    Consider that the first thing Cyclops does after breaking out of jail is go rescue Emma, so it's not really fair to say he wouldn't have done the same thing. Especially if we consider how he reacted after the first time he thought Jean was dead, quitting the X-men and getting almost immediately on the rebound with Lee Forrester and then Madelyne Pryor. If anything, right now might be the only time Cyclops hasn't been in a romantic relationship, and that only seems to be because Emma broke up with him. If anything, Cyclops is a character who has perpetually been at least partially defined by his romantic relationships (Jean, then Maddy, then Jean, and then Emma, all greatly effecting the arc of his character along the way).

    Psylocke then, by being on the rebound with Fantomex and/or Cluster (since the idea is that what she was attracted to was the same person in both), is really only dealing with Angel's death in exactly the same way as Cyclops dealt with Jean's. Moreover, Psylocke was developed as a character for years before being in a relationship with anyone and has thus actually been less defined by her romantic relationships than Cyclops.

    One of the things that makes a character like Storm so singular among classic female superheroes is that she was around for a decade before she ever had any serious romantic relationships, and so has been more defined by her own evolution as a hero. So, that she's found comfort with an old friend after her marriage to the 'Panther ended, for me, does nothing to diminish that or devalue her strength as a character, regardless of what that relationship is (which seems to be the real issue here).

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    HAWK2916

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    #61  Edited By HAWK2916

    @oldnightcrawler: yeah.... well the whole point Ive been trying to make is while YOU personally might not see it as a big deal, there are SOME that see it as degrading. Storm is one of my favorite characters but I hate when characters are used to push certain shall we say political agendas. Because SOME view it as degrading, this angers me, because I have no choice but to feel like its being done on purpose. Almost like when someone calls a person you care about a derogatory name, it bothers you. That was my whole thing reasoning from the other side, the not so liberal side of the spectrum. Because of the number of liberals it feels at least to me like a sly attempt at character assassination. Personally at least for me, my biggest issue with her portrayal is not how she chooses to express herself, rather its who shes been put with. That they put her with the hypocrite is my source of frustration. I admit i did go off a little bit on some of the suggestions I was reading here, but only because I felt it was going down that same old road again. Then when I felt that some were trying to argue by taking bits and pieces of what I was saying instead of looking at the whole, it just descended further into doing the thing I hate which is derailing a topic.

    So to take all the way back to the original question/thread content..... If the rumor is that they might be ending whatever relationship they have, Im actually fine with it. I dont care for them being together anyway so I would be completely happy.

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    Cutter

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    Don't know about you guys but, this is the best for Storm and wolverine...not be together.

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    Uncanny-Mutie

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    Breaking up?!? I didn't know they were in a relationship. I was under the impression that they were just f__k buddies. :)

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    jhazzroucher

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    #64  Edited By jhazzroucher

    They will never break up

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    daredevil21134

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    Good.She can do better.She just needs to go to Hell's Kitchen and meet a certain charming Lawyer......hahaha

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    StormRockstheXMEN

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    Storm and Daredevil? There's a couple I never considered.

    I wanted to like Storm and Wolverine together, and I really thought I could. They have a shared history and a deep friendship that connects them on many levels. However, it just isn't translating with the current stories. This being the case, I'd rather see them apart.

    I think I'd rather read about Storm and Namor hooking in during the Age of X.

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    Erik

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    Please, who didn't see that coming?

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    jhazzroucher

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    Storm and Daredevil? There's a couple I never considered.

    I wanted to like Storm and Wolverine together, and I really thought I could. They have a shared history and a deep friendship that connects them on many levels. However, it just isn't translating with the current stories. This being the case, I'd rather see them apart.

    I think I'd rather read about Storm and Namor hooking in during the Age of X.

    They have great chemistry together. Storm and Wolverine forever!

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    StormRockstheXMEN

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    @stormrocksthexmen said:

    Storm and Daredevil? There's a couple I never considered.

    I wanted to like Storm and Wolverine together, and I really thought I could. They have a shared history and a deep friendship that connects them on many levels. However, it just isn't translating with the current stories. This being the case, I'd rather see them apart.

    I think I'd rather read about Storm and Namor hooking in during the Age of X.

    They have great chemistry together. Storm and Wolverine forever!

    I hate to burst your bubble Jhazz, but they are not destined to be in the comic book. If you are reading Wolverine new series, they've already broken up and he's moved on.

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    Jeanniebird

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    @stormrocksthexmen said:

    Storm and Daredevil? There's a couple I never considered.

    I wanted to like Storm and Wolverine together, and I really thought I could. They have a shared history and a deep friendship that connects them on many levels. However, it just isn't translating with the current stories. This being the case, I'd rather see them apart.

    I think I'd rather read about Storm and Namor hooking in during the Age of X.

    They have great chemistry together. Storm and Wolverine forever!

    Indeed, Rolo forever! They are to good together to ignore. Even if apparently some comic book authors disagree. Then again, there are quite a few things I disagree with the comics when it comes to Wolverine. But hey, that's what life's all about: Disagreeing. About fictional comic characters ;-)

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