Do I really need to have a starting point for X-men, and then go from there? Or can I just pick up any x-men hardcover/omnibus and be alright? (So long as I have at least SOME general knowledge of what I'm about to read) because if continuity IS in fact really important, or even relatively Important, I feel screwed as far as X-men goes...

@landrysaathoff: There are multiple jumping on points in X-men history and many summaries of X-men history exist online and elsewhere. It can be difficult to just jump right into any given point in X-men comics over the years, and some require more context than others, but there's a certain amount of fun to be had from finding stuff out as you go along.

Tl;dr- yes and no.

@landrysaathoff: really I'd say if you don't want to hunt things down or pay out the youknowwhat... the best bet is too find the most recent hardcover and then just use Wikipedia to fill the books then if you like what your reading and want to see how it got to this point, or even just want a better appreciation for the current events you can always track down older books.

It doesn't seem to matter anymore...

@squares:

Ok like what Jumping on points? Because I was thinking of starting with Claremont's Uncanny X-Men omnibi Vol.1 and Vol.2 because people say that it's the "spiritual starting point" of x-men, and it's what interests me the most right now. So that means starting at Claremont's first issue which is #94 I believe. But it's difficult, because those two omnibus volumes I'm looking at buying go from #94 at the beginning of the first omnibus, and then all the way up to Uncanny X-men #152 (or somewhere around that) by the end of Vol.2. Which is all fine and dandy, UNTIL I see another X-Men omnibus (also by Claremont, which adds to my confusion) that is just called "X-Men" and it starts at someplace like Uncanny X-Men #234 and then onward from there. Why did it skip so much? Is what it skipped important? Will it likely be collected in Uncanny X-Men omnibus Vol.3? What's the difference between the two (why are they named differently)? And my most important question... Why would they realse it that way, why wouldent they just realse Claremont's run Chronologically?

@landrysaathoff: I'll try to answer your questions in order.

Jumping on points include Astonishing X-men: Gifted, Second Genesis, and (somewhat) All-New X-men.

That sounds like a good place to start, I'd certainly recommend it.

I have no idea why omnibuses (omnibi?) do that so often, I assume they're either trying to collect runs or different companies have different ideas about what they want to collect.

What they skipped (around Uncanny #234) is pretty important, I think. But hey, when it comes to important reading for X-men, different people believe different things...

If the first series of omnibuses seems to collect Uncanny X-men from #1 onwards in a logical fashion then yes, it most likely will be included at some point.

They're probably made by different companies.

Other than the reasons I stated...I don't know, I suppose some publishers only want to (or can?) include certain comics.

As a bit of a side note, I started reading X-men comics with Claremont's New Mutants. It's a decent starting point but doesn't tell you all that much about the core teams.

@squares: This is actually very helpful, thank you. Does anyone else have anything to add to that to further my understanding of X-Men and Marvel's confusing Omnibuses?

continuity is not that important.

if a story is meant to take place in the same continuity as another, it will be referenced in the story. Otherwise it just doesn't matter.

start anywhere, read enough, and you'll pick it up as you go.

As far as "jumping on" points, I don' think continuity matters that much. As far as the overall evolution and development of the characters I think continuity is essential and does matter. Most of the major stories will reference the canon events enough for new readers to understand the relevant parts of history.

Definitely this.

This is what happens to x-men fans when you put Bendis on All New.

why?

It can significantly impacts the quality of the story they are telling. When writers take their time to know the relevant history of the characters they are using I think it makes the story quality a lot better, it's more "believable" in a positive or constructive sense for long time readers, and really makes for a more satisfying reading experience because all of the elements of the story and their connection to the characters fits.

For long time readers like myself I find that there is nothing more asinine than writers who disregard important elements of continuity and end up presenting a story filled with PIS, WIS, and/or CIS, and can also sometimes be regressive to the character.

For a minor example with Storm, we know that she can use her powers while she is in space. But under Hudlin's pen during her time in the Black Panther title, she goes into space to visit the inhumans, they all get into a fight, and suddenly....her powers don't work while in space and she is effectively helpless. It went from being an interesting and entertaining story to asinine crap and a ruined reading experience (since I only read that book for Storm) because Hudlin didn't do his homework.

sorry, I didn't mean why is continuity beneficial?, I meant, why is continuity "essential"?

The Dark Knight Returns, The Killing Joke, All Star Superman, The Ultimates, Kingdom Come, Old Man Logan, the animated or cinematic version of any comic character, all of these stories take place outside of established continuity and all of them are still great -and in some cases, definitive- stories with those respective characters; based on that, while I can see the benefit of continuity, I still don't see why it need be considered "essential" to a story being good.

@oldnightcrawler: Well for stories that are established from the beginning to be happening outside of continuity (movie verse, animated and non 616 stories in the MU) I don't think adhering to history is important. They are off shoots that are intended to be outside of normal continuity and will have a continuity of their own (if it's ongoing like the movie-verse). Those stories can be good but I don't see how this is relevant here.

I don't think this addresses the question from the OP or applies to what I posted above, which is speaking to the importance of adhering to actual 616 continuity. I think continuity is essential to what happens in the main universe for the reasons I explained.

Since we both like him let's use Kurt for an example. Not adhering to continuity is like having 616 Nightcrawler suddenly becoming an atheist and a blood thirsty killer because a writer doesn't care to follow the history of the character and how these important elements of the character relates to the universe of the X-Men. This is obviously an extreme example to help clarify what I am stating but if a new reader jumped on with that story he/she would be off base with important history of the X-Men universe.

The older stories were more consistent in terms of continuity, and overall plot direction. Stories written after 2008-2009 don't tend to place much emphasis on continuity while retcons and out-of-character plotting/dialogue start to proliferate. If you don't care about the overall history of the team, you can pretty much pick up any more recent book and treat it as self-contained fanfiction stories.

I think continuity is important, because otherwise there is no point following a series - you might as well just collect artbooks IMHO, but I also think it's best to be realistic about the direction of Marvel comics. I don't think new readers need new jumping on points, because the executive teams are focused on making each title as accessible as possible to new readers by downplaying prior canon, and constantly setting up new status quos every few months.

my point with bringing those stories up was that they still retain the essence of what's cool about the characters and tell good stories even without sharing continuity with other stories. I would argue that most good stories do. if it's important that a story exists in the same continuity as another, that will be made relevant in the story, but if if it isn't, why does it matter?

Take Whedon's Astonishing X-Men or Morrison's New X-Men; those books do take place in continuity, but since they don't cross over with any other stories, it doesn't really matter to those stories themselves that they do.

See, for me that's an example of character consistency, which I do see as more relevant. But even within a set continuity, characters are written out of character all the time, so it's not as if continuity itself prevents that. Character consistency I can totally see the point of, but continuity is really just how all the stories fit together, which needn't be relevant to the stories themselves.

@oldnightcrawler: I see what you mean and know that there are some stories that continuity is not important to, but I stand by my point. I'm not stating that continuity is the fix for characters being written consistently, only that it's relevant and essential as it pertains to the characters' histories and evolution, and if it matters, good story quality. That history and evolution can be tied and important to the over all continuity of the X-Verse (i.e. - Jean Grey with the PF, Xavier's conflict with Magneto), but as I mentioned in my 1st post, if the OP just wants to have a "jump on" point and has a general idea of what is currently going on, then I wouldn't stress about continuity.

@thunderbolt30: and I stand by my point that if continuity is important to a given story, it will be referenced in that story, and if not it doesn't matter. But I do agree that it's not worth stressing about :v

Well just for argument....I think continuity is really important just not concurrent continuity. Example being, If the X-Mansion gets blown up in one book then i don't care that its still standing in another title that's out within the same time. But after a year of time, the writer should acknowledge that the X-Men don't live at the mansion anymore and their stories have a new setting.

We read stories to see what happens next, if someone dies i'd like to know that they won't just comeback to life a few years later and not have to explain why because its a different author.(Corsair)

@koays: Corsair got off lucky, I wish I just didn't know how Nightcrawler came back to life.

I'd be just as happy if he showed up at the school and was just, like, "hello, mein frende! did you miss me while I was in Heaven?" or whatever.

LMAO, when you put it that way, i think i'll put my Corsair complaints to the side....lol You think Aaron was just lashing out because he was taken off the X-Books?

@koays: nah, I think he was happy to get to do that story; if nothing else it's obvious that the guy loves Nightcrawler. The first 4 issues of Amazing X-Men were actually pretty satisfying, as were some parts of issue 6.. I just think his explanation for how Nightcrawler came back to life was overly contrived and beyond weird, seemingly just for the sake of being singular.

@oldnightcrawler: His writing style makes it hard to tell for me. He tends to have a lot of story arcs that start off strong and let down in the ending, but this was something he had to consider twice. Oh well if anything he gave Kyle and Yost something to explore with the character.