@jpgman: Yes, that's what I mean. Personally I try to avoid spoilers but knowing that that's the explanation certainly alleviates some stress because Taylor has been writing this book so well I really haven't understood how he could get just that one thing so wrong.
Wonder Woman
Character » Wonder Woman appears in 8808 issues.
The Amazon princess, blessed with god-like super abilities, Wonder Woman is one of Earth's most powerful defenders of peace, justice, and equality and a member of the Justice League. She is considered an archetype for many heroines outside of comic book. Her initial origin depicted her as a clay baby brought to life by patron goddess Aphrodite, but in recent years she has been depicted as the daughter of Zeus and Amazon queen Hippolyta.
Why I Despise Injustice's Wonder Woman
@jpgman: Well the two are technically not related. The comic isn't really meant to be a prequel (especially as it's planned as an ongoing for as long as sales support it) so obviously there will be differences. Still, if that happens in the game, it could happen in the comic, and right now it's a better explanation than just "whatever, it's not canon, so WW can be however he wants her to be."
I think later issues update them though? I have seen images from it being released on ign, and the pages were from issues that weren't even out yet. I could be wrong but the pages I saw were Batman visiting superman in what appears to be his city or white house or what ever, with soldiers and the house of El crest on Flags, with him being an actual dictator or leader, and his costume seems to be the one from the game.
Well. it is official, Her and Superman beat a young, and clearly, inferior hero till he was crippled, because he tried to stop them from breaking up a non-hostile protest in a foreign country.
Well. it is official, Her and Superman beat a young, and clearly, inferior hero till he was crippled, because he tried to stop them from breaking up a non-hostile protest in a foreign country.
Oh wow. Really? Did the kid make it?
Yes, Batman called an ambulance. Flash stood there and watched, but now is ashamed. That is mainly what the last issue was about.
@drgnx: ....o.o... me likey!
Evil Wondie is just too much fun.
Precisely! I think they're "Watchmen"-ing it up!
@jphulk26: Your spoiler didn't work and you many have ruined the surprised for some.
See this debate is still raging. Aside from the people who just dislike the Injustice premise in general (I'm sorry, but you can't have a perfect Superman in this story and have it make any sense, so yeah, he's going to get his hands dirty), I think the real issue is that while other characters are behaving differently because of extreme stimuli pushing them to act that way, Wonder Woman is just acting really OOC with no clear reason for doing so. Superman's behavior makes sense in the context of the extreme nature of what happened - he really killed his wife and unborn child, and he really wiped out the entire city of Metropolis. But what's Diana's excuse for being "whatever he needs me to be"?
If the spoiler which has surfaced in this thread is accurate, then that helps a lot and it will make people's complaints go away. Until it does, people getting upset over her representation -- the most glaring deviance from canon -- makes sense.
It makes perfect sense for that Wonder Woman. People forget that this isn't the standard universe's version for all we know she's always felt that way and it's just coming to the surface. As I keep saying the reason that so many can't appreciate it is because they won't allow themselves to see Diana through someone else's eyes.
@evil_incarnate: But that's just the point. She is the only character whose behavior is entirely incompatible with "the real" Wonder Woman. Even if you believe that Superman would never kill, under any circumstances at all, ever, his actions are at least understandable within the context of the story -- they're as believable as any story involving Superman killing someone ever could be. So this new version is different, but you watched him start out as the Superman you knew and then saw him change into this one who is increasingly different. But Wonder Woman has just been completely different all the way through, and said some things that the "real" Wonder Woman would be loathe to say, because they are directly contradictory of who she is and why people value her, and unlike Superman, who at least had a clear reason for acting contrary to how he would, and who naturally evolved into that, she just is different.
I understand your point but I simply don't accept it. All of these characters are stretched versions of their real selves, but Wonder Woman is nigh unrecognizable. Saying she's more changed than the others is not something you need to try to disprove.
ya, I'm not a big fan of how they did wonder-woman in the injustice game. she whas who I first used in the demo and after finishing the demo I realized I'd never use her again. I really hope this game has different enterances and ending animations for each character or else it will get real old real quick.
@evil_incarnate: But that's just the point. She is the only character whose behavior is entirely incompatible with "the real" Wonder Woman. Even if you believe that Superman would never kill, under any circumstances at all, ever, his actions are at least understandable within the context of the story -- they're as believable as any story involving Superman killing someone ever could be. So this new version is different, but you watched him start out as the Superman you knew and then saw him change into this one who is increasingly different. But Wonder Woman has just been completely different all the way through, and said some things that the "real" Wonder Woman would be loathe to say, because they are directly contradictory of who she is and why people value her, and unlike Superman, who at least had a clear reason for acting contrary to how he would, and who naturally evolved into that, she just is different.
I understand your point but I simply don't accept it. All of these characters are stretched versions of their real selves, but Wonder Woman is nigh unrecognizable. Saying she's more changed than the others is not something you need to try to disprove.
Let's stop and think for a moment. What do you know of this version of Superman before he killed the Joker? You know like I do that he was married to Lois Lane. Now did it take him the same amount of time as it did in the cannon universe to marry her? Did they have a child in the cannon universe? If they did have a child in the cannon universe would she have had the same kid in this Elseworld comic? Could it have been a girl instead of a boy or vice versa?
What do you know about this version of Wonder Woman before these events took place? Did Wonder Woman come to America with Steve Trevor? Did this Wonder Woman ever have romantic interest in Superman and if so did she ever express them? Did she have a romantic relationship with Batman? Has she ever displayed jealousy towards Lois?
There's no point in you attempting to answer any of these questions because you nor I know, why is that? Because we were all given the same amount of limited knowledge of these versions of our favorite characters. The story started without giving us any back history of the Justice League members. Meaning that somethings can be the same as in the cannon universe and somethings can be different. Now whether that difference is just a tad bit askew or totally different in comparison has yet to be fully seen.
You've done what many readers have done given limited knowledge of them, which is you substituted what you don't know about these versions with what you do know about the cannon universe. While this might be a natural instinct for many it doesn't make it any less illogical.
Let's break this down and simplify it. You know for a fact that this is an Elseworld comic and with that things will be different and not completely the same this includes, but is not limited to hair color, height, powers, people, etc, however despite that knowledge you're complaining that she's different. Different to whom? Different than the Wonder Woman of the cannon universe, which we knew would be a possibility and therefore it doesn't matter or different to the Wonder Woman of the Elseworld universe, which you nor any other reader has a previous knowledge of?
You like many readers whom are complaining and are refusing to accept this version as cannon to this specific universe have unfounded and unjustifiable complaints. You were given fair warning that this would be different and because the difference isn't something you find favorable you're saying she's evil, etc. Is she not fighting for peace? Did she alongside Superman not call for a ceasefire between nations? Did she kill the soldiers in the tank or did she allow them to live? She's different to the cannon universe Wonder Woman this we know and this is what we expected in some way, but you're refusing to acknowledge this Wonder Woman as she is in this specific universe because of your lack of imagination because you and many others like you can't or won't see past what you expect of her.
The same could be said of Flashpoint Wonder Woman. In that reality she waged war, conquered the U.K., killed Steve Trevor and fought physically on even ground with Aquaman. Did you read that and accept it as an alternate timeline and therefore true or did you mentally discredit all of the events along the way by comparing them to the cannon timeline? In short you've already summed up that you refuse to accept this portrayal of her, which further solidifies my previous point that people need to become better readers and expand their imaginations.
@evil_incarnate: Well, I have no desire to argue with you over this. Taken every other character's differences in behavior between Injustice portrayal and canon, the deviation is observably greater with WW than any other character. You have not endeavored to disprove this claim, which is likely wise, because you'd likely fail.
I have no great desire to defend anything here. The fact that the game features an alternate-universe version of WW who may have ulterior motives, and that such a thing would in fact make a tremendous amount of sense based on how the comic version has acted, may mean nothing. But consider how absurd that whole rant you just gave will seem if it turns out she wasn't Wonder Woman all along?
The thing that sets apart this book as so good is that it's believable. Yes, in an elseworlds book "anything can happen," but the intriguing thing about Injustice is that you can actually see how these events would happen -- as if they flowed naturally from canon into this storyline. The thing is, the rest of the characters can have their canon history intact and still act and speak as they have in Injustice -- either easily, or with only mild strain of imagination. Wonder Woman alone breaks that statement -- she sticks out as speaking not just differently, but antithetically to the things the very core idea of Wonder Woman as a character is about. She refused to deliver news to Clark which would have brokered peace and saved lives. I'm sorry, but that is a bit too much for my imagination.
But like I said, it really does not matter to me. I enjoy this book quite a bit. I don't care whether the depictions are accurate. But my appreciation of the book has not clouded my judgment as to whether the accuracy is there. And I see it missing in Diana in a way it is present in everyone else. If you dispute that, that's your prerogative. I make no snap judgments -- I see only that with each issue, she becomes a more loathsome character to me any many others, and I do not understand why.
I'm not saying "don't answer this," but if you do, and seek to argue, I will warn you I have no reply. I legitimately do not care.
@evil_incarnate: Well, I have no desire to argue with you over this. Taken every other character's differences in behavior between Injustice portrayal and canon, the deviation is observably greater with WW than any other character. You have not endeavored to disprove this claim, which is likely wise, because you'd likely fail.
I have no great desire to defend anything here. The fact that the game features an alternate-universe version of WW who may have ulterior motives, and that such a thing would in fact make a tremendous amount of sense based on how the comic version has acted, may mean nothing. But consider how absurd that whole rant you just gave will seem if it turns out she wasn't Wonder Woman all along?
The thing that sets apart this book as so good is that it's believable. Yes, in an elseworlds book "anything can happen," but the intriguing thing about Injustice is that you can actually see how these events would happen -- as if they flowed naturally from canon into this storyline. The thing is, the rest of the characters can have their canon history intact and still act and speak as they have in Injustice -- either easily, or with only mild strain of imagination. Wonder Woman alone breaks that statement -- she sticks out as speaking not just differently, but antithetically to the things the very core idea of Wonder Woman as a character is about. She refused to deliver news to Clark which would have brokered peace and saved lives. I'm sorry, but that is a bit too much for my imagination.
But like I said, it really does not matter to me. I enjoy this book quite a bit. I don't care whether the depictions are accurate. But my appreciation of the book has not clouded my judgment as to whether the accuracy is there. And I see it missing in Diana in a way it is present in everyone else. If you dispute that, that's your prerogative. I make no snap judgments -- I see only that with each issue, she becomes a more loathsome character to me any many others, and I do not understand why.
I'm not saying "don't answer this," but if you do, and seek to argue, I will warn you I have no reply. I legitimately do not care.
The whole point of Elseworld comics is to be able to play around with characters in ways that would "ruin" the canonical timeline. By comparing both timelines Wonder Woman seems the most different of any character, but even if the big reveal is that she's in fact a doppelganger where would the "aha moment" lie? As none of us have any previous knowledge of this Wonder Woman to compare her actions to it's not as if any of us could clearly say this isn't the real her because she doesn't act like the real her. For that we'd have to rely on the other characters analysis of her behavior. Clearly many want this to not be the real her as her character in this doesn't sit right with them and the explanation that it wasn't her all along would calm their minds and uphold the image they've built for her within their minds.
Also I see many going back to the point that she didn't fully tell Superman what Aquaman said as if this holds some sort of significance as whether or not she's truly evil. There are two things he said one to seek his counsel and two that he was sorry about Lois. If this version is truly in love with Superman and wants to be with him then reminding him of his dead wife whom he accidentally killed along with their child isn't the best way to go about getting him to love you too. At most she's being selfish in this moment. Furthermore none of what she left out would/could have saved lives as the battle with Atlantis already ended and she informed Superman that Aquaman agreed to stand down. Thus ending the battle and prompted Superman to return Atlantis.
There are many heroes that are blindly following Superman (Flash, Captain Marvel, etc) because he's hurt and angry and they feel the utmost sympathy for him and perhaps are also fed up with stopping problems once they've already started instead of preventing them, yet no one calls them evil.
I wonder if this mean that Superman was keeping her in check, since she said at the beginning that had been waiting for Superman to give that speech, and even helped get him in the mindset to give said speech. This puts her on par with people who only follow the because of the consequences, as soon as you take away the law, they would let loose.
I just finished the story mode and it's very well done. Wonder Woman is not what we've been lead to believe. There's plenty to hate and plenty to love. . . give it a chance :D
@press_oblivion: That speech Wonder Woman made in her chapter after she defeated herself, was very well executed.
She refused to deliver news to Clark which would have brokered peace and saved lives. I'm sorry, but that is a bit too much for my imagination.
To be fair, she did hesitate in that moment. While I agree it's a sleazy move on her part, I believe she did so because she firmly believes Aquaman would only serve as an obstacle in what they're trying to accomplish.
Also, did her remarks in JL #19 remind anyone else of Injustice?
So after playing it (if you even bothered to) what is your updated take on this "ruined" wonder woman, since there was more to it than her just being written this way for the game? As for her personality the more I read the more I don't see why people complain about the actions in the game when they thought she was the main one.
She told Clark he was a stupid idiot for allowing the JLA to secretly erase doctor lights mind, and he should have killed him in the first place, this isn't the first time she suggested killing someone. She refers to people as rabid dogs that need to be put down and monsters that need to be killed. This pure nice wonder woman that was butchered by this game doesn't exist, and was only this way in the cartoon. The one in the game doesn't seem that different at all.
@w0nd: My updated take is that I no longer care. The Wonder Woman presented in the comic is the one that we all know ends up following along with Clark's regime, and who also get's her rear handed to her in the game several times over as per the game's story progression.
In a way though she was written that way for the game. She was written in a way where she would be dislikable when presented against the regular Wonder Woman, which was really the point from the very beginning.
Overall though, I still dislike the "ruined" Wonder Woman, but mostly because of the fact that when you follow the story progression of the game, you never really feel like you are fighting someone important, and even in the big battle when you have regular Diana against regime Diana, it felt like you were fighting someone who was much weaker that what she was supposed to represent. So killing nature aside, I still don't like the Regime Wonder Woman.
Wonder Woman in the game is completely different from the one in the comic. The comic tells the events that leads to Superman's regime in the alternate universe. The Diana from Earth-1 lectures Diana from Earth-V about how she views the outside world. To me they got Diana's personality spot in the game.
I didn't read the comics, just played the game.
And I thought the reason she was acting that way was because she was in love with superman.
But now you're telling me she was just pretending she loved him...=/
Even Catwoman's plot for being part of superman's team makes more sense now! :P
@ultra_beleco: This Wonder Woman is in love with Superman's power that is it.
As much as I like videogames they just aren't subtle. Nearly every triple A game nowadays is more or less violent and misandric with unlikeable characters. It's no surprise that Injustice wanted to tell a story like this even if it is a fighting game.
THE TRUTH ABOUT WONDER WOMAN:
I think fans & writers (especially the fans!) have lost site of who the original Wonder Woman concept was meant to be. She is neither the campy & silly Lynda Carter portrayal, nor the hard warrior that is more akin to Ares.
Her original concept: Force adapted to Love/humanity.
That means she will fight, but her master is Love. And that effects how & when she fights. As opposed to the Aresian way, which is simply thoughtless, hearthless violence.
This concept matches up with Marston's advice to people....to make Love & Altruism your masters, in whatever you do in life--He called this Loving Submission. And to not let the Aresian part of you (the Ego) be the ruling party. Otherwise, you end up with discord, destruction, injustice.
I haven't read the comics or played the game. I know what the breaking point was for Superman in that universe but what was the thing that drove Wonder Woman over the edge? The OP seems to indicate that this universe's WW was always a savage. Anyone want to confirm this?
Wonder Woman is just staunchly and blindly loyal to Superman in this Universe, her dream is helping him realize his. There was no breaking point for Wonder Woman, she's merely driven by her feelings towards Superman.
@brunnhilde: @delphic: I see. Thank you both.
@w0nd: Diana's frustration with Clark had more to do with him keeping Light's rape of Sue Dibny as well as the League's mindwiping him. The most controversial thing canon Wonder Woman ever did was kill Max Lord and that only got so much flak because the video tape of her killing Lord was taken out of context and left out Lord controlling Superman and threatening to have him kill numerous people. Diana may resort to killing but only as last resort.
Contrast with Injustice Diana who has no problem taking advantage of Clark's grief and pushing him to darker paths despite his wife's body being barely cold.
@agent_z: I forgot about this thread. I am fine with evil counter parts. In this case the comic and game just showed why they became corrupt, instead of just showing up and being evil because they are from an evil backwards universe where lef tis right and up is down.
If I remember the OP's main problem was that wonder woman was doing all these things, without even playing the game. All the original "good" characters are in the game
@agent_z: I forgot about this thread. I am fine with evil counter parts. In this case the comic and game just showed why they became corrupt, instead of just showing up and being evil because they are from an evil backwards universe where lef tis right and up is down.
If I remember the OP's main problem was that wonder woman was doing all these things, without even playing the game. All the original "good" characters are in the game
They did that with pretty much every character except Diana. She's depicted as a Lady MacBeth type who enables and encourages Superman's deplorable actions but it's clear that Superman is a tragic figure while Diana is depicted as a corruptive influence with no sympathetic qualities.
To me Injustice is nothing more than a mental exercise of "What if's".
What if, Superman completely lost his way.
What if, Wonder Woman wasn't so noble.
What if, they had to fight against those they called friends.
What if, Superman and WW became united in sorrow.
Because in the end Injustice simply deliver us, the consequences of crossing all the lines. Even those that against those two, have crossed the lines, and in the end they're no better than Superman and WW.
Bruce and his group of rebels in the end they're no better nor more righteous than the one's they're fighting. They too crossed all the lines.
And that is what Injustice is all about. It's Injustice because of the actions that lead to this all mess. It's Injustice because those that swore to upheld Justice turned against it, to satisfy their own personal needs. Both sides did it. And that's the main Injustice, because in Injustice there's no more heroes. Both sides are wrong.
It's an injust world that pushed good people to do injust acts not because they had to do it, but because they chose to do it.
And it's Injustice, because Injustice is what our world is all about. Our world, of we the readers, is an a world were Injustice reigns unquestionable.
And for that simple fact I don't hate any character in Injustice because, in the end they're are the ugly (to our eyes) version of a world that resembles ours in a lot of ways.
People have their own agendas, people make mistakes, people many times by fighting evil become the very evil they're fighting.
It's Injustice.
The thing is that this elseworld is supposed to be different from the main universe in that the Joker nuked Metropolis and made Superman kill his wife and baby, it's not supposed to be a complete rewrite of the characters...character.
Let's take someone like Flash for instance, he wouldn't side with Superman, he barely even want to hurt his own villains when fighting them, and he is often seen trying to talk to them and keep them on the straight and narrow whn they aren't doing something he has to stop. Now we're supposed to believe he would join superman in killing every criminal they find? I can see Hawkgirl or Hawkman doing that but definately not the Flash. And Wonder Woman in this story seem to be basicly trying to please Superman because she's in love with him for some reason, she's been turned completely upside down.
And we're supposed to think the universe is very similar?
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