Full story here:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/10/25/wonder-woman-movie-not-called-wonder-woman

Thoughts?

In my opinion, sales for the previous film are probably because of two reasons:

1. WW always getting shafted by poor promotion and neglect.

2. I know I'm in the minority here but... I thought the movie was kind of weak. The animation was solid but I thought the writing left a little to be desired. IMO it came off way too heavy-handed (a fault of many WW material IMO). But clearly I seem to be in the minority on this.

I just hate that he was like "WW can't support her own title. That's not my opinion... it's just based on sales." One title gives you the right to say she can't support a title?? And one that IMO doesn't measure up to the other animated films? Right.

I also don't get where he was saying her sales figures just didn't get high enough. The sales figures of her film surpasses several Justice League, Superman, and Batman movies. Granted that her film has been out longer to garner more sales.

I'm not surprised that they don't want to do a pure Wonder Woman movie. I don't think it's just a problem of promotion - rather it is a deeper image problem. The general public just doesn't really get Wonder Woman. People understand Batman and Superman - they know the history, the contrast, the supporting characters, and the general themes. With WW they know the costume.

I also agree that the animated film was so-so. The art style was fine and the general plot with Ares was not bad. However I agree her man-hating characterization was heavy-handed. I also didn't like the invisible jet (felt REALLY random), WW's lack of flying, and the way they tried to make Steve Trevor her equal (that first fight between them in the forest? lol, Trevor should have gotten #wrekt). I know it comes across as pathetic 2D waifu obsession, but really Trevor did not feel right for her given that he was admittedly such a cad and literally the first man she meets. Just felt contrived.

WW is still the most successful female comic character,so what are you talking about?.

and who doesn't get WW?,only people that never read her comics,and only judge her by what they saw on the superfriends,JL cartoon,etc,of course they aren't going to get wonder woman if they don't read her title,but a lot of the general audience knows she is an amazon princess,made out off clay,the blessings from the gods,the lasso,bracelets,cheetah,steve trevor,most people know these things,and she has had hits on her own besides her comic,her live action show with lynda carter was a hit,her animated movie was a hit,it's one of DC 10 best selling animated movies,and she achieved all this without all the marketing and pusgh that DC gives to batman and superman,or GL who only has been successful in comics,but flopped with his movie,and WW animated movie sold almost as much as GL 2 animated movies combined.

and another thing,comic female heros movies have a bad trackrecord at the box officie,that's why they are working 3 times harder for WW,because the expections for a movie about her is much higher than the expections for elektra,catwoman and supergirl,so get your facts right.

I agree that she has some image problems... but I think it mainly stems from the writing. Writers just need to get off their "Let's try to write something feminist! Okay how do I do that...? Oh okay we'll just make everyone complain about men and how awful they are and how great women are instead!" Wonder Woman resonates with women. That much is clear. She just needs to increase her male audience and one way of doing that is to make her stories be feminist without hitting people over the head with it... along with getting rid of the fake-feminist "man-hating" stuff that alienates even the most feminist man. Then add in some deeper character work to learn more about Diana and she'll be solid. We just need to get over this thing that "Wonder Woman is for women" thing.

I've said this before but I'm going to keep putting it out into the ether... DC should just go ahead and make Steve Trevor gay. First off, it will remove him as a romantic interest which DC has been wanting to do. Second, it will make his arrival on Themyscira sooooo much more interesting. He can disprove some stereotypes the Amazons have while perpetuating others. Third, it will add some more diversity to DC. Fourth, it will be a good way to make the character less "man-hate-y" by forcing writers to think a little bit more. Just an idea of mine though.

My main problem with this whole thing is that they are completely disrespecting her. She is part of the Trinity. Treat her as such!! If you don't think she can sell a solo movie... fine. Have her do a Batman/WW film or a Superman/WW film (which would be a good chance for them to keep trying to sell the coupling to fans) or even a Trinity movie. But to treat her as a B-tier character is shameful. Funny thing is, I probably wouldn't have noticed or cared that much if they didn't open their big mouths on this.

I never understand why they think its so difficult to do anything with wonderwoman.....

comic female heros movies have a bad trackrecord at the box officie,that's why they are working 3 times harder for WW,because the expections for a movie about her is much higher than the expections for elektra,catwoman and supergirl,WW is a complex character and they will need to work harder than with other female heros.

This is lame news. Unsurprising but lame

Feminist but not male hater, peace maker but not afraid of engaging in fighting, strength, beauty... Too hard for them to understand and interpret. So why not leaver alone until someone who gets her and can show the public who she is shows up? Forcing her making appearance where she is constantly undermined is soooooo unfair.

@gokuwarrior: ahh yes thanks finally somone explains it to me.

the problem is many writter don't writte her following her background,they try to reinvent her instead,johns and azzarello are the latest examples,first we are going to need writters that want to writte her the way she really is,respecting her character and background like perez,ruka did,then we need scripts written by similar people,to bring the true comic wonder woman to the big screen.

@gokuwarrior: So true that some writers just twist her at their will because they don't understand or don't like her. If they can't accept her as who she is, they shouldn't be assigned to the job. Remember Rucka's run when WW want to publish a book? The publisher make her a terrible cover. Too bad we don't have anyone in our world to change the cover back to the lasso of truth

that's why i don't like azzarello,because he said he didn't like wonder woman,so he is just for the money and all the changes he did with the character are just a pretentious attempt to make her own vision of wonder woman disrespecting her fans and creator.

When I say people don't get Wonder Woman I don't mean that people don't know her, I mean they have trouble understanding what is essential and unique about her. Part of the problem is her origin. Batman's is pretty straightforward and easy to work with. Superman's is also quite well-understood. Ask non-comic fans about Wonder Woman and they'll likely shrug or only know bits and pieces.

The thing is, WW is potentially very valuable for DC. The live action show was a hit, and her animated movie did well. It all comes down to writing. Lesser known characters like Blade and Green Lantern can get multiple big budget movies and TV series all because they are executed well enough to make money. WW certainly has similar potential, but it will take a very savvy production with a good script, director, and cast.

@gokuwarrior: wait azzarello said he didn't like wonder woman? i remember him saying b4 he took the gig he didn't like what didio had plan for her so he took the ww job and wrote the new 52 story we have now

completely false,her character is clear and easy to understand,feminist but not male hater, peace maker but not afraid of engaging in fighting, strength, beauty,stand for truth,for equality,for sisterhood,oh yes so hard to understand,please what is so hard to understand in that?,people who read her comic understand all this aspects about the character,the problem is when some writters try to create her own vision,reinvent her instead of writting her stories based on everything that has been established about the character,that's when some people get confused,because they writte her respecting her background instead of trying to reinvent her,that's why ruka and perez run are her most successful and loved by the biggest amount of people,they cared to writte her baased on her established background and didn't try to create a new character out of her.

this is the essential of wonder woman.

her flaws.

she struggles with her duty as a hero and her beliefs,she struggles to understand how can she try to protect humans from evil when she also has to protec humans from themselves,how she protects humans,when she also has to protect the world from humans,she struggles to understand how she often has to fight the once she wants to protect,because the self-destructive nature of humans confuses her,makes her doubt,and she often questions herself about if what she does is right or wrong,she always suffers because her beliefs in love and peace contradict with the violence,lies and distrust of the man's world,which makes her vision of a better world a failure.

and that leads us to the essential elements of wonder woman.

1)amazons,the perfect world ruled by women where peace and love predominate,the utopia that the amazons represent,and diana ralizing that even amazon world isn't perfect and foghts with the prejudice that her sisters have against men.

2)the gods and their blessings to wonder woman.

3)diana is a pure soul,compassionate, kind and protective as a mother and also strong,independent,wise and fearless as a warrior.

4)diana's nature,her ability to open the heart of other people,her morals,what she stands for,the way she treats everyone even her villans,without prejudice,and the way her kind heart changes the lives of the people around her,even her villans.

5)diana's supporting cast,vanessa,julia,steve,etta,and how they get involve in diana's mission and try to help her even thought they are just mortals,showing that some humans are willing to go beyond their limits tryng to make a difference in this world,even thought they are vulnerable,they prove to be role models,that you don't even need powers to try to do siomething for this world.

6)diana's villans,they represent wonder woman's antithesis,ares is war,violence and obsessed with having total control. ,cheetah=hate,jealousy,contempt for life and power ambiccion,silver swan=lack of self-esteem,frustration and anger.

dr psycho=small man complex,loneliness,sadness and obsessed with finding someone for him to never be alone,his obsetion with diana.

circe=ego,evil,superiority complex and vindictive.

her villans not only have a lot of power,but they represent wonder woman's antithesis.

follow this standar and you have a great comic,cartoon,movies.

@darknightspideyfanboy:he said he didn't like her,and considering all the changes he made with her,it was obiously true.

@gokuwarrior: I actually understand why not every writer likes or gets her. She was created for very specific reasons, one of the biggest reason is feminism, which is not a topic everybody likes to talk about. But feminism is so profound in her character that no recreation of her can avoid it. If superman is a role model for general humanity, so is she; but she means more to woman, she is a much direct example for woman than superman is. There is gender issue awareness throughout her story, which is not simply hating man for not putting down the toilet lid. It is about things like being comfortable and confident for who she is, and fighting for equal opportunities, and avoiding seeing people as their stereotypes, etc. This can be a very deep and realistic topic, as deep as batman's parents-got-kill-so-fight-crime-in-a-terrifying-batsuit, if not deeper and broader. It is very hard to balance her deep cores and present interesting plots and keep its heroic comic style. With similar reason, it is difficult to balance between her mercy, encouraging side with her warrior, tough side.

Wonder Woman is full of contradictions, that is what makes it so unachievable to make a good movie and if a good movie can be made, it will not just be 'good' but splendid.

@hastalavista:she doesn't have contradictions,she is complex,she sees things in an objective way,she is kind and compassionate but also fearless and can be very tough when she needs to be,it's the way to balance all this thing that some writters are unable to find.

@gokuwarrior: Ok, bad choice of word. Yes complex not contradictory.

@gokuwarrior: cant find it in Google so dont know if what you say is true or just fanboy blind hate can you give me a link

i dont know if i should be glad or mad in one point were getting another wonder woman focuse animate movie on on another he sound like he saying ww is not popular enough to sell product

Hmm maybe they'll adapt JLA League of One, that would probably be badass.

I actually thought the Wonder Woman movie was great. It was meant as a intro to Wondy for the general audience and did its job. It felt like one of Marvel's live action movies.

I actually was happy she didn't have flying powers. It looks cheesy and takes away from her warrior side.

And regarding your point on feminists, I think Wonder Woman has to address it mainly in her origin and get it over with. Sure it can pop up later, but I think if we focus on other themes like love, hate, greed, war, etc would make WW more universal.

That would be badass.

I think WW needs an animated series that fully develops her character. Look at the success Legend of Korra is having. WW could achive something like that or more as she already has a big fanbase.

I suspect that having a Wonder Woman movie without Wonder Woman in the title wouldn't be too much of a big deal, considering the recent Superman and Batman titles weren't called Superman and Batman. It was Man of Steel and The Dark Knight. Now I'm not entirely certain that Diana has a cool nickname to fall back on for a movie title but if they instead of making it a JLA title gave her a title of her own that people can see and know that's Wonder Woman then bam there they go. Now, what they plan to do is absolute disrespect. The minute you read "We'll handle Wonder Woman in our own way, regardless of whether they'll do a [live-action] movie or not,"...then you get scared. Cus whenever directors take a character with even a semi-established story line and throw it away to do their own thing .... it's rarely good, almost never good, I'm only saying that on the off chance that there may be one instance that someone took a character and remade them for the better.....but that's not going to be the case here...

@itsdaveyj: hey look here big boy/girl, we got our self a review that tells you in deep analysis of the 2009 WW film :) http://youtu.be/loEXRZ__Wzk hope that will make you smile :)

@papinacho: good approach! Love the story.

I can´t agree with this statement more. I do love the animated film, but mainly because of its structure. The film also did not do that badly so I really don´t care for his statements about it.

The approach Rucka took to writing her was so much better. Her feminist ideology was much more humanist. Yes she had critiques of Mans "The Modern" World, but they were not simply about womens relations to men or sexual politics. It was about everything and much more with a focus on her being preaching peace rather than aggression. The animated film was good, it is one way to address wonder womans mythology and I defo think it was one of the best DC movies despite some flaws it had great humor, action, cool villain and some nice commentary on male female relations. After all it was not necessarily advocating the Amazons stance, in fact it was negating it. But sometimes it did this at the expense of WW character. I think if the film had have got 15 mins more run time, to show how Diana´s views contrasted with The Amazons, so she was more in line with her philosopher friend and at odds with her mother it would have been much better. Also it could have explained that invisible jet but that didn´t bother me too much.

I still really enjoyed the film for what it was and much of it can be used, especially in structure for a WW movie, but it also needs some vast improvements in Diana´s characterization and make Ares much much more horrifying and challenging a villain. I also don´t like that they killed him or had The Amazons help save the world at the end.

You are referring to Batman's and Superman's live action films. In the DC animated universe the past movies have been:
Superman: Unbound
Batman: The Dark Knight Returns
Superman vs. The Elite
Batman: Year One
All-Star Superman
Superman/Batman: Apocalypse
Batman: Under the Red Hood
Superman/Batman: Public Enemies
Batman: Gotham Knight
Superman: Doomsday

So clearly Superman and Batman have had their names in the titles for quite a while now.

Read the article and I think it's a great idea. They want to do a Wonder Woman centered Justice League movie. Why not? It'll sell and draw in more WW fans both existing and new. I don't understand the fuss.

Because WW fans want Diana to stand on her own too feet without the backing of the male JLA to sell a film when they want another WW centred film. Just my impressions of the usual WW forum complaints and rants.

I'm one of these Wonder Woman fans you speak of. I don't see anything wrong with having the JL help catapult her into the spotlight. People that don't read her stuff don't know how awesome she is. This will change that.

I'd like to chime in and say that I'm ALL for this. One of the things that I disliked about the major life altering DC events is that they're always centered around Batman or Superman. We began to see a shift in this with Flashpoint because it focused on WW, AM and The Flash with Batman/Superman either not present or playing supporting roles.

Unfortunate as it may be a lot of people aren't really checking for WW in comparison to the more popular superheroes and to quote Mary Poppins, "A spoonful of sugar helps the medicine go down." The sugar in this case being the other Justice Leaguers. Bring them in for the the mere sake that Batman/Superman will be present and keep them there to witness WW's ability to carry a story. That will accomplish two things as far as I'm concerned the first being to gain new fans and the second to allow WW to showcase her abilities. As many WW fans notice Diana's powers and fighting abilities often get downplayed when next to Superman or Batman and they always seem to have her coming in at second best in the respective attributes when it comes to the League.

One of the biggest problems I think her titles have suffered from is the fact that so many writers seem to want to show her as a woman more than a superhero. I hate to say this, but I think a lot of that may be because the majority of her series are written by men whom seem to have very little knowledge of her. We've all seen this play out whether it's the fact that they forget that she's super strong or has super speed. The fact that Diana is so closely tied to Greek history should actually make it easier to write for her instead of hard. There are plenty of characters and stories that they could pull from to create adventures for her, but this is seldom done. Add in the fact that her titles (this current one especially) seem to be going at a snails pace and even I had to stop reading it for awhile out of shear boredom. My remedy to fix that would be have someone who actually enjoys the character write her. When you hear about writers speak about writing for Superman/Batman/Spider-Man you often hear these men that sound elated because they've read these comics as children and now as adults are the one's doing the writing. On the flipside when it comes to WW you often hear people talk about it like it's a chore and if they do a good enough job they'll be moved to another title.

Bottom line Wonder Woman, as hard as it is for me to say this isn't a strong leading character, but it isn't because she doesn't have the makings, but because she's never given the opportunity. If they truly wish for her to fulfil the role as DC's flagship Superheroine not because she's the first woman, but because she's the best then they at DC need to stop treating her as a second class citizen.

i´d buy it. but i don´t think her last film was a failure. that´s all alot ww fans are saying. her comic is though.

@jphulk26:true,her animated movie is one of DC 10 best selling animated movies,so it can't be a failure.

I know, I am as well. And whilst I agree with you that a WW centred Justice League film has the potential to do well, it's important to bear in mind the shortcomings of Flashpoint as well since that was a Flash centred film that wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

I liked it but it left a few great things out. Wasn't bad though. Wonder Woman doesn't have an existing JL story in the New 52 I don't think. Hopefully they MAKE it good haha.

There was also a fair amount of over the top violence too.

Seems a bit unnecessary unless I've read it wrong, Wonder woman sold more than the Justice League movies

@90mv: Yeah, but sold it very slowly. That's all that matters to WB.

I still say if Thor can be made into a movie, Wonder Woman can. Both are:

-Demi gods from a mythical place

-Travel's to man's world where they fall in love with a mortal

-Met other superheroes and form a team of heroes together

-Are apart of a race of immortal warriors

-Steeped in their respective mythology.

-Are prone to being disobedient to their strict parents

The only difference is that WW is a woman, and we have seen before that strong women characters are successful, such as Buffy, Xena, Resident Evil, etc. WB stop being so standoffish and make it happen.

The problem you're addressing is your own. I started reading WW with Perez and the book has never bashed men in order to elevate women. That's a misconception that only non-readers share. Wonder Woman antagonists have been equally male and female, if anything there have been more evil women and heroic men than vice versa.

How many people knew about this movie anyway ? I came across it by accident

Agree

DC events is that they're always centered around Batman or Superman,they are even choose Green Lantern to do a movie not going to ww

Some people was right

DC Person #1: Hey, what are we going to do for Wonder Woman's 75th Anniversary?

DC Person #2: Who?

@90mv: exactly. They didn't put too much effort on marketing her. And yet, even so, the movie sold well. Imagine what could happen if they take her really seriously like, or even just close to, how they treat superman and batman.

I'm ok wiyh this. I don't even think a ww cartoon is even in the far future though. They have 3 toons planned and ww isn't one.

I swear I don't get it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DC_Universe_Animated_Original_Movies

According to this ,out of the 19 films they released she has the 5th best selling yet it's considered a failure?

The only female comic hero the whole world recognizes. The one ALL female comic characters are compared to. The only one fashion designers base collections off of. The cosmetic company's base make up lines on. The one published non stop for 75 years. But no she isn't popular enough to hold her own cartoon or movie? Maybe I am not seeing something they are seeing.can someone help me .