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    Wonder Woman

    Character » Wonder Woman appears in 8719 issues.

    The Amazon princess, blessed with god-like super abilities, Wonder Woman is one of Earth's most powerful defenders of peace, justice, and equality and a member of the Justice League. She is considered an archetype for many heroines outside of comic book. Her initial origin depicted her as a clay baby brought to life by patron goddess Aphrodite, but in recent years she has been depicted as the daughter of Zeus and Amazon queen Hippolyta.

    Has Wonder Woman had Sex?

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    Timandm

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    #51  Edited By Timandm
    @KillerZ: Well, I think that answers that... What title and issue is that from?
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    Timandm

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    #52  Edited By Timandm
    @Feliciano2040: Take a look at what Killer Z posted...
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    Feliciano2040

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    #53  Edited By Feliciano2040
    @FadeToBlackBolt: NONSENSE !!! Some things are too good to be true.
     
    @Timandm: Ironic that few of us imagined that Wonder Woman actually liked to flip tortillas.
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    No_Name_

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    #54  Edited By No_Name_

    @TheCrowbar said:

    I'm going to settle this now. Wonderwoman has had sex. With me. She's a selfish lover. She doesn't look at me when we make love and then she gets out of bed to go deflect bullets. /cry

    Oh man, this cracked me up.

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    No_Name_

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    #55  Edited By No_Name_

    @Timandm said:

    @Feliciano2040 said:
    @Timandm: Glad it's really worth it ! And dammit why did we got so much into She-Hulk ? Where are the real Wondie fans ? Has she had intercourse or not ?
    Well... She DOES come from an Island of ONLY women... Who never marry.... Who never have children.... Who have no siblings or family members.... Um... I'm sort of wondering where all those women came from in the first place... Of course, we all know Diana was made from a pile of sand.... That Athena turned into a REAL girl... Is it just me or does that sound like a story you make up for children who are so young you don't want to tell them about sex? Also, consider this... The amazonian women are hundreds if not thousands of years old, right? A thousand years and NO SEX? Really? REALLY???? Well, I guess I should be more specific and say no sex with Men... Although, I don't know if they have it with each other... Man, this is taking so many wrong turns...

    Diana was made from clay by her Mother. I'm pretty sure there had been men on the island, but that Hippolyta closed the borders to Paradise Island and made the island invisible to the outside world to preserve their culture and protect their race. I was under the impression that the women of that island simply never age.

    I would like to point out that simply because women choose to hang out together without the company of men doesn't make them lesbians. If that were the case, wouldn't they spend more time having romantic relationships and focus less on being a warrior nation, constantly training to protect themselves and their island? That doesn't mean that there are no lesbians on Paradise Island; I just think it's ignorant to assume that they are all lesbians. I mean think about it, when you take men out of the equation you just get so much more done, and women prove to be considerably less competitive with one another because they aren't competing for a man's attention.

    I think Diana has had sex. We don't question if every comic book character has had sex because it's something that always happens off panel, so this shouldn't be any different.

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    Feliciano2040

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    #56  Edited By Feliciano2040
    @Babs said:

    I mean think about it, when you take men out of the equation you just get so much more done, and women prove to be considerably less competitive with one another because they aren't competing for a man's attention.

    Oh man this is SO GOOD, I never knew of anyone that needed to read "Y: The Last Man" so badly.
     

    I think Diana has had sex. We don't question if every comic book character has had sex because it's something that always happens off panel, so this shouldn't be any different.

    But it is, specially when the character in question has lived in an island where only thousands of other women live, seriously, at what age did she saw her first man ? 22 ? 23 ? 
     
    If it's any different, it's only with other characters, we know Batman has had sex,  as well as Hal Jordan, Barry Allen, Guy Gardner, and plenty others, because there is no reason to doubt that they could do it, unlike what happens with Wonder Woman, or even Superman (to name someone else), has Superman had sex ? It is different with him as well.
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    KillerZ

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    #57  Edited By KillerZ  Moderator  Online
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    Timandm

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    #58  Edited By Timandm
    @Babs Diana was made from clay by her Mother. I'm pretty sure there had been men on the island, but that Hippolyta closed the borders to Paradise Island and made the island invisible to the outside world to preserve their culture and protect their race. I was under the impression that the women of that island simply never age.
     
    There are no men on Paradise island... It is against their laws... NO MEN....

    I would like to point out that simply because women choose to hang out together without the company of men doesn't make them lesbians. If that were the case, wouldn't they spend more time having romantic relationships and focus less on being a warrior nation, constantly training to protect themselves and their island? 
     
    This is not a case of women choosing to "hang out together."    This is an island nation whose citizens are female only...  There are no men in their kingdom and there never have been...  This is not a case where a group of female friends decide to hang out for a weekend... This isn't like an all girls school...  This is a kingdom composed ENTIRELY of women, and men are OUTLAWED...
     
    Now, considering that they never age and have been around for three-thousand years or so... and considering they are all healthy women...  Is it not natural for them to have sexual desires?  Since they are not allowed to leave the island except by special permission from the queen, AND since men are not allowed on the island, doesn't it make sense that many of them are having sex with each other?  This in NO WAY would prevent them from training to be warriors...  Are you suggesting that in societies with both men and women that only those who go without sex or relationships can become warriors?
     
    Now, if that isn't ENOUG evidence to at least SUGGEST that many of the amazons are lesbians, did you not see the scan KillerZ shared?  I'll put it here for you.
     
    No Caption Provided
    That's a scan from WONDER WOMAN volume 2 issue 38....  It's RIGHT THERE....
     
    I mean think about it, when you take men out of the equation you just get so much more done, and women prove to be considerably less competitive with one another because they aren't competing for a man's attention.
     
    I have a mother, two sisters, a wife, and three daughters....  That statement absolutely does not hold water...  A group of warrior women who are NOT competitive?  Really?  REALLY?  I don't know how many sleep overs my daughters have had, but it seems like a gajillion...  EVERY SINGLE TIME, without exception, the girls end up having competitions of some sort.  They have not had a sleep over in which there was not at LEAST a few arguments...  Women not competitive?  In what world?
     
    But hey, if you want to IGNORE WHAT WAS WRITTEN IN THE STORY... AND you want to believe that an island nation full of ONLY women, who have been around AND HEALTHY for about 3000 years could actually all be abstinent then...Well, more power to you...  I think it's a 'cute' idea...
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    Timandm

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    #59  Edited By Timandm
    @KillerZ: Thanks!
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    cosmo111687

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    #60  Edited By cosmo111687
    @Babs said:

    I mean think about it, when you take men out of the equation you just get so much more done, and women prove to be considerably less competitive with one another because they aren't competing for a man's attention.

    All due respect, Babs, but I don't think all the source of competitiveness between women is based around attracting men. There isn't much difference between genders when you take cultural influence out of the equation (if the women of Themyscira aren't taught that pink is associated with women and blue is associated with men, then they won't just naturally be inclined to pink just because they're women. The perceived differences of gender are largely culturally influenced). And you'll find that women upon the island are likely to be just as competitive over a great many things outside of attracting a heterosexual partner. For instance, you've seen just how important it is for those women to prove that they are great warriors in the Wonder Woman animated film. They're not training to be warriors because not having to worry about attracting men has freed up their schedules, but because as a culture they value skills in fighting. 
     
    One thing I've always wondered, though, is that we accept that there are lesbians upon the island. But what happens to transgender women on the island. Wouldn't they be ostracized for wishing to be "men"? Or would the concept of transgender even exist in a culture with only one gender? 
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    No_Name_

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    #61  Edited By No_Name_

    @Timandm: Wow.

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    FadeToBlackBolt

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    #62  Edited By FadeToBlackBolt
    @Feliciano2040 said:
    @Babs said:

    I mean think about it, when you take men out of the equation you just get so much more done, and women prove to be considerably less competitive with one another because they aren't competing for a man's attention.

    Oh man this is SO GOOD, I never knew of anyone that needed to read "Y: The Last Man" so badly.
     


    Everyone on Earth should read Y, though. It's simply one of the best series ever.
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    FadeToBlackBolt

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    #63  Edited By FadeToBlackBolt

    For the record, we don't really know how Amazon physiology works. I mean, they're obviously based on humans, but who knows how their sex drives function? They simply may not ever feel the desire to have sex, particularly since they're a race without the need for procreation.

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    Feliciano2040

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    #64  Edited By Feliciano2040
    @cosmo111687 said:
    But what happens to transgender women on the island. Wouldn't they be ostracized for wishing to be "men"? Or would the concept of transgender even exist in a culture with only one gender? 
    You've just thought of a FANTASTIC idea for a Wonder Woman story, can't you sell the script to DC or something ?
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    Timandm

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    #65  Edited By Timandm
    @Feliciano2040: Transgender Woman?
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    cosmo111687

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    #66  Edited By cosmo111687
    @Feliciano2040: Aw shucks. Thank you. :) My only hope is that if they ever choose to write that story (something akin to exploring Renee Montoya's sexuality in Gotham Central, for Batman. Maybe just call it Amazons, or something similar...), that they don't go down the typical Hollywood route and make him into a psychotic killer or a villain or some-such. And, of course, if there was a writer who I would believe could write that story, it would Greg Rucka (or maybe even Brian K. Vaughn, since we're all sort of talking about Y: The Last Man...)
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    Noelieboats

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    #67  Edited By Noelieboats

    There was never a massive labido element to her was there?

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    okayla

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    #68  Edited By okayla

    I always assumed she'd had sex with women, but not any dudes.

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    RazzaTazz

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    Timandm

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    #70  Edited By Timandm
    @FadeToBlackBolt said:
    For the record, we don't really know how Amazon physiology works. I mean, they're obviously based on humans, but who knows how their sex drives function? They simply may not ever feel the desire to have sex, particularly since they're a race without the need for procreation.
    But, isn't Queen Hippolyta basically saying they have sexual desires that they satisfy with each other?
    No Caption Provided
    To be fair, it's hard to imagine ANY group of human beings that are healthy, reasonably young, and long lived not having sexual desires...
     
    It's easy to believe that most of the amazons would be into each other... But to be fair, if it were an island nation of all men, I have no doubt they'd be all Spartacus/Greek...
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    Timandm

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    #71  Edited By Timandm
    @TheCrowbar said:
    I'm going to settle this now.  Wonderwoman has had sex. With me. She's a selfish lover. She doesn't look at me when we make love and then she gets out of bed to go deflect bullets.   /cry
    Sooo... Be honest....  Would you want her to stay in bed to deflect bullets?   Hmmm... Actually, I guess I can see where that might be kind of interesting... Dangerous but interesting...
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    mistrx75

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    #72  Edited By mistrx75

    I bet Steve did, but seeing as we're discounting him... possibly not.

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    IKnowEverything

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    #73  Edited By IKnowEverything

    I bet she got naughty with Tom.

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    Feliciano2040

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    #74  Edited By Feliciano2040
    @IKnowEverything: And Tom iiiiiissssss......... ?
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    GC8

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    #75  Edited By GC8
    @KillerZ said:
    No Caption Provided
    Good catch. 
    This is what I like, hard evidence from the texts.
    So basically it's chastity, masturbation, or lesbianism if you're an Amazon.
    So... there's options. Of course WW has been known to be at odds with Amazonian laws in the past, so....
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    RazzaTazz

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    #76  Edited By RazzaTazz

    If I know Perez's writing style (and I think I do) he would never have written anything insinuating that.  I think what he meant to imply here is that they love each other and find an outlet for their passions in this way.  Anyway one panel in one issue doesnt make it fact. 
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    PowerHerc

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    #77  Edited By PowerHerc

    She probably had sex last night.

    Whe could definitely get it any time she wants it.

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    Erik

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    #78  Edited By Erik
    @RazzaTazz said:
    If I know Perez's writing style (and I think I do) he would never have written anything insinuating that.  I think what he meant to imply here is that they love each other and find an outlet for their passions in this way.  Anyway one panel in one issue doesnt make it fact. 
    I disagree. The message Perez was sending here is abundantly clear and it has never been information that has been contested at all. In fact, when Wonder Woman decided to court Nemesis, she performed the Amazon ritual of her people for courtship and she even confirms Nemesis' suggestive questioning concerning why an island of women would need a courting ritual and that it is going to be a little strange since Nemesis is male.
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    Pokeysteve

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    #79  Edited By Pokeysteve
    @Erik
    @RazzaTazz said:
    If I know Perez's writing style (and I think I do) he would never have written anything insinuating that.  I think what he meant to imply here is that they love each other and find an outlet for their passions in this way.  Anyway one panel in one issue doesnt make it fact. 
    I actually just read that issue a few days ago. Perez did the plot and Mindy Newell wrote the actual script.
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    RazzaTazz

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    #80  Edited By RazzaTazz
    @Erik said:
    I disagree. The message Perez was sending here is abundantly clear and it has never been information that has been contested at all. In fact, when Wonder Woman decided to court Nemesis, she performed the Amazon ritual of her people for courtship and she even confirms Nemesis' suggestive questioning concerning why an island of women would need a courting ritual and that it is going to be a little strange since Nemesis is male.
     
    I am not sure what the point is as realted to the original discussion of whether or not she has had sex.  Is it the implication that she is a lesbian?  This is stupid and ridiculous and exactly what Frederic Wertham stated as fact where she had the Hooliday Girls as lesbian lovers (despite being infatuated with Steve Trevor at the time.)   Even if it is the case that there are some lesbians on Themyscira (and it is a resaonable assumption that there are with over two thousand Amazons) that there is no reason to associate lesbianism with Diana who has never once in a comic book panel expressed any interest in women.  If the reporter was asking a lesbian here how they last so long without sex then I expect she would give an answer including her own sexual preference as an example of behaviour, but whether there Amazons are 99.9% lesbian or 0.1% lesbian it doesn't change the fact that Diana has never been characterized as having that sexual preference.  Even if Diana was a lesbian it wouldn't change the underlying aspect of her character, in fact it might highlight it.  One of her main messages is that humans should be compassioante towards one another and find common ground.  I am pretty sure if such a person actually existed that she would be frustrated by people discussing her sex life instead of focusing on her mesage.   
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    Feliciano2040

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    #81  Edited By Feliciano2040
    @RazzaTazz said:
    I am pretty sure if such a person actually existed that she would be frustrated by people discussing her sex life instead of focusing on her mesage.   
    I didn't know there was anything wrong about being curious about something one can perfectly wonder (ha!) about a character.
     
    Also, nobody here is demeaning or degrading her character, neither is anyone misinterpreting her message, we're just making assumptions and having fun.
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    Erik

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    #82  Edited By Erik
    @RazzaTazz said:
    @Erik said:
    I disagree. The message Perez was sending here is abundantly clear and it has never been information that has been contested at all. In fact, when Wonder Woman decided to court Nemesis, she performed the Amazon ritual of her people for courtship and she even confirms Nemesis' suggestive questioning concerning why an island of women would need a courting ritual and that it is going to be a little strange since Nemesis is male.
     I am not sure what the point is as realted to the original discussion of whether or not she has had sex.  Is it the implication that she is a lesbian?  This is stupid and ridiculous and exactly what Frederic Wertham stated as fact where she had the Hooliday Girls as lesbian lovers (despite being infatuated with Steve Trevor at the time.)   Even if it is the case that there are some lesbians on Themyscira (and it is a resaonable assumption that there are with over two thousand Amazons) that there is no reason to associate lesbianism with Diana who has never once in a comic book panel expressed any interest in women.  If the reporter was asking a lesbian here how they last so long without sex then I expect she would give an answer including her own sexual preference as an example of behaviour, but whether there Amazons are 99.9% lesbian or 0.1% lesbian it doesn't change the fact that Diana has never been characterized as having that sexual preference.  Even if Diana was a lesbian it wouldn't change the underlying aspect of her character, in fact it might highlight it.  One of her main messages is that humans should be compassioante towards one another and find common ground.  I am pretty sure if such a person actually existed that she would be frustrated by people discussing her sex life instead of focusing on her mesage.   
    This has absolutely nothing to do with my post or the post you were initially responding to. 
     
    Fact: The scan you disputed is Post-Crisis so why are you bringing up her romantic history with Steve Trevor? A man whom she was never attracted to and was old enough to be her father Post-Crisis. 
    Fact: Pre-Crisis has almost no ties at all to Post-Crisis canon with very few exceptions.
    Fact: Amazons were shown to be sexually attracted to men when in Patriarch's world Post-Crisis. 
    Fact: Amazons have been stated on panel twice that they find sexual gratification in one another or among themselves Post-Crisis. 
    Fact: Even if Diana partook in such gratification when growing up on the island (and I NEVER said she did so where your long-winded speech on that came from I have no idea) that would not necessarily make her a lesbian. The very same applies to all the Amazons. They are an immortal people stuck on an island with only one gender. Would you say that people in prison are homosexual because they find sexual gratification with the people they have around them? No of course not. At least not as a rule. It seems like you have a serious hangup about homosexuality which is really too bad. I would think that if Wonder Woman did exist, she would be more frustrated at your attitude towards a discussion of homosexuality more than fanboys wanting to know if her people "play" with one another. If you want people to focus on her message (and trust me, I am completely on board with that) perhaps you should practice what you preach.
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    SC

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    #83  Edited By SC  Moderator

    I am best friends with George Perez and Gail Simone and what they have told me, stated empathetically with the weight of a thousand golden tiaras and the vigor of a million golden magical lasso's is that fans cherry pick way too much. Especially when most writers aren't like most fans and like to leave a bit of ambiguity about certain creative aspects about characters none of them really agree with. So it just seems odd when fans try and take one scan and vehemently apply its as the truth and facts to a fictional character, where things as facts as truths change panel to panel, issue to issue and writer to writer. Insistence probably isn't the best way to make a point here, if someone ones to prove something on more objective terms, then its up to them to prove, and people will have different standards.  
     
    Also I am best friends with Wonder Woman and she does exist and she is most frustrated by people not agreeing with me, her friend. Bwhaha.  
     
    @Erik said:

    It seems like you have a serious hangup about homosexuality which is really too bad. I would think that if Wonder Woman did exist, she would be more frustrated at your attitude towards a discussion of homosexuality more than fanboys wanting to know if her people "play" with one another. If you want people to focus on her message (and trust me, I am completely on board with that) perhaps you should practice what you preach.
     
    It does appear like you chose your words carefully here, so thats sort of nice and appreciated and I recognize this before saying my bit, but still, it seems a bit too far, at least to me. Especially since your use of tense makes this seem more like an accusation, less so than a question. Or maybe its a statement and you used the word seemed for that effect, in which case I would say that it doesn't seem at all like the poster had a serious hang up about homosexuality and so your statement comes off rather like an ad hominem attack (this person probably has hang ups about homosexuality and so that's why their stance is what their stance is). Presumption of a persons towards homosexuality based on? The fact that they find assumptions and conclusions drawn from arguments and points insufficient means to suggest what other people have concluded? The implication about a poster and their attitudes and stances about homosexuality based on what they have posted and reasoned. It sort of more seems like your presuming a fair bit to help seemingly validate your own point, which is fair since that's what people are generally trying to do in when disagreeing, but certainly if the Amazon Princess was real, (and don't forget she is, she is my BFF) surely what would frustrate her most is people making such accusations about others for mere internet points. Your last statement is a fallacy as well. Just because a person wants to focus on her message doesn't mean they can't give opinions on other matters either. So you agree with that focus on the message I presume by your declaration to trust you that you are on board with that, yet still it was your who chose to originally quote this poster to disagree with their take on the situation. Your drew focus to this subject where they were just content to leave their perspective. Arguably that same irony might apply to me, but I am here strictly for titillation regarding lesbians. *grin*  
     
    As for me to assume what they might actually be hung up about? Well, okay, how about this? Do you have any links to interviews, or videos where Perez with abundant clarity addresses this issue as your original quote suggests? If your line of reasoning is that it was very clear (what ever is being disputed) and the idea that because nothing absolutely contradicting was ever stated or those earlier lucid notions were not challenged thats pretty fair reasoning. However it just might not be enough for other people. Certainly not to me, and I have spoken to many candid Wonder Woman writers since (Gail Simone use to use CBR you are probably aware of this too? Perez has discussed this a bit before) then and their opinions, and understandings and what they wish to be viewed as facts (as far as facts go in comics and fiction) paint a much less clear, much more discretionary, much more ambiguous picture than the one you paint. Then again, I am not exactly clear on the supposed message you are advertising he sent? 
     
    Then I agree, you did not mention that Diana partook in such activities strictly, but surely you must have some idea how a rebuttal came about, its because you mentioned her name, and although in the context you were using, you weren't using her name to suggest she herself was partaking (you were using her in a scene in which she relayed information about such practices) so i think the other poster was in potential error. Then again, the subject of this thread is about Wonder Woman. I am sure you could excuse them for presuming your point tied back into Wonder Woman. They even actually attempt to clarify your point with a question at the beginning and then they address the points. In any case you must have some idea how their statements came about. Now if you want long winded? *points to my post* 
     
    Funnily enough though a lot of your points see, to presume that "they" was referring to all Amazons (original quote) when it could just be used to specify a set number. Majority in this case, but minority counts as well. Since your points only address some, but potentially not all Amazons, so arguably a lot of your points are based on (fair) assumptions as well.  
     
    I don't think any of your points validity are increased by mentioning if something is "longwinded" or supposing a poster has hang ups about homosexuality and/or perhaps needs to practice what they preach. Your valid points are very valid on their own terms. Unless you felt some underlying personal attack? In which case I can understand if you chose to reciprocate, I am just blind to it, from reading though, but I could be wrong? 
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    #84  Edited By cosmo111687
    @Erik said:
    @RazzaTazz said:
    @Erik said:
    I disagree. The message Perez was sending here is abundantly clear and it has never been information that has been contested at all. In fact, when Wonder Woman decided to court Nemesis, she performed the Amazon ritual of her people for courtship and she even confirms Nemesis' suggestive questioning concerning why an island of women would need a courting ritual and that it is going to be a little strange since Nemesis is male.
     I am not sure what the point is as realted to the original discussion of whether or not she has had sex.  Is it the implication that she is a lesbian?  This is stupid and ridiculous and exactly what Frederic Wertham stated as fact where she had the Hooliday Girls as lesbian lovers (despite being infatuated with Steve Trevor at the time.)   Even if it is the case that there are some lesbians on Themyscira (and it is a resaonable assumption that there are with over two thousand Amazons) that there is no reason to associate lesbianism with Diana who has never once in a comic book panel expressed any interest in women.  If the reporter was asking a lesbian here how they last so long without sex then I expect she would give an answer including her own sexual preference as an example of behaviour, but whether there Amazons are 99.9% lesbian or 0.1% lesbian it doesn't change the fact that Diana has never been characterized as having that sexual preference.  Even if Diana was a lesbian it wouldn't change the underlying aspect of her character, in fact it might highlight it.  One of her main messages is that humans should be compassioante towards one another and find common ground.  I am pretty sure if such a person actually existed that she would be frustrated by people discussing her sex life instead of focusing on her mesage.   
    This has absolutely nothing to do with my post or the post you were initially responding to.    Fact: The scan you disputed is Post-Crisis so why are you bringing up her romantic history with Steve Trevor? A man whom she was never attracted to and was old enough to be her father Post-Crisis.  Fact: Pre-Crisis has almost no ties at all to Post-Crisis canon with very few exceptions.Fact: Amazons were shown to be sexually attracted to men when in Patriarch's world Post-Crisis.  Fact: Amazons have been stated on panel twice that they find sexual gratification in one another or among themselves Post-Crisis.  Fact: Even if Diana partook in such gratification when growing up on the island (and I NEVER said she did so where your long-winded speech on that came from I have no idea) that would not necessarily make her a lesbian. The very same applies to all the Amazons. They are an immortal people stuck on an island with only one gender. Would you say that people in prison are homosexual because they find sexual gratification with the people they have around them? No of course not. At least not as a rule. It seems like you have a serious hangup about homosexuality which is really too bad. I would think that if Wonder Woman did exist, she would be more frustrated at your attitude towards a discussion of homosexuality more than fanboys wanting to know if her people "play" with one another. If you want people to focus on her message (and trust me, I am completely on board with that) perhaps you should practice what you preach.  
    Please, try to reread what she said and then you'll realize how much you misunderstood. 
     
    Just to point some of the things you missed: 
     
    • Razzatazz is responding to your post as well as previous insinuations that Wonder Woman might have had lesbian relationships in the past. 
    • It is not a condemnation of homosexuality to state the simple fact that Wonder Woman herself has never had a lesbian relationship.
    • She is not calling the idea of Wonder Woman being lesbian "stupid". She's criticizing the unsubstantiated claim that she is a lesbian. 
    • Razzatazz even entertained the idea that it might highlight certain aspects of her character if she was a lesbian and stated that Wonder Woman's message is about compassion towards all people - no matter their race, creed, sexual orientation, etc.
     And I have to completely agree with Razzatazz that Wonder Woman would be fed up with the idea of people discussing her sex life. It'd be great to see some of her romantic life, if the story is there and if it's true to her character. But her sex life hasn't been a major focus in her books because she's kind of busy saving the world.
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    SC

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    #85  Edited By SC  Moderator
    @cosmo111687:  Great post! 
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    #86  Edited By thehummingbird
    @Erik said:
    @RazzaTazz said:
    @Erik said:
    I disagree. The message Perez was sending here is abundantly clear and it has never been information that has been contested at all. In fact, when Wonder Woman decided to court Nemesis, she performed the Amazon ritual of her people for courtship and she even confirms Nemesis' suggestive questioning concerning why an island of women would need a courting ritual and that it is going to be a little strange since Nemesis is male.
     I am not sure what the point is as realted to the original discussion of whether or not she has had sex.  Is it the implication that she is a lesbian?  This is stupid and ridiculous and exactly what Frederic Wertham stated as fact where she had the Hooliday Girls as lesbian lovers (despite being infatuated with Steve Trevor at the time.)   Even if it is the case that there are some lesbians on Themyscira (and it is a resaonable assumption that there are with over two thousand Amazons) that there is no reason to associate lesbianism with Diana who has never once in a comic book panel expressed any interest in women.  If the reporter was asking a lesbian here how they last so long without sex then I expect she would give an answer including her own sexual preference as an example of behaviour, but whether there Amazons are 99.9% lesbian or 0.1% lesbian it doesn't change the fact that Diana has never been characterized as having that sexual preference.  Even if Diana was a lesbian it wouldn't change the underlying aspect of her character, in fact it might highlight it.  One of her main messages is that humans should be compassioante towards one another and find common ground.  I am pretty sure if such a person actually existed that she would be frustrated by people discussing her sex life instead of focusing on her mesage.   
    This has absolutely nothing to do with my post or the post you were initially responding to.    Fact: The scan you disputed is Post-Crisis so why are you bringing up her romantic history with Steve Trevor? A man whom she was never attracted to and was old enough to be her father Post-Crisis.  Fact: Pre-Crisis has almost no ties at all to Post-Crisis canon with very few exceptions.Fact: Amazons were shown to be sexually attracted to men when in Patriarch's world Post-Crisis.  Fact: Amazons have been stated on panel twice that they find sexual gratification in one another or among themselves Post-Crisis.  Fact: Even if Diana partook in such gratification when growing up on the island (and I NEVER said she did so where your long-winded speech on that came from I have no idea) that would not necessarily make her a lesbian. The very same applies to all the Amazons. They are an immortal people stuck on an island with only one gender. Would you say that people in prison are homosexual because they find sexual gratification with the people they have around them? No of course not. At least not as a rule. It seems like you have a serious hangup about homosexuality which is really too bad. I would think that if Wonder Woman did exist, she would be more frustrated at your attitude towards a discussion of homosexuality more than fanboys wanting to know if her people "play" with one another. If you want people to focus on her message (and trust me, I am completely on board with that) perhaps you should practice what you preach.
    FACT: posting Fact before saying a more so opinionated take and openly targeting a commenter whom you began the discussion with does not make it true. 
    FACT: I am being hypocritical and using caps to be even more annoying than someone who just types fact: well maybe not quite as annoying as a person who does that, that makes assumptions with no prior information that someone is homophobic.  
    FACT: I am a water Buffalo that live in Narnia and eats pumpkins for dinner!  
    FACT: the above statement has to be true because I typed FACT: in front of it.  
    FACT: this logic is flawless! Thank you for introducing it to me...now ahem -clears throat- shall we move on or do I need to continue?  
      
     (some of what you typed was true but using fact: is a very obnoxious thing to do, and I hope this shows you that)  
     

    Now I would like to say half of what you are saying or more has absolutely no support. It was not even hinted so much in the wonder woman series that she engaged in such activities. I think rather than typing FACT: you should have typed ASSUMPTION: or maybe even MY DEEP DARK FETISH: before what you said yes? then that would have been a FACT, as you put it? Now I am merely mimicking your tone, with the poster above he did no such thing, but disagree and use facts rather than assumptions in her argument, but I am not here to discuss Wonder Woman with you, but something else more offensive and quite uncalled for you brought up.  
     
     
    Hmmmm so because the above poster disagrees with the fact that wonder woman engaged in sexual activities with females that makes her a homophobe? I am having to assume this, well because you did not even explain that much. You just blatantly called her a homophobe. Now I am explaining why I believe what I am saying you may disagree, but I am explaining that I see no evidence offered. I am sure after I post you will attempt to rip this apart, I am sure, please have fun when doing so, I mean all you have to do is type FACT: to make it true in your opinion. I do not see a single time the other poster mentioned having an issues with sexual activities between two women. I am not disagreeing here that people can engage in such activities and still not be a lesbian. Do not get me wrong here, I am just pointing out the lack of basis for your claim. I do not even disagree with what you are saying about wonder woman, and I do agree their are subtle hints, but not enough to make such a claim. I am getting off track though let me start a new and say my point.  
     
     
    The above poster never mentioned having an issues with a homosexual relationship, she merely disagreed that there was enough evidence to make a definite conclusion that wonder woman had engaged, and pointed out a few instances that would work against. This is how a debate works normally yes? I know the way I have behaved is not proper either and I can only use your incorrect posting habits to excuse a certain amount of this incorrect behavior of my own, but the point I am getting at personally is, just because you disagree, you can not just jump the gun and start using offensive language. I mean that is like if we were talking about if I liked carrots or green beans more. I reply I prefer green beans, and then you blurt out carrot hater! I never said I hated carrots merely I preferred green beans. This was my real problem with the post. She never once mentions having an issue with homosexuals or homosexual relationships? So before I go on I will ask as to give the opportunity what gave you this thought in the first place? Maybe I can understand more.  
     
     
    "Wonder Woman would be more frustrated with your attitude toward homosexuality, which is really to bad."  
     
    I am going to be honest.  I do not even no where to begin with this one. I was/am flabbergasted. I mean what? Once again reinforcing that the above poster had an issue with homosexuality, without any proof. I will ignore that since I offered you a place for redemption, but the Wonder Woman would be frustrated? Acting as if a fictional character would be disappointed with ones poor behavior (which did not exist in the first place, their poor behavior I mean) is beyond childish. You also bring up practicing what you preach? This whole statement is yet again both ironic and hypocritical. Razzatazz at no time pointed fingers at you, merely spoke the truth, that this discussion was getting off the original topic and point of Wonder Woman in general. You then speak of fanboys talking about the girls "playing" with each other? This being wrong and off her message, when I saw your earlier message, where you bring up the topic of lesbian sex among the amazons? Please explain how this is different and how razzatazz was not practicing what she was preaching. I am hoping this is all just a big misunderstanding and that this will have a peaceful resolution.  
     
     
    I am apologize for any spelling errors and hope you can help answer some of my questions thank you so much. 
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    #87  Edited By thehummingbird
    @cosmo111687@SC:  
     
     
    Great job to both!!! night you two! 
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    #88  Edited By cosmo111687
    @SC: Takk!
     
    @thehummingbird: Yeah, the seeing Amazons playing with each other comment was kind of off-putting. And Razzatazz really does hold up to many of the ideals set by Wonder Woman; most of all intelligence and rationality. I'm sure this was all just a big misunderstanding. More knee-jerk reaction and too little critical thinking leading to out there-claims (that Razzatazz has "hang-ups with homosexuality" :/...). *SIGH...Anyhoo...Goodnight! :)
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    #89  Edited By thehummingbird
    @cosmo111687:  
     
    Agreed I typed that at 4 am I am sure their are many mistakes, so good morning now! 
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    superojsimpson

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    #90  Edited By superojsimpson

    I am lovin this thread!! it's good to know that great minds think alike.

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    #91  Edited By Erik
    @SC
    I do not read interviews with writers. What is canon is what is on the pages. As for my assumption of RT's hangups on homosexuality, well her reply to me read extremely aggressive based on what she knows about Pre-Crisis and trying to apply that knowledge to Post-Crisis. SHE made it about Diana, I did not and if you feel my post went to far or it read as if I were, I apologize. It was not my intention to do so, I merely post in a "cut the fat, matter-of-fact" style. Granted this thread is about Diana but the currently discussed picture is a slightly off-topic yet parallel discussion. I also did not post the picture nor is the Amazon explaining their sexuality Diana. It is some other Amazon. I stated only that Diana confirmed a courting ritual used by the Amazons among one another, which does in fact reinforce the other user's posted scan. Does that mean all Amazons use it? No of course not. In the scan, the Amazon even states that some Amazons have chosen a life of chastity while some others simply find release with themselves. But there is still the other group (and this is the part that is abundantly clear) that find sexual release in one another, as stated on panel and as confirmed in volume 3. 
     

    @cosmo111687


    Perhaps you should read the post yourself. Her post that was in reply to me WAS overly aggressive on the subject of Diana's sexual preference. I would know better than most on the topic of what is an aggressive reply. Furthermore, I never said that Diana was a lesbian. I merely confirmed that it is a common practice on Paradise Island and provided two separate references to that effect (borrowing one from the previous user). You agree with RT about what Wonder Woman would be fed up about but you still post on the so-called tired subject. Besides, I am sure RT is a big girl. I do not see any reason why she would need you to "fight" her battles for her. Unless perhaps you do not think she is capable of doing it herself?
     

    @thehummingbird


    Where I stated they were facts, they are. And if you think I am openly targeting RT simply because I replied to her, then that is on you. Also, your "facts" are not facts at all. And if you honestly are trying to be "more annoying" than me, that qualifies as trolling. I would advise you to cease such behavior. I am not above flagging a trolling/flaming post. And no, I do not find someone typing fact in front of the points they want to make annoying in the slightest when they are indeed facts. I come from the battle forums, that is benign debating behavior there. If it offends you, I can attempt to post in such a way that would be akin to holding your hand and reassuring you that everything will be okay. 
     
    Again, as stated previously, you are fighting the wrong battle (which does not surprise me because your post and the other two included in my reply were posting in a knee-jerk reaction style to shield another user from a mild confrontation). I never said Diana partook in any such activities. I only stated that some Amazons did, which is a fact. And if you want to accuse me of a fetish, it could only be that I have a fetish for canon, which I openly admit is true.
     
    Again, I never said Wonder Woman engaged in anything. Did you even bother to read my post at all? Because your determination to push an argument that was never mine onto me is more frustrating than your openly admitted trolling. My grounds for the assumption of RT's homophobia is based on her reply. Nothing more, nothing less. I never stated it was fact either but again, not surprised. You clearly just skimmed my post at best. You must not debate much. Terrible way to debate.
     
    She never mentioned having an issue with homosexual relationships, but the tone of her response is valid enough. It should be especially for you since you made clear assumptions about my post. Assumptions I would like to point out, that are wrong and were never my intention to convey. You are merely projecting.
     
    You cannot use me as an excuse to behave poorly. That is childish and very stupid in a forum patrolled by active moderators. I never used offensive language either. So you are fabricating my augments for me then? Capital! I can just sit here and let you argue with yourself then. 
     
    I also love how you crucify me for using a slightly modified line taken directly from RT's post as if it were my own. You must not even be reading her posts either. You can be flabbergasted all you want but if you really want to hate on someone for mentioning how a fictional character would feel, perhaps you should direct your condescension to RT, since it was merely a line I borrowed from her. Which I would like to add is pretty funny that in your attempts to insult me, you actually insult her, the person you are trying to defend with you life. Your part about "practicing what you preach" did not make much sense though, so I cannot with full confidence address it correctly but I will do my best. I told her that if she wants people to focus on her message (being peace, love, compassion, understanding, etc etc etc) that she should do so herself. Openly displaying aggression to a group of users for wanting to talk about Diana's (and by extension, the Amazon's) sex life is in direct confrontation with Diana's aforementioned message. But then again, I am not the one that brought up how Diana would feel about this first. But it is cute that you decided to hit hardest on what turned out to yet again, be your friend's own argument turned back around on her.
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    I'maDC/ImageGuy!

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    #92  Edited By I'maDC/ImageGuy!

    Does it really matter?

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    #93  Edited By Erik
    @I'maDC/ImageGuy! said:
    Does it really matter?
    Nope. Not even a little. But some have found the topic interesting for one reason or another.
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    #94  Edited By Primmaster64

    I don't know...Maybe she will....With Supes in a couple of months.

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    #95  Edited By Erik
    @Primmaster64 said:
    I don't know...Maybe she will....With Supes in a couple of months.
    A real possibility if the rumors are true that Lois will no longer be a romantic interest for Superman.
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    #96  Edited By joshmightbe

    The level of concern for super hero sex lives on here is disturbing 

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    #97  Edited By thehummingbird
    @Erik:  
     
    wow you are super impressive you almost managed to rework everything I said, except you did not . I will reply in a bit. I am sorry you have to wait love, but I currently busy, I just saw your reply. I hope your evening is well. Also thank you for doing just as I said, and not only that but I get the lengthiest reply I am so honored! Oh and I see you did not understand my sarcasm, it is okay I forgive you, it seems their are many things you do not understand. Let me save it for my reply yes? Please enjoy yourself while you wait. 
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    #98  Edited By Erik
    @thehummingbird said:
    @Erik:    wow you are super impressive you almost managed to rework everything I said, except you did not . I will reply in a bit. I am sorry you have to wait love, but I currently busy, I just saw your reply. I hope your evening is well. Also thank you for doing just as I said, and not only that but I get the lengthiest reply I am so honored! Oh and I see you did not understand my sarcasm, it is okay I forgive you, it seems their are many things you do not understand. Let me save it for my reply yes? Please enjoy yourself while you wait. 
    Flagged for clear attempts at baiting.
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    #99  Edited By thehummingbird
    @Erik:  
     
     
    Right back at yah! =D 
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    #100  Edited By Erik
    @thehummingbird said:
    @Erik:    Right back at yah! =D 
    Yeah only the mods actually read the flagged posts so your intentional attempts to abuse the flagging system will also be addressed by a moderator.

    This edit will also create new pages on Comic Vine for:

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