Could a new kryptonian villainess be a better challenge for WW?

#1 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman has been seriously injured by his villains, Some of superman's tougher villains such as darksied, zod, imperiex,metallo,brainiac and even have come close to killing him ( and he was "killed" in a stalemate with doomsday) (even lex luthor has knocked superman around using kryptonite). these villains give their hero counterparts a good challenge.

wonder woman's villains don't really challenge her like superman's and batman's do to them. writers have set wonder womans power/strength on par with superman, yet still her main villain (cheetah) is probably not even on spidermans level. ares puts up a fight, but it seems like he goes down way too easily and i'm sure they can do better than circe........please correct me if you've seen otherwise

Proposal: How would you feel if WW had a ruthless kryptonian villainess (along the lines of Faora or ursa) who somehow makes it to earth, and has the ability to give WW the fight of her life. Essentially this kryptonian villainess could be wonder woman's doomsday/ zod? do you guys see and potential for any new WW villains at all?

#2 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: there is no need for that,cheetah,circe and ares are real powerhouses when they are in good hands like perez,they just need a writter that makes them what they are supposed to be,ares and circe should easely be able to fight against some of the most powerful DC beings,like wonder woman,superman,darksied etc,after all ares and circe are gods,real gods and when they are in the hands of a good writter they show how powerful and dangerous they really are,the same with cheetah(avatar of a god),in the hands of writers like perez or ruka,she was a badass,DR psycho could be amazing,making him a powerful telepath,with telekinesis,force fields,teleportation,etc,silver swan is raleted to ares who is near sky father being so wonder woman villans have the potential to be some of the best and most powerful villans in DC,they just need a writer that knows how to use their full potential.

#3 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: Hey man i'm tryn to be open-minded...................out of those that you mentioned, i think ares is the greatest threat.............but in terms of circe and cheetah, it doesn't seem like they are threats that will cause WW to be pushed to her limits.

circe reminds me alot of the marvel's enchantress, essentially she's a sorceress (she took WW's super strength/durability at 1 point, but then WW got them back and she turned WW into a pig) .....i think she'd be a great villain for zatanna

cheetah is suppose to be WW's main villain right? i've never even seen her even come close to beating WW. i read that she was faster than WW, but WW is superior to her in every other way. i'd see her being a great villain for vixen (they've actually had a couple encounters before).

this Dr psycho you mention, the short and stubby dude in the tux with the bulging eye.......if You want people to take WW more seriously, haha yeah, "Due to his small stature he is a below average hand to hand combatant" he's gonna need an upgrade as you said.

If WW has superman level strength, lets give her superman level villains. Let her duke it out with MonGAL, she'd make a great WW villain hey if maxima shows up in the new 52 or whichever comic she happens to be dating superman in..............that could create the scene for one earth shaking battle (maxima once fought toe to toe with doomsday).

I said a kryptonian villainess bcuz i know they would give her a challenge (despite supergirl's horrible display).........just like H'el came out of nowhere, i could envision a rougue fearsome kryptonian woman entering the scene........and battle WW like superman battled doomsday or darksied or zod

#4 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: cheetah is too fast for vixen to handle and circe is a goddess,too much for zatana,most of wonder woman villans are very powerful when they are written properly,people think bad about them because they were victims of bad writing too many times in the past,something that happended to wonder woman too,to see how powerful they really are you should read perez run,and ruka run,why do you want a new villan for wonder woman when there is nothing wrong with her current villans?,wonder woman's villans just need to be written properly,cheetah is supposed to be one of the best speeders on DC,with healing factor,and super strength enough to hurt characters like superman and wonder woman,ares and circe are supposed to be sky-fathers,silver swan is supposed to be powered by ares himself,queen clea is supposed to be wonder woman's equal in super strength,super speed,durability and skills and with the poseidon's trident as her main weapon,so these characters just need a writer to write them properly,write them like they are supposed to be written,and now it's a great time to start to do it,now that that we have the rebot,the only characters that need a boost is dr psycho,giganta and dr poison.

#5 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: Queen clea, now your talking, she seems like good match up for WW...........with her i have a general idea of what atlantean strength is like.

i still see circe like a sorceress tho...........kinda like loki.....you know, the "puny god" (reference to avengers)

you ask why, have you ever seen WW pushed to her very limits that she nearly died trying to win a battle......like superman with doomdsay, or batman with bane, ect? i wanna see an epic battle like that.............its gonna take a really epic villian to do that

#6 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: again,her villans are very powerful when they are written properly,her villans need to be writteng with the proper power level,ares has to be what he is supposed to be,an sky-father,the same with circe,cheetah has to be writteng like the avatar of a god,speed only below flash,strength to hurt beings like superman and wonder woman and healing facter and regeneration power,clea has to be writteng as the dark version of wonder woman,that's what they are supposed to be.

#7 Edited by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123 said:

yet still her main villain (cheetah) is probably not even on spidermans level.

You obviously haven't read Justice League 13 & 14. Cheetah had the whole League grabbing their crotch in fear trying to keep from pissing their pants. Where ever you're getting the idea that Cheetah is only as strong as Spider-Man is just wrong, she's on Wonder Woman's level. Even in the Pre-N52 era she was almost without equal.

@marvel123 said:

ares puts up a fight, but it seems like he goes down way too easily

What exactly are you referring to here? When has the God of War been defeated easily?

@marvel123 said:

i'm sure they can do better than circe........please correct me if you've seen otherwise

Pre-N52 Circe was one of the most dangerous characters on the planet . . .why would you need to do better? I think that you're confusing animated appearances with what's been published.

@marvel123 said:

Proposal: How would you feel if WW had a ruthless kryptonian villainess (along the lines of Faora or ursa) who somehow makes it to earth, and has the ability to give WW the fight of her life. Essentially this kryptonian villainess could be wonder woman's doomsday/ zod? do you guys see and potential for any new WW villains at all?

I don't see your point. Wonder Woman's ties to Kryptonians should be limited to the JLA Battlefield and the Bedroom. Her character is unique and so are her rogues and introducing a Kryptonian foe is like trying to prop her up on a crutch saying that she's not good enough to stand on her own. Including anything Krypton associated, immediately, includes Superman even if he's not there physically and diminishes her stature. There is room for an idea like this creatively of course but to present it in the way that you have, essentially trampling her rogues, is saying that she needs Krypton threat levels because nothing else she has to face is good enough, is cheap.

While you're trying to "keep open minded" remember the test of a hero isn't just about strength. Some of these characters embody threats that cannot be resolved with brutality and their absurd appearance may be one of the tools that they use to gain the upper hand.

If you're simply looking for a fight, there are undiscovered Gods, Demons, Monsters and Mechanizations that can be created to fill the power role that you're looking to place a Kryptonian into. Leave the Krypton stuff to Superman, that's where that belongs.

#8 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: agree,and wonder woman's villans(ares,circe,cheetah,clea)are very powerful when they are writteng properly,we don't need new villans,we need good writers to work with the current villans,writers that use their potential.

#9 Edited by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: Is that what cheetah should be like?, being able to take on the justice league single handedly, like martian manhunter...........if so then, i stand corrected. i've never seen her being portrayed like that (especially in the animation). i've always seen WW beating her, either she ends up hogtied or knocked out.

Ares, he's supposed to be among the baddest of the bad and he puts up a fight with every one. however various incarnations of him i've seen loose more battles than win. over in marvel i've seen him loose to thor and hulk, i've seen him loose to perseus, loose to callisto, loose to hercules, loose to kratos, i saw WW battle him and slice off his head...........it seems like various writers/ producers (everywhere, not just in dc) have lowered his standards to fit in with their story............for a full god he looses to alot of mortals and demi's, he's supposed just a little bit under zeus's level and in the same class with hades, hera, posidon ect. right?

with circe, i think your right....i was basing that off of her performance in the animation (i wasn't really impressed with it)..........i see it like this, WW is to thor as Circe is to loki.....................you may not agree, but without loki's magic and cheap tricks (which only slows thor down), loki doesn't really stand a chance against thor. ........WW's known for her strength and fight and i just haven't seen circe meet her on that level. ............however i read on her page that she had WW strength for a while, but WW got them back. and yes...... i know everything isn't dependant on strength...........but it's alot more fun in battle

Yeah man i'm keeping an open mind to new possibilities and heck yeah i'm lookin for fight (a superman doomsday class fight). for those people who aren't truly convinced that she is truly on par with the kryptonians; i say, why not give her a kryptonian villain (superman doesn't have to fight them all)

but even better, what @gokuwarrior: said, is a great idea. Queen clea she seems like good match up for WW, i'd like to see more battles with her...........with her i have a much clearer idea of what atlantean strength is like, after knowing what aquaman can do.

I would still like to see her rivalries with cheetah ,ares,and circe and sure they can be written better. (if ares is written the way he's supposed to be written........in essence he could be WW's doomsday). and you're right it doesn't have to be a kryptonian, it's just that at the time i was thinking that a rougue kryptonian female with kryptonian combat skills could give her doomsday class battle. but i wanna see WW pushed to her very limits (especially by another powerful female) all i'm saying is that i haven't seen that so far......if you got any scans please share, i appreciate your comments btw

#10 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: when wonder woman slided ares she used a divine weapon to do it,in most fights wonder woman has a hard time against him,cheetah has some good fights against wonder woman in the perez run,ruka run and siomone run,look wonder woman v2 issue 9,and issue 31 for example,so as i said,when those characters are writteng properly,they are very powerful.

and why do you talk about strength only?,wonder woman has more powers,super speed,durability,flight,defence against mind attacks,enchanted senses,etc.

#11 Edited by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

Those things that you're mentioning about Ares (I thought you were just talking about the DCU) are, in my perspective, a disservice to the title of GOD. But that's a topic for another thread. When it comes to Wonder Woman there is a culturally in-born teaching to worship the Gods. She would more likely pray to him for guidance and good favor in what ever campaign she's waging than willingly fight him (I'm not saying she wouldn't fight him but to go to fists with him would be the absolute last resort). This sort of contradiction has never really been addressed in the comics I think as Ares has always been treated as a Villain and not a GOD and I think that there should be a strong and clear distinction between the two War is the nature and propensity of Ares not evil but he is depicted as evil and I feel that a character like Diana understands it.

In respect to Ares power level I look at it like this, all the Gods are actually equal but serve at different levels of a Hierarchy. Just as all humans are equal, but when you go to your job, you answer to your boss who is at a different status level than you are but it doesn't mean that your boss is more of a man or woman than you are. You also have a specialty at your job, you and few others are likely responsible for tasks and assignments that no one else does. Ares job description is War and there is no one else in the pantheon that has his expertise, there for he is more powerful than Zeus in the topic of War. So Zeus is more like the president or owner of the company and Ares works there at a lower level but is just as likely as any other God to take ownership of the company ousting Zeus for control. I don't know if that logic makes sense.

Azzarello's run actually flows in this direction as the dynamic of the Gods is very modernized.

The Doomsday scenario doesn't apply to Wonder Woman, for me, in regards to Ares. Wonder Woman should have concern for her life and the existence of the world if Ares is on the loose as he wields the Wrath of God. Doomsday is a task before Superman and the acceptance of completing that task at the cost of his life is included in a possible resolution, but he should not fear Doomsday as Diana should fear Ares or Clark should fear Darksied. For Wonder Woman, her Doomsday character was Genocide.

man i do ramble on . . .

#12 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: this genocide character seems legit, she's the bears the future body of WW, and in some form outmatched her............ yeah that seems cool, essentially she battle a version of herself......like a bizzaro/ zombie/doomsday -ish WW. there are not many females that physically outmatch WW........makes sense to have one of them a twisted version of WW herself

@gokuwarrior: better writting you say.......like how they've redeemed aquaman (making him as strong as superman, bulletproof, the underwater super speed/swim, ect). if cheetah is written any better, i fear she may seem a little overpowered.......taking out the justice league, thats a bit overboard. but your right, i agree they can just use some of her villains that we don't see as often, and write them well like Queen clea, genocide,and silver swan

thanks for commenting

#13 Edited by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: cheetah won't seem overpowered because cheetah was always supposed to be powerful enough to fight against characters in wonder woman's league,so they just have to write her the way she is supposed to be written,and again,don't forget that wonder woman has other powers not just super strength.

#14 Posted by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

I have overstated Cheetah's role against the Justice League. She did not take them all down but it was a concerted effort by the remaining team to subdue her, and we find out at the end that she wanted to be captured as it was revealed that she was working for someone and wanted to get on the inside. I think Johns is leaning towards a Legion of Doom incarnation. The Flash has been out of commission in the JL book since Cheetah severed his Achilles tendon.

#15 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: yeah, i know she has flight and superspeed.....and essentially thats why i thought of a kryptonian villainess, because they have the whole flight, superspeed and strength ect. - thing going for them.......and i just figured a well trained one could give her a good challenge.......but i didn't limit it to just kryptonians, you guys had some good ideas. i agree that in the futere, writers can utilize some of her villains that we don't see as often, and write them well.........like Queen clea, genocide,and silver swan.

............please excuse my excessive use of periods

#16 Edited by drgnx (3564 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123:

I would not mind bringing back the Bizzarro's as long as they do some updates. Like dialing down the deformed comical appearances and not making them so simple minded. I like Smallvilles take on Bizzarro, he had inverted morals, but was still different from his Earth-3 counterpart (Ultraman), but had Clark's intelligence in tack for the most part. I would like characters in DCnU to have to face their Zarros as often as Superman did, but not the simple minded incarnations we have seen but intelligent twisted versions of themselves. Naturally this would include Wonder Women too. The real challenge would be to differential them from their Earth 3 and Antimatter universe counter parts (though I think DC should get rid of the Antimatter universe while finding another way to keep the Anti-monitor relevant - but that is a different topic).

The real issue with Giving Wonder Woman a Kryptonian villain is that DC seems to be trying to differentiate her from them, despite her dating Superman, I think Superman is a deep as they want to tie the Kryptonian linkage to her, at least for now. A better way of putting it would be that DC tends to keep families separate... for the most part...so I think she may get in a tussle that is Superman related but not likely her own dedicated Kryptonian villain. It is a good thought, but a 3rd way of thinking would be why not a dedicated White Martian, or a Lantern, or a meta-Atlantian

It is not a bad idea, I can't say I'm really for or against it, just not something I see DC doing based on other comics.

#17 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@drgnx: thanks for the input, i did like smallville's incarnation of bizzaro as well. your right it doesn't have to be limited to a kryptonian villainess, i agreed with the previous commentors who convinved me that writers can just use some of her villains that we don't see as often, and write them well (like Queen clea, genocide,and silver swan, ect.) ......they all seem legit, i they'd give WW a fight to her last breath and push her to her limits (although she'd still be the victor in somehow)........the inspiration for this thought was the superman doomsday movie

i just was wondering if she would do well with a female villain who could do some of the things she could do and give her a good fight. i learned from WW fans that she is the strongest female fighter in all of comics....so which left to give her a good challenge like bane gives baman or atrocitus gives green lantern or doomsday, darksied, mongul, brainiac, imperiex, gives superman....but it seems like genocide can give WW a challenge of that calibur..

at the time, i chose a kryptonian female because they would come in at a close second to her, and it seemed like a more believable challenge than cheetah , since they also have superman level strength, flight, superman level speed, special abilities, plus kryptonian fighting skills (but i guess i was wrong about cheetah). but yeah its definitely not limmited to kryptonians.

#18 Edited by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

Ares can easily kill kryptonians. I think in the New 52, they seem to be grooming another child of Zeus (the first born) as Wonder Woman's Doomsday. First Born seems to be able to gain the powers of people he eats. Can also reboot Devastation with her origin from Cronus. Devastation appeared in the last Young Justice episode. Genocide might also be powerful enough to kill kryptonians.

#19 Posted by a88378438 (3420 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: @marvel123: @Press Oblivion:

#20 Posted by drgnx (3564 posts) - - Show Bio

Hmmm the male cheetah.....

#21 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@colonyofcells: yeah he should be able to, but thats if WW doesn't kill him first, (which she has in a couple incarnations). i was kinda gearing it towards a female villain. i agreed with the previous commenters who convinved me that writers can just use some of her villains that we don't see as often, and write them well (like Queen clea, genocide,and silver swan, ect.) ......they all seem legit, they'd give WW a fight to her last breath and push her to her limits (although she'd still be the victor in somehow)........ and yes the inspiration for this thought was the superman doomsday movie.

@a88378438: i stand corrected, i saw some other scans of her battling the league. i guess cheetah's supposed to be on ww and superman's level. i've never seen her being portrayed like that (especially in the animation). i've always seen WW beating her, either she ends up hogtied or knocked out.

thanks for the input

#22 Posted by a88378438 (3420 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: cheetah should be captain marvel or wonder woman level..

#23 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

Cheetah started out as just a mentally ill human but she gained many powers over the years after COIE. She now seems to be a sort of cat god so maybe she can even beat Thor.

#24 Posted by jphulk26 (1332 posts) - - Show Bio

No, Wonder Woman, 1, doesn´t need new villains, 2 if she does have them, they should be part of her story not fucking Supermans. Wonder Woman needs no new villains, she needs new writers. Half of Supermans villains, can´t hurt him that bad but they use their mind to fuck with him. The same even goes with Batman. Batman has a bunch of weak ass villians who need whole gangs to stop him. Hero and Villain has archetypically from the begnning of time been brains (evil) vs brawn (good).

#25 Posted by BlackWind (6497 posts) - - Show Bio

@jphulk26 said:

No, Wonder Woman, 1, doesn´t need new villains, 2 if she does have them, they should be part of her story not fucking Supermans. Wonder Woman needs no new villains, she needs new writers. Half of Supermans villains, can´t hurt him that bad but they use their mind to fuck with him. The same even goes with Batman. Batman has a bunch of weak ass villians who need whole gangs to stop him. Hero and Villain has archetypically from the begnning of time been brains (evil) vs brawn (good).

Exactly. They aren't even in the same genre.

#26 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@jphulk26: and @BlackWind: i agreed with the previous commenters who convinved me that writers can just use some of her villains that we don't see as often, and write them well (like Queen clea, genocide,and silver swan, ect.) ......they all seem legit, they'd give WW a fight to her last breath and push her to her limits (although she'd still be the victor in somehow)........ and yes the inspiration for this thought was the superman doomsday movie.

i know it's not all about a physical challenge when it comes to villains (joker and luthor are great villains)........but sometimes a straight up hardcore battle is what i'm looking for, and i saw that between superman and doomsay.

i just was wondering if she would do well with a female villain who could do some of the things she could do and give her a good fight. i learned from WW fans that she is the strongest female fighter in all of comics....so who's left to give her a good challenge. like bane gives baman or atrocitus gives green lantern or doomsday, darksied, mongul, brainiac, imperiex, gives superman....but it seems like genocide can give WW a challenge of that calibur..

at the time, i chose a kryptonian female because they would come in at a close second to her, and it seemed like a more believable challenge than cheetah , since they also have superman level strength, flight, superman level speed, special abilities, plus kryptonian fighting skills (but i guess i was wrong about cheetah). but yeah its definitely not limmited to kryptonians.

thanks for your comments

#27 Posted by jphulk26 (1332 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: OK I get what you´re saying now. I didn´t understand before. I still don´t think she needs a krytonian villainess. she has:

Genocide = Doomsday

Circe = Sinestro

Ares = Darkseid

White Magician hasn´t been mentioned

She also has The Gorgans who are pretty hardcore

Genocide could be viscous if used correctly. she just needs an update.

The thing is and this what frustrates me about WW writers, they never build on whats come before. Thats why it seems like she has no established powerhouse villains. Its really annoying, especially with the New 52, when we finally had a chance to introduce modern takes on some of her great villains to new fans Azzerrello has just completely fucked it up as if her rogues were just garbage. As Geoff Johns demonstrated with Cheetah they´re not. I would go as far as to say she has better villains she has faced over time than Green Lantern or Flash and she could be on pah with superman if her villains are updated. Again to much focus is given to WW, and why she doesn´t sell and they keep focusing the comic on her and making her more accessible, which is bullshit, she´s fine, her book doesn´t sell cause the writers don´t give a consistent clear image of her mythology i.e. supporting cast, city, and they need to focus on making her established or underused villains cool. Put Ares up against the justice League, to show how he could fuck them all up, which makes it important when he appears in her solo comic. People buy comics with just the Joker in it or Lex Luthor, villains sell comics, almost as much as the hero. Thats what ww needs. DC need to get over their Batman superman fetish, cause that cashcow is going to get fully milked after a while.

#28 Posted by Bruxae (13984 posts) - - Show Bio

I dont know if id want a Kryptonian in the WW series, but id like an oppertunity for her to demonstrate her real strength some more.

I think so far in the New 52 her biggest strength feat is lifting a newsvan.

#29 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@a88378438: , @jphulk26: , , @Bruxae: thanks for your coments. i now know that WW has some legit villains and that they just need to be seen more/ written well.........just for kicks and giggle what if this scenario were to occur in a superman comic....tell me watchya think

SCENARIO

i thought of a random scenario that could possibly work: supes n WW are dating (so thats her connection to this story) . a random kryptonian lady shows up out of nowhere (like H'el), superman's kinda excited to see another kryptonian (cuz she seems nice at first), superboy is infatuated with her, kara doesn't trust her ( because of the whole H'el issue) but she has a secret agenda (trying to restore the city of kandor to its glory and start a new krypton on earth/ensalve humans). at the fortress of solitude ,superman finds out her plan and she finds away to trap him in the phantom zone along with kara, and just knocks superboy out cold. then WW ( who met her prior to this scene and didn't really trust her to begin with )shows up looking for clark and finds this kryptonian villainess is trying to follow through with her evil plan......one thing leads to another.........and we have what could be one of the most epic female battles of all time (i'm talking superman doomsday level, goku vs buu level).....mountains shake when they exchange blows, ect. WW even takes off her bracelets and they're still evenly match, she is pushed to her very limits and finds some way to win (tho she ends up temporarily paralized from some severe damage)..........she recovers in a couple weeks tho.............as for the kryptonian villainess.......she's almost lifeless and ends up floating in deep space

#30 Posted by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

Like I mentioned before, there is room for an idea like this and what you've done here is plausible.

I think that it's a much better idea as a Superman story rather than making her a part of Wonder Woman's Rogues gallery, but I think also that you're lending too much credence to Kryptonian power.

Just My Opinion . . .

The idea that Kryptonians can show up on earth and immediately be as powerful or more powerful than Superman is a little ridiculous to me. Superman spent almost his entire lifetime on Earth soaking up the radiation of the Sun to become as powerful as he is. For another Krytponian, even Supergirl, to come here and off the bat have all of the gifts and control that Clark does is upsetting. She even flew back to Krypton's deathbed, had an adventure, and came back to Earth like it was a field trip, it's ludicrous.

This is tantamount to a middle aged blue collar worker, who's out of shape and want's to pick up running for health reasons, beating an Olympic runner in a track meet, who has been training for years. Just like you can't expect to be controlling the company when you've been hired at an entry level position.

Also I DO NOT LIKE the idea of there being more Kryptonians existing in the Universe. This starts to diminish the unique quality of Superman and his abilities.

While I understand your desire for these Dragonball Z scenarios in the world of American comics, it just really doesn't fit that well because the themes in the comics is to do right in the face of wrong, preserving the sanctity of life, and protecting the powerless, not looking for a title or defeating the next challenge, it's not a competition.

#31 Posted by Hazlenaut (1960 posts) - - Show Bio

Wonder woman needs villain that people will give reason to care. A hissy fit deity Aries does not make us care. Cheetah’s origin and character change so many times, that we need to make guide to show the difference. The latest cheetahs are now a tragic werecheetah, which reminds me of Golddiggers, and an Amazon betrayed who is dressed as a cheetah.

Wonder Woman is the willing to kill so this is concerning, but it also means the villain would have bragging rights as that hero won’t hold her punches for killers. I feel that she needs a villain that is like the Shredder from Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles.

#32 Posted by jphulk26 (1332 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: I like it. Most of it. But I´d rather pre new52 wonder woman in this story; she´s more cunning, has a better set of powers, and is just more bad ass. I´m talking Rucka Simone WW. She´d kick Kryptonian ass. The Kryptonian would have needed to spend along time near another yellow star before getting here as Press Oblivion stated. Maybe at first she fakes being less powerful, but then you realized she´s travelled the universe and absorbed rays from a much larger yellow sun, making her a super super krytonian.

However as stated before i´m fed up of Superman and Batman villains showing up all the time, I want some WW and Flash villains at the centre of the action in future. Especially WW, because as I said she has villains that would kick the JL´s ass.

#33 Posted by marvel123 (377 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: i blame smallville, i love the kryptonians

Also I DO NOT LIKE the idea of there being more Kryptonians existing in the Universe. This starts to diminish the unique quality of Superman and his abilities

sometimes i think so as well, but i also think it humbles superman showing that, he's not the only one who can lift the weight of the earth and move faster than bullets,and blow hurricane force winds, fly, ect........"no one man should have all that power" i like how all kryptonians can come to earth and be like superman (whether young or old, male or female, white or black).......i saw that in smallville and i thought that was cool. it's not like some heroes such as thor or WW where the hero is superior to individuals according to their kind. i also like the concept of the atlanteans where aquaman and mera are shown as equals.

also we have hero characters like WW, shazam, MM, icon that are on par with him as well. they essentially bring him down to earth saying: "hey, i'm probably just as strong as you supes"

@jphulk26: yup, besides grodd, mirror master, zoom and capt. boomerang idk many of flash's villains

#34 Posted by drgnx (3564 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123 said:


also we have hero characters like WW, shazam, MM, icon that are on par with him as well. they essentially bring him down to earth saying: "hey, i'm probably just as strong as you supes"

Hopefully Majestic too XD XD XD.

But I think it is good to mention the non-kryptonians, because it also accents the point when he is rivaled by non-krpytonians.

#35 Posted by drgnx (3564 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123:

@Press Oblivion said:

Like I mentioned before, there is room for an idea like this and what you've done here is plausible.

I think that it's a much better idea as a Superman story rather than making her a part of Wonder Woman's Rogues gallery, but I think also that you're lending too much credence to Kryptonian power.

Well there is a lot of room with Daemonites now, they made their presence known, I'd rather DC opens them up for villains for better integration now that I think of it, with their nature you get a wide range of powersets, Look what Hellespont did to Superman, no reason a female Daemonite can't get one of those bodies (arcturian or something ) and go after Diana...

#36 Edited by Pokeysteve (8330 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: Your first post in this thread pretty much covered my thoughts so thank you. Even though you were much nicer than I would have been haha.

I'd also like to add that Imperiex is not a Superman villain. He was every ones villain.

And if we're naming credible Wonder Woman villains I'm throwing Devastation out there.

#37 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: actually there are many characters in comics that can beat any DBZ character,and that comes from a big DBZ fan,and there have been a lot of intense fights in comics like the fights from DBZ,some people think that by saying that characters like wonder woman should be above planet busting level,i'm saying that she should destroy a planet,or have a fight that makes the earth tremble every issue,and that's not the point,i think that wonder woman can be above planet busting level,and have an intense and epic fight occasionally,i'm not talking about doing this as often as DBZ does,just do it ocassionally to make those fights more special and memorable,i think it'd be good to let wonder woman have some fights like that in the climax of the most important runs,something that could happen 2 or 3 times per year,that would mean that we'll have enough space to different types of stories,so it won't be a one dimensional comic,her best and most powerful villans will show up,that way we'll have a more versatil comic from her,and her villans will get the respect and status that they deserve giving some really epic fights full of power with a very interesting plot supporting everything,those epic and intense fights would be saved for the most important runs which will make those figth more memorable,that can't be wrong right?.

#38 Posted by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

@drgnx said:


Well there is a lot of room with Daemonites now, they made their presence known, I'd rather DC opens them up for villains for better integration now that I think of it, with their nature you get a wide range of powersets, Look what Hellespont did to Superman, no reason a female Daemonite can't get one of those bodies (arcturian or something ) and go after Diana...

That's totally credible too! The Daemontes could be an outstanding, universal, villain.

I like the ideas that you guys are throwing around because you're not limiting yourselves in the creative arena.

@Pokeysteve said:

@Press Oblivion: Your first post in this thread pretty much covered my thoughts so thank you. Even though you were much nicer than I would have been haha.

I'd also like to add that Imperiex is not a Superman villain. He was every ones villain.

And if we're naming credible Wonder Woman villains I'm throwing Devastation out there.

Thanks for saying "thank you", totally unnecessary but greatly appreciated :D

@gokuwarrior said:

@Press Oblivion: actually there are many characters in comics that can beat any DBZ character,and that comes from a big DBZ fan,and there have been a lot of intense fights in comics like the fights from DBZ,some people think that by saying that characters like wonder woman should be above planet busting level,i'm saying that she should destroy a planet,or have a fight that makes the earth tremble every issue,and that's not the point,i think that wonder woman can be above planet busting level,and have an intense and epic fight occasionally,i'm not talking about doing this as often as DBZ does,just do it ocassionally to make those fights more special and memorable,i think it'd be good to let wonder woman have some fights like that in the climax of the most important runs,something that could happen 2 or 3 times per year,that would mean that we'll have enough space to different types of stories,so it won't be a one dimensional comic,her best and most powerful villans will show up,that way we'll have a more versatil comic from her,and her villans will get the respect and status that they deserve giving some really epic fights full of power with a very interesting plot supporting everything,those epic and intense fights would be saved for the most important runs which will make those figth more memorable,that can't be wrong right?.

I understand what you're saying, and I would like to see that occasionally too. There are too many debates on the topic of who would beat who and there's is some fun to be had with a theme like that. It is comics after all and they should be fun and compelling.

#39 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

It would be fun to see Wonder Woman beat up Pandora.

#40 Posted by oceanmaster21 (8181 posts) - - Show Bio

her villian circe is very powerful but i wud like to see her and ursa fight if its a bloodlust fight no weapons just raw power it wud be ausome bc ursa no joke and neither is wonderwoman one on one cud go either way ursa has slite advantage

#41 Posted by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

@oceanmaster21: Wonder Woman for the win!

#42 Posted by oceanmaster21 (8181 posts) - - Show Bio

wonderwoman cud beat ursa but ursa can beat wonderwoman as well

#43 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@Press Oblivion: for me,to make something more unique it has to be something special that don't happen every issue,a fight where wonder woman fights against a character above planet busting level must be something epic that only happens ocassionally in the climax of the most important runs,comics have something in their favor,when it comes to villans and troubles,they aren't one dimensional,sometimes to save the day in the comic world it takes more than power levels,sometimes it's not about the power,it's about the mind,sometimes save the day is not about punch somebody and have a fight that leaves a mess all around,characters like luthor don't have power to destroy a planet,but they find other ways to cause troubles that make them dangerous,and those characters can be used even if a hero is above the planet busting level,because someone as luthor for example,he is a genius,and he finds a way to be a big problem without fighting directly against powerhouses like superman,that's why i think that fights between planet busting beings should be something that happen only ocasionally,it wouldn't be unique if all wonder woman characters become planet busting beings,but her biggest villans,someone like ares,it's logical that a god like him should be above planet busting level and wonder woman will prove that she is powerful enough to handle someone at that level when she fights someone like ares,the purpose with characters at that level is to have some epic fights 2 or 3 time per year,fights reserved by the most important events where a hero faces a situation where it has to go all out,that will make those issues memorable.

#44 Posted by a88378438 (3420 posts) - - Show Bio

@gokuwarrior: agree,agree,agree,agree,agree can't any more!!!!!

#45 Posted by gokuwarrior (4368 posts) - - Show Bio

@a88378438: thank you,thank you,thank you!.

#46 Posted by Press Oblivion (1643 posts) - - Show Bio

@oceanmaster21 said:

wonderwoman cud beat ursa but ursa can beat wonderwoman as well

What you said.

@gokuwarrior said:

@Press Oblivion: for me,to make something more unique it has to be something special that don't happen every issue,a fight where wonder woman fights against a character above planet busting level must be something epic that only happens ocassionally in the climax of the most important runs,comics have something in their favor,when it comes to villans and troubles,they aren't one dimensional,sometimes to save the day in the comic world it takes more than power levels,sometimes it's not about the power,it's about the mind,sometimes save the day is not about punch somebody and have a fight that leaves a mess all around,characters like luthor don't have power to destroy a planet,but they find other ways to cause troubles that make them dangerous,and those characters can be used even if a hero is above the planet busting level,because someone as luthor for example,he is a genius,and he finds a way to be a big problem without fighting directly against powerhouses like superman,that's why i think that fights between planet busting beings should be something that happen only ocasionally,it wouldn't be unique if all wonder woman characters become planet busting beings,but her biggest villans,someone like ares,it's logical that a god like him should be above planet busting level and wonder woman will prove that she is powerful enough to handle someone at that level when she fights someone like ares,the purpose with characters at that level is to have some epic fights 2 or 3 time per year,fights reserved by the most important events where a hero faces a situation where it has to go all out,that will make those issues memorable.

indeed :)

#47 Edited by Epicbeast3000 (956 posts) - - Show Bio

@marvel123: Dude Ares freakin killed Highfather. He is more powerful than any of supes villains and Ares could probably beat every superman villain.

#48 Posted by colonyofcells (2038 posts) - - Show Bio

Only the gods seem powerful enough to challenge Wonder Woman these days.

#49 Posted by PowerWoman (3381 posts) - - Show Bio

@colonyofcells: True,the wonder woman strength level always close to superman strength,in new 52,superman can easily lift earth weight,wonder woman should be easily lift earth weight too,so,we need some real powerful charater to fight with wonder woman,dont like pre-crisis,a lot of street characters can match superman or beat superman,they are make superman so weak,even destroy city buster charater can dozen of times stronger than superman,wonder woman should be destroy planets in fight,we need ww has this feats,mountains shake when they exchange blows or planets shake when they exchange blows

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