Bone to pick with Logan.

#1 Posted by Rickbarry (1811 posts) - - Show Bio

Why did you kill Morph, Wolverine?! He was the only man that could make you laugh and you let Sentinels shoot him over and over and over!

Bastard.

#2 Posted by KainScion (2973 posts) - - Show Bio

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

#3 Posted by KainScion (2973 posts) - - Show Bio

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

#4 Posted by _slim_ (13240 posts) - - Show Bio

lol

#5 Posted by Gambit1024 (9890 posts) - - Show Bio

lolwut?

#6 Posted by ArturoCalaKayVee (11996 posts) - - Show Bio
#7 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@KainScion said:

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

not only that but it was an old cartoon, it's time to get with the present, time to be pissed at Wolverine for something else.....how about schism

#8 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor said:

@KainScion said:

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

not only that but it was an old cartoon, it's time to get with the present, time to be pissed at Wolverine for something else.....how about schism

H@T3R

#9 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@KainScion said:

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

not only that but it was an old cartoon, it's time to get with the present, time to be pissed at Wolverine for something else.....how about schism

H@T3R

I don't know if this makes me a hater but I hate schism and blame Wolverine more than anyone else (even though no 1 person was solely responsible)

#10 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@KainScion said:

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

not only that but it was an old cartoon, it's time to get with the present, time to be pissed at Wolverine for something else.....how about schism

H@T3R

I don't know if this makes me a hater but I hate schism and blame Wolverine more than anyone else (even though no 1 person was solely responsible)

I really don't get why anyone would ever blame a character for something. I mean, I guess I comprehend but... Oh well. I liked them getting off Utopia. Utopia sucks. If Schism meant that, then I'm all for it.

#11 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@KainScion said:

it was a cartoon dude. get over yourself.

not only that but it was an old cartoon, it's time to get with the present, time to be pissed at Wolverine for something else.....how about schism

H@T3R

I don't know if this makes me a hater but I hate schism and blame Wolverine more than anyone else (even though no 1 person was solely responsible)

I really don't get why anyone would ever blame a character for something. I mean, I guess I comprehend but... Oh well. I liked them getting off Utopia. Utopia sucks. If Schism meant that, then I'm all for it.

Eh, you can argue against the Strategic integrity of Utopia but the plain stupidity of splitting the mutants in half at their weakest hour is actually stated in the story, so I personally just wish they would have stuck together no matter where they are. as for blaming characters, while the writers do make them do the stupid things they do, they still do them and the damage is done through them so I blame both writer and character even though I blame the writer more

#12 Posted by Soulstealer (825 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor: I blame him for all the ridiculous healing factor moments that the writers seem to love doling out...

Okay, maybe I actually blame the writers, but I want a sense of danger applied to him again. I guess what I'm saying is that the wolvie I love gets his butt kicked sometimes. XD

#13 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@Soulstealer said:

@BlackArmor: I blame him for all the ridiculous healing factor moments that the writers seem to love doling out...

Okay, maybe I actually blame the writers, but I want a sense of danger applied to him again. I guess what I'm saying is that the wolvie I love gets his butt kicked sometimes. XD

oh yeah nobody likes a nigh immortal superhero, even Superman has kryptonite floating around everywhere

#14 Posted by BloodTalon (440 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

I really don't get why anyone would ever blame a character for something. I mean, I guess I comprehend but... Oh well. I liked them getting off Utopia. Utopia sucks. If Schism meant that, then I'm all for it.

I agree with the fact that Utopia sucks in fact it sucks so bad I will say it twice Utopia sucks!

But I do some times like to blame characters because it helps with my suspension of disbelief

#15 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BloodTalon: But I don't think Wolverine's at fault. Ethically, its the best option. Kids shouldn't fight.

#16 Posted by BloodTalon (440 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp: I agree with you and Wolverine on the ethics of it, but the Schism was half Wolverine's fault and half Cyclops's fault because if either one had seen it the other way the Schism would not have happened

I would have left with Wolverine if I had not left already

#17 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BloodTalon said:

@ReVamp: I agree with you and Wolverine on the ethics of it, but the Schism was half Wolverine's fault and half Cyclops's fault because if either one had seen it the other way the Schism would not have happened

I would have left with Wolverine if I had not left already

Yeah, well the thing is that "fault" has negative implications.

#18 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BloodTalon: But I don't think Wolverine's at fault. Ethically, its the best option. Kids shouldn't fight.

Kids definitely shouldn't have to fight but when they do, they do. If I'm sitting in class taking a test and somebody walks up and puts a gun to my head I don't just ignore it and go back to circling B, and I think that's a accurate metaphor for the modern mutant situation, they always have a gun to their temple so choosing to just ignore it and go to school like it isn't happening is naive and unrealistic at best. When you can't afford to do something then doing it isn't an option and age doesn't change that, and at this point in time the x-kids can't afford to be just kids.

That aside a compromise could have easily been reached that would both protect the kids for the most part and allow them to contribute in the fight for their survival and future

#19 Posted by BloodTalon (440 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BloodTalon said:

@ReVamp: I agree with you and Wolverine on the ethics of it, but the Schism was half Wolverine's fault and half Cyclops's fault because if either one had seen it the other way the Schism would not have happened

I would have left with Wolverine if I had not left already

Yeah, well the thing is that "fault" has negative implications.

but there were negative out comes the children of the atom are now split and friends were forced to pick sides so no matter witch side you are on there were some bad things so I think that there should be some blame given out thats all

#20 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor said:

Kids definitely shouldn't have to fight but when they do, they do.

Yeah, but when kids fight they're brawling over the girl next door, not fighting a psychopath who's reminiscent of Hitler.

If I'm sitting in class taking a test and somebody walks up and puts a gun to my head I don't just ignore it and go back to circling B, and I think that's a accurate metaphor for the modern mutant situation,

No, they call the police and someone handles it. Adults handle it. They don't do jack. Sure, they may ca-pow the guy that's holding the gun, but then the police comes and they go back to circling c (because b isn't the correct answer btw, Caesar was Roman, not greek)

they always have a gun to their temple so choosing to just ignore it and go to school like it isn't happening is naive and unrealistic at best.

They don't. They are going to a specific school which is protecting them and training them for when they're of age to fight. Never put a gun in the hands of an 8 year old and expect them to go kill someone for you, its disgusting.

When you can't afford to do something then doing it isn't an option and age doesn't change that,

I don't agree, in this particular case of comic books, they are more than capable of doing it. There are exceptions, like Jubilee and X though...

and at this point in time the x-kids can't afford to be just kids.

Yeah they can. I'll tell you why. At this point the X-Men are about twice as weak as they were before and one half has just put the X-Kids beign just kids, which means that they're doing it at a considerably lower strength and they're pulling through just fine.

Also lets not forget that Xavier did this for the greater part of his life with the X-Men and lets face it, the only thing that has really changed is the fact that the total number of mutants is down. The people that are at the school are still the same and this means that the people both protecting the school and learning within it are still at the same strength. This perceived threat that people want to kill them now is kinda BS, because these guys always wanted to kill them just as hard as they want to do now. In fact, now when they were together, they even had a better chance to protect them since the X-Men's strength was higher since they were all together.

That aside a compromise could have easily been reached that would both protect the kids for the most part and allow them to contribute in the fight for their survival and future

Oh, I agree. I don't mind the kids fighting at all, but I don't think they should be treated as soldiers. Its not an ultimatum and I'm not sure the Cyclops understands that they need to be treated in this particular manner for them to fight. When some random ass sentinel appears and they can take them solo, then they don't need to endanger the lives of the kids without them. Wolverine isn't totally right, but of the two he has the view which I like best. Its not even that I like him as a character more, because I loved pre-Utopia Scott.

#21 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

Kids definitely shouldn't have to fight but when they do, they do.

Yeah, but when kids fight they're brawling over the girl next door, not fighting a psychopath who's reminiscent of Hitler.

My point being when they have to fight someone reminiscent of Hitler, then they have to fight that person reminiscent of Hitler, when something has to be dne then either you do it or it isn't done

If I'm sitting in class taking a test and somebody walks up and puts a gun to my head I don't just ignore it and go back to circling B, and I think that's a accurate metaphor for the modern mutant situation,

No, they call the police and someone handles it. Adults handle it. They don't do jack. Sure, they may ca-pow the guy that's holding the gun, but then the police comes and they go back to circling c (because b isn't the correct answer btw, Caesar was Roman, not greek)

I'm not asking the X-students to handle everything and I most certainly expect the adults to be involved, prof X always was (almost) when the original 5 were teens, all I expect from the kids s that ca-pow, at least in this situation. By the way the question was about Babylon and all I know about Babylon was that it starts with B so I circled it :p

they always have a gun to their temple so choosing to just ignore it and go to school like it isn't happening is naive and unrealistic at best.

They don't. They are going to a specific school which is protecting them and training them for when they're of age to fight. Never put a gun in the hands of an 8 year old and expect them to go kill someone for you, its disgusting.

Wasn't the school blown up in the first issue? I think they might need all hands on deck to guard the second biggest target in all of comics including the students. I agree that they shouldn't kill I hated Cyke putting X-23 on X-force but I do expect the students to do recon and skirmish missions

When you can't afford to do something then doing it isn't an option and age doesn't change that,

I don't agree, in this particular case of comic books, they are more than capable of doing it. There are exceptions, like Jubilee and X though...

and at this point in time the x-kids can't afford to be just kids.

Yeah they can. I'll tell you why. At this point the X-Men are about twice as weak as they were before and one half has just put the X-Kids beign just kids, which means that they're doing it at a considerably lower strength and they're pulling through just fine.

Also lets not forget that Xavier did this for the greater part of his life with the X-Men and lets face it, the only thing that has really changed is the fact that the total number of mutants is down. The people that are at the school are still the same and this means that the people both protecting the school and learning within it are still at the same strength. This perceived threat that people want to kill them now is kinda BS, because these guys always wanted to kill them just as hard as they want to do now. In fact, now when they were together, they even had a better chance to protect them since the X-Men's strength was higher since they were all together.

We both know how Marvel works there handelig it now but how long until another massacre? They've been dealing with that weak @$$ new Hellfire club but Sabertooth is coming for them and who knows what actual serous threats after that, they've handled Kilgore but let's see what happens when Sinister get's tired of fighting the UXM Marvel loves a tragedy and somebody will die as soon as they get a serious threat. And when Xavier was doing this how many times was the school blown up? Yes the same guys are coming after that have always been coming after them but they've never been so successful and dangerous, it's a different game with different stakes and the X-men need all there players

That aside a compromise could have easily been reached that would both protect the kids for the most part and allow them to contribute in the fight for their survival and future

Oh, I agree. I don't mind the kids fighting at all, but I don't think they should be treated as soldiers. Its not an ultimatum and I'm not sure the Cyclops understands that they need to be treated in this particular manner for them to fight. When some random ass sentinel appears and they can take them solo, then they don't need to endanger the lives of the kids without them. Wolverine isn't totally right, but of the two he has the view which I like best. Its not even that I like him as a character more, because I loved pre-Utopia Scott.

We can both agree that the X-kids should have been handled better but there still assets and while they shouldn't be treated as soldiers they should be treated as X-men. I also think Scott was right to have them fight the sentinel they had allot of fire power there and there wasn't much of a chance for failure.

My other question is why the X-kids actually want to be in the school I've seen most of them almost beg for missions when cyclops actually didn't use them and now that he wants to use them the suddenly aren't for it?

#22 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor said:

My point being when they have to fight someone reminiscent of Hitler, then they have to fight that person reminiscent of Hitler, when something has to be dne then either you do it or it isn't done

But that's the point, they don't have to.

I'm not asking the X-students to handle everything and I most certainly expect the adults to be involved, prof X always was (almost) when the original 5 were teens, all I expect from the kids s that ca-pow, at least in this situation. By the way the question was about Babylon and all I know about Babylon was that it starts with B so I circled it :p

Exactly, they had backing and it was a different time when things weren't quite as dangerous as it was now. Its constantly referred to and thus, the 60s aren't a good comparision.

Wasn't the school blown up in the first issue? I think they might need all hands on deck to guard the second biggest target in all of comics including the students. I agree that they shouldn't kill I hated Cyke putting X-23 on X-force but I do expect the students to do recon and skirmish missions

Not blown up, but I get the point. But Wolverine took care of it. Period. The children were ok. I also expect students to do stuff, but Cyclops wants them to be soldiers.

We both know how Marvel works there handelig it now but how long until another massacre? They've been dealing with that weak @$$ new Hellfire club but Sabertooth is coming for them and who knows what actual serous threats after that, they've handled Kilgore but let's see what happens when Sinister get's tired of fighting the UXM Marvel loves a tragedy and somebody will die as soon as they get a serious threat.

And..? What then? Wolverine will kick his ass. Like the X-Men have done for the past 40 years without endagering students. I'm not saying that students shouldn't fight back, but they should be students, not goddamn soldiers.

And when Xavier was doing this how many times was the school blown up?

Exactly, the school was blown up loads of times and the students were never required to kill or be treated as soldiers.

Yes the same guys are coming after that have always been coming after them but they've never been so successful and dangerous, it's a different game with different stakes and the X-men need all there players

How is it different? The only difference is that there are less mutants overall. Period. That doesn't really affect the X-Men at all, these people always wanted to kill them and they always targeted them.

We can both agree that the X-kids should have been handled better but there still assets and while they shouldn't be treated as soldiers they should be treated as X-men.

Place the word Junior before X-Men and we're in complete agreement.

I also think Scott was right to have them fight the sentinel they had allot of fire power there and there wasn't much of a chance for failure.

Wolverine said they could solo. If they could solo, they could solo.

My other question is why the X-kids actually want to be in the school I've seen most of them almost beg for missions when cyclops actually didn't use them and now that he wants to use them the suddenly aren't for it?

Because they don't want to be soldiers, treated like dirt, forced to fight ruthlessly?

#23 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@lykopis: Welcome x3

#24 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

My point being when they have to fight someone reminiscent of Hitler, then they have to fight that person reminiscent of Hitler, when something has to be dne then either you do it or it isn't done

But that's the point, they don't have to.

I'm not asking the X-students to handle everything and I most certainly expect the adults to be involved, prof X always was (almost) when the original 5 were teens, all I expect from the kids s that ca-pow, at least in this situation. By the way the question was about Babylon and all I know about Babylon was that it starts with B so I circled it :p

Exactly, they had backing and it was a different time when things weren't quite as dangerous as it was now. Its constantly referred to and thus, the 60s aren't a good comparision.

Wasn't the school blown up in the first issue? I think they might need all hands on deck to guard the second biggest target in all of comics including the students. I agree that they shouldn't kill I hated Cyke putting X-23 on X-force but I do expect the students to do recon and skirmish missions

Not blown up, but I get the point. But Wolverine took care of it. Period. The children were ok. I also expect students to do stuff, but Cyclops wants them to be soldiers.

We both know how Marvel works there handelig it now but how long until another massacre? They've been dealing with that weak @$$ new Hellfire club but Sabertooth is coming for them and who knows what actual serous threats after that, they've handled Kilgore but let's see what happens when Sinister get's tired of fighting the UXM Marvel loves a tragedy and somebody will die as soon as they get a serious threat.

And..? What then? Wolverine will kick his ass. Like the X-Men have done for the past 40 years without endagering students. I'm not saying that students shouldn't fight back, but they should be students, not goddamn soldiers.

And when Xavier was doing this how many times was the school blown up?

Exactly, the school was blown up loads of times and the students were never required to kill or be treated as soldiers.

Yes the same guys are coming after that have always been coming after them but they've never been so successful and dangerous, it's a different game with different stakes and the X-men need all there players

How is it different? The only difference is that there are less mutants overall. Period. That doesn't really affect the X-Men at all, these people always wanted to kill them and they always targeted them.

We can both agree that the X-kids should have been handled better but there still assets and while they shouldn't be treated as soldiers they should be treated as X-men.

Place the word Junior before X-Men and we're in complete agreement.

I also think Scott was right to have them fight the sentinel they had allot of fire power there and there wasn't much of a chance for failure.

Wolverine said they could solo. If they could solo, they could solo.

My other question is why the X-kids actually want to be in the school I've seen most of them almost beg for missions when cyclops actually didn't use them and now that he wants to use them the suddenly aren't for it?

Because they don't want to be soldiers, treated like dirt, forced to fight ruthlessly?

The more we discuss this the more it sounds like were agreeing, I just want the X-kids to be assets and go on a few non lethal missions to contribute to the cause. Tell me if at the basic level were saying something different

#25 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

#26 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

Well then I guess we were saying the same thing the whole time I guess

#27 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

Well then I guess we were saying the same thing the whole time I guess

The disagreement came from who we agreed with, Cyke or Logan, to which you answered the former while I preferred the latter.

#28 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

Well then I guess we were saying the same thing the whole time I guess

The disagreement came from who we agreed with, Cyke or Logan, to which you answered the former while I preferred the latter.

Right, almost forgot how it started, well we at least agree a common compromise could be reached

#29 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (33880 posts) - - Show Bio
Online
#30 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

Well then I guess we were saying the same thing the whole time I guess

The disagreement came from who we agreed with, Cyke or Logan, to which you answered the former while I preferred the latter.

Right, almost forgot how it started, well we at least agree a common compromise could be reached

Yeah, I just don't agree that Cyclops would be the fastest or the best way to reach it.

#31 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

Well then I guess we were saying the same thing the whole time I guess

The disagreement came from who we agreed with, Cyke or Logan, to which you answered the former while I preferred the latter.

Right, almost forgot how it started, well we at least agree a common compromise could be reached

Yeah, I just don't agree that Cyclops would be the fastest or the best way to reach it.

Eh, to each his own I guess

#32 Posted by God_Spawn (38088 posts) - - Show Bio

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor said:

@ReVamp said:

@BlackArmor: Yeah, basically. If by non-lethal you mean missions where they shouldn't kill and aren't high-danger.

Well then I guess we were saying the same thing the whole time I guess

The disagreement came from who we agreed with, Cyke or Logan, to which you answered the former while I preferred the latter.

Right, almost forgot how it started, well we at least agree a common compromise could be reached

Yeah, I just don't agree that Cyclops would be the fastest or the best way to reach it.

They just need to f*ck and get it over with.

Moderator
#33 Posted by ReVamp (22865 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: True. I've been defending that point since before Schism was out. I couldn't care less about the rest.

#34 Posted by BlackArmor (6141 posts) - - Show Bio

@god_spawn: There

s a gutters comic I want to post but can't find it

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