Vertigo Discussion Thread

#351 Posted by jloneblackheart (5499 posts) - - Show Bio

Just read Sweet Tooth #17. Just as I start getting bored with it, it always picks back up awesome again. 

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#352 Posted by Nighthunter (28580 posts) - - Show Bio
@Yumulu said:
" @Nighthunter: This? Yay, Jill Thompson is awesome
"
yup that one :)
 
the art looks awesome AND original
#353 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio
@Nighthunter said:
" @Yumulu said:
" @Nighthunter: This? Yay, Jill Thompson is awesome
"
yup that one :)  the art looks awesome AND original "
didn't Delirium basically have a party already in Death's Door? I haven't read it but I thought she basically threw a party at Death's when Lucifer expelled all the souls from Hell 
 
@jloneblackheart said:
" Just read Sweet Tooth #17. Just as I start getting bored with it, it always picks back up awesome again.  "
what'd you think of #18? I liked it...though I had trouble figuring out who was narrating...the only people who's proper names were used was Wendy and Bobby...so I would have thought that meant it was Gus doing the narrating but he's referred to as The Boy...maybe it's not supposed to matter but it does to me!
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#354 Posted by jloneblackheart (5499 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek the lost I kind of just took it for granted as an unknown outside narrator, like an old Disney movie.
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#355 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio
@jloneblackheart: hmm, I suppose that works...buuuut if it turns out it's somewhat significant in #68, years from now, I'm saying I told you so!!!
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#356 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

So, now that we know Northlanders will be ending next year (and Brian Wood's long and wonderful stay at Vertigo)...how many years does everyone give Vertigo before they pull the plug?

Haven't had a new ongoing in a year and the closest thing to one that has been mentioned for the future is Spaceman which isn't really an ongoing but apparently it's going to be a series of limited series, something like Hellboy or Criminal...this leaves only eight ongoings still in print as of now (DMZ and Northlanders excluded due to their confirmed upcoming conclusions)

These are my predictions on how much life is left in all of them (keep in mind I could be way off):

  • American Vampire (Snyder, unless he changes his mind, only plans to take this to the present...at the current rate of two decades per year, I'd give this three or four more years...doubt it's going to be cancelled before it ends unless sales drop drastically...I mean it's the only ongoing getting hardcovers -and apparently now trades as well)
  • Fables (okay, this book could very easily have another decade or two in it and although I doubt they'd ever cancel it...it might be subsumed by DC in the future once Vertigo dwindles down to almost nothing)
  • Hellblazer (again, another decade or two is possible...if it would outlast Vertigo, I guess that'd prove it's greater then the imprint, having begun before it and continuing after it but it won't likely happen due to the new DC universe...I just want to see Milligan on the book for a long time, at least 300 issues published and John eventually finding a natural death, since DC is using a John knock-off, it's perfectly plausible the real one can find a true death although I'm sure his various parodies and likenesses will continue for many years)
  • House of Mystery (I have to admit I'm kind of surprised this book hasn't been cancelled yet considering it's a DC property, but regardless, this book feels like it's in the climax stage right now...I'd estimate another two years max)
  • iZombie (not sure on this series...I know when he started it Roberson said he had it planned out to #25...I could see another year or two but it doesn't really feel like there's a storyline that'll continue for many years, to me anyway)
  • Scalped (this book definitely feels like it's in the climax stage, however, I have no idea how long it'll be before it ends, tbh, I'm kind of surprised sometimes it hasn't already but I'm loving every new issue -minus 44, that was godawful- and expect the conclusion to be nothing short of gut-wrenchingly perfect)
  • Sweet Tooth (I don't believe this book was ever intended to last that long, another year or two I'd say before a natural conclusion)
  • The Unwritten (there's still a lot of room to be covered, I have no idea what the intention is but I'd kind of like if this book ended at 75 issues like Carey's one and Gross' two previous epics at the Vertigo imprint...however, if they have more then that, I wouldn't object)

Overall though, in five years, I could easily see the imprint having disappeared entirely and at best Fables being brought on to DC, although I could also see Willingham going somewhere else with the property, except that I'm not sure DC would want to let it go. Then again, he may decide to end it in that time, but there's no reason he'd have to.

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#357 Posted by iSpud (7 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost: Hey there. I'm new to comicvine as it's only very recently I have been able to afford/have access to a local comic book store. However, I have been a fan of the Vertigo line for a long time now and had the pleasure of reading 'Preacher' as my first comic series... but I digress. 
 
I wanted to reply as I am worried about the Vertigo lines future. Your post above helped me a lot but I believe that 'Spaceman' will have a preview of the new ongoing Vertigo title if I'm not mistaken. There is still a whole lot more room for ongoing series that will be left unfilled though.
#358 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

@iSpud: Hmm, I had not heard that Spaceman would have a preview of a new series...I would hope if they're having a new series they would already start dropping hints about it and such, I mean Spaceman has been referenced in some way or another for like a year I think and it's only coming out in October. The most recent ongoing, iZombie, appeared over half a year earlier then its first issue in the House of Mystery Halloween Annual #1. The fact that Vertigo isn't trying to push some new series doesn't give me hope there'll be any new ongoing in 2011 (the only other year this has happened was 1997)...and with all the cancellations in 2010, it's very discouraging. Now that "The New 52" has been announced though, it is clearly responsible for the current lack of new content over at Vertigo, they threw out some proposals and ongoing titles for the sake of this relaunch and because they're so busy launching all these new titles, they probably don't care that Vertigo's not getting any. Really frustrating. However, even if Vertigo goes under within a few years, I love re-reading my comics and need to do it more...so on that side of it, there can be positive, at least for me.

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#359 Posted by iSpud (7 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost:   My apologies, the preview of the new ongoing will actually be in issue 1 of 'The Unexpected', also due in October.  
 
" Plus, don't miss a preview of Vertigo's next smash-hit monthly series: a macabre and magical saga of voodoo gods and mortals in the death-soaked streets of New Orleans!" 
 
I got the above exerpt from:  http://www.dccomics.com/vertigo/comics/?cm=20549 
 
The launch of "The New 52" has definitely had a huge effect on Vertigo, I don't know why I didn't think of that. I'm not sure if this is a little far-fetched but the success of the Marvel movies has made DC more aware of the potential for success in superhero movies and a result, have put all of their focus on the superhero line of comics, hence the relaunch. I could be very wrong though. All I hope for is that Vertigo pulls through the next couple of years and is given the opportunity to expand its title count. 
 
Do you own a lot of the Vertigo titles? I've only been able to recently purchase them monthly so I'm trying to track down as many full runs as I can. Titles such as Deadman, Testament, Outlaw Nation, Codename: Knockout, The Un-Men and Wasteland have caught my eye. Could you recommend these titles or any other ones I may be overlooking?
#360 Posted by Nerx (15088 posts) - - Show Bio

Is there any books with a similar feel to 100 Bullets?

#361 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

@Nerx: Scalped is the current noir series, different story but same genre

Spaceman (first issue in October) is by the 100 Bullets creative team (as in like, same colorist, letterer, cover artist, interior artist, writer, editor, etc. as far as I know)

Jonny Double (which I haven't read yet) was a four-issue mini that Azzarello and Risso made before 100 Bullets, it was recently re-released as Vertigo Resurrected: Jonny Double

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#362 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

@iSpud: Hmm, good catch, I do read all the solicits when they come out but just for the general idea, I basically forget what they say immediately thereafter. I just read The Unexpected solicit and summed it up as "Strange Adventures without that f@#king ridiculous Green Lantern banner screwing it all up...bastards" so I think I'm going to enjoy it (The Unexpected that is). But if that's all the promotion of this new title that they won't even give a name, it seems like they are actively hoping it will fail, no? Or maybe they want to try the new technique of a new title popping up unexpectedly on readers instead of the usual hype and preparation that goes on for everything months in advance.

I'm not sure what's the exact reason behind this relaunch but I've kind of always pictured the problem here being that the people in charge at DC aren't businessmen but fanboys that want their own personal DCU. I mean, I don't think the people in charge of the content at a big publisher like Marvel or DC should be making that content as well...someone needs to keep the creators in check. I'd also like to see Vertigo expand...oh, and I just remembered that there actually has been news of a new Vertigo title, Fairest I think it was? Anyways, it's a Fables spin-off so it's really only filling the slot that Jack of Fables left void after going downhill and ending. That's clearly not the title referenced in The Unexpected solicit though and Fables could very well end up being the entire imprint at some point with all it's spin-offs and such.

And yeah, I've got a vast bulk of the Vertigo catalog I'd say, always getting more though. I could recommend (or not) almost any ongoing title (there's less then a dozen I haven't finished and/or started I think...although you ironically mentioned two of them); the minis, one-shots, and OGN's are the area I'm currently working more on reading. Of those specific five though:

  • Deadman: One of those ongoings I haven't read. I think I keep concentrating on the 90's stuff and this one constantly slips my mind. I'd definitely check it out sooner if they ever collected the second half.
  • Testament: I liked this series, it wasn't an "essential" in my opinion but it had its moments and is definitely worth checking out. Didn't like the ending but that's not unusual with creator-owned comics that get cancelled and need to rush to some sort of resolution. I think the problem was that the character's didn't really make me feel anything for them, they were just tools to move the story. It was the stuff with the gods and the parallels between Biblical stories and the present that was interesting. Bonus: Blue Breasts.
  • Outlaw Nation: Another one of those unread ongoings although I read the original short story from Winter's Edge #3 when the series was called The Great Satan. The premise has always intrigued me, Delano has written some of my favorite comics...but he's also written some that I'm not very fond of.
  • Codename: Knockout: This series was really just some senseless fun. Personally, I think "adult" comics should learn from this series...fun and naked ladies bundled together. Kind of reminds me of when Tarot tried to be fun instead of preachy (ugh). I always felt this wasn't typical Vertigo fare but then again as Axel Alonso said, the point of Vertigo is releasing comics of every kind imaginable so you can't really pin down what's Vertigo. I'd only recommend this book if you just want a fun spy book with a hot, sometimes naked, babe and her gay, occasional fourth-wall breaking, sidekick who can't decide if they want to work for G.O.O.D. (her mother's organization) or E.V.I.L. (her father's organization). Although it also had some great covers.
  • The Un-Men: I think the series was cut short too soon, I haven't really decided how I felt about it. I liked the book but it didn't get across that horror feel I wanted from an Un-Men title. It felt more like a book about a bunch of carnies then mutated freaks of nature that were born from the mind of one of the most foul and disgusting beings to ever walk the Earth. A modern day look at The Un-Men, I guess? Although this again was a series with an ending that really disappointed, victim of early cancellation.

Wasteland isn't a Vertigo series, if it were ever collected it could be by Vertigo but it hasn't so far so I haven't really looked into the book...I'm interested in it though. Only so many comics I can read at once though.

Also, I'd like to say that if you want a second opinion on any of these before you check them out, Silkcuts, has been a Vertigo fan longer then I have and has read some stuff I have not so he could probably provide more insight.

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#363 Posted by iSpud (7 posts) - - Show Bio

I second you on those Green Lantern banners. An absolute atrocity and eye-sore, really takes away from the cover art. With regard to the new title popping up from seemingly nowhere, I've never experienced anticipating a new title before. I've only collected trades for the past 3-4 years with whatever money I could get together and bought the single issues of American Vampire just over two weeks ago and devoured them over three days. I am now officially creating my very first pull-list, exciting times. I do however hope that this new mystery title comes out as soon as possible.  
 
Oh yes I have heard of a new Fables spin-off title being announced. Have't read any Fables yet though, far too late to the party I am. I need to start collecting the trades soon, it appears to be quite the epic title. 
 
I hope that the powers that be at DC realise exactly what Vertigo is (and has been) about for all these years. Even as a comics newcomer the Vertigo line stood out to me and it was obvious that they were all about pushing boundaries while at the same time telling cool stories.  
 
Once I get more money together I am going to go on an absolute rampage and purchase all the back catalogue that I can. Thank you very much for the info on those titles I mentioned, I will be checking them out as soon as I get my hands on them. 

#364 Edited by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

Hellblazer Annual #1? and not by Vertigo? WHAT THE F@#K IS THIS SH!T?!

http://dccomics.com/dcu/comics/?cm=20901

I guess this means Vertigo will be losing it's longest-running title? I suspect within a year or two, Fables and it's spin-offs will be all that's left at Vertigo

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#365 Posted by Silkcuts (5272 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost said:

Hellblazer Annual #1? and not by Vertigo? WHAT THE F@#K IS THIS SH!T?!

http://dccomics.com/dcu/comics/?cm=20901

I guess this means Vertigo will be losing it's longest-running title? I suspect within a year or two, Fables and it's spin-offs will be all that's left at Vertigo

You caught this before me.
I really hope this is an error.
We really need to send pete a letter what is up with this?
The DCU has the fake John, why would they move the real one to the DCU when he is drastically older?
I know in Hellblazer Pete is slowly explaining multiple Johns in the main book, but why would they force him to move John.
two John titles, means more sales.  And please tell me they won't renumber HB and reboot it... I will stop supporting DC if they do.
#366 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silkcuts said:

@aztek_the_lost said:

Hellblazer Annual #1? and not by Vertigo? WHAT THE F@#K IS THIS SH!T?!

http://dccomics.com/dcu/comics/?cm=20901

I guess this means Vertigo will be losing it's longest-running title? I suspect within a year or two, Fables and it's spin-offs will be all that's left at Vertigo

You caught this before me. I really hope this is an error. We really need to send pete a letter what is up with this? The DCU has the fake John, why would they move the real one to the DCU when he is drastically older? I know in Hellblazer Pete is slowly explaining multiple Johns in the main book, but why would they force him to move John. two John titles, means more sales. And please tell me they won't renumber HB and reboot it... I will stop supporting DC if they do.

I'm starting to think (hope) it's an error that it's not Vertigo...because I see a few other should-be-Vertigo items listed on the DCU site instead of Vertigo's site...I know that whole website has always been inaccurate at places but really it's the #1 that seems so ridiculous...what about the real Hellblazer Annual #1? I didn't even think that they might reboot the numbering...you think they will? =/ hmm...maybe I will send a letter asking about the #1, surely they couldn't have forgotten the 1st one (especially since they're collecting it in a new edition of Devil You Know in two months)

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#367 Posted by Silkcuts (5272 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost said:

@Silkcuts said:

@aztek_the_lost said:

Hellblazer Annual #1? and not by Vertigo? WHAT THE F@#K IS THIS SH!T?!

http://dccomics.com/dcu/comics/?cm=20901

I guess this means Vertigo will be losing it's longest-running title? I suspect within a year or two, Fables and it's spin-offs will be all that's left at Vertigo

You caught this before me. I really hope this is an error. We really need to send pete a letter what is up with this? The DCU has the fake John, why would they move the real one to the DCU when he is drastically older? I know in Hellblazer Pete is slowly explaining multiple Johns in the main book, but why would they force him to move John. two John titles, means more sales. And please tell me they won't renumber HB and reboot it... I will stop supporting DC if they do.

I'm starting to think (hope) it's an error that it's not Vertigo...because I see a few other should-be-Vertigo items listed on the DCU site instead of Vertigo's site...I know that whole website has always been inaccurate at places but really it's the #1 that seems so ridiculous...what about the real Hellblazer Annual #1? I didn't even think that they might reboot the numbering...you think they will? =/ hmm...maybe I will send a letter asking about the #1, surely they couldn't have forgotten the 1st one (especially since they're collecting it in a new edition of Devil You Know in two months)

Lets do the math.  issue 300 is in 17 months.... a little over one year....  After the 300 mark  can see enough room for Milligan to explain the real world John and how he came back to the world of capes... You know as well as I know that that is a horrible idea, but DC only care about maximizing profit. Hellblazer is not "accessible" since the number is too high and people need numbers to jump in... I know it is sad.... people need to be spoon fed.  I didn't read Hellblazer at #1 I read it at Ennis arc and understood.  So After #300 the HB fans get their milestone and DC has a point in which they can move it....
 
I am really hoping the "#1" is an error as well, and it is very likely they forgot about Delano's annual.  Heck, Ennis' didn't carry the annual trend when he did his Specials... HB Special #1 and Heartland. 
 
I hope for the best, but expect the worst.  With DC pissing on their legacy of Tec Vol. 1, why would they care about any other legacy?
#368 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silkcuts said:

Lets do the math. issue 300 is in 17 months.... a little over one year.... After the 300 mark can see enough room for Milligan to explain the real world John and how he came back to the world of capes... You know as well as I know that that is a horrible idea, but DC only care about maximizing profit. Hellblazer is not "accessible" since the number is too high and people need numbers to jump in... I know it is sad.... people need to be spoon fed. I didn't read Hellblazer at #1 I read it at Ennis arc and understood. So After #300 the HB fans get their milestone and DC has a point in which they can move it.... I am really hoping the "#1" is an error as well, and it is very likely they forgot about Delano's annual. Heck, Ennis' didn't carry the annual trend when he did his Specials... HB Special #1 and Heartland. I hope for the best, but expect the worst. With DC pissing on their legacy of Tec Vol. 1, why would they care about any other legacy?

Ugh, and I just realized that if they would reboot Hellblazer it will be in the DCnU...the more I think about this, the more it sounds plausible and it upsets me...I always thought John deserved an end...I mean I'm content with a character like Lucifer ending without his actual death, I thought his ending was perfect...but John has been living in real time for decades, I just think he deserves to be put to rest naturally and become even more of a milestone in comics and an example of the potential the medium has...I sincerely hope he continues on for many more years, and more great writers after Milligan...maybe Snyder will take up the mantle one day?

Well, I wouldn't mind if they just made this some sort of other thing like Heartland and gave it its unique name, but calling it Hellblazer Annual #1 just seems like an intended insult...I could understand why making it a #2 would seem odd since there's over two decades but that doesn't mean you should just stop acknowledging the first one exists

Also, I've noticed DC seems to be reprinting Vertigo characters as part of their main publisher...so maybe a lot of Vertigo things are going to retroactively become DC, I see Saga of the Swamp Thing Book 6 is solicited on the DCU site, I hope not though =/

And you're probably right, and these new guys think pissing on legacies is a way of being new and fresh, like wtf is that? You're still telling the same stories, just unnecessarily throwing aside a legacy for the sake of drama.

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#369 Posted by Silkcuts (5272 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost said:

@Silkcuts said:

Lets do the math. issue 300 is in 17 months.... a little over one year.... After the 300 mark can see enough room for Milligan to explain the real world John and how he came back to the world of capes... You know as well as I know that that is a horrible idea, but DC only care about maximizing profit. Hellblazer is not "accessible" since the number is too high and people need numbers to jump in... I know it is sad.... people need to be spoon fed. I didn't read Hellblazer at #1 I read it at Ennis arc and understood. So After #300 the HB fans get their milestone and DC has a point in which they can move it.... I am really hoping the "#1" is an error as well, and it is very likely they forgot about Delano's annual. Heck, Ennis' didn't carry the annual trend when he did his Specials... HB Special #1 and Heartland. I hope for the best, but expect the worst. With DC pissing on their legacy of Tec Vol. 1, why would they care about any other legacy?

Ugh, and I just realized that if they would reboot Hellblazer it will be in the DCnU...the more I think about this, the more it sounds plausible and it upsets me...I always thought John deserved an end...I mean I'm content with a character like Lucifer ending without his actual death, I thought his ending was perfect...but John has been living in real time for decades, I just think he deserves to be put to rest naturally and become even more of a milestone in comics and an example of the potential the medium has...I sincerely hope he continues on for many more years, and more great writers after Milligan...maybe Snyder will take up the mantle one day?

Well, I wouldn't mind if they just made this some sort of other thing like Heartland and gave it its unique name, but calling it Hellblazer Annual #1 just seems like an intended insult...I could understand why making it a #2 would seem odd since there's over two decades but that doesn't mean you should just stop acknowledging the first one exists

Also, I've noticed DC seems to be reprinting Vertigo characters as part of their main publisher...so maybe a lot of Vertigo things are going to retroactively become DC, I see Saga of the Swamp Thing Book 6 is solicited on the DCU site, I hope not though =/

And you're probably right, and these new guys think pissing on legacies is a way of being new and fresh, like wtf is that? You're still telling the same stories, just unnecessarily throwing aside a legacy for the sake of drama.

No one would agree more about "Killing" real time John if they don't want Vertigo being Hellblazer.  I would honestly write it in homage to Jenkins' 100th issue concept of the bar scene and the idea that these horror stories were simply bar stories.  So at least JOHN HIMSELF IS TELLING ME HE LIED THE WHOLE TIME! 
 
It is also possible HB will stay Vertigo since the new book two is solicited as Vertigo and book one is too new to change the spine.  I really hope the last Moore hard cover stays "vertigo" just so the spines look good.  Veitch books change it and I won't cry.  It ruins the look on a book shelf if the spines are messed up.
 
Totally understand the annual problem.  I guess that is why it is DC so they can call it a "#1" again.  Since ones apparently are important to sales. So DC is the new Marvel.  Being the new Marvel is why legacy means nothing.
#370 Posted by aztek_the_lost (28224 posts) - - Show Bio

@Silkcuts said:

No one would agree more about "Killing" real time John if they don't want Vertigo being Hellblazer. I would honestly write it in homage to Jenkins' 100th issue concept of the bar scene and the idea that these horror stories were simply bar stories. So at least JOHN HIMSELF IS TELLING ME HE LIED THE WHOLE TIME! It is also possible HB will stay Vertigo since the new book two is solicited as Vertigo and book one is too new to change the spine. I really hope the last Moore hard cover stays "vertigo" just so the spines look good. Veitch books change it and I won't cry. It ruins the look on a book shelf if the spines are messed up. Totally understand the annual problem. I guess that is why it is DC so they can call it a "#1" again. Since ones apparently are important to sales. So DC is the new Marvel. Being the new Marvel is why legacy means nothing.

You mean 120th issue, right? And I actually like that idea...as the only alternative that is...I really don't want Hellblazer to be "retconned" as its ending, I just want it to end naturally. It would be such a huge insult if they did that to Hellblazer I probably would consider cutting all ties with DC (short of buying stuff that doesn't support them, back-issues and out-of-print trades and the like). I think Hellblazer has extended beyond something the current DC has any right to tamper with but maybe I'm just delusional.

You think they'll continue collecting Swamp Thing in hardcover past Moore? I figured they were just doing Moore and that was it...I mean they never finished collecting Veitch in trade, why would they start in hardcover since they probably won't finish it in that format either. But yeah, I hate the idea of them changing imprints for the sake of my shelf too (and just because I support Vertigo so I don't want all my Vertigo books no longer being regarded as such). I'm personally worried if they ever finish collecting Shade it will be under DC and that will piss me off. I know they just want more sales and they want to eliminate the existence of an area of the publisher directed at a different audience but it annoys me that they'd collect these stories that are the essence of Vertigo as the current DC which doesn't represent that at all =/

I personally don't think being a #1 really helps sales much in and of itself but maybe I'm not a typical comic fan. I don't think people just buy things because there #1's, I mean yes the #1 will always sell best but that's because people who bought previous issues will leave ongoing titles and some people will try a #1 because they are interested but I think people are usually informed enough to know if it's actually a good jumping on point or not and who jumps on at an Annual anyways? The Big Two have the wrong priorities and it frustrates me, why can't comics be represented by better businesses?

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#371 Posted by Silkcuts (5272 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost: Yup I meant 120.. shame on me... but I am genius enough to figure out that is the only end they can give us if the younger DCU John is the version they make the primary version.
 
Hellblazer has extended beyond something the current DC, my life and impact on the Vine is a great example of how growing with John is good for your soul.  I hope the gods stop DC if Didiot is still even thinking of stopping Hellblazer.
 
Well Swamp Thing in theory should be collected, Vol. 2 had Morrison and Millar.  With the already success of JLD (since a lot of people are going to get it), I can see Shade completed slowly but surely.
 
The #1s work for Superhero books, not for someone like John Constantine.  I miss Kahn, I think DC was had a better head on its shoulders when she was boss.

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