Tim Drake-Deadliest member of the Bat-Family?

Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

I love Tim Drake. He's tied for my favorite DC character with Hal Jordan and Wally West. And I have one question:Could he be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family? Now, this is my OPINION, but I say yes, he will be. What does that mean? Well, In terms of Bat-Fam deadliness, it goes Bruce-Dick-Jason. Jason beat tim many times as Robin, but he has gotten a lot better. I think right now, he is almost as good as Jason. And for the Damian fans, Tim demolished him in Red Robin #14, as he always held back before. His intelligence exceeds ALL members of the Bat-Fam, including Bruce. Bruce said Tim was smarter than him before. Dick said so as well, also adding that he was a better Robin than Dick, and he will probably be a better Batman too. NOw, Tim is also the most like Bruce. They are the two smartest-the World's Two Greatest Detectives- and use that in their most difficult battles. All members have experienced unspeakable tragedy- but Tim has had the most. His parents were killed when he he was 13-15, which means he bonded with them more than all the other members. His two best-friends(Superboy and Kid Flash), his girlfriend(Spoiler), a love interest(The Old Lynx), Bruce, Darla Aquista, and some other people. His skill with the Bo Staff is unrivaled, as he is the best Stick Fighter on Earth. He is also very agile, of course, not as agile as Dick or Jason, but quite agile. He is very Tech-Savvy, and his skill is comparable with that of Oracle's. He fought and gained the upper hand in a fight with Dick as well. Ra's Al Ghul now believes Tim is his worthy successor, not Bruce, and called him Detective. He outsmarted Ra's, took on the Russian Unternet, defeated the Council of Spiders while protecting Tam, is practically unstoppable if he has prep before a battle, outsmarted Lady Shiva, created a systematic way of stopping all criminals with The Hit List, and has done all this... at the age of 17. I believe, when Tim is older, he will be the greatest Martial Artist, Detective (He already is), Hacker, and Batman. He will be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family.

#1 Posted by iLLituracy (13537 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm not sure about him becoming the greatest martial artist, but Tim is formidable enough to be a significant threat now and a imminent threat in the future, IMO.  
 
This also should be in the Tim Drake board, not off-topic.

#2 Posted by KEROGA (984 posts) - - Show Bio

he totally has potential,he could be an awesome bad guy

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#3 Posted by Superguy0009e (2265 posts) - - Show Bio

Tim Drake (after Dick) is the next Batman, if he takes it up, he will be the best Batman ever, he is that talented

#4 Posted by BlackArmor (6136 posts) - - Show Bio

1 correction Cass Cain comes before Dick and Jason on the Baat fighting scale, but other than that i'm in complete agreement

#5 Posted by RainEffect (3240 posts) - - Show Bio

Having written my own blog on why I love Tim Drake, I actually like the idea of being to comment on someone else's. 
 
Tim is Batman as a teenager. Sure, he might not have the sheer martial arts prowess that Cassandra or Dick has, but he's got two of the most pivotal aspects of Bruce Wayne down - the detective ability and the emotionally detached persona. No one else can detach themselves quite like Tim can (aside from Bruce, obviously) and that is where Tim is set apart from the rest of the Bat family. Damien is a little twat and doesn't fall into the same league as the big three (Dick, Jason and Tim) so I'm not including him. Dick's got too much heart to be Batman, in my opinion. He wasn't never meant to be Batman, he was always meant to be his own man. Jason would slander the name of Batman by being a murderous psycho, plus his intellect is not on the same level as Tim's. That leaves Tim. As Bruce said in Hush - "Tim wants to be the World's Greatest Detective, and from what I've seen, he will be someday". 
 
"You are a very dangerous man, Timothy." - Ra's al Ghul
 
Oh yeah, I HATE the Steph/Tim relationship. I just don't think they were meant to be. Lynx and Red Robin, on the other hand, is awesome.

#6 Posted by Duo_forbidden (1161 posts) - - Show Bio

When it comes to fighting, I still think he's the second weakest (Damian<Tim<Jason<Dick<Cassandra<Bruce). But when it comes to intelligence, he can be as scary as Bruce. The last issue of Red Robin pretty much proved that he can be capable of becoming a villain or the next Batman if he decided to be. 

#7 Posted by BlackArmor (6136 posts) - - Show Bio

@RainEffect: Isn't it kind of weird that you hate the Bruce Selina (I agree by the way) relationship but you like the Tim Lynx relationship when Lynx is described as being Tim's catwoman? not trying to start a fight or anything just find it knid of wierd

#8 Posted by Superguy0009e (2265 posts) - - Show Bio

@RainEffect: u do got to give it to damien though, he has the skillz

#9 Posted by 218Comics (191 posts) - - Show Bio

Batman was always the deadliest member of the Bat Family... until Damien came along.

#10 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

I think if Tim tries hard enough, his Martial Arts skills can climb astronomically. Like I said, his skills with the Bo Staff are pretty insane. And, in one of the last few issues of Robin, Tim fought Cassandra after being worn down by a fight with 20+ ninjas, and although the fight was never resolved, it was looking like a stalemate. Add the worn down factor, and his prowess as Red Robin, the order would go Bruce-Dick-Tim-Cass. And, in Red Robin #16 or 17, Tim makes Cass look kind of foolish. Tim's fighting skills increase with his intelligence, as his main form of fighting is deducing weak points and HOW to fight particular enemies with data and statistics on them. So when Tim's intelligence gets him to the point where he's the smartest, couldn't it be logical to assume he'll be the deadliest fighter? Just a thought. Let me know what you guys think on the Fighting=Intelligence for Tim topic.

#11 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@RainEffect: Your blog post inspired mine. :)

#12 Posted by entropy_aegis (15103 posts) - - Show Bio

@WhiteLightning said:

I love Tim Drake. He's tied for my favorite DC character with Hal Jordan and Wally West. And I have one question:Could he be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family? Now, this is my OPINION, but I say yes, he will be. What does that mean? Well, In terms of Bat-Fam deadliness, it goes Bruce-Dick-Jason. Jason beat tim many times as Robin, but he has gotten a lot better. I think right now, he is almost as good as Jason. And for the Damian fans, Tim demolished him in Red Robin #14, as he always held back before. His intelligence exceeds ALL members of the Bat-Fam, including Bruce. Bruce said Tim was smarter than him before. Dick said so as well, also adding that he was a better Robin than Dick, and he will probably be a better Batman too. NOw, Tim is also the most like Bruce. They are the two smartest-the World's Two Greatest Detectives- and use that in their most difficult battles. All members have experienced unspeakable tragedy- but Tim has had the most. His parents were killed when he he was 13-15, which means he bonded with them more than all the other members. His two best-friends(Superboy and Kid Flash), his girlfriend(Spoiler), a love interest(The Old Lynx), Bruce, Darla Aquista, and some other people. His skill with the Bo Staff is unrivaled, as he is the best Stick Fighter on Earth. He is also very agile, of course, not as agile as Dick or Jason, but quite agile. He is very Tech-Savvy, and his skill is comparable with that of Oracle's. He fought and gained the upper hand in a fight with Dick as well. Ra's Al Ghul now believes Tim is his worthy successor, not Bruce, and called him Detective. He outsmarted Ra's, took on the Russian Unternet, defeated the Council of Spiders while protecting Tam, is practically unstoppable if he has prep before a battle, outsmarted Lady Shiva, created a systematic way of stopping all criminals with The Hit List, and has done all this... at the age of 17. I believe, when Tim is older, he will be the greatest Martial Artist, Detective (He already is), Hacker, and Batman. He will be the deadliest member of the Bat-Family.

I have adressed Ra's and Shiva as well as Bruce's comment.

If statements mattered then i guess Bane is the second most dangerous man on Earth and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.

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#13 Posted by RainEffect (3240 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis said:

@WhiteLightning said:

 and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.
Shhhh! You might bring Ezneru back!
#14 Posted by entropy_aegis (15103 posts) - - Show Bio

@RainEffect said:

@entropy_aegis said:

@WhiteLightning said:

and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.
Shhhh! You might bring Ezneru back!

LOL

Online
#15 Posted by Saren (25578 posts) - - Show Bio

Alfred has always been numero uno in the Wayne household. Always will be.

Moderator
#16 Posted by FadeToBlackBolt (23334 posts) - - Show Bio

No, Tim lacks Bruce's paranoia and ridiculous levels of forethought, which is crucial to being Batman.  
 
But even then, Tim will never be as good a Batman as Bruce Wayne, because he lacks Bruce's tragedy. Yes, Tim has had a tragic life, but he himself is not tragic. Bruce Wayne is Batman, he's the most dangerous member of the Bat-family, and he always will be. Offhand conjecture based on a few lines in a Robin solo series won't change that. 

#17 Posted by Jonny_Anonymous (32993 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis said:

@RainEffect said:

@entropy_aegis said:

@WhiteLightning said:

and Sentry has the power of a billion suns.
Shhhh! You might bring Ezneru back!

LOL

Did he get banned?

@RainEffect said:

Having written my own blog on why I love Tim Drake, I actually like the idea of being to comment on someone else's.

Tim is Batman as a teenager. Sure, he might not have the sheer martial arts prowess that Cassandra or Dick has, but he's got two of the most pivotal aspects of Bruce Wayne down - the detective ability and the emotionally detached persona. No one else can detach themselves quite like Tim can (aside from Bruce, obviously) and that is where Tim is set apart from the rest of the Bat family. Damien is a little twat and doesn't fall into the same league as the big three (Dick, Jason and Tim) so I'm not including him. Dick's got too much heart to be Batman, in my opinion. He wasn't never meant to be Batman, he was always meant to be his own man. Jason would slander the name of Batman by being a murderous psycho, plus his intellect is not on the same level as Tim's. That leaves Tim. As Bruce said in Hush - "Tim wants to be the World's Greatest Detective, and from what I've seen, he will be someday". "You are a very dangerous man, Timothy." - Ra's al Ghul Oh yeah, I HATE the Steph/Tim relationship. I just don't think they were meant to be. Lynx and Red Robin, on the other hand, is awesome.

I agree with every thing you say

#18 Posted by yumyumbubblegum (618 posts) - - Show Bio

Tim Drake: potential to mentally surpass Bruce

Damian Wayne: potential at becoming a better martial artist than Bruce

Dick Grayson: potential to be Bruce

Jason Todd: got replaced by Tim as Robin and Damian as the Bat family's psychopath black sheep. Of no further use in assigning a bat emblem on his chest.

Bruce Wayne: got lazy with contraceptives. Definitive Batman.

#19 Posted by BlackArmor (6136 posts) - - Show Bio

FTBB makes a good point from a literary perspective Tim isn't a tragic hero so much as a hero with a tragic past. It felt like in RR#25 they took steps to change that by having Tam point out Tim's tragic flaw something he always lacked and something that you need to technically be a tragic hero but even then Tim's tragic flaw isn't as good as Bruces and it may not even still stand post reboot. Looking at tragic flaws is really intresting with the bat family and Tim's is the least engaing of the three i've seen

Bruce: Obsession

Dick: Optomism(something along those lines it's what james gordon jr manipulated at the end of detective comics)

Tim: his plans work but hurt his friends......something like that

Jason and Damian have one to but i don't know enough about their charecters to really guess

#20 Posted by fodigg (6146 posts) - - Show Bio

I love Tim Drake, he's my favorite of the Bat-Kicks and right up there with my love for Bruce. That's why this type of thinking "he's the best at everything" worries me. If he's the best at everything then he's not really distinct anymore. That's why I don't mind it when writers downplay his combat abilities in favor of his strategic/deductive abilities. I think that's more definitive Tim than playing him up as a Lady Shiva-trained martial artist.

Ultimately, any member of the Bat-Family could defeat any other member in the right fight depending on the needs of the story. Hence why we have Babs able to rough up ex-Batman Dick Grayson over in Batgirl. Just assume that they're all in the same "tier" of martial abilities (except maybe Cassandra being one tier above, although she has her own limitations and possibly doesn't exist anymore) and that should be enough.

#21 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@FadeToBlackBolt: Ummm.... Read Red Robin #26 and your comment of his forethought will change. Read Red Robin: The Hit List and your comment on paranoia will change.

#22 Posted by luckydomino1 (491 posts) - - Show Bio

this is really laughable

#23 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@luckydomino1: Why? I'm expressing my OPINION aren't I? God, people are real dic*s on the Internet sometimes.

#24 Posted by The Stegman (23813 posts) - - Show Bio

no...as of now, i say he's the least deadliest, i think Bruce,  Dick, Cass and Jason have much more fighting ability, i see Damien over shadowing him very soon, the only one i see Tim being better than, is Steph

#25 Posted by BlackArmor (6136 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Stegman: also from what i'v seen barbra but he really solidly beat damian so unless they skip at least 2 years worth of training damian won't even be a challenge any time soon

#26 Posted by KingofMadCows (345 posts) - - Show Bio

Yes, Tim has a long bright future as Joker Jr.

#27 Posted by Pokeysteve (8235 posts) - - Show Bio

Tim is definitely awesome but calling him the "deadliest" member of the Bat Family isn't right. Kind of like calling Sea Turtles the deadliest marine creature. Tim doesn't kill people.

Has DC done any future stories where Tim is Batman?

#28 Posted by The Stegman (23813 posts) - - Show Bio
@BlackArmor: meh i don't wanna count Babs yet...i say pre 52 babs could beat him (when she wasn't in the chair obviously) but the new one doesn't have enough showings yet besides that lil sparring session with Nightwing. And i think Damien has the potential to beat Tim in the future
#29 Posted by BlackArmor (6136 posts) - - Show Bio

@Pokeysteve: yes in Titans of Tommorow he used the gun that killed Bruces parents to kill all the villans in Gotham the story opens with him shooting Dula Dent in the face, When they redid Titans of Tommorow Tim was potrayed as a the same corrupt Batman except this time he basically lead Justice League Unlimmited , and in Red Robin Tim as Batman was shown as a possible future but not elaborated on for more than a panel, intrestingly enough his bat suit resembled the Batman Beynond suit. DC hasn't really done any otherworld books potraying Tim as Batman but i hope they will

#30 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@Pokeysteve: 1.) Ya, he was Batman and very DEADLY.

2.) I never said he was the deadliest, of course he isn.t,,, now. I'm talking in the future, when he's at his prime.

3.) I never said he will, but if he did (hypothetically, of course) he would be, inthe future.

#31 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Stegman: I would have to disagree with you on that, given Tim's enormous talent, but it's your opinion, and I'm not anyone to say you're wrong, so...

#32 Posted by BlackArmor (6136 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Stegman: Tim's my favorite Robin but i definetly expect Damian to be able to beat him in the distant future but no time soon and i'm not familair with either pre wheel chair Babs or current her so i don't know about before but from what i saw in number 1 she seemes way to offbalance to really beat anyone from the bat family but i stopped reading after number 1 so i don't know how she faired against Dick

#33 Posted by The Stegman (23813 posts) - - Show Bio
@WhiteLightning: meh, i just see him as more of a detective than fighter, although he is a very very good fighter
#34 Posted by Pokeysteve (8235 posts) - - Show Bio

@BlackArmor: Thank you for the info.

@WhiteLightning said:

@Pokeysteve: 1.) Ya, he was Batman and very DEADLY.

2.) I never said he was the deadliest, of course he isn.t,,, now. I'm talking in the future, when he's at his prime.

3.) I never said he will, but if he did (hypothetically, of course) he would be, inthe future.

I'm focused on the word itself. Deadliest. The word implies he kills people. Punisher is deadly while Spider-Man is not. I'm just nit picking English and don't disagree with your post. Someday Tim will be a major Bad Ass. I hope he has better people skills than Bruce haha.

#35 Posted by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Stegman: I do too, but Tim's fighting skills have been escalating enormously since he became Red Robin. And am I the only one who was enraged when Tim lost his Robin role, but now likes him more as Red Robin?

@ Pokeysteve He will definitely be a MAJOR BAD ASS, and I hope he bests everyone, not only Bruce.

#36 Posted by The Stegman (23813 posts) - - Show Bio
@WhiteLightning: oh no, Tim's my personal favorite of all the Robins, i think he's the funniest,the best detective, and the most qualified to one day become Batman...just not the evil future Tim Batman....or the Joker for that matter
#37 Posted by luckydomino1 (491 posts) - - Show Bio

let me finish kanye west and calm down you do know these are fictinal characters right he may be the smartest but hes got a long way if he wants to be the strongest

#38 Edited by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Stegman: Uggghhh... If I hear anyone say Joker Jr one more time, I'm gonna go around and burn every copy of Batman Beyond Return of the Joker I can find!

#39 Edited by WhiteLightning (39 posts) - - Show Bio

@luckydomino1 One, it's my opinion, you can't say anyone's opinion is wrong unless you have factual evidence to support your contradiction, which you can't, because I'm talking about when he reaches his prime, not NOW, so any evidence you have is in the present, and can't be used in representation of prediction or advancement, because I never once said he's the strongest now, I said if he continues to escalate like this, I BELIEVE he WILL be. And two, yes, they are fictional characters, but why make characters and stories unless they mean something to you and hold a special place in your heart, because Tim got me into comics, and I'm grateful for the opportunity he (meaning the people who write him) gave me to be able to immerse in a culture of art and literature where the IMPOSSIBLE means POSSIBLE, so Tim holds a very special place in my hypothetical comic book heart, and I don't find it laughable at all. And finally, I HATE Kanye West, he's an arrogant asshole douchebag, and you saying my blog is laughable is being way more of douche bag than me snapping back in defense of my article.

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