Thors fighting speed.

#1 Edited by Skunkstein (591 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor is a beast, no doubt. He is legit. But i started wondering these couple of days, since i read a thread about his speed feats... and apparantly he is very slow, looking solely on his speed in battle, well at least compared to his strenght and durability, people like Spider-Man and Wolverine have been stated to have better speed than Thor.

Here are some feats of Thors ''speed'':

Doesnt this SEVERLY put him down compared to people who react at nanoseconds? I mean the age old debate between who wins Thor or Superman... i always had my money on Thor due to his magic, but i see no way of Superman not speed blitzing him. What help does strength have? If you have no way of hitting your enemy.

Im actually a little sad, if his speed is really this low, in my heart, Thor just fell a looong way down on my power tree.

#2 Posted by TheSwordsman (1954 posts) - - Show Bio
#3 Edited by Skunkstein (591 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good scans, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

#4 Posted by TheSwordsman (1954 posts) - - Show Bio

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

#5 Posted by Skunkstein (591 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

Yeah, i know what you mean, but if Thor really should be one of Marvels highest tier characters, he really should have speed as well, now it doesnt make sense at all that he is seen as one if not the strongest Marvel hero.

#6 Posted by SC (13299 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor isn't really objectively fast, he is relatively fast, as in he is a fictional character. As in because he is fictional, writers will consider many more other details and factors than Thor's speed when writing the character because its not really a defining aspect of the character. So when Thor fights Wolverine, and Silver Surfer and Gladiator and Superman and Juggernaut and Hulk he will keep up with all of them about the same. Which would probably be really frustrating for anyone trying to ignore these characters are fictional and looking at measuring or quantifying this characters objective speeds from actions or reactions but thats just how it goes. Not just that but writers disagree with each other on aspects of the character as well all the time. To look at it another way, if Thor was created by his creator to be similar if not superior to Superman, if Superman was substantially faster then Thor's other traits would rise as a consequence. Except what if a writer didn't want Thor to be stronger than Superman and so wrote Superman as strong or stronger? Then Superman's speed would be sacrificed to better represent the competitiveness between the characters. Then thats just one writers potential stance.

So in this sense comics is a lot like wrestling instead of say sports. Its fixed sometimes for the entertainment purpose rather than accurate factual observations. Thor is in that sense a wrestler who feuds with a lot of slower wrestlers that are weaker and less durable than him, so there speed is a way for entertainment to be had in interactions, or to compensate for other differences, just like a wrestler like the Silver Surfer who is usually in space zipping around being super ultra fast, when he does have a feud with Thor competes with Thor instead of outmatching him in speed, because Thor was created (or pushed) to be his superior (and its also why Silver Surfer's strength level has risen dramatically over time) - Superman is like in a different Wrestling Business. Pushed a lot more than Thor and also as far as speed, defined by speed a lot more. Though if WWE Thor ever went over to WCW to fight Superman then the writers and large majority of fans probably won't care about objective speed feats and focus on entertainment (and more of a competitive feel) then again also depends on the writer.

Moderator
#7 Posted by TheSwordsman (1954 posts) - - Show Bio

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

Yeah, i know what you mean, but if Thor really should be one of Marvels highest tier characters, he really should have speed as well, now it doesnt make sense at all that he is seen as one if not the strongest Marvel hero.

I hear ya. He is still one of the strongest and one of the most powerful Marvel heroes even without his supers-peed though, just not one of the fastest like Superman is in DC. Mjolnir still makes him a top tier character just as Silver Surfers abilities do even though he does not have super-speed per se (I am sure he could amp it with cosmic energy though). To me Thor having super-speed (as opposed to travel speed) wouldn't really make sense.

#8 Posted by Fifthchild (623 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

Thor has never had traditional superspeed. I'm not sure why the idea that he did became so prevalent, probably because certain fans felt he needed it to compete on the Battle forum or whatever. Still, speed is massively overrated on the Battle forum of this site in terms of how much of an impact it has in Battles.

Thor's probably not quite that slow - people like Wolverine and Batman are usually shown faster than bricks and superstrong character. Still as a character his "x-factor" has alwys been the hammer. Whereas for Superman it was strength and speed, for the Hulk it was the ability to get stronger and tougher as a fight went on and for the Surfer it was a very vaguely defined powerset ("the power cosmic!!!") - from day one Mjolnir is what made Thor special.

#9 Posted by TheSwordsman (1954 posts) - - Show Bio

@Fifthchild said:

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

Thor has never had traditional superspeed. I'm not sure why the idea that he did became so prevalent, probably because certain fans felt he needed it to compete on the Battle forum or whatever. Still, speed is massively overrated on the Battle forum of this site in terms of how much of an impact it has in Battles.

Thor's probably not quite that slow - people like Wolverine and Batman are usually shown faster than bricks and superstrong character. Still as a character his "x-factor" has alwys been the hammer. Whereas for Superman it was strength and speed, for the Hulk it was the ability to get stronger and tougher as a fight went on and for the Surfer it was a very vaguely defined powerset ("the power cosmic!!!") - from day one Mjolnir is what made Thor special.

Yes, I know Thor has never had superspeed. Some people erroneously equated his travel speed with his combat speed.

Obviously Thor is quite that slow i.e. slower than Wolverine, as he stated it in canon. Not only are Wolverine and Batman shown to be faster than most bricks and super-strong characters they actually are faster.

I am not at all sure why you are stating so many obvious facts and simply reiterating things I have already posted as seen below. Your post to me was wholly unnecessary. No need to reply as the conversation will surely become circular, I simply want to bring these issues to your attention to avoid further unnecessary posts.

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

Yeah, i know what you mean, but if Thor really should be one of Marvels highest tier characters, he really should have speed as well, now it doesnt make sense at all that he is seen as one if not the strongest Marvel hero.

I hear ya. He is still one of the strongest and one of the most powerful Marvel heroes even without his supers-peed though, just not one of the fastest like Superman is in DC. Mjolnir still makes him a top tier character just as Silver Surfers abilities do even though he does not have super-speed per se (I am sure he could amp it with cosmic energy though). To me Thor having super-speed (as opposed to travel speed) wouldn't really make sense.

#10 Posted by Fifthchild (623 posts) - - Show Bio

@TheSwordsman said:

@Fifthchild said:

@TheSwordsman said:

@Skunkstein said:

@TheSwordsman: Nice.. good feats, they dont make me more hopeful though, its to bad.. he should have the whole package, speed, strength, durability. He seems extremly handicapped now.

Yep. My point in posting them is to Highlight the fact that Thor does not have great combat speed and is not superhuman where said combat speed is concerned. I kind of like the fact that he does not have super speed as it makes him more interesting IMO. I know what you mean about handicapped as far as forum battle "speed-blitz" arguments though.

Thor has never had traditional superspeed. I'm not sure why the idea that he did became so prevalent, probably because certain fans felt he needed it to compete on the Battle forum or whatever. Still, speed is massively overrated on the Battle forum of this site in terms of how much of an impact it has in Battles.

Thor's probably not quite that slow - people like Wolverine and Batman are usually shown faster than bricks and superstrong character. Still as a character his "x-factor" has alwys been the hammer. Whereas for Superman it was strength and speed, for the Hulk it was the ability to get stronger and tougher as a fight went on and for the Surfer it was a very vaguely defined powerset ("the power cosmic!!!") - from day one Mjolnir is what made Thor special.

Yes, I know Thor has never had superspeed. Some people erroneously equated his travel speed with his combat speed.

Obviously Thor is quite that slow i.e. slower than Wolverine, as he stated it in canon.

A lot of absolutely conrtadictory things have been stated ans shown "in canon". Thor isnt a real person and we arent watching a documnetary of his life so just because one portrayal shows one thing doesnt mean its the final word on Thor's speed or anything else.

Not only are Wolverine and Batman shown to be faster than most bricks and super-strong characters they actually are faster.

I am not at all sure why you are stating so many obvious facts and simply reiterating things I have already posted as seen below. Your post to me was wholly unnecessary.

Lol sorry to waste your precious time with all these obvious facts you already knew.

I seems you are on top of things so I'll try to stay out of your way.

No need to reply as the conversation will surely become circular, I simply want to bring these issues to your attention to avoid further unnecessary posts.

Indeed! Apologies again for sharing my opinion. It wont happen again.

#11 Posted by Pyrogram (41246 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor is pretty slow in that terms, but when need be he can travel FTL and just blitz somebody, like he did vs galactus a couple of times, Or just smash their face in.

#12 Posted by Selinaky (677 posts) - - Show Bio

I think Thor's reaction time is faster than an average person, but he's not especially fast. I guess he can't have super speed anyway, that'd make him insanely powerful - he has no other obvious weakness. He can already travel extremely fast with Mjolnir.

#13 Posted by jeanroygrant (20191 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor was not meant to be a fast character. He's slow on the ground. but fast in the sky.

#14 Edited by ThePhoenX (119 posts) - - Show Bio

I'm okay about the fact Thor is definitely not a speedster. But why the hell some people think he's fast though?

Mayhap because of this :

or that :

And now, do you still think he's not fast?

#15 Posted by CH1C4N0444 (32 posts) - - Show Bio

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Thor%20Stats/ThorSuperspeed08144.jpg

Meh, microseconds isn't bad.

#16 Posted by Edm28 (38 posts) - - Show Bio

Yeah combat superspeed is not thor great strenght but he has some scans who show his speed.And i would like one day Marvel show Thor with a real combat superspeed.

#17 Posted by boostergold321 (301 posts) - - Show Bio
While character talk can be cheap, Thor's speed has always been astonishing to his opponents. The original Black Knight shoots bolas from his lance that are literally surrounding Thor, but because of his speed, Thor knocks the lance away and evades capture. Black Knight exclaims, "I've never seen such speed... such power!!" From Avengers #6:


Here, Hela only has to touch Thor in order to ensnare his soul in 1v1 combat, but is unable to do so because of his speed, "His speed, his anger, are beyond comprehension!" From Thor #354:




Here, while fending off two Herald-level foes, Adam Warlock likens his ability to catch his staff mid-swing and his combat speed to that of lightning, "He moves like the lightning he commands, much quicker than I remember." From Infinity Watch #23:

But he has more than just subjectations (no matter how reliable the speaker). What everyone really cares about are the more objective and reliable speed feats. One reliable type of speed feat is where the character moves so fast that they become a blur of motion or move too fast to be seen. Here, Thor fights Heimdall and swings his hammer down on him at speeds "moving too swiftly for the eye to follow," even too fast for Heimdall in Journey Into Mystery #125:

Likewise here, Thor digs a trench in a blur of motion that is "almost too fast for the human eye to follow." From Marvel Team-Up #26:


And here, while helping rebuild Asgard, Thor hammers down repeatedly on a pillar and "becomes a blur of motion" in Thor #267:


Thor's combat reflex speed feats are impressive in their own right. Here, Thor reacts to a knife being swung down only inches from his face with a mighty heave in Thor #218:

Thor reacts and swats away arrows that are only a few feet away from hitting him from behind in Thor vol. 2 #27:


Here, Thor is about to have his face smashed by a cursed Mjolnir which is zooming back to him, but he moves swiftly enough on reaction to dodge it in Thor vol. 2 #27:


Thor reacts to Wrecker swinging his mystic crowbar onto Thor's head from behind. Literally only inches away, Thor moves so swiftly once again, he snatches the crowbar with his hand in Thor vol. 2 #29:


And it looks like current Thor hasn't lost that bare-handed touch as he catches Bor's axe inches from his face in Thor #600:


He's also fended off an ambush by Wolverine who was right on top of him in Wolverine vs Thor #2:

Another common way to measure those is to see how well Thor does against speedsters. Here, Thor builds a trench around crazed citizens and Avengers, including a zooming Quicksilver in Avengers #98:


Here, Thor punks the Newman speedster, Juvan, who was created by the High Evolutionary, using nothing but his bare hands in Thor #447:


Here, Thor catches another High Evolutionary creation who possesses superspeed, the godling, Zefra in Thor #475:

And Thor has punked the superspeedster, Hermes, the literal Greek God of Speed, not just once, but twice in Avengers #281 and Thor vol. 2 #27:



But even superspeedsters can job and it's difficult to quantify exactly how fast they are going in each instance. But Thor does have directly measurable superspeed feats. Here, he literally snatches a fired tank shell out of mid-air with his bare hand in Journey Into Mystery #93:

And similarly snatches a fired missile with his bare hand in Marvel Team-Up #148:


Here, we see Thor flying outside a window and when Jane Foster gets his attention, Thor manages to intercept Cobra's poison dart within a split-second. The dart is fired before he even is inside the room, just to give you the proper frame of reference to understand the speed and reflexes necessary in Journey Into Mystery #98:


Here, in the space of one and one-fifth seconds, Thor dives out of the sky, smashes Mjolnir down and causes a shockwave to divert a runaway truck from killing a young boy ACROSS the city in Journey Into Mystery #108:


Here, Thor's able to swat away a torrent of flying bricks t to be half a building, not allowing any of them to pass through in the space ofmilliseconds. To give you a reference as to how fast he's swinging his arms back and forth, check out panels three and four. Notice how far a speedblitzing Gladiator advances between Thor's swings! From Thor vol. 2 #34:

Here, in the space of micro-seconds before a zooming cursed Mjolnir will strike Thor from behind, Thor lays a haymaker onto an Enchanter and spins around in time to snatch Mjolnir in mid-air, from Thor#144:


Now we all know Thor has stopped bullets and energy beams by spinning Mjolnir around. And it's been argued that he has to do that because he's not fast enough to block them traditionally with Mjolnir or bat them away. After all, he'd require faster than bullet ("FTB") and faster than light ("FTL") combat speed reflexes to do so. However, these next scans should dispel ANY doubt whether he does possess FTB or FTL combat speed reflexes since he deflects bullets and energy blasts by moving or swinging Mjolnir once rather than by spinning Mjolnir. Here, with FTB speed, he deflects two bullets with a single swing way back in Journey Into Mystery #100:


Here, he blocks a single bullet with the head of Mjolnir before whirling it to create a field in Thor #246:


As for FTL reactions that can be measured in nanoseconds (light travels one foot per nanosecond), he's swung and swatted away Blastaar's energy blasts in Thor #270:

Far from a one-off FTL feat, he does the same to Mole Man's energy blaster shot in Marvel Two-In-One #96:
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/...wo-In-One96.jpg

Here, Enchantress shoots a blast at Captain America and Thor reacts with FTL speed to cut off the energy blast in mid-flight, from Marvel Comics Presents #44:
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/...eed17bMCP44.jpg

Phoenix shoots a telepathic blast at a groggy Thor at the moment Thor's arms are at his side. AFTER the shot is fired and already traveling at him, Thor raises his arms and reflects it back with Mjolnir. Telepathy being instantaneous traditionally (as noted in the narration), we can assume for the sake of argument that it was only traveling at light-speed, making this another FTL feat, from Excalibur#428:



In terms of flight speed, he's flown at least three times the speed of light, from Thor #185:


He bats away a possessed Iron Man's repulsor rays in Avengers vol. 3 #3:

And again bats away ray blasts in a training session in Avengers vol. 3 #23:


Punking Quicksilver again In Mighty avengers vol #34:





#18 Edited by boostergold321 (301 posts) - - Show Bio

How does Superman have a speed advantage? Can someone answer that honestly? Besides magic, what advantage or disadvantages are there really???

Both characters have been shown with microsecond and nanosecond reaction time!!

Both characters can move at supersonic speeds.

Both characters, on rare occassion, move at the speed of light and beyond!

Both characters have shown arstronomical feats of power!

Anyone who tries to puts one over the other when it comes to personal abilities is just bein biased, wanting to favor one characters over another despite that the facts tell them the opposite!

Both characters depend on the circumstance of story. These guys have people from the real world pulling their strings. They're called WRITERS!!

Both have missed the mark against things that have been shown within their ability to handle!

Superman looks like Stupid-man every so often against the lame villains of DC!

Thor gets made to look like the god of blunder instead of thunder from time to time as well with low-tiers of Marvel!

It's called jobbing. The Job is doing less than what your expected to do when it comes to your superpowers. Thor and Superman's power have to take a dive sometimes for the sake of the story!

When it happens, people, in state of shock ask, "where did the characters' speed/other powers go?"

The answer: It was put on the back-burner awaiting the writers permission to be used, that's where.

Does that make them chumps all of sudden? Should we ignore the level of Super-ness that they are known for? No! We should simply realize that writers don't let the characters perform to the best of their abilities 100 percent of the time because if they did, then most of the time, there would be no story interesting enough to read.

#19 Posted by Malevolent1 (1072 posts) - - Show Bio

@boostergold321: Outstanding post. Nice scans that give conclusive proof that Thor is not a slow poke.

#20 Posted by Malevolent1 (1072 posts) - - Show Bio

@Skunkstein: I feel your pain. Thor is right up there with Superman in every way...except, as you noted, the speed department. I've always considered Thor super fast just not on the level of the typical DC bricks with near light speed feats.

#21 Posted by Pyrogram (41246 posts) - - Show Bio

@boostergold321: Amazing post

#22 Edited by The_Titan_Lord (6855 posts) - - Show Bio

Nice

#23 Posted by phisigmatau (529 posts) - - Show Bio

How does Superman have a speed advantage? Can someone answer that honestly? Besides magic, what advantage or disadvantages are there really???

Both characters have been shown with microsecond and nanosecond reaction time!!

Both characters can move at supersonic speeds.

Both characters, on rare occassion, move at the speed of light and beyond!

Both characters have shown arstronomical feats of power!

Anyone who tries to puts one over the other when it comes to personal abilities is just bein biased, wanting to favor one characters over another despite that the facts tell them the opposite!

Both characters depend on the circumstance of story. These guys have people from the real world pulling their strings. They're called WRITERS!!

Both have missed the mark against things that have been shown within their ability to handle!

Superman looks like Stupid-man every so often against the lame villains of DC!

Thor gets made to look like the god of blunder instead of thunder from time to time as well with low-tiers of Marvel!

It's called jobbing. The Job is doing less than what your expected to do when it comes to your superpowers. Thor and Superman's power have to take a dive sometimes for the sake of the story!

When it happens, people, in state of shock ask, "where did the characters' speed/other powers go?"

The answer: It was put on the back-burner awaiting the writers permission to be used, that's where.

Does that make them chumps all of sudden? Should we ignore the level of Super-ness that they are known for? No! We should simply realize that writers don't let the characters perform to the best of their abilities 100 percent of the time because if they did, then most of the time, there would be no story interesting enough to read.

awesome and thank you @thephoenx.. awesome post

#25 Posted by dum529001 (1654 posts) - - Show Bio

How does Superman have a speed advantage? Can someone answer that honestly? Besides magic, what advantage or disadvantages are there really???

Both characters have been shown with microsecond and nanosecond reaction time!!

Both characters can move at supersonic speeds.

Both characters, on rare occassion, move at the speed of light and beyond!

Both characters have shown arstronomical feats of power!

Anyone who tries to puts one over the other when it comes to personal abilities is just bein biased, wanting to favor one characters over another despite that the facts tell them the opposite!

Both characters depend on the circumstance of story. These guys have people from the real world pulling their strings. They're called WRITERS!!

Both have missed the mark against things that have been shown within their ability to handle!

Superman looks like Stupid-man every so often against the lame villains of DC!

Thor gets made to look like the god of blunder instead of thunder from time to time as well with low-tiers of Marvel!

It's called jobbing. The Job is doing less than what your expected to do when it comes to your superpowers. Thor and Superman's power have to take a dive sometimes for the sake of the story!

When it happens, people, in state of shock ask, "where did the characters' speed/other powers go?"

The answer: It was put on the back-burner awaiting the writers permission to be used, that's where.

Does that make them chumps all of sudden? Should we ignore the level of Super-ness that they are known for? No! We should simply realize that writers don't let the characters perform to the best of their abilities 100 percent of the time because if they did, then most of the time, there would be no story interesting enough to read.

True that.

#26 Posted by Saren (26021 posts) - - Show Bio

@dum529001: I already warned you once about what would happen if you just spammed dozens of large scans in a thread.

Moderator
#27 Edited by dum529001 (1654 posts) - - Show Bio

Examples of Thor's power

Here's some of Thor's feats of strength:

Thor flexes and snaps adamantium alloy cables like they were nothing, from Thor #309:

Does this look familiar? Twenty years later, Thor literally re-performs his feat of lifting a metal railway and sustaining the weight of a passing train as it races by, from Thor #319:

Early on, Thor pushes over the Leaning Tower of Pisa with his finger, from Journey Into Mystery #92:

And large numbers already are quantified as Thor leg presses millions of tons of rock onto the Destroyer, from Journey Into Mystery #119:

After the villain, Graviton, finds his powers uncontrollable, he compresses an entire floating city into a sphere, and Thor, along with several other Avengers, find themselves supporting and then heaving millions of tons of weight into the Atlantic, from Avengers #159:

Thor tows the small island, Hydrobase, into New York harbor, from Avengers #301:

At the conclusion of Acts of Vengeance, Thor closes a chasm of a "million tons of earth" over Loki, fromWest Coast Avengers #55:

Here Thor crushes a force-field of the Power Cosmic (amped by Loki's power) that keeps him from Mjolnir, from Silver Surfer #4:

Here, Thor destroys another of Silver Surfer's force-fields with a single strike, from Silver Surfer #4:

As for pure collateral damage, a single punch met with the same force has leveled a countryside, from Thor#338:

And with repeated blows? Thor and Red Norvell literally wreck Asgard with their fist-fight and almost deafen Heimdall, from Thor #476:

Thor literally matches a Savage Hulk's strength in a grappling contest for an entire hour, from Defenders#10:

Indeed, his punch is so powerful that combined with a punch of equal strength, it is capable of actually closing dimensional rifts, from Avengers #100:

Here, he stalemates immortal Hercules in a contest of arm-wrestling, from Thor #222:

Thor resists a force "as though half a planet" were bearing down on him, from Thor #140:

Thor resists the gravimetric pull akin to "that of a neutron star" and busts out, from Thor #281:

A neutron star has 200 billion times the gravity of earth. That level of acceleration means a neutron star's gravity is faster than light.

Thor actually lifts the Midgard Serpent who is powerful enough to crush the earth. Note that the catastrophic effects of such a feat are actually physically felt on Earth, from Thor #32:

Survives the weight of twenty planets in Thor annual vol 1. #9 :

Thor has resisted extreme ranges of heat throughout his career. Thor doesn't even register a reaction when immersed in lava, from Avengers #5:

Thor walks around inside the furnace of the trolls, whose fires were used to forge Mjolnir, from Thor #211:

Magical fire-bolts engulf Thor to no effect, from Thor #292:

Ghost Rider's pure hellfire blasts are useless in Avengers #214:

Cosmic fire-bolts from the Herald, Firelord, have a similarly negligible effect in Thor #306:

And Thor has literally stood in the center of the Sun while confronting Atum in Thor Annual #14:

On the opposite end of the spectrum, Thor effortlessly resists arctic forces summoned by the Executioner in one of his first fights in Journey Into Mystery #103:

Here, Thor resists the "devastating energy of an exploding sun" from the Executioner's axe, from Journey Into Mystery #103:

Thanos' fleet nails Thor with a salvo of energy blasts and the mere indirect impact knocks both Captain Marvel and Ironman unconscious in Marvel Two-In-One Annual #2:

Thor is not only immune to electricity blasts, but indeed refreshed by them as shown in Thor #288:

One of his most impressive feats, Thor survives being rocked by multiple blasts by the Fourth Host of Celestials, from Thor #300:

Thor's unconscious body isn't even destroyed by a Doomsday Bomb capable of destroying a planet, fromThor #387:

And while empowered by the Odinforce,Thor has resisted the Destroyer's beam of total disintegration inThor vol. 3 #5:

Here, we see Thor flying outside a window and when Jane Foster gets his attention, Thor manages to intercept Cobra's poison dart within a split-second. The dart is fired before he even is inside the room, just to give you the proper frame of reference to understand the speed and reflexes necessary in Journey Into Mystery #98:

Thor digs a trench in a blur of motion that is "almost too fast for the human eye to follow." From Marvel Team-Up #26:

And here, while helping rebuild Asgard, Thor hammers down repeatedly on a pillar and "becomes a blur of motion" in Thor #267:

Thor's reflexes have always allowed to react at lightning speeds faster than the human eye can perceive.Even in a hail of attacks or debris. There's something about this feat is that Thor speed and moves faster than the sight of Heimdall , a god endowed with super-senses , able to hear the grass grow, the sap running in the trees or the beating of the wings of a butterfly on the other side of the galaxy and whose eyes see light years away. Whatever the case, the fineness of Heimdall's senses are greater than those of any being.

Here, Thor fights Heimdall and swings his hammer down on him at speeds "moving too swiftly for the eye to follow," even too fast for Heimdall in Journey Into Mystery#125:

Here, Hela only has to touch Thor in order to ensnare his soul in 1v1 combat, but is unable to do so because of his speed, "His speed, his anger, are beyond comprehension!" From Thor #354:

Here, while fending off two Herald-level foes, Adam Warlock likens his ability to catch his staff mid-swing and his combat speed to that of lightning, "He moves like the lightning he commands, much quicker than I remember." From Infinity Watch #23:

Here, in the space of one and one-fifth seconds, Thor dives out of the sky, smashes Mjolnir down and causes a supersonic shockwave to divert a runaway truck from killing a young boy ACROSS the city inJourney Into Mystery #108:

Here, in the space of micro-seconds before a zooming cursed Mjolnir will strike Thor from behind, Thor lays a haymaker onto an Enchanter and spins around in time to snatch Mjolnir in mid-air, from Thor #144:

Here, Thor is about to have his face smashed by a cursed Mjolnir which is zooming back to him, but he moves swiftly enough on reaction to dodge it inThor vol. 2 #27:

Thor has dug a ditch so fast that neither Quicksilver was valoz enough to escape it (Quicksilver was already in motion before Thor has started digging the trench).

Thor punks Quicksilver once again:

Thor reacts to Wrecker swinging his mystic crowbar onto Thor's head from behind. Literally only inches away, Thor moves so swiftly once again, he snatches the crowbar with his hand in Thor vol. 2 #29:

And it looks like current Thor hasn't lost that bare-handed touch as he catches Bor's axe inches from his face in Thor #600:

With his great speed, without the use of his natural control over the weather, he can create winds of hurricane force or greater- than-hurricane-force air shockwaves in Journey Into Mystery #100 and #84:

Here, he literally snatches a fired tank shell out of mid-air with his bare hand and bats a barrage of them back in Journey Into Mystery #93:

And similarly snatches a fired missile with his bare hand in Marvel Team-Up #148:

Here, with FTB speed, he deflects two bullets with a single swing way back in Journey Into Mystery #100:

Here, he blocks a single bullet with the head of Mjolnir before whirling it to create a field in Thor #246:

And many times again...

Here, Thor flings Mjolnir to the farthest reaches of the galaxy in Thor: Whom The Gods Would Destroy:

And he can fling the hammer many times the speed of light and transcend the boundaries of time and space in Thor #392-393, Thor #140 and Thor #274:

As for FTL reactions that can be measured in nanoseconds (light travels one foot per nanosecond), he's swung and swatted away Blastaar's energy blasts inThor #270:

Far from a one-off FTL feat, he does the same to Mole Man's energy blaster shot in Marvel Two-In-One#96:

Here, Enchantress shoots a blast at Captain America and Thor reacts with FTL speed to cut off the energy blast in mid-flight, from Marvel Comics Presents#44:

Thor can spin Mjolnlr around fast enough to shield himself from lasers, from Thor #218:

Phoenix shoots a telepathic blast at a groggy Thor at the moment Thor's arms are at his side. AFTER the shot is fired and already traveling at him, Thor raises his arms and reflects it back with Mjolnir. Telepathy being instantaneous traditionally (as noted in the narration), we can assume for the sake of argument that it was only traveling at light-speed, making this another FTL feat, from Excalibur#428:

He can even block a constant barrage of laser vision from Count Nefaria, from Avengers #166:

He bats away a possessed Iron Man's repulsor rays in Avengers vol. 3 #3:

And again bats away ray blasts in a training session in Avengers vol. 3 #23:

and again......

Mjolnir also allows for simulated flight whereby when thrown it could pull it's wielder along. Basically, Thor flies by flinging his hammer really hard and then hanging on for ride:

And no matter what, it's been explained that "Thor can always control the course of his flight," from Thor#400:

In terms of flight speed, he's flown at least three times the speed of light, from Thor #185:

Thor has trapped Hermes the god of speed, and well, that's just say that ... but are spears spears thrown by gods thousands of times stronger than any human, imagine how fast would travel those spears =).

During the saga of Surtur , commissioned by Nick Fury (Nick Fury), Thor reached and surpassed in speed to a spaceship traveling at a speed came many times that of Light and even outside our solar system, Thor increase their 100 times speed to overtake the ship.

Travels from Earth to Sun in a matter of moments:

Saves Rulk from a Black Hole(ANOTHER FTL feat):

Thor intercepted Ego whom was moving at hyperspace speeds:

Catches Ego again after getting shot at by Stranger:

#28 Posted by Thurdazz1313 (49 posts) - - Show Bio

This scan drives me crazy, I've stated this on other posts so forgive the repeat. This is not Thor It's Eric Masterson in the context of this story arch, Thor killed loki & his spirit was imprisioned for it. Eric M. was chosen to replace him he was given Mjolnir ,he gained Thor's strength, Durability, & very basic use of the hammer ,he couldn't even fly without crashing initially, He gained none of Thor's combat skills or experience, So an architect from new York was given the powers of a god & no instruction manual , Masterson had to train w/ Captain America & Hercules for months to gain basic control of his abilities. Later after Thor's release they fought & Masterson couldn't land a punch even w/the hammer. As far as fighting normal street -levelers Like Wolverine, !.) bad story & there've been a few examples of that. 2) Thor's oath , restraint to Avoid accidentally killing mortals, He has stated & shown great frustration w/ letting battles go to long . In the Wolverine fight wolverine thought he was fighting Sabertooth so he was going all out, Thor knew he was fighting wolverine he was holding back, Remember Thor took out Daken w/1 shot'

Thor has shown feats that rival Darkseid who has super speed that rivals DC's big guns, Swatting away Hyperion, catching Zebra (new God of speed), Shattering Quasar's & Silver Surfer's Energy constructs. It's the same as Swatting away Superman, Deflecting the Flash, Shattering Green Lantern's Constructs. Darkseid doesn't zip around but no one says he doesn't have Super speed . they quote these examples to why he does, So I say same examples,same result. Thor has Super Speed & Combat Reflexes .

#29 Posted by jagernutt (3184 posts) - - Show Bio

@sc said:

Thor isn't really objectively fast, he is relatively fast, as in he is a fictional character. As in because he is fictional, writers will consider many more other details and factors than Thor's speed when writing the character because its not really a defining aspect of the character. So when Thor fights Wolverine, and Silver Surfer and Gladiator and Superman and Juggernaut and Hulk he will keep up with all of them about the same. Which would probably be really frustrating for anyone trying to ignore these characters are fictional and looking at measuring or quantifying this characters objective speeds from actions or reactions but thats just how it goes. Not just that but writers disagree with each other on aspects of the character as well all the time. To look at it another way, if Thor was created by his creator to be similar if not superior to Superman, if Superman was substantially faster then Thor's other traits would rise as a consequence. Except what if a writer didn't want Thor to be stronger than Superman and so wrote Superman as strong or stronger? Then Superman's speed would be sacrificed to better represent the competitiveness between the characters. Then thats just one writers potential stance.

So in this sense comics is a lot like wrestling instead of say sports. Its fixed sometimes for the entertainment purpose rather than accurate factual observations. Thor is in that sense a wrestler who feuds with a lot of slower wrestlers that are weaker and less durable than him, so there speed is a way for entertainment to be had in interactions, or to compensate for other differences, just like a wrestler like the Silver Surfer who is usually in space zipping around being super ultra fast, when he does have a feud with Thor competes with Thor instead of outmatching him in speed, because Thor was created (or pushed) to be his superior (and its also why Silver Surfer's strength level has risen dramatically over time) - Superman is like in a different Wrestling Business. Pushed a lot more than Thor and also as far as speed, defined by speed a lot more. Though if WWE Thor ever went over to WCW to fight Superman then the writers and large majority of fans probably won't care about objective speed feats and focus on entertainment (and more of a competitive feel) then again also depends on the writer.

I agree. If Marvel and DC comics became one comic book franchise, I find it hard to believe that Superman or Wonder Woman would be able to consitantly speed blitz Thor. Likewise I find it hard to believe that Flash(Wally) would prove any faster than Surfer accept in order to escape from him by the skin of his teeth during any serious all out confrantation.

#30 Posted by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

Except that there's a clear contrast between Superman and Wonder Woman's combat speed with how fast Thor can move. Thor has been blitzed by street levellers at least half a dozen times. It's not bad writing or jobbing if it happens on a consistent basis. Therefore, why would there be any differing proof that Thor has anything beyond street level speed at best in combat?

#31 Edited by coolcat4 (282 posts) - - Show Bio

#32 Edited by dum529001 (1654 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

Except that there's a clear contrast between Superman and Wonder Woman's combat speed with how fast Thor can move. Thor has been blitzed by street levellers at least half a dozen times. It's not bad writing or jobbing if it happens on a consistent basis. Therefore, why would there be any differing proof that Thor has anything beyond street level speed at best in combat?

Half a dozen times of low-showings isn't all that consistent considering the character has 60 years of history.

What about the dozens upon dozens of times Thor has shown to be extremely fast? Things like that are way more consistent to the character than a few low-showings.

#33 Posted by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

Except that there's a clear contrast between Superman and Wonder Woman's combat speed with how fast Thor can move. Thor has been blitzed by street levellers at least half a dozen times. It's not bad writing or jobbing if it happens on a consistent basis. Therefore, why would there be any differing proof that Thor has anything beyond street level speed at best in combat?

Half a dozen times of low-showings isn't all that consistent considering the character has 60 years of history.

What about the dozens upon dozens of times Thor has shown to be extremely fast? Things like that are way more consistent to the character than a few low-showings.

And in that 60 years of history he's had more consistent low speed showings than high speed showings. Why do you persist in believing otherwise? I would never be able to delude myself into holding such a blatantly incorrect view when the evidence for Thor's slow is right in front of you. You must have quite the talent to continue holding such wrong and incorrect opinions on this subject matter when all arguments and evidence state otherwise.

#34 Posted by dum529001 (1654 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger said:

@dum529001 said:

@lvenger said:

Except that there's a clear contrast between Superman and Wonder Woman's combat speed with how fast Thor can move. Thor has been blitzed by street levellers at least half a dozen times. It's not bad writing or jobbing if it happens on a consistent basis. Therefore, why would there be any differing proof that Thor has anything beyond street level speed at best in combat?

Half a dozen times of low-showings isn't all that consistent considering the character has 60 years of history.

What about the dozens upon dozens of times Thor has shown to be extremely fast? Things like that are way more consistent to the character than a few low-showings.

And in that 60 years of history he's had more consistent low speed showings than high speed showings. Why do you persist in believing otherwise? I would never be able to delude myself into holding such a blatantly incorrect view when the evidence for Thor's slow is right in front of you. You must have quite the talent to continue holding such wrong and incorrect opinions on this subject matter when all arguments and evidence state otherwise.

Actually you are very delusional if you think Thor doesn't have more showings for extreme speed than he does for the opposite.

#35 Edited by Jayc1324 (13160 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: the only "thor is slow" feats I've seen are him getting tagged by wolverine and spiderman. And some other street levelers. But at the same time, those same street levelers have tagged people faster than Thor, and everyone has low showings, even flash (Deathstroke tripping him) Compare that to the numerous super speed feats he has, as you can see above in this thread, like feats with iron man and gladiator.

#36 Edited by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

@jayc1324: There's also Mongoose blitzing him twice, the Captain America training session and another god blitzing him during the Blood and Thunder mini series. Not to mention that every one of his speed feats has context behind them, is something a street leveller can replicate or is a classic showing which is not compatible with his current speed. It is really not low showings in the slightest for Thor's speed. It's the track record that he's consistently shown on matters of speed. He has consistently high strength, durability and energy projection feats. Why change that logic when it comes to speed and there are severely lacking showings to support the conclusion that Thor is fast. There's no credibility whatsoever to the view that Thor has beyond street level combat speed. Heck, the Hulk has better combat speed showings than Thor.

#37 Edited by Jayc1324 (13160 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: So street levelers can hit iron mans blasts back at him and deflect energy beans from phoenix? And did you take a look at the gladiator feat above? Also the captain America thing was Eric Masterson, not Thor. Eric Masterson couldn't even touch Thor in a fight later on. The street leveler stuff is still low showings just like Deathstroke tagging flash and successfully running away from superman, and batman tagging wonder woman. Thor has fought people way faster than street levelers like silver surfer before and never had a problem with speed, him struggling with street levelers is kind of crazy actually.

Thor is even shown blocking attacks from wolverine and catching numerous speedsters above as well.

#38 Edited by Lvenger (21066 posts) - - Show Bio

@jayc1324:

So street levelers can hit iron mans blasts back at him and deflect energy beans from phoenix

The latter was a one off speed feat that does not match with Thor's consistent speed feats. You cannot base your argument on that one cherry picked showing when way more showings conclusively demonstrate he has slower speed than that.

And did you take a look at the gladiator feat above?

Yes I did. Gladiator does not use his speed effectively in combat often and was certainly not blitzing Thor to his full extent like he has in other showings. In contrast, DC powerhouses do use their speed more effectively which is why they would be all over Thor with their superior speed use in combat.

Also the captain America thing was Eric Masterson, not Thor.

Masterson had The Power of Thor which he used to beat Gladiator and Ronan. You don't beat those 2 by not having The Power of Thor on hand. If you try and argue Masterson was not as powerful as Thor when he beat those 2, you're deluding yourself of the truth. Not to mention Cap explicitly said "the original Thor had trouble with the same exercise" which was designed to test combat instincts and reaction times. A very clear demonstration that Thor has slow reactions and speed in combat.

The street leveler stuff is still low showings just like Deathstroke tagging flash and successfully running away from superman, and batman tagging wonder woman.

Not when Mongoose blitzed him 3 times. Here

Here (Thor only tagged him by spinning Mjolnir round which is not a demonstration of his combat speed, only how fast Mjolnir can be spun round. And that's not attributable to Thor's combat speed in the slightest.)

And here (Thor only tagged Mongoose by summoning a storm and turning the ground to mud)

In contrast, Mongoose was having trouble tagging Spider-Man, a problem Thor has too and only tagged him by spraying gas at him

Thor has fought people way faster than street levelers like silver surfer before and never had a problem with speed, him struggling with street levelers is kind of crazy actually.

Silver Surfer tends not to use his speed in in character fights. Spider-Man and The Thing have tagged him when outside of those showings, he's casually dodged lasers and asteroids along with having nanosecond reactions. When you see how many times Thor has struggled with street levellers in pure speed and reactions, it isn't crazy at all. It's consistent based on available evidence on a regular basis.

Thor is even shown blocking attacks from wolverine and catching numerous speedsters above as well.

Is that why Thor admits Wolverins is faster than he is?

But even though I and many others on here have debunked your faulty, baseless arguments time and again, you'll never listen to reason or empiricism in favour of your own warped view on how fast Thor is. So here's something you can't argue with; executive Marvel editor Tom Breevort saying that Thor can't fight at superspeed.

/thread.

#39 Posted by Jayc1324 (13160 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger: In that scan Gladiator was using his speed for combat though. Also the iron man and phoenix feats are valid.

Thor was clearly faster than Masterson though.

All you're doing is giving more low showings. I could do the same for every character who's fast.

Thor is faster than street levelers seeing as how he fights people like surfer. Saying surfer doesn't use speed is BS.

Most important though, Thor has caught speedsters. No street leveler is doing that like Thor did. That proves his speed. My argument isn't baseless at all. I'm bringing up valid feats and all you do is call them out to be invalid. He has tons of speed feats, they are consistent. Street levelers should not be as fast as Thor unless they can catch speedsters as well. And he didn't catch one speedster, he caught numerous. Its consistent.

That is one writer who didn't even create Thor. Stan Lee created him to be the most powerful superhero in marvel, and gave him great speed feats. I could bring up writers who say that daredevil can beat wolverine easily.

Bottom line, he has low showings against street levelers, but great showings with speedsters and those way faster than street levelers.

#40 Edited by dum529001 (1654 posts) - - Show Bio

@lvenger:

#1. Mongoose never blitzed Thor in that instance because mongoose couldn't even land any hits while Thor could.

#2. Being rushed by a god who's speed is not ever referenced does not prove Thor lacks great superhuman speed. In fact, it proves nohing in regards to speed.

#3. In Thor's fight with Wolverine he was cut off mid sentence which means he never admitted Wolverine was faster than him. And you forget the part of the fight where Wolverine gets smacked and Thrown by Thor before receiving a bolt of lightning with Thor saying that he's done holding back.

#4. Silver has certainly used in his speed when he's fought Thor.

#5. Quoting someone who doesn't write Thor books does not erase what numerous other writers of Thor have done, including the guy who created Thor, Stan Lee.

#6. Masterson Thor was ignorant of Thor's powers despite having them. Even Thor realized that. Even so, looking at all of Masterson Thor's feats, he has displayed superhuman speed and perception more than opposite.

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