How do you guys want Lobdell to improve the superman book? More feats, deeper storylines, reinvent classic villians?

Superman should be DC's flagship title so I guess I'm hoping that he'll elevate it's status...though I figure that he'll make the book much better I don't see it becoming DC's flagship title

He might make it a title I would add to my pull. Currently, I'm reading Superboy and a part of me hopes he will be able to connect all the super titles. I would love it if Superboy stopped just being a sub story of Teen Titans. I want Superman to get involved with his clone.

@jstndmnd said:

He might make it a title I would add to my pull. Currently, I'm reading Superboy and a part of me hopes he will be able to connect all the super titles. I would love it if Superboy stopped just being a sub story of Teen Titans. I want Superman to get involved with his clone.

That's on its way with H'el on Earth, so he'll at least meet that expectation.

I really just hope he adds some excitement to the book. Grounded was so dull Pre-Flashpoint and the first year of Superman in the New 52 has been playing it safe with standard super-villain battles. Lobdell has always been good at over-the -top action ever since his X-Men days. If he can bring some of that to Superman then the book at least won't be a yawner anymore. I'm not expecting much more than that.

I hope that he has a long term story in mind for the book....I feel like that's the reason why Scott Snyder's Batman and Swamp Thing along with Jeff Lemire's Animal Man have been so successful

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

@Avenging-X-Bolt said:

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

Haha! True. I like Lobdel but he really screwed up TT.

@ssejllenrad said:

@Avenging-X-Bolt said:

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

Haha! True. I like Lobdel but he really screwed up TT.

I actually like his Teen Titans...

@Jekylhyde14 said:

@ssejllenrad said:

@Avenging-X-Bolt said:

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

Haha! True. I like Lobdel but he really screwed up TT.

I actually like his Teen Titans...

Same here. Not sure why people have problems with it.

My hopes are

1. More old villains reimagine

2. More new villains

3. More relationship forming

4. Storylines like The killing Joke that will keep selling over and over again

5. New supporting characters

6. Superman and Powergirl meeting each other.

I'm hoping he does something worthwhile with the character.

@Deranged Midget: Jim lee has left the JL title does that mean hes leaveing DC comics as well?

@Z3RO180: I wouldn't think so. He holds the Co-Publisher position at DC alongside Dan DiDio so I would assume his leave from Justice League would simply mean his presence on a new title, preferably the rumoured Superman title with Scott Snyder.

That its good...But I doubt it...

@sethysquare said:

@Jekylhyde14 said:

@ssejllenrad said:

@Avenging-X-Bolt said:

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

Haha! True. I like Lobdel but he really screwed up TT.

I actually like his Teen Titans...

Same here. Not sure why people have problems with it.

Lobdell's

Titans run is, in my opinion, a complicated subject. I would say that it's

hands down the best Titans run since Johns with the possible exception of Krul whose

run was cut too short to really tell if it would ever escape it's meh faze.

Lobdell's run managed to really bring an energy to the book which when looking

book at years of stale angst filled issues is an accomplishment. The problem is

that it seemed to be aimed way to much at new readers or at least people who

weren't really fans of the characters, most of them were fairly out of

character with Cassie being the extreme case and Bart being the low end, The mutilation

of all the involved characters history with virtually no concrete hints at what

had and had not come before further frustrated longtime fans. Finally Lobdell's

pushing of Bunker, Skitter, and to a lesser extent Solstice over characters who

had literally thousands of fans pining for their returns made it hard for those

who came before the reboot to really get behind the book, personally I read it

out of a sense of obligation because I've read every issue since the beginning

of Johns run not because the book is anything more than decent. Other problems

with the book is that several have accused Lobdell of being incapable of

writing teenagers, I'm 17 and kind of see it but in my opinion it's not so bad,

others have called it slow, unstructured to the point of seaming like it has

ADD (my simile but not my complaint), and drawn so that everyone looks the

same. Whether or not these problems are true is largely subjective so you may

have some of them where others may not. On a more personal level my problem

with the book was that the Nowhere crossover was nothing but 4 books of

brawling before a cliché ending with no story or character development to speak

of. All of that being said the book has gained steadfast defenders for being

fun action packed, and character focused. It is admittedly a fun comic but

perhaps not one for long term fans. At least those are my thoughts on the

disagreement

@BlackArmor:

I can understand and respect all of those points. I suppose from my view, I just see Lobdell's Titans as the best run on the series since Geoff Johns just as you do. I don't think it's quite as good as Johns' Teen Titans or as good as Young Justice by Peter David was, but it beats just about everything that followed Johns (Krul was okay but like you said, meh). Lobdell has at least brought team dynamics back to the book. The team is interacting and forming relationships with one another which is key to any good team book.

I'm not so offended with the way he's re-interpreted either Superboy or Cassie. Do I miss the old Cassie? Sure. The tough girl act is sort of growing on me, though, and I really like the edge of Superboy's new apathy. I honestly don't see Bart as being much different except for the fact that Lobdell can't make him quite as funny as either David or Waid did. The New 52 reworked Superman's character, so why not Cassie and Co.?

As far as the line-up, it would have been nice if he used some of my old favorites. I miss Arrowette and Secret from Young Justice. I also really liked Kid Devil, Ravager, Static, and Blue Beetle from the Teen Titans (I won't even mention the possibility of using Stephanie Brown because I don't want waffles sent to my house). However, all of those characters started out as new at some point. We had to give them a chance for them to grow on us. I like Bunker and Solstice a lot so far (Skitter I'm still reserving judgment on). I think if more people gave them a chance then they'd like the characters as well. Besides, as long as they're still publishing Teen Titans then there's always a chance for our old favorites to return.

I understand that you were just explaining all the possible reasons for criticism against the book, and, again, I completely get and respect those reasons. I was underwhelmed by The Culling too. It was very jumpy. I just have a feeling that once this book really picks up steam, it'll start resembling the Teen Titans book we all used to love and the Young Justice book from my teens. I think if people stick with it then they'll only see it get better. Remember, the old version of the team didn't happen over night.

I want more Clark Kent.

Clark is the man, Superman is the mask. I want to see more of his relationships with characters like Jimmy, Lois, and Perry. I'm not saying that Lois and Clark have to fall in love, but their banter and their competitiveness is a must-have. See Secret Origin. I'd love to have Lex come in and be a major player outside of just your normal villain, I wanna see that rivalry reform outside of Lex's latest scheme story-lines. I kind of hate that we've already had him in Action Comics and not recognize Clark, because the one thing that Smallville did awesomely was give Lex a whole new fresh storyline. I'd love it if Clark and Lex knew each other and now had a rivalry ala Smallville.

Like...make it good.

@Jekylhyde14 said:

@ssejllenrad said:

@Avenging-X-Bolt said:

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

Haha! True. I like Lobdel but he really screwed up TT.

I actually like his Teen Titans...

Same here I really like this new Teen Titans

The problem with his Teen Titans is that you can't really care about any of the characters because you don't know anything about them. For the most part, those familiar with their Pre-Flashpoint identities are recalling those pasts, but it's more and more clear all the time that these characters aren't those characters. They should have focused on the core (Tim Drake, Superboy, Wonder Girl, Kid-Flash) before introducing so many other characters (Skitter, Solstice, Bunker). I like the new characters, especially Bunker, but we needed to get to know the Core Four first.

@mpierce2690 said:

The problem with his Teen Titans is that you can't really care about any of the characters because you don't know anything about them. For the most part, those familiar with their Pre-Flashpoint identities are recalling those pasts, but it's more and more clear all the time that these characters aren't those characters. They should have focused on the core (Tim Drake, Superboy, Wonder Girl, Kid-Flash) before introducing so many other characters (Skitter, Solstice, Bunker). I like the new characters, especially Bunker, but we needed to get to know the Core Four first.

Before the reboot, the team was tim drake, superboy, wondergirl, kid-flash, beastboy, raven, ravager and solstice.

As of now raven is in phantom stranger and will rejoin titans, beastboy is in ravagers and rose is in superboy and ravagers.

So Scott really only added 2 characters .

@sethysquare said:

@mpierce2690 said:

The problem with his Teen Titans is that you can't really care about any of the characters because you don't know anything about them. For the most part, those familiar with their Pre-Flashpoint identities are recalling those pasts, but it's more and more clear all the time that these characters aren't those characters. They should have focused on the core (Tim Drake, Superboy, Wonder Girl, Kid-Flash) before introducing so many other characters (Skitter, Solstice, Bunker). I like the new characters, especially Bunker, but we needed to get to know the Core Four first.

Before the reboot, the team was tim drake, superboy, wondergirl, kid-flash, beastboy, raven, ravager and solstice.

As of now raven is in phantom stranger and will rejoin titans, beastboy is in ravagers and rose is in superboy and ravagers.

So Scott really only added 2 characters .

I'm not really against adding characters, I still would have made the first four or five issues about Drake, Superboy, Wonder Girl, and Kid-Flash before adding Bunker, Skitter, and Soltice or later Beast Boy (whom I love), Raven, and Rose (whom they were doing a great job building up in Superboy's own title). Just so that we could get some real insight into their personalities and their backstories first. It's not like Justice League where all of those characters (besides Cyborg) have their own titles, there should have been a focus on the core team that probably isn't going anywhere before making them share the spotlight with other characters. It ends up doing everyone a disservice because you're trying to introduce us to seven characters at once.

It seems that in this universe...he is Clark and Superman.

@mpierce2690 said:

@sethysquare said:

@mpierce2690 said:

The problem with his Teen Titans is that you can't really care about any of the characters because you don't know anything about them. For the most part, those familiar with their Pre-Flashpoint identities are recalling those pasts, but it's more and more clear all the time that these characters aren't those characters. They should have focused on the core (Tim Drake, Superboy, Wonder Girl, Kid-Flash) before introducing so many other characters (Skitter, Solstice, Bunker). I like the new characters, especially Bunker, but we needed to get to know the Core Four first.

Before the reboot, the team was tim drake, superboy, wondergirl, kid-flash, beastboy, raven, ravager and solstice.

As of now raven is in phantom stranger and will rejoin titans, beastboy is in ravagers and rose is in superboy and ravagers.

So Scott really only added 2 characters .

I'm not really against adding characters, I still would have made the first four or five issues about Drake, Superboy, Wonder Girl, and Kid-Flash before adding Bunker, Skitter, and Soltice or later Beast Boy (whom I love), Raven, and Rose (whom they were doing a great job building up in Superboy's own title). Just so that we could get some real insight into their personalities and their backstories first. It's not like Justice League where all of those characters (besides Cyborg) have their own titles, there should have been a focus on the core team that probably isn't going anywhere before making them share the spotlight with other characters. It ends up doing everyone a disservice because you're trying to introduce us to seven characters at once.

Well, to be fair, there hasn't been an issue that is about Bunker or Skitter. Bunker hasn't had much of a back story introduced and Skitter just had one or two issues where she was the sub plot.

The whole book is about Superboy, Red Robin, Kid Flash and Wonder Girl.

There were many issues that tied in with Superboy so there was alot of focus on him. Kid Flash had his back up and DCU presents, Wonder Girl's armor is being revealed right now and Tim Drake will be having an issue dedicated to him in #0. I like it that not all the big names are here. Kinda like how X-men splits their top characters in several books so that there could be more characters being introduced.

Beast Boy, Terra, Caitlin and Rose are doing a great job in Ravagers. Raven seems to be coming back in a huge way, Omen is being reinterpreted, Starfire, Arsenel and Red Hood have their adventures in Red Hood and the outlaws, Blue Beetle would be joining the adults, Cyborg is with the league, Dick Grayson is setting up his Batman lite stories as Nightwing after his stint on Batman. I can accept how things are going.

The only ones I miss are Miss Martian, Tempest, Red Star and Aqualad.

I can deal with Wally West and Donna Troy being erased, because Wally is kinda a mix between Bart and Allen and Donna is also kinda a mix between Diana and Cassie.

I hope he doesn't screw it up like he did with Teen Titans.

The new 52 Teen Titans are poorly written, and the art doesn't help either. Their all cliche angst-machines(outside of Solstice, Kid Flash and Bunker) that lack all of the qualities that made the old TT so great. It's just Lobdell writing 90's X-Men with the Teen Titans names only.

@Ironhawk22 said:

The new 52 Teen Titans are poorly written, and the art doesn't help either. Their all cliche angst-machines(outside of Solstice, Kid Flash and Bunker) that lack all of the qualities that made the old TT so great. It's just Lobdell writing 90's X-Men with the Teen Titans names only.

Exactly this!

@Suprman: I love(d) the Teen Titans and honestly continuity isn't even really the problem. Sure I want Donna, Wally, and of course Garth back(As well as many others but those three specifically) but I can live without them(Hey Garth was atleast confirmed to exist). It's the writing, he writes every character the same. If you put random bits of diologue in front of me from Skitter, Wonder Girl, Red Robin, and Superboy I probabally couldn't tell the difference. The premise used to be a group of friends coming together to hang out and learn from one another how to be better heroes, now it's "Seven Super-powered Teenagers on the run from a goverment that hates them must fight the bad guys and each other". That is literally the exact premise of the X-Men. If I wanted to read X-Men(which I already do), Marvel has like ten titles with them in it(also better written). Plus is there really any legitimate reason for the goverment to hate them? Nope, they just do. DC needs to realize that the 90's over, and get over the cliche that all teenagers are angsty. You should read Danger Club, it's how the Teen Titans should be.

@Ironhawk22: I will look into it. Especially since Avengers Academy is leaving, which is a great series if you haven't read it. The new titans are just a bore to read. and like you said if I wanted to read X-Men, I'd read X-men. Plus I feel that Lobdell has complete disrespect for the continuity of the Teen Titans and that just pisses me off to no end because I got into comics through Teen Titans. I love the Marv Wolfman run and the Geoff Johns Run, and I really liked the J.T. Krul did before the relaunch.

It's great, you can get the first issue for free on Comixology that's how I started reading it. It's about this teen superhero team Danger Club, their mentors go into space to fight some evil force. They never come back, and the world's gone to hell . It's a bit like Teen Titans meets Lord of the Flies. I actually did read Avengers Academy for a while, but then when "Fear Itself"(Marvel's great but really not their best work) came around I lost interest but perhaps I should pick up some of the issues I've missed. Do you watch Young Justice? It's fantastic, it's how the reboot should have been done. I wish Johns would just leave JL and write TT again.

Also how is Teen Titans: The Games by Wolfman and Perez?

@Ironhawk22 said:

@Suprman: I love(d) the Teen Titans and honestly continuity isn't even really the problem. Sure I want Donna, Wally, and of course Garth back(As well as many others but those three specifically) but I can live without them(Hey Garth was atleast confirmed to exist). It's the writing, he writes every character the same. If you put random bits of diologue in front of me from Skitter, Wonder Girl, Red Robin, and Superboy I probabally couldn't tell the difference. The premise used to be a group of friends coming together to hang out and learn from one another how to be better heroes, now it's "Seven Super-powered Teenagers on the run from a goverment that hates them must fight the bad guys and each other". That is literally the exact premise of the X-Men. If I wanted to read X-Men(which I already do), Marvel has like ten titles with them in it(also better written). Plus is there really any legitimate reason for the goverment to hate them? Nope, they just do. DC needs to realize that the 90's over, and get over the cliche that all teenagers are angsty. You should read Danger Club, it's how the Teen Titans should be.

The argument that lobdell writes all the character the same is a false one. please. you mean solstice n starfire and cassie sounds like the same person? superboy, tim, bart, bunker sounds like the same person? if anything he made them so differefnt from each other that people are complaining.

@Ironhawk22: I enjoyed it very much. Wally isn't in the book and that's pretty much my only complaint, I also gave it a good review if you want to read it.

http://www.comicvine.com/the-new-teen-titans-games-ogn/37-293439/user-reviews/?review_id=27593

Please note that it was written during my early days of writing reviews lol.

@sethysquare: The argument is that Lobdell is doing NOTHING new with his titans series. He is literally just writing the exact same thing he did with his X-Men series in the 90s. That's the problem with this series. He is completely ignoring Titans history deciding to re-write it entirely as a copy of the X-Men. The fact that he's basically erased the Wolfman and Perez run on the book in the 80's proves that. In the 80's, X-Men and Teen Titans were the best selling series of Marvel and DC. They were both so popular that a crossover comic was released. Now Lobdell has turned them into Dc's X-Men. They are NOT the X-Men. Finally the thing I hate the most is the lack of mentors. There is no connection between KF and Flash, No connection between Wonder Woman and Cassie, and Barely anything between Red Robin and Batman and Superman and Superboy. Those are the things that piss me off the most.

@Suprman said:

@sethysquare: The argument is that Lobdell is doing NOTHING new with his titans series. He is literally just writing the exact same thing he did with his X-Men series in the 90s. That's the problem with this series. He is completely ignoring Titans history deciding to re-write it entirely as a copy of the X-Men. The fact that he's basically erased the Wolfman and Perez run on the book in the 80's proves that. In the 80's, X-Men and Teen Titans were the best selling series of Marvel and DC. They were both so popular that a crossover comic was released. Now Lobdell has turned them into Dc's X-Men. They are NOT the X-Men. Finally the thing I hate the most is the lack of mentors. There is no connection between KF and Flash, No connection between Wonder Woman and Cassie, and Barely anything between Red Robin and Batman and Superman and Superboy. Those are the things that piss me off the most.

1. In what sense is he writing the exact same thing? He created a clone in Xmen that had to deal with being related to the most powerful person on earth and pretty much couldn't deal with it? He wrote someone who has a hero's journey?

He wrote about a PTSD starfire, a recovered drugged addict roy, a cassie that is ready to die for love, bunker is a constant joy and accepts himself for who he is, a solstice that is optimistic, cheerful and is the most mature and learned girl. A kid flash and tim drake that is pretty much the same as pre new 52.

I don't see anything he did was something that he has written before. I could be wrong, but do prove me what has he written now that is a rehash of what he did in the 90s.

Also, Teen Titans was the best selling series in the 80s. It was only after TT's success that Xmen copied its success and became an instant hit in the 90s.

Also, yes sure, one thing he changed was the lack of mentors, but this "change" had been like that for quite some time. The titans had been very independent ever since they became popular. Furthermore, shows like Young Justice and Teen Titans, kinda further cemented the fact that people actually like to read about these characters not as sidekicks but as their own individual person.

KF had nothing to do with Flash even before the reboot. He was basically Barry's grandson that got lost in time and somehow came back. When Bart was first introduced, he also had nothing to do with Barry except for the blood line. Just like in the show young justice.

Red Robin had everything to do with Batman. He had a freaking picture with Batman and batman's most trusted ally (this can also be seen in all the other bat books)

Superboy always had nothing to do with Superman except he was being a clone. When he was first created, he was what he is. Its only after a while that he met Superman and they started to be more connected to each other. Even so, Superman was hardly Superboy's mentor. Supergirl has always been Superman's "side kick" and Superboy always has more relationship with the titans than Superman. In the past few years, the only time Superboy was involved in Superman crossover was Reign of Doomsday. He conveniently missed out on all the crossovers like New Krypton and etc.

Lastly, Cassie was a fangirl of WW. Now, she actually became a character of her own and was able to build up a story that can be completely without Wonder Woman as of now. Her relationship with Diana can always be further explored.

And he did not erase the Wolfman and Perez run on the book. He always wanted to have a previous version of the run with Dick, Kory, Beast Boy and the rest. It was editorial that said TT is the first ever incarnation of the team.

@sethysquare: I believe I said that Wondergirl, Red Robin,Superboy and Skitter's diologue all sound the same as each other, Bart, Kiran, and Bunker are the only ones I could probabally tell apart. Cassie was great pre-reboot now she's just Bombshell with blond hair and a red outfit. Although it doesn't bother me she isn't connected to WW anymore, what bothers me is the constant "DON'T CALL ME WONDER-GIRL!!!!". Also as I said, am not bothered by the retconning of Wolfman and Perez's NTT, or any other history they had. Though I prefer it remained in continuity it's a reboot so things have to be rebooted. What I am bothered by is poor writing, and 90's X-Men style Teen Titans. About the 90's X-Men comparisons I only own a couple of 90's X-Men issues(oddly enough written by Lobdell) I got a year or two ago and it's crazy how UNCANNY(Get the pun) it is to current TT. The costumes, the diologue, the stories are all very similar. Also the X-Men were based off the Doom Patrol not the Teen Titans. How can you not see the similarities in the Titans new background "Superpowered teens on the run from a goverment that hates them.". You can like the New 52 Teen Titans, but it doesn't change the fact I don't.

@Ironhawk22: you cant tell a difference between skitter and wondergirl and superboy and red robin?

Red Robin the detective/leader, Skitter the girl that wants nothing to do with the team and constantly makes weird noises, Superboy, the clone who have little regards for human life or morals, cassie, the girl who is kick ass tough and is willing to do anything to save her loved ones.

you really cant tell them apart?

Also xmen was based off doom patrol when they first started but it only got popular in the 90s after the titans revamped.

Also I wasnt trying to convince u otherwise. But characterisation is one of Lobdell's strong suit. Every character is so different and everyone of them has an intriguing back story.

@sethysquare:We all have our opinions. The thing I think everyone can agree on here is Young Justice is awesome. @suprman: Great. I now have three trades I gotta pick up BQM Stephanie Brown run, Buffy Retreat, and that's not even counting the new JSA Liberty Files. Sad Wally's not in it, but it sounds awesome.

Oh and about the actual question. I hope Lobdell does a good job, Superman deserves it. I might pick it up, just to see Rocafort's art.

Cover to superman #15

Scott Lobdell BETTER do this art justice!! damn kenneth rocafort's just gone way up in my book,i mean what a cover,WOW!!

@ssejllenrad said:

@Avenging-X-Bolt said:

That he doesn't f($&@ it up like he did with Teen Titans.

Haha! True. I like Lobdel but he really screwed up TT.

What about the hack-job he did on Superboy? That was twice as bad, and twice as worrying since it's a Super-person, nominally at least.

I was enjoying Dan Jurgens' run the most of anything on Superman so far. I am stoked for Kenneth Rocafort, but I am pessimistically hopeful about the writing side.

@Ironhawk22 said:

Also how is Teen Titans: The Games by Wolfman and Perez?

Amazing. Read it day before yesterday. The only comic hardcover I can recommend buying, and this is coming from a person who couldn't give a damn about Perez, Marv or the Titans in particular.

In one of his interviews, Lobdell suggested that Supes and Kara will continue to have an antagonistic relationship after "H'el On Earth." That really bugs me because this is when they should start bonding.

@jrock85:

I agree. It doesn't make much sense to me in context of the character development. Throughout her own series, Kara has been homesick and desperately searching for some trace of Krypton. She feels alienated and completely alone. Why on would she keep aggressively turning away the only other Kryptonian on Earth? Especially when he's done nothing but reach out to her.

I know they're doing it so they can keep Kara independent from Kal. They want to make her become her own hero rather than dwell in his shadow. I think that's great but there are other ways to do it.

Let's hope that he doesn't screw it up like Teen Titans.

What am I hoping for?

- A better run than the first 11 mediocre/sub-par issues of Superman.(issue 12 is so far the best issue of Superman imo).

- Something memorable to happen.

- More overlapping with the Superman family titles.

- A reason to be excited to read the title, not just out of character loyalty.

I been enjoying his Teen Titans and Superboy so Im looking forward to what he can bring to Superman what I hoping for is more closeness between the Super titles, New supporting characters and More relationship forming I hope see Wonder Woman in it and Superman being Super and bringing excitement back to the Super book.