@spidershamrock said:

If they want to revamp Superman they should make him go on a rampage after a loved one dies and accidently kill some innocent people as well as most of his enemies. Then they could play up the atonment aspect for the next couple of years

Darth Kent

@Man of Lengend said:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PlwDbSYicM

I love this video it explained everything about superman

Oh, hey, that dude...wrote Chronicle. Sweet.

@Endanger said:

@syoungkeezy said:

@samuel_larson_10: @samuel_larson_10 said:

I want to see him be more brutal in combat. Use more heat vision and show less remorse, just to make it interesting

or maybe they can show him fighting smart like scanning his opponents for hidden weapons and using his superhearing for stakeouts

He does that all the time, especially scanning enemies. When he's fighting mechanical enemies he scans them all the time, takes them out with eletromagnetic pulses. He uses his super-hearing all the time so he can rush to help people. You people even the read comics? And the fact the author says that you can only count the pre-52 great Superman stories on one hand proves that he hasn't read enough Superman comics. And the fact that he says that every villain uses Kryptonite, that can't be more wrong. Kryptonite never even shows up in the comics. I'm just going to name some of the good Superman stories pre-52 without referencing any Elseworld or Mini-story tales 1. Dominus Effect 2. Superman/Majestic arc 3. Road to Krypton 4. Black Ring Saga 5. Doomsday/Death of Superman 6. The issue where he first meets Darkseid post-Crisis 7. Superman #2 (the issue where Lex finds out his secret) 8. Action Comics #646 (first issue where Maxima appears) 9. Superman Sacrifice 10. Gang Wars 11. Superman Exiled (the first time he meets Mongul) 12. Absolute Power 13. Godfall 14. New Krypton 15. Last Son 16. Up, Up, and Away and on and on ......

THANK YOU!!!

But everything said here is upmost crap about how he's over powered or he's too good and his villains are not interesting including his new ones. why? let me list them off

Too Powerful? Since the 60s yeah we don't live in the 60s anymore. Plus I can name alot of characters much more over powered than Superman. Hulk, Thor, Phoenix, Sentry. (All Marvel heroes mind you which I've listed)

Also Superman has been defeated without Kryptonite, even read the latest Superman issue of Superman comics thats out he got defeated and it was without kryptonite.

He needs better villains? Are you joking? Doomsday is a powerhouse monster, Lex Luthor is a mad genius thats also a business tycoon, Bizarro is a failed clone, Parasite is a power mad creature that drains powers and life energy, Mongul is a tyrant, Darkseid is a god. also as for the new villains how can we care about them? how do we care for any villain? they are bran new you have to read them and the writer has to write them in. Joker wasn't a sensation over night it took years of stories with him.

He's too good? Really? people who say this are just ignorant and I will say this to their face, Superman is not meant to scare people I mean would you seriously trust a Man who can bench a mountain? who was pretty much an A$$ to everyone? I wouldn't for one. and also people don't seem to realize that Superman is someone you want to aspire to be like he's the good guy we all want to be the man who gives hope to everyone, the light in the darkness.

@Endanger said:

@sethysquare said:

See guys, I think you all might have mistaken the article. I don't think the article is trying to bring Superman down, but rather its trying to tell us why it is so difficult to write a good superman story. And if anything the past 11 issues of Superman proves that. I think thats what Gman is trying to say. Superman deserves better stories and the past 11 issues of Superman just does not seem to make it. We all know there are tons of great Superman villains out there. If you guys hang around Superman forums, you guys will know I'm kinda always there because I'm a huge fan. But even I can't help but be disappointed by some of the Superman comics and I think DC is right to switch out the writers because perhaps at this point of time, Jurgens or Perez just isn't suited to write Superman now.

Writing a good Superman can be hard, yes, but it shouldn't be magnificently difficult. Many writers have proved that in the past. What I am insulted by is that the author stated that you can only count the good Superman stories on ONE HAND. And that is just wrong. Have you read any of these stories? 1. Dominus Effect 2. Superman/Majestic arc 3. Road to Krypton 4. Black Ring Saga 5. Doomsday/Death of Superman 6. The issue where he first meets Darkseid post-Crisis 7. Superman #2 (the issue where Lex finds out his secret) 8. Action Comics #646 (first issue where Maxima appears) 9. Superman Sacrifice 10. Gang Wars 11. Superman Exiled (the first time he meets Mongul) 12. Absolute Power 13. Godfall 14. New Krypton 15. Last Son 16. Up, Up, and Away 17. Pre-crisis Time Trapper arc 18. Pre-Crisis Superman Lex Luthor all-out war 19. DC Comics Presents #86 (First time Superman met Swamp Thing) 20. Great Darkness Saga 21. Dark Knight in Metropolis 22. The Secret I just came up with 20, good, great Superman stories off the top of my head I can go on and on......... and these aren't even Elseworld tales, I haven't even included All-Star Superman, or For All Seasons or any of that stuff, they're just normal, canon stories. And I haven't even gone listing all the Justice League stuff yet

I do agree and I think the Gman kinda was a little belittling Superman there.

I can add on to 20 more of those stories that you mentioned. I guess I did not read that part of the post and browsed through it. I did think it was a little unfair.

Like you said theres also All Star Superman, Kingdom Come, Red Son, Superman For tomorrow, You also missed out Action Comics #775 and the quite a few of Geoff Johns' run on Superman.

I think it's sad when people say, "I can't relate to Superman" It's like, Oh really?? You can't relate to someone who represents the ideal man? THAT'S NOT SURPRISING AT ALL. (sigh)

It seems people like messed up people. You have to be dark & gritty to be well liked it seems.

Batman is my favorite but if the question was brought up, who's the greatest superhero of all time? I would say Superman. Him being a "boy scout" and always doing the right thing is what I like most about him. He values life and it's so rare these days that it gives me hope to see a character who does. What people need to understand is Superman was created in the 1938. At a time when people were desperately looking for hope. Not only did children read comic books at that time, so did soldiers. Superman IS the symbol of hope. So many people are consumed with the negative things in life and they let that change them, easily. Superman comes from a dark past, his whole freakin planet is completely gone, he lost his home, his parents, everything. To be brought up in a planet where he doesn't belong. He is literally the loneliest being in the planet and yet he CHOOSES to be good which is amazing to me. But he's not perfect, he has some issues. Doing the right thing is the hardest thing to do. Sadly, I don't think people would know that. If people ACTUALLY READ a Superman book instead of judging from the outside then they would know that.

Oh, and about Superman not having good or interesting "bad guys" is a bunch of baloney! Lex Luthor (who is the 2nd greatest villain of all time!), Brainiac, General Zod, Doomsday, Darkseid, Metallo, Parasite, Superman Prime, those are all great villains! But judging by this article and comments, I would say Superman's greatest foe is people.

It all comes down to the writer. It's up to the writer to make him great as he should be. Grant Morrison did a fantastic job with All Star Superman. He gave us a Superman with morals, values and god-like powers but still managed to make the book interesting. Now that's a great writer!

I really hope DC finds someone good enough to take Grant Morrison's place in Action Comics:/

i really only like superman in all star superman!!!!...but you know whatever!

@sethysquare said:

@mettlekm: He does actually. He had a relationship with Lana Lang, Big Barda and several other women. But after he got married to Lois Lane, he just can't date anymore.

BTW, did you just say you got the same problem? LOL

I bet nowadays that's not even considered a good excuse not to try and "pick up chicks".

What it comes down to for a lot of people is simply put, he doesn't have that cool factor. Now what I mean by that is basically his costume. He just doesn't look badass. Now at the same time his costume is iconic but we all know iconic and popular are 2 different things hence why Bats and Spidey are arguably more popular than Supes. I mean they finally got rid of his red underwear, I mean really why do heroes wear underwear over their pants. It just looks silly and you could get away with that years ago but not now. People can say all day long how he's not overpowered but non comic fans just don't care enough about him. Pretty much why his sales struggle compared to other characters. This doesn't mean I don't think he is a great character, he is granddaddy of all superheroes and deserves respect. The thing is its hard to keep him relevant in modern times. His best stories are the ones where he's being beaten down like in Death of Superman or where he's more badass like in Red Son. If they toned his powers down a little an let him cut loose a little more it might help. But what he really needs is a great writer and artist to take him to new levels. This is DC's flagship character and it's pretty sad that they can't get him right. This reboot was supposed to really help him the most and that's failed so far. Hopefully they get a new team that understands him and makes great stories that the character deserves.

@LastSonBackUp said:

@The Stegman said:

I am really trying to restrain myself from going on a rant right now because these are the most common, and ignorant reasons to dislike Superman. -He's too "goody goody" and is a boyscout -He's too overpowered Both of these stem from ignorance from people who have probably either read really old Superman stories, or none at all and can be easily dis proven by simply READING A modern Superman story. I hear it all the time how "Oh he's too powerful" I know, god forbid a character named SUPERman to be super, and if you read his stories you will see the dangers he faces, the enemies he encounters often times are just as, or more power than he is, yet he puts his life on the line, like all superheroes to defeat them anyway.As a side note, for the him being overpowered argument, I find it a bit odd that people always pair him up against Marvel's Thor and it's quite a heated debate over who would win, yet I never hear a "Thor is too powerful" complaint. As for the other two reasons, -Him having bad villains. If the truth was the sun, this would be Pluto that's how far away it is from it. Lex Luthor to me is one of, if not THE greatest villain in comicbook history,How is in many ways symbolizes the worst in man, the greed, the deceptive nature, the distrust of others different and foreign to us, while Superman represents everything man can be, the good aspects, loyalty, respect, love, how Luthor is more than just an ''evil villain'' but rather believes he is truly doing the right thing by helping the world be rid of Superman and aliens like him. Just as the Joker is the opposite side of Batman, Luthor is the polar opposite of Superman (Sorry Bizarro) then you have General Zod, Metallo, Brainiac, Darkseid. I mean besides Batman, Spider-Man and Flash, No other hero has such an interesting group of rogues. -Him having bad stories Red Son, All Star, Birthright, The entire New Krypton Arc, Death of Superman, Up, up and Away, Secret Origins, For the man who has Everything, Whatever Happened to the Man Of Tomorrow say otherwise. Superman to me is the single greatest and most influential character to ever burst from a comic book and has done more for superheroes than any other character I can think of. You can make fun of him, his morals, what he stands for, but at the end of the day, he is the greatest superhero to ever ''live'' and in my opinion does more than just fight crime, he inspires us (both the reader, and the fictional characters he interacts with) to be better, to strive for a better tomorrow, and I for one will always be a Super fan.

This post is absolutely spot on. No one really reads Superman comics, hence the ignorance that spews from their mouths is completely laughable.

People think Superman is overpowered, but not once do I hear "Thor is overpowered" or "Hulk is overpowered", considering they have no weaknesses. Hulk's personality disorder? That is dead. That's not an excuse as a "weakness" anymore. Thor's "pride"? That's the past too. Seriously, people need to think outside the box. I feel as though fans criticize without reading, and the comments on this page seem to solidify that point.

Guess what? If Superman just succumbed to every single piece of Kryptonite that was presented to him, how can the stories progress anywhere? *pulls out Kryptonite. Superman dies.* Really. That's what I'm reading from most of the comments posted on this page. Let's consider the fact that Superman has to struggle with his humanity and place in the world. Superman Grounded explored that. His place among the people of Earth that he loves and grew up with. No other character can capture that emotional tie to the people of Earth like Superman can. That's what I love about him. And in regards to Kryptonite, I'm pretty sure the YEARS of sun-exposure have given him the strength and the willpower to fight through it's radiation. Like you said, heaven forbid if a SUPERman is anything but. Lol. Ridiculous.

People really speak without having any knowledge on anything. I don't know how relevant Batman is to comic readers, or to society in general, or to anyone really. Spider-Man is relateable. He's a teenager, struggling with his love life with Mary Jane, and he happens to be a superhero who has to carry New York City on his shoulders. Kind of a lot to bare for a teenager. Superman? The hero that all of us inspires to be. A larger than life individual who portrays the goodness that all human beings can do. The type of people they can become. And yet he still struggles with his humanity and his place among the people. I love that sense of humanity that Superman has. Batman? Yeah, let me kill my parents real quick. Lemme get back to you. Lol. And walk through the shadows with my smoke pellets like a ninja. Seriously, Batman is the least relateable character. Hulk? Let's get mad. And I don't think people want to relate to multiple personality disorder. Thor? Gods do not exist. Unless you want to take the "pride" aspect of Thor into account, but even Thor proved how too much pride is bad. Way to go, Odin! Teach him a lesson! Lol. Seriously, the most relateable comic characters in existence are Superman and Spider-Man. People just don't read Superman comics, hence why they spew ignorance from their mouths.

And regarding Lex Luthor? I couldn't have said it better myself. Superman has an amazing rogues gallery. People just... I don't know. They just don't read Superman comics.

Hear, Hear!! :))

It's not necessarily that Superman is too powerful... it's that he & his powers are flawless.

You can't compare him to the Hulk. Hulk is an idiot. And when he's Banner/Hulk sure he's scientific smart he's not as strong cause he's not as angry. Plus part of the appeal of the character is Banner dealing with the monster inside of him. He's not your typical superhero... Regarding Thor: his dad could stomp him. So many enemies in Asgard would kill him if he didn't have help. It's part of his ragnarok recurring history. He's also often cocky and headstrong, so fairly easily tricked. He's a tough SOB but he's not invulnerable... These are flawed characters. Makes them identifiable and makes them able to lose. So when they overcome those flaws and win it is an accomplishment. Superman never seems to be the underdog, and when he's written that way, it feels contrived. Yeah, you could say Hulk vs Superman would be a great fight! But seriously, only if the writer dumbed superman down for that moment. All he'd have to do is use his super speed, fly him to space and throw him away from oxygen. Only one comparable is Surfer, but even he needs his board and Galactus created him and could stomp him anytime!

Superman doesn't need to breathe, but has super breathe! He can see through walls and shoot lasers out of his eyes. Super speed. Super smart. Super hearing!!!! Why would he need super hearing? Super strength. Flight. Invulnerability. I mean he's got everything. It's like the writers/creators just wouldn't stop! It's like everytime they wrote him into a corner, they'd just give him another superpower... to excess. It's not like he can just see through walls, he can see halfway around the world and into a wall in china or pluto! You'd have to combine daredevil, Thor, cyclops, flash to get close to his skill set and you still don't have super smarts and would need to breathe... and eat... I mean the guy doesn't get thirsty right? Flash has to eat like 5 supersized big macs as an appetizer. Thor's drinking mead like it's out of style.

Like I've said. Great iconic character. Comics wouldn't be the same without him... I'm sure they have reduced his powers, but it doesn't feel that way to the layperson.

But for those of you who don't understand what people mean when they say he's too powerful... I understand why you love him, got it. But you can't see that "too powerful" perspective? He's really an ideal. All that power and he still cares about saving cats. That makes him great. Understood & agreed. But people's grievances as to why they don't find him as interesting as they would need to in order to buy his comics, have validity.

On the whole, I agree with 99% of the comments; Superman's stories are making him less and less relevant to why he was the first and greatest superhero of all time. Superman is and always will be, my favorite character and yes he has very weak stories because he is so powerful.

IDEA: Have a storyline where he gets some of those godlike powers taken away and then he may be relevant again. Think about it, after the loss of power he will NEED to call on others to help him. The Justice League will have a NEED for more than one member because superman will be lacking in some areas. The villains will have a chance at defeating him and he will have a much harder time thwarting them.

When are we going to get to the point where Superman is written because the writers feel he HAS to be rather than NEEDS to be? Hopefully the new team with Lobdell can change all that and make him the iconic character he deserves to be. (No pressure)

Oh, BTW......

modunhanulon July 31, 2012 at 12:10 a.m.

Without Grant Morrison, I don't think Action Comics is worth to read...

Without Grant Morrison gives people a reason to read Action. He's confusing as hell and is a horrible writer......

Powers & Physics. One of the biggest problems with many writers is that they don’t research enough Science to make it believable and thus create tension. For example, if a bad guy attacks a commercial airplane from the outside and a few stewardess are blown outside, Superman needs to re-seal the pressure on the cockpit, so his super-breath could do that. But the fallen stewardess need rescue, however the human body can only withstand so much pressure from G-force that Superman would have to bring them inside the plane rather than accelerated downwards to the ground landing each to safety. Superman can fly fast, but at some point human ribcages collapse if we fly too fast. Then, if he wants to steer the damaged plane, he can’t just lift or push into it because his power would just puncture the haul because the energy would be distributed only to the point of pressure. Steering could be a major problem, the wings could cause the plane to nose dive or spin out of control; he could remove the wings but risks further maneuverability issues. One way to ’safely’ land, is to remove the combustible airplane wings that often house the fuel, then below 10,000 where the oxygen is more prominent he could create an ice cocoon from his super-breath to create a protective structure for an emergency landing; he could even add more ice at the bottom-center to make it more manageable.

Personality. As a legal-Alien myself, I can tell you I can identify myself to Superman, but not sure many people want to. He’s an Alien, rural-farmer country folk, and a nerdy reporter uncomfortable in the big city. That doesn’t appeal to the spoiled bitchy selfish ironic pop-culture savvy characters that seems to be the standard of cool to many hard-core nerds, it seems any deviation of this is too much work for the reader and therefore lame; which is no surprise most act like this regardless of coming off immature. Superman needs more observational narrative the way Rorschach had in Watchmen (only observational narrative - not the tone, violence, or messed up views), Inner Thought Bubbles can leads us into the mind of Superman. “Why do the fat humans order non-fat lattes but keep gaining weight?” or “This hotdog meat, I saw it running on the subway last Monday along with it’s fellow rodents” or “why is that nerd wearing a superman shirt yet he contradicts the logo by being a homophobe troll online?” or “this city smells like pee, but no one suggests more public bathrooms”. Yes for the most part he is a do-gooder, but that hasn’t stopped our Troops from conveying interesting stories, nor our local police or fire-fighters and coming off relatable. And the best time I’ve spent talking to all these three groups come from their everyday observations. So a man who can fly and see through walls, would have some pretty damn good stories to tell.

The Journalist. You know how all that news stuff thingie is like totally boring, lame, and like omg annoying? Actually no. Maybe to someone who lives in a bubble, any news from outside said bubble is a downer. But with Wiki-Leaks, the Arab spring, the collapse of printed papers in the developed world, and the newfound liberation of the internet in 3rd world countries…there has never been a better time to be a journalist in a fictionalized manner. 45 killed and 35 missing journalists in Mexico alone last year, 140 since 2003 in Iraq, and that’s just two places to write about. This is the brilliant part of Superman, it’s creators made him a Reporter for a reason, to divulge the injustice of the age and to make kids aware of it. Concealing said evil results in a man-child society that seldom feels worth, and asks why the terrorist hate us without ever giving a damn outside of their pop-culture bubble. How can we demand Superman to be realistic and relatable if we shy away from the real gritty reports Journalist Clark Kent might give us?

Enemies. Superman can just beat anybody right? Sure, just like we can put a bullet into the skull of every person we don’t like, but that doesn’t make it right or solves all problems. In the classic Novel (Movie) Star Ship Troopers we’re given a glimpse into a pseudo-fascist regime thinking violence and superiority being better for solving problems -“force my friends is violence. The supreme authority from which all other authorities are derived”. The book is mocking this, just like 1984 mocked the concept of Big-Brother. Superman was created against this view that physical superiority expressed in violence automatically makes the individual a better person. Superman can prevent a suicidal bomber from going off, but he can’t stop the hate. He can prevent Lex from his plans, but without proof no court system will jail Luthor. He can destroy Brainiac, but is unable to stop us humans from wiping out species that we’ve made extinct and are only viewable on the internet. Superman has the great villains, the problem is, many writers can’t attach a villain to a great concept and execute it properly because they have to dumb down the stories; which results in fan-favorite brawls. I grew up with the Columbine Generation, so being a nerd and somewhat being picked on, I was disgusted that those two would shoot up a school out of frustration. Superman is a nerd like us, and yeah he could punch out a guy into the sky as we can shoot anyone, but the point is being better than using violence to overcome problems.

Iconography. When Grant Morrison showcased All-Star Superman, he was able to showcase an Icon with groundbreaking ability as a writer, he showed the why of Superman. Everyday writers need to take the Icon and use it for social commentary. For instance, with the salary of a Journalist Clark Kent would live in a crappy apartment. Sure, that is obvious. But what if instead he broke into Condominiums, Lofts, Luxury Townhouses when their yuppie or wealthy elite owners were away on business? It’s not like he’d steal anything, he’d just use the bed to sleep, the bathroom to brush his teeth, etc. With his Super-Man abilities, he could listen into conversations and figure out a schedule to be able to live comfortably in the 1% houses within Metropolis, a sort of Robin Hood nod to the Social Crusader origins of Superman. The story could get out, and the Media might try to make Superman a bad guy, but the support of the people might give them an excuse to place a red piece of cloth outside their Metropolis run down blue-collar apartment when the 99%ers not using it so Superman can crash at said place when the owners are away. No one would rob your place if you did that in Metropolis, they might think “oh man, Superman might be there”. And for little kids reading this in the real world everywhere, leaving a red cloth hanging from their window could be like leaving Santa Cookies on Christmas. For us adult readers, it’s like, Superman can live with us, we welcome him because he is one of us.

To paraphrase Lex Luthor (of all people action figures) in JustSomeRandomGuy's Zero Hour videos: "Nobody looks up to you Superman, because they don't want to strain their necks!"

More writers need to stop trying to "humanize" Superman, and recognize him as the ultimate leader; a scrupulous politician. Even though he doesn't have the authority of those figures, his powers DO give him a similar responsibility. He has a responsibility to first the Superman Family, then Metropolis, then the World (these are not always mutually exclusive; If all of Metropolis blows up, that includes Lois, Jimmy, Perry etc. If all of the Earth blows up... game over for everybody, including Metropolis and including the Superman family, regardless of location).

I agree at least partially with about the Superman comics being about moral/ethical priorities more than physical or mental challenges. Superman's black-and-white viewpoint is perfect to play with in a grayscale universe. I honestly would like to see him take over from a street leveler or something, in a storyline like the times he appeared during no Man's Land.

Of course there's always the reverse: Superman gives us his all, what do we owe him? Should governments or even individual citizens make efforts to at least control things like Kryptonite and red-sun devices? I don't know, just thinking... on the internet.

On an unrelated note, I'd love to see more Red Son-style stories where they play with his history -- for example, the background for Supergirl (kara Zor-El, not the others) has always been that she was supposed to take care of the infant Kal-El. What if that had happened? Or what if Jor-El's recommendation for Krypton to enter the Phanom Zone had been followed? What would the Kryptonese culture have been like? If they'd all had rockets, where would they have gone? I don't know, just a thought.

@BushidoBlack said:

There is nothing wrong with being a boy scout. Captain America is a boy scout and we see how that doesn't effect his popularity outside of comics. I think it's just a combination of what many folks in here have already said.

Captain America can be a boy scout, but he has the common sense to kill when it's necessary.

@bigsoto74 said:

@caesarsghost said:

Great article, and while I completely agree with the "no awesome new villains" I love the new de-powered Superman in the New 52, especially in Action Comics but you see that he is having a tougher time handling the villains in Superman too.

I did not know he was depowered and I might have to check it out. I am collecting the new Aquaman. I never thought I would ever admit to that, but I really like what they did to him and did not over do it.

Oh yeah, I am collecting the new Aquaman too, I think its awesome in every sense of the word.

I would invoke the idea that Silver Age power levels for Superman should be rekindled in the New 52 as evidenced by Grant's Supes masterpiece in All-Star Superman...but then againm that was also merely a self-contained 12 issue maxi series that hasn't been expanded on. I guess then it does make sense to have him at his power level without it being too much. I think its just a matter of storylines. We've just had too many mediocre stories for so long that a real overhaul changeup is needed. I mean in all honesty despite my love of collecting Superman stories, the last real Man of Steel tale that had charmed me was the 5 part Brainiac! story arc from about 4 years ago. That's a long time to really just have mediocre stories since then.

I don't like Superman. I have no problem with him being too nice. In fact, there are not enough really nice heroes out there for me.

My problem is 1: too powerful so there's no tension and comic writers keep changing his levels so it's hard to keep track, and 2: IT'S ALWAYS LEX LUTHOR!! I am so sick of how everything has to be related to Luthor. I liked it when he was an evil business man. Making him president was so stupid and I can't STAND how his and Clark's lives have to intertwine together since childhood. That's ridiculous. You could have a archenemy that you had no connection with until the first meeting.

My favorite interpretations of Superman are "The Adventures of Superman" starring George Reeves because they emphasized Clark Kent getting things done over Superman doing a minimum of effort to save the day which is blah, and "The animated series" starring Tim Daly because Superman had a variety of events to deal with and not just Luthor even though it was the cool Luthor version, and I liked how quiet Daly's Superman was. He didn't so snarky which fits Superman I thought.

The only thing i really like about Supe is his unwavering goodness. I'm only 22 though. So i don't have some innate love for him. I think his villains are ok in that they find ways to give him a challenge, but i don't find them interesting at all. Why is Lex the way he is? Lex is obviously uncontrollably narcissistic, but what is the background on his past? Every DC villain can't be the Joker. Most villains have to actually be interesting for people to like them. The better the villain the better the hero. Which brings me to my second point. Supe can't get much better than he already is.

I've personally always felt that supe being a member of the JLA detracted from all of the other members, and himself. It always seemed to me that Supe is just around to protect the other JLA members, and to punch stuff that they can't. He should be a deeper character than that. It's hard to create both a character with incredible power to punch stuff, and a character that has deep characterization. It's the same reason i don't like Red Hulk. I love Supe for what he is, but what he is is a lost alien puppy dog that runs around wagging his tail to fit in with everyone. LET'S SEE HIM GET MAD, AND BREAK A PLANET IN HALF!

i ranted.

You know what's really not cool about Superman? Letting Grant Morrisson do whatever he wants in Action and keep it a secret so that the other title, Superman, sucks balls.

I like Grant Morrisson... a lot... but what DC did there was just putrid and awful. For a while, I genuinely started believing that Morrison's Action Comics must be taking place in yet another universe.

Superman as well as other superhero's were created in the beginning as "heroes" who stopped crime and saved people from harm. But now they seem to focus mainly on the grudges that they have with the villains, and "who can beat up who?" or, problems within their team, and they just forgot what these heroes were created for in the first place. They are supposed to be able to defeat anyone. "They're Superhero's" !!! That save the world.

'Death of Superman' is a good Superman-Story?

So that would mean Supes has to die first to get a good Superman-Story? o.O

That's kinda ironic..:p

The odd thing is many people who dislike superman for being too powerfull are fans of Thor,Silver Surfer, and the Hulk. How is that for irony?

@sabracadabra said:

The odd thing is many people who dislike superman for being too powerfull are fans of Thor,Silver Surfer, and the Hulk. How is that for irony?

not very

Superman has a ton of villains, the problem is writers always fall back on the same ones:

Lex Luthor, Brainiac, Zod, Metallo, and Bizarro.

Hard to have more interesting villains when you focus on the same 5....

Superman, just like always, gets the short end of the stick...for everything. Always gets the worst writers, none that can do him justice because they have no creativity to write awesome Superman stories. I pretty much noted that DC doesn't seem to give a damn about the Man Of Steel, given how they have treated him so far in the run. If anyone is to blame for any of this, is DC, because they are pretty much the ones that control everything that happens in the DC Universe. They pretty much taken risk with Batman( Someone I will touch later on this rant) which in the end actually is what made him so popular. He wasn't always the dark and gritty character he is today. Read the Silver Age comics and see how ridicules the stories where.
  
Powers: 
How is he overpowered? When did people get this idea of Superman being over powered? He is powerful, because...HE'S SUPERMAN. He is supposed to be powerful. What would you want him to be? Regularman?Normalman? I think that's all B.S. He doesn't have a lot of superpowers, all of his senses are heighten to a extreme proportion that would make us humans view him as powerful. He is supposed to be the most powerful Superhero on Earth, at least in these standard. But no he is overpowered...Just like everyone else have mentioned, look at Hulk, look at Thor, Shazam, Black Adam, Gladiator, Hyperion, Sentry, ect. All of these beings have the same powerlevels of Superman, but no, Superman is the only one here overpowered, but Thor can beat him and so can Hulk. >_> Are you kidding me? All of those guys are as powerful as Superman. LOOK AT BATMAN! the guy is just a human guy, but he is a walking Deu Ex Machina. He can beat anyone with prep and beat Superman with a banana. And you don't call him overpowered? You are pretty much being an idiot if you don't call them as well ''Overpowered''.  This isn't the Silver Age. that's why I always love John Byrne powerlevels.

He is too Good:
 So? Is it wrong to be good? Look at the world we live on today. its filled with darkness, is it bad for someone to help you if you fall? Being Superman has a lot of pressure, he CAN get angry, he has actually, he CAN feel tragedy, he has in the comics. I always kinda filled mixed about the whole boyscout persona, mainly because it can get boring every now and then(cause I wanna see Superman kick some a$$), but you can be a good person and not be a boyscout. That's how I would like for him to be written. Kinda like in Action Comics 1. Be good, but won't mind getting his hands dirty. That path proved to be interesting, but unfortunately, i only saw that Superman in like 3 or 4 issues of Action Comics.
 
Villain:
 I would probably blame Lex Luthor for this part and probably the reason why people think he is ovepowered. But if you take away Lex, Superman has pretty cool villains. Probably because writers always recycle the bald guy, is the reason why you don't see them. Every time Superman fights Doomsday, Mongul, Darkseid, Metallo, Ultraman, Zod, Gog, Bizarro, Cyborg Superman, ect. He is fighting for his life and the life of others. Most of the guys I mentioned are either equal to Superman or are physically superior to him. Back in the Pre-Crisis Age, Superman couldn't beat neither Darkseid or Mongul. Mongul was specifically created to be a physical and mental thread to Superman. And Superman only beat him once back in that age and he immediately passed out after he beat Mongul, because he gave it his all. Helspont still has the potential to be a good Superman villain. Just needs to be done right this time.
 
Stories:
 I will admit that when Superman is written bad, is boring. But written well he equals Batman written well. This one goes to the writers they assign to Superman. Just like I mentioned, Superman gets what's left over in anything really. Batman for the most part, always gets the best writers in the biz, Aquaman has been awesome, so has Wonder Woman, and Green Lantern. But Superman got crappy writers. Now you are telling me Grant Morrison is leaving Action Comics. Sad that someone as big as Supes always gets screwed over by DC. Pre-Flashpoint wasn't good neither. We had like 2 years of sucky stories and you had Superman off his main book and replace by someone else...I look at his doppelgangers and they have proven that Superman can indeed be successful and popular again. they just need to get the right writers for Superman, who has good ideas and can do awesome stories. Kinda sometimes think that vertigo writers can do Superman justice. DC needs to do what they did to Batman and actually take risk. Give Superman someone else to love besides Lois Lane, kill Lois lane, make stories that even his super powers can solve everything, give him more cosmic type of stories or give him controversial topics, ect. Its all in your hands DC, you are just to scared to see the potential.
 
Look at Superman's Animated Series, it was awesome. Take that as an example. DC just needs to stop sucking on Batman and pay attention to their other Most Famous Superhero. Now is the chance, especially since his movie is coming out next year, and most likely and animated series.

@mettlekm said:

@sabracadabra said:

The odd thing is many people who dislike superman for being too powerfull are fans of Thor,Silver Surfer, and the Hulk. How is that for irony?

not very

Seriously? Thor and Surfer are as powerfull,if not more so, than Superman. Also, as powerfull as supes is, there many people that can beat him.So lets not that say he is too powerfull.This comment isnt for you specifically, just to people in general who say supes is unstoppable or too powerfull.

@sabracadabra: Sorry for being abrupt! I put a post about a dozen posts up from this one. Just my viewpoint... too perfect, or too flawless vs too powerful.

I am really trying to restrain myself from going on a rant right now because these are the most common, and ignorant reasons to dislike Superman.  -He's too "goody goody" and is a boyscout -He's too overpowered  Both of these stem from ignorance from people who have probably either read really old Superman stories, or none at all and can be easily dis proven by simply READING A modern Superman story.   I hear it all the time how "Oh he's too powerful" I know, god forbid a character named SUPERman to be super, and if you read his stories you will see the dangers he faces, the enemies he encounters often times are just as, or more power than he is, yet he puts his life on the line, like all superheroes to defeat them anyway.As a side note, for the him being overpowered argument, I find it a bit odd that people always pair him up against Marvel's Thor and it's quite a heated debate over who would win, yet I never hear a "Thor is too powerful" complaint.    As for the other two reasons,  -Him having bad villains.   If the truth was the sun, this would be Pluto that's how far away it is from it. Lex Luthor to me is one of, if not THE greatest villain in comicbook history,How is in many ways symbolizes the worst in man, the greed, the deceptive nature, the distrust of others different and foreign to us, while Superman represents everything man can be, the good aspects, loyalty, respect, love, how Luthor is more than just an ''evil villain'' but rather believes he is truly doing the right thing by helping the world be rid of Superman and aliens like him. Just as the Joker is the opposite side of Batman, Luthor is the polar opposite of Superman (Sorry Bizarro)  then you have General Zod, Metallo, Brainiac, Darkseid. I mean besides Batman, Spider-Man and Flash, No other hero has such an interesting group of rogues.  -Him having bad stories  Red Son, All Star, Birthright, The entire New Krypton Arc, Death of Superman, Up, up and Away, Secret Origins, For the man who has Everything, Whatever Happened to the Man Of Tomorrow say otherwise.  Superman to me is the single greatest and most influential character to ever burst from a comic book and has done more for superheroes than any other character I can think of. You can make fun of him, his morals, what he stands for, but at the end of the day, he is the greatest superhero to ever ''live'' and in my opinion does more than just fight crime, he inspires us (both the reader, and the fictional characters he interacts with) to be better, to strive for a better tomorrow, and I for one will always be a Super fan.

I don't know why Tony thought the Man of Steel teaser was amazing. I thought it was super boring and needlessly dark. Superman is not a dark character and trying to Nolanize him will do nothing to make people love him.

What's so interesting about that trailer? Like I really would like to know nothing about it impressed me. It came off as pretentious and self serious.

I "get" Superman quite a bit, but I've never had much interest in him as a character outside of Animation or in quick guest spots/Batman team ups. I plan on Reading All-Star at some point as well as Casey's Adventure's of Superman as soon as I get a chance though. I have enjoyed greatly Silver Age superman stories because he's a total prick in them and they just so bat $hit insane.

But Superman being a boy scout and "too good" is why I like the character.

EDIT: Everything is "dark and gritty" nowadays. Superman is refreshing.

These are all the reasons I'm not a fan of Superman. He just doesn't do it for me; however, if not for his existence or his being the way he is I don't think I would have such an attachment to the other heroes I enjoy. He gives me something to compare Hal Jordan and Bruce Wayne and while those two can even be suckers sometimes I always think, "Well at least they aren't Superman." and then continues to enjoy the comic.

That said I am going to read Geoff Johns Secret Origins for Superman, I haven't read anything about Superman in years and I've decided to give something another go.

There are multipul stories of people who have the "ultimate powers of the universe" who can and will do anything, but they have to watch the ones they love die. Hell they did it in the Superman Animated series where they rid us of Joel Schumacher pathetic attempt at a comedic relief, a bumbling Clark Kent, and gave us back the investigative reporter that he started as.

While the "Truth, justice and the American way," stance no longer entertains readers and the "Lets give Superman any power to get him from this bind," comes off as a deus ex machina that ultimatly drags the story down would you respect Superman any more if they removed any of his powers? Lets just take the basic powers he has: Heat Vision, Frost Breath, X-ray Vision, Flight, Super Speed, Super Strength, and Super Hearing, which would you have them remove?

Now, I understand that not alot of people like the Boy Scout, Law-full good heroes, but in today's ever changing world there has to be a voice of reason. If every hero where like the Punisher, or every hero where Batman imagine how boring that would make comics. Can you imagine Peter Parker saying, "I'm the god-damn, Spiderman?" As a joke sure, but honestly you'd hate it. Now imagine Superman brusting through a gang leaders house and just heat visioned everyone's face off, lame the fight would end in three seconds.

Enemies wise, I read someone earlier say toy man sucked... Did you watch Smallville?

Mainly, and I hate to do this, I blame the writers. If you can't write a tragedy like the greeks could with a half-god you've no place in Superman comics.

Blame the writers, they fucking suck. Seriously this whole reboot was a fail for Superman. I though WE would finally have a grounded, more real Superman but DC fucked that up, he hasn't changed a bit. Even i can come up a good story with Superman

I think Superman needs to stay the way he is. I love him as the boyscout true blue super hero! The guy you feel you can always depend on. There's a WHOLE MESS of characters out there that are dark, brooding, gritty, and angsty. We don't need Superman joining them!

@The Stegman: Mate, you just made my day. Kudos.

this just goes back to "SUPERMAN NEEDS TO BE A UNIVERSAL HERO!!!!" Metropolis is cool, i love it but it is to small for him. Its like having a fully grown shark protecting a town pond (if they could survive but you get the picture) from other fish. Getting him out of Metropolis would help them get away from the Lois and Clark schitck that they just revised. He has the power to be on Storm Watch and or take on an entire invasion by himself he doesnt need to be saving cats from trees. Kara or Kon-El could have stopped the threats in Metropolis.

As for better villains, they are building up Metallo and they need to bring in Parasite and maybe Lobo.

DC please expand Superman beyond the normal Superhero bc he is not your average superhero.

maybe superman ran of out stories to tell? I mean he's had over 1000 solo issues(action comics is 900 but he had other solo comics).

g-man said, "You can't just throw a bunch of villains that can compete with his strength. He is meant to be the strongest there is."

It's easier to come up with villains for batman because he's just a "regular human".If you have mythical roots like Wonder Woman or Thor, you'll have no problem with coming up with villains for the stories.

You can't keep on having generic alien monster keep coming.

@The Stegman said:

I am really trying to restrain myself from going on a rant right now because these are the most common, and ignorant reasons to dislike Superman. -He's too "goody goody" and is a boyscout -He's too overpowered Both of these stem from ignorance from people who have probably either read really old Superman stories, or none at all and can be easily dis proven by simply READING A modern Superman story. I hear it all the time how "Oh he's too powerful" I know, god forbid a character named SUPERman to be super, and if you read his stories you will see the dangers he faces, the enemies he encounters often times are just as, or more power than he is, yet he puts his life on the line, like all superheroes to defeat them anyway.As a side note, for the him being overpowered argument, I find it a bit odd that people always pair him up against Marvel's Thor and it's quite a heated debate over who would win, yet I never hear a "Thor is too powerful" complaint. As for the other two reasons, -Him having bad villains. If the truth was the sun, this would be Pluto that's how far away it is from it. Lex Luthor to me is one of, if not THE greatest villain in comicbook history,How is in many ways symbolizes the worst in man, the greed, the deceptive nature, the distrust of others different and foreign to us, while Superman represents everything man can be, the good aspects, loyalty, respect, love, how Luthor is more than just an ''evil villain'' but rather believes he is truly doing the right thing by helping the world be rid of Superman and aliens like him. Just as the Joker is the opposite side of Batman, Luthor is the polar opposite of Superman (Sorry Bizarro) then you have General Zod, Metallo, Brainiac, Darkseid. I mean besides Batman, Spider-Man and Flash, No other hero has such an interesting group of rogues. -Him having bad stories Red Son, All Star, Birthright, The entire New Krypton Arc, Death of Superman, Up, up and Away, Secret Origins, For the man who has Everything, Whatever Happened to the Man Of Tomorrow say otherwise. Superman to me is the single greatest and most influential character to ever burst from a comic book and has done more for superheroes than any other character I can think of. You can make fun of him, his morals, what he stands for, but at the end of the day, he is the greatest superhero to ever ''live'' and in my opinion does more than just fight crime, he inspires us (both the reader, and the fictional characters he interacts with) to be better, to strive for a better tomorrow, and I for one will always be a Super fan.

Excellent points, I really agree with what you have to say. I actually write for a website and wrote my own article about Supes's positive attributes and a break down of why people aren't fond of him, but should be. If you're interested, feel free to check it out (no pressure, of course): http://moarpowah.com/2012/02/16/silverwolfs-den-superman-or-how-i-learned-to-stop-worrying-and-love-the-man-of-steel/

I love Superman, just to preface this next statement...writing for him is like writing for Jesus. A buddy and I were having this conversation a couple years ago after watching Richard Donner's cut of Superman II. He's the strongest of all the DC Heroes. He saves mankind time after time. He has "bible" like values (thou shall not kill etc...) and he stands for truth, justice and the American way. I think with faulty writing it is impossible to write for a character like him. It's a catch 22, when he dominates an opponent it's boring. When he actually gets into any trouble or actually loses a fight, it's not believable. What a set of circumstances for a writer going in! All that being said, the best Superman stories have been written by the BEST writers DC has had. I thought the "Public Enemies" arc a few years ago by Jeph Loeb was one of the best storylines because Supes had to rely on Batman and Captain Atom to save the world from President Luthor. Granted a giant Kryptonite metor was heading straight for earth but these types of plot devices are needed when your character is akin to our lord and savior. However, great Superman stories exist and they will be there in the future. I'm not losing any sleep about that.

I've always thought that Superman's lack of villains was just a cop out, cuz I think some of them are pretty decent, like Luthor (or course) and Darkseid as mentioned before. Maybe his other villains need to be re-imagined a bit. How about a Metallo that's not just a sort of android with a chunk of Kryptonite, but one with the ability to engage with computer systems on a world wide level? Or instead of a mischievous Mr. Mxyzptlk, maybe he can be a truly evil and sadistic wizard from another dimension?

I love the character of Superman and personally don't think he's over powered or one-dimensional. I always thought his greatest weakness was never Kryptonite but actually circumstance. Here he's supposed to be the greatest hero on earth, yet he STILL cannot save everyone if he tried.

DC editorial will never let Superman change in any permanent or significant way. He isn't so much a character as he is a mascot for the company. Writers do know how to make him interesting, it's just that DC wants him to be the way he is forever. That's why all of the best Superman stories are either out- of- continuity or involve Superman analogues.

You know Superman was intended to entertain children, and people get smarter as they grow older, so naturally you're interest's will change and thing's you were once entertained by as a child may now seem boring. Maybe you should try reading a different comic. I'm sure children still love Superman.

I think good Superman stories can happen! However, I think DC needs to be much more strategic when approaching Superman. I don't think I would have a monthly Superman title. As Tony eluded to, Superman stories are just too difficult to think of. I say, give the writers some time to think of great Superman stories and only have it come out bi-monthly--six issues per year. This will hopefully keep Superman fresh and exciting.

Also, I know some people may roll their eyes, but there needs to be writer who can relate Superman to Jesus Christ. Superman should go through very difficult trials and tribulations, he should be falsely persecuted, Superman shouldn't be liked by everyone, and most importantly, Superman should make an impact in his universe.

I can go on, but I think DC needs to think about intelligent ways to revamp Superman.

I will start off by saying I don't, nor ever have, read a lot of Superman. Not a favorite character of mine. With that said, I feel it almost impossible to make Superman relevant these days. When Superman rose to prominence 70 years ago, the world was a different place. His boy-scout antics and unflappable values were inspirational back in the day and reflected the values and beliefs which America was built upon. He was truly an American hero. Someone who always rose above, somebody who never did wrong, someone we could all strive to be more like. Well America is in decline big time, and so is Supes. Are the two related? Probably not, but its interesting nonetheless. I'm not saying politics and Superman are intertwined or anything like that, but I do believe the ideologies and beliefs of the general populace do play a role in a characters popularity. Supes' ideologies and beliefs and actions matched up with those of the nation way back when, leading to his popularity and iconic status. Nowadays we can see that America is a flawed nation who no longer values the things that it used. However, Supes is still a completely flawless character who never loses, and seemingly is never in any real danger. Maybe his character should change to better reflect the nation - someone who has flaws, but instead of trying to hide them, celebrates and embraces them. If Superman has no shortcomings, then how can he ever come up short? Nobody's perfect, and nobody wants to read about someone who is.

IMO one way to make Supes more interesting would be to have him make more mistakes. A civilian dies, an innocent bystander gets it, a building full of people blows up before he can get there. Even with all his power he shouldn't be able to save the day every time. His innocence and humility should be spun into weaknesses. Superman plays by the rules - he needs villains who are the exact opposite. Unfortunately for Supes he does have an extremely weak rogues gallery and maybe somebody out there just needs to write better villains for him. Or maybe better stories. For instance, Batman, the other flagship DC character, has had the RIP, Battle for the Cowl, Return of Bruce Wayne, Dr. Hurt, and Court of Owls events in recent years. Those were all great stories, some of which depicted Batman near or at his breaking point which was fun to read. Maybe someone needs to write a story like that for Supes. Something dark where he basically gets broken mentally and physically. Seeing him, an alien, go through more realistic and human struggles would make him much more easy to relate to and much more interesting. Holy rant Batman!

You know Superman was intended to entertain children, and people get smarter as they grow older, so naturally you're interest's will change and thing's you were once entertained by as a child may now seem boring. Maybe you should try reading a different comic. I'm sure children still love Superman.

just don't make him a boy scout, treat him seriously by giving him real serious flaws, give him some new badass villains that have potential to be up there with Darkseid,Lex Luthor, Brainiac, General Zod, and Metallo, and write his current and more lame villains to be more actual threats to superman

@SandMan_: this I know. point being?

You know what really makes superman not cool? Endless complaints from everywhere.....