Current Hyperion is far stronger than Current Superman. That's a blury fact. But fact nonetheless. If they fought, Supes will be beaten to the pulp. Well, it doesn't really matter. Superman is still more interesting and a ripoff will always be a ripoff.

@sog7dc:

Hyperion didn't have to push with the same strength the Universes were pushing. The force exerted by Hyperion didn't have to be equal/opposite level of force - he would just have to be durable enough that the Earths breaks before his hand does.

To better illustrate my point, imagine you're in Hyperion's position.

You have your hands streched horizontally.

In each hand, you're holding in your palm a baloon [the two Earths]

Now, imagine say, a truck [the two Universes], slowly pushing against the direction of your baloon.

You're holding them apart until the pressure is too great for the baloons, but that doesn't mean you're as strong as the truck. You're just strong enough for your elbows not to turn backwards, because you're more durable than the balloons, until they eventually break [the Earths didn't pop like the balloons, obviously, but you get the analogy].

It doesn't mean you're actually strong enough to stop the trucks [the two Universes] themselves from advancing.

Know what I'm saying? Hyperion didn't display the strength to hold two Universes back. He displayed the strength to hold two Earths, until the pressure was too much for the Earths and they broke.

@sog7dc: That mean,this feats more like durability feats

here,why worlds break another explanation

Realistically (speaking from a comic book angle of course) Hyperion never applied force to two different universes when he kept the earths from hitting each other; his feat alone was directly related to the two planets only. Through comic-book physics, the universes were wrapped around those respective Earths, being pulled along like your finger pressing on plastic wrap.

@thanosismad: Basically correct，I'm just waiting hickman explanation why hyperion surviving it,Obviously, this must be a reason,but if final writer explained that this is due to his extreme durability,i'm would be no any doubt

just for now,i cant got it,because even odin or other skyfather cant surviving,i dont know hickman is try tell us hyperion>skyfather or cosmic being,but my first impression is that what we are missing a key factor for why hyperion surviving

the another how can hyperion held apart of worlds,the hickman says will be explained in the nexts,he isnt explanation why hyperion not touch them,And he admits it will explain in the future, which gave me for now, a premature conclusion is unwise,we needs waiting,hickman would be explained why hyperion held them and why hyperion surviving

the writer isnt Interested hyperion how powerful

@killemall said:

@lvenger said:

I agree. Both Hyperion's incursion feat and Superman's benching the planet for 5 days aren't accurate representations of what they can do.

Honestly, after Lobdell taking over, i am not so sure about the later. The second mention of Superman being able to kick moon out of his own orbit, and repeated mention of Superman being the most powerful character on earth, again and again by the writer all sort of feats, Superman being able to lift Earth.

Its a high end feat but under Lobdell i find that feat surprisingly acceptable now, which i did not before.

You mean New 52 Superman? Not Pre Flashpoint Superman? In any case my knowledge on the High Evolutionary is sorely lacking. I only know him from his first appearances in early issues of The Mighty Thor and he didn't seem all that tough. But I guess he must have been amped later on.

New 52, although i dont see them as significantly different, current Superman at least seems physically stronger and faster in travel than the old counterpart.

High Evolutionary, has progressively only grown more and more powerful, after all that was the whole point of him trying to evolve. After Thor, he had an appearence in Hulk, where an enraged Hulk needed almost an entire issue just to break apart his armor, when seeing his mistake HE effectively asked Hulk to put an end to him and refused to even fight back.

There is actually an odd instance where High Evolutionary has gone up against Galactus and lost though.

Now he has completely control of his body, even in the said issue he heals his arm instantly, and a lot of varied powers (he used neither against Hyperion though, sadly).

Oh and since you havent read the issue here is the Hyperion vs High Evolutionary fight if you are interested.

Gallery

The Iron Man that got stomped was just an empty robot if I remember correctly. Tony is out in space with the Guardians of the Galaxy I think. Why Marvel are making Iron Man a cosmic hero I have no idea. Anyway sounds like you read the issue so I'll take your word for it there. But if you remember The Amazing Spider-Man #694 - Alpha, Part 3: Final Grade Terminus took on the Avengers there and Alpha managed to basically solo him. Granted he did draw power from the expanding universe itself and was getting more powerful by the day but he didn't have all that many feats or experience. And he made Terminus look like a wimp. So he doesn't have all too many consistent showings.

While Iron Man himself isnt inside the suit, its still his most recent suit, or well second most recent than Godkiller, that was given to the Avengers , so it should be much different from Iron Man himself fighting.

I dont take his defeat against Alpha as a bad sign, given how powerful Alpha was meant to be, specially given Alpha's next story arc, where he only got back 10% of his power, and still seem to have pretty much every power in the book, at pretty high level. A small discharge of his power changed a human to a monster that nearly took out and entire city.

That being said, this Termius was one repaired and possibly upgraded by High Evolutionary, who pretty much excels on that department, but i am not drawing Hyperion being more powerful than Thor based on him being Terminus solely, but how the issue has Thor and Avengers fair against Terminus and how Hyperion faires against him.

Since you havent read the issue yet, here are the scans, do let me know if you find i am missing something

Gallery

Agreed

A friend nerdier than I am stated that Superman is the most overhyped character in terms of power, more so than even Galactus. That says a lot.

If we were to compare their highest end feats, Marvel NOW Hyperion probably takes the cake. Otherwise, I think New 52 Superman has a better diversity with his powers and a more consistent power base. Hyperion is a bit behind in that book I think.

Aren't ALL of hyperions strength feats unquantifiable?

Wait, stronger than SA Supes too? Really?

@sog7dc: No

Hyperion isnt push two universe,he push two planets and fail,also he not withstand two big bang,but survive universe destroyed,scan isnt show hyperion tank any explosion or any explosion was happen,but fanboys deliberately hype

Same points like odin fanboys trying hype odin destroy galaxy which never happen

Lol - i love the way how Hickman just openly mocks all the "OMG can you explainz how comic book power happens in comic book and who is most powerfullest when Earth can move universes!!!??" questions.

Hickman is basically writing Superman in the MU with Hyperion so i imagine they would be shown as pretty much dead even if the two ever met up in some crossover or whatever.

As far As I Know Right Now According To Science And Thee Charactor Has Made SUPERMAN Is Beyond Way,Way Far Stronger Than Marvel Hyperion....SuperMan CAN Lift EveryThing Infinity Thee Figure 8 Infinity And It means EVERYTHGING!!!!!

He isn't even stronger than Post-Crisis Superman.

He does have two planetary feats, though, I wouldn't say far stronger, more so on the same level. When Hickman is writing it at-least.

He'd beat Truth Superman.

Hyperion would stand no chance but Supreme... Now that's a whole other matter.

Supreme is basically the most powerful version of Superman without any weaknesses (except one that isn't easily explored) and a level of control over his powers it puts Superman to shame.

Not because Superman doesn't have the potential to match Supreme, but rather the writers choose to keep Superman as he's basically been since the 90's

@heavenlydarkdragon: Well I'd say the difference in Superman and Supreme's character formulas is that Supreme is more of an exploration of a Silver age type Superman character under modern circumstances. Whereas Superman got changed from his overpowered Silver Age state to a far more restrained Post Crisis depiction so Superman could be explored in a more modern context. That's why Superman has stayed the same for decades, which is something I know you hate.

@lvenger:

There's nothing wrong with change. Something I also know you hate.

Even a small amount of change is way better than giving hints on Superman tremendous potential but do nothing with it.

In another forum I came across this interesting debate, where apparently in the same comic, Superman tried to see in the entire EM spectrum at the same time but was unable to do so, because of what they called sensory overload. But then he focus his vision and apparently now he can see in the Emotional Spectrum. He was able to see the yellow light of fear.

And some were debating if since Superman could see in the EM spectrum, if he could or should possess powers based on that. Not like the rings obviously, but more like Superboy-Prime when he absorbed the energy of the Guardian that tried to kill him.

Long story short, I simply commented by saying that whatever that was, it was a one time thing. Just like when Morrison showed Superman using Microwaves to fry electric equipment or Snyder showed Superman using Gamma radiation. Even within what should be Superman natural power set, he doesn't use it. And he doesn't use it, because writer's have this inability/fear to write Superman even near of what he should be capable of doing.

I mean... See in the entire EM spectrum at once. Superman was shown not being able to do it, mainly because there would be no real excuse to say Superman can't see through led, or he can't find someone. So they chain up Superman, while doing the most ridiculous stuff, like saying his son should already be more powerful than him just because he's human. The human ego saying that anything that includes human in it, like a alien-human hybrid is by default stronger than the most evolved species. Real Dragon Ball science.

We've seen many characters evolve over time, power wise, even losing their weaknesses or having them greatly reduced. Superman however if anything he's even more vulnerable now. Before he even had the kryptonian Torquasm art to at least protect his mind, now anyone with a strong enough telepathic power can give Superman a run for his money.

Nobody wants an unbeatable Superman. Simply a Superman when Batman or anyone else calls him one of the most powerful beings on Earth, I don't start laughing, given the sheer amount of weaknesses he has.

At least Supreme, although OP, the stories were good and even fun to read.

I don't need to read the comic to know Parallax will either be removed by Sinestro mastery over fear, or Superman willpower will beat it off his body. But after that the simple fact he was able to see in the Emotional Spectrum will be brushed under the rug.

@heavenlydarkdragon: Um I wasn't commenting on anything to do with my opinion on changes to do with Superman, only why Supreme and Superman are different characters. This has nothing do with our past disagreements. I was just discussing your post.

Well yeah that was in the current Superman story arc where Superman managed to see the emotional spectrum with his vision. But I don't get what the point of having Superman Prime like powers would be. Prime only had those powers when he absorbed the energies from the dead Guardian and that just increased his power temporarily. There was circumstantial context to that power.

Actually I think Pre Flashpoint Superman was able to look at gamma wavelengths once or twice but I see the point you're making. Snyder had Superman use gamma vision only once and no other writer repeated that. But where you seem to think Superman's potential is limited, I would say you want too much of Superman. As powerful as he can be, it wouldn't necessarily be a good thing for him to become too overpowered like his Silver Age version.

Superman's seen across the entire electromagnetic spectrum at least 3 times Post Crisis and may have looked at the entire EM spectrum New 52. I can send you the scans if you want because a few writers have had him able to perceive the entire EM spectrum.

I asked Patrick Gleason on Twitter if Jon was more powerful than Superman and he told me that Jon hadn't actually surpassed Superman yet and that during Black Dawn, Superman was still more powerful. So no need to worry about that anymore.

Kryptonite is an iconic weakness though, basically as famous as Achilles Heel when it comes to describing flaws and vulnerabilities. So the chances of Kryptonite being removed are less likely than pigs flying. And a lot of characters are 'vulnerable' to mind control in the sense that they can be mind controlled by a powerful telepath with ease so that's not exactly an uncommon weakness. Plus Superman has actually taken some powerful magic attacks despite being vulnerable to it.

I see, perhaps comics like Supreme, Miracle Man and Majestic are more up your street as I've told you before. Again I'm sorry Superman isn't doing it for you but just because you don't like it doesn't make it bad. Lots of people still like Superman comics I hear.

@lvenger:

Just found it interesting, because usually what Superman can perceive with his senses he can also somewhat replicate. Kinda like when Morrison showed he could use Microwaves to fry electronic equipment, but then no other writer picked on that. And yes, also Snyder's Gamma vision. Instead the only thing done was that awful power called super-flare, that according to what I've been reading in some reviews, it seems DC is now pushing Red K to somewhat explain how Lana got her powers from Clark. Which is kinda funny in my opinion, seeing DC had two great powers, and went with the one no one wanted.

Of course I would never expect Superman to start making willpowered constructs like the Laterns, but the ability to see emotions could work in his favor.

Yes. But that's been one shot's mainly. Like 99% of the time Superman simply can't see in the entire EM spectrum all at once. He usually goes from one frequency to another. Kinda like again in Unchained when they were looking for Lois, and Superman can't detect anything but Wraith tells him to focus on a specific narrow band of the ultraviolet spectrum, and then he sees something.

Also if he could see it all at once, then he would no longer possess the inability to see through led. Even just gamma would be more than enough to see through led. His own power levels, if he really was using X-Rays and not some imitation of it, then he would be able to see through led. Seeing that given enough energy even X-Rays go through led. That's of course referring to actual X-Rays, and not whatever Superman uses.

Yes. Some stories have began to spike my interest. But only a few. And there lies the problem. Quality is still very shaky.

I was recommended to read the Godslayer story. And I did. Only to end up thinking I had just read Marvel's Civil War 2. Because the main issue was the same. If one knows the future, should one act upon it or wait it out, after all like Tony pointed out, are people seeing THE future or A future. One word makes all the difference. And again I got to see Superman lose his powers in minutes because of a red sun, when in the New 52 we were kinda pass that. Seeing then it mostly only stopped him from recharging his powers but he kept them all the same as long as he had energy stored in him. Something I'm honestly tired that DC doesn't make some ground rules on how that is. Either he loses them or he's unable to recharge them.

It's that kind of inconsistency seen in powerfulcharacters that honestly I don't have the patience for it anymore.

Actually no. I read Supreme mostly to see what the big fuss was about. And once I started I read it all. Was okay, good sometimes. Sometimes a little poor but I enjoyed seeing a character using his full potential and not have to worry on outshining those he could easily outshine. But after that I've been following on other less powerful but more consistent characters. Or other types of stories. Like Spawn, reading up on some Star Wars, some Alien and Predator comics. But I'm mostly following Manga stories. So basically that, Manga, Image and Marvel. DC Comics I only really read consistently, Red Hood and Green Lantern related comics.

Superman... I'm mostly keeping an eye out for reviews. And even then I see some weird stuff. Not long ago I was reading a much heated debate, where people were arguing about if Lois Lane had gotten her leg cut or not. And a bunch of other stuff. Because apparently the comic didn't exactly explained if the leg had been really cut, if it was an illusion, and if it was illusion why was she in the hospital. And if it wasn't how did she get her leg back. In a nutshell, it was a mess. So much so I felt glad I wasn't part of that discussion. I simply read some comments and moved on.

The only thing that caught my attention was the revelation that Oz is actually Jor-El. That one was quite the twist. Although I'm not entirely sure if DC made the best decision by being Jor-El. Seeing all previous versions of him all died with Krypton. But if nothing else he was aware of Manhattan and he was around even during the New 52, so the story behind him grabbed my attention. Just hope DC delivers something great. And not another Wally case of, I was trapped and then I escaped. How I got here I have no idea.

no