This has often been discussed, so I'd like to hear your thoughts.

How powerful is your ideal Superman?

How many tons can he lift? 100? 1000? 1,000,000? Planet-moving? In between?

How fast is he? 1000000 mph? 641,999,999 mph? 650,000,000? How fast should he be?

How much damage can he take? A nuclear bomb? A supernova? A cruise missile?

How good are his senses? Can he hear what's happening on Mars?

How good are his reflexes?

If I'm honest, I like Superman to not have limits. I don't want there to be a quantifiable "this how strong" or "this is how fast" because at the end if the day, for me that's not what comics or the characters are about, at least not the ones like Supe's.

@wishiwassuperman: I like this idea. Superman is always testing his limits the more powerful his enemies get.

I like him the way he is now and now he seems to be pretty powerful but i don't want a Superman who is capable of sneezing a solar system away or who can turn back the time, he should always have some limits.

I liked his power levels when jeph loeb was writing him, (don't judge me) he was powerful but could be overwhelmed if the threat was powerful enough

@kumquatodor: I like this question. and I like you. you may be my firend now. I shall be at your house later with starburst and Mario kart

He should have no prescribed limits, but no silly stuff like towing stars, sneezing away planets etc. I certainly like him to survive nuclear bombs, lift anything he cares to and move at super-speed. Its that combination of speed and strength that makes him "super" and able to stand up on the battle forums to most of the marvel pretenders...

@sog7dc said:

@kumquatodor: I like this question. and I like you. you may be my firend now. I shall be at your house later with starburst and Mario kart

I have prepared for you, son of... whoever your father is. I warn you, I have preped for this encounter. I have a blueshell in my utility belt...

I want you to remember, in all your private moments, the one shell who beat... the multiple shells that frustrated every racer to exsist.

I geuss a very powerful Superman could work, but... I LIKE FIGHTS!

I prefer Superman to be weaker; He can lift no more than 1,000,000 tons. He is slower, able to fly no faster than 50% lightspeed. He is more fragile, not able to take major nuclear attacks.

The reason why, I prefer weaker Superman are

1. when he gets hit, I question why he doesn't fly into buildings while going 185,999 mps. I question why he has to hit people several times if he has nuclear bombs for fists and suns for eyes.

2. It also raises the question: how powerful is Shazam/Darkseid/Doomsday? If they are more powerful than Supes, then they could do whatever they wanted.

3. I like the Justice League. Now don't get me wrong. I don't mean nerf Supes so that Bats has something to do. I mean... What's the point of the Flash (ever) if Supes is 90% as fast as him? What is the point of WW? What is the point of Batman if Supes is 10,0000,000x faster at thinking? I prefer Supes to be the Jack of All Stats, so to speak; Not the best at anything, good at most things.

My idea.

1. 800,000 ton strength limit. Stronger people will exceed him, with god-like characters lifting 1,000,000 tons.

2. 16% lightspeed flight. Speedsters like the Flash would be something like 50% speed unless using more dangerous speed force.

3. Nukes will kill him, he needs oxygen, food, etc.

4. He accellerates fast, but not so fast that he could get to top speed immediately. A little slower than MOS movie.

5. Reflexes are related to his current speed. If he is at top-speed, then go he can react faster than if he were, say, staying still. His reflexes are always better than a normal human though.

strongest hero of earth. but not a cosmic character that's not what he's supposed to be.

faster than escape velocity but slower than light, and strong enough to move any kind of earthly objects, fully loaded tankers, buildings etc. but not a planet mover. can deal damage equivalent to nuclear bombs, when he's flying in at high speeds but not that kind of power when he's just throwing punches from his shoulders. Can Survive nukes, tactical nukes without any issue. but would be significantly damaged by a tsar bomb. not surviving supernova's. he can't hear from mars since sound simply doesn't travel in space. reflexes related to speed, can't move faster than light, or react faster but pushing the speed light travels inside a medium of air. not in a vacuum. could outfly some energy blasts when pushing himself to his max.

For me?

Strength:Enough lift our entire universe weight

Speed:Faster than infinity itself

Durable:Could survive universal explode

Breath:Sneeze away Multiverse

Heat:Hotter than big bang

Fly:All dimensions.through Omniverse

Vision:Can see all the multiverse,past,future,all the possible

Hear：Entire omniverse

Cold:Colder than absolute zero

Superman should be as strong as he need,Final,Superman should be infinite powerful,he should be as strong/powerful as Toaa or beyonder

And there I have a weak of superman:

Strength:Move billion of galaxies

Speed:Billion and billion and billion time faster than speed of light

Durable:More powerful than billion time supernova

Breath:Easily blow out galaxy like dust

Heat:Much hotter than supernova

Fly:all the universes

Vision:Can see entire universe

Hear:Entire universe

Cold:as cold as absolute zero

This is weak superman for me

I like John Byrne power levels.

I like him being a good one step more powerful than all the rest,enough to fear his power, but not enough that you couldn't team up and take him down.

When it come to how powerful I want Superman I think of it like the older he gets the stronger he will become but at some point he reaches his limit. So I would say If New 52 Supes ever became the same age as Pre 52 Supes the power level of Pre 52 Supes would be hi max

@z3ro180: in this new 52 he is already above that,atleast when it comes to comparing him to others,and consistency of feats.

I like Pre-Flashpoint Superman

My ideal Superman is strong (push planets), is fast but not fast enough to rival any Flash, with even more sub-par reflexes. Very durable (nuclear bomb sounds good). Science-smart but not above average intelligence otherwise. And low-end super-senses (able to generally patrol Metropolis but no more). He should, however, be able to push against those limits and surpass them if he must.

I think he should be strong enough that he can still have villains who can equal him physically, without them being able to simply destroy the earth in a matter of seconds.

@joygirl: Stronger than all DC hero together,Faster than all flash,smarter than batman,etc

@stephens2177: Truth be told I'm ignoring all two feats that where given to him in H'El on earth. Mainly because, even though I like Lobdell when he started on superman he was giving him feat just so he could have some. Just all in all I would like it if the rumors are true that next September is 5 years in the future and Supes is more or at least closer to his pre 52 counterpart in power and personality.

I'm perfectly fine with Pre Flashpoint levels of power. Strong enough to move planets, durable enough to survive an exploding star, faster than light in travel speed and enough sensory prowess to scour the globe. Plus genius levels of intellect which would make sense given his faster thinking process and total recall/photographic memory. But nothing too preposterous like lifting a star or any of the suggestions made by PowerWoman. That wouldn't be entertaining at all.

@lvenger: not on,y is PowerWoman version of Superman Un entertaining it would be utterly and completely boring.

@sog7dc: There is havering an opinion and there is posting some bland idea hopeing to start something. I have a lot of thread where PowerWoman has posted something like that and a few posts later the enite thread is derailed

I would like him to be #1 in strength category, but then top 5-10 in everything else. It will make him good enough in each category to beat any opponent he comes up against if he uses strategy, but not overly insane powerful so that he can beat the more powerful opponents too quickly. These powers are all based on new 52, and the heroes of earth btw, nothing cosmic.

He is on equal footing with Thor, Hulk and Shazam already. Why would you think otherwise based on his feats? And Apollo's sun blast will probably wear off over time just like sun dipping does.

well @czarny_samael666 explained to me the other day that those other guys have destroyed planets so that means they are stronger considering Supermans best feat is destroying that moon tht knocked him out.

I think its really stupid that it wears off. if that's the case why doesn't his power wear completely off? it just doesn't make sense to me

@sog7dc: That's only in relation to striking power. There's a distinct difference between how much someone can lift and how hard they can hit. For instance, weight lifters can lift more than boxers but boxers hit harder even though they may not be as strong. Thor's best striking power feats come from Mjolnir anyway, not his own fists. Superman's also lifted more than Thor on numerous occasions with more consistency Pre Flashpoint. And that doesn't mean they beat him anyway.

@lvenger: but striking power is really all that matters in a fight

@sog7dc: Yes that is true. However, it also matters how many hits you can get in and that's something Superman can do over Thor and Hulk.

@lvenger: yes very true but can he harm either of them sufficiently?

@sog7dc: Yes of course he can! Thor's reactions are slovenly in comparison to Superman's. He won't be able to land barely any, if at all hits on Superman whereas Superman can dodge practically all of his attacks and wear him down with consistent speed blitzes. Thor's street level reactions means that he won't be able to react to any of Superman's attacks whereas Superman will be able to take Thor down with his combat tactics. Why wouldn't you think that Superman's vastly superior speed and easily comparable physical stats coupled with his nanosecond reactions result in a victory to Superman over Thor?

As for Hulk, the same applies really. Hulk can be worn down with speedblitzes or BFR and Superman can achieve a solid majority. Simple really. World Breaker poses more of a problem but I maintain the same logic for victory and at worst, it's a stalemate since WBH can't touch Superman.

@lvenger: oh ok. I was harboring the logic that if Thor can take planet busting force and superman can't dish that out then superman could not harm thor

@sog7dc: Well following your logic Superman has also tanked planet busting force on multiple occasions so he should be able to take most of Thor's best hits anyway.

For me around Man of Steel levels. I would also limit his super intelligence to just genius levels. I think by giving him solid limitations you can make even better ongoings, focus on the farm boy like Greg Pak is doing.

That sounds very boring

No,superman should be as powerful as TOAA

I think what makes Superman, Superman is that even though he has limitless power and potential, he still remains true to his moral code and never loses his sense of decency, 23 or 42 I doesn't matter, that said, I do not like it to be campy. Superman (in my opinion) should not be able to turn back time or turn into an ant (I know that was never one of his real powers but still...) but instead should be limitless in his own respectable field, Not telekinesis or shapeshifting but super-strength and heat vision and speed and frost breath, and of course.... flight. You know!

Superman has also destroyed another moon, it was probably one of the saturn's ones, without being koed or even damaged and Supergirl did the same with another moon in another star system.

@zandalf:

Superman didn't destroyed that moon, he flied through it.

Hurting =/= winning a fight. I am not sure If You've seen my post of Thor's fights and feats and fights and feats of his enemies. Power Gem Drax was able to one shot planet buster and he fought with Thor twice - both times Thor was giving all he had, because once he was mad and once he belived that he is fighting for perfect universe. Once he won and took Power Gem for himself and once they were in stalemate, unable to KO each other.

And all this people have better ones than Superman. I will send You PM with that scans.

He can harm him. And in fight out of character Superman's wins, because of his greater (1000 times) reflex.

To sum it all:

Thanos and Drax feat is the greatest, because they just matched their strength and pressure destroyed the planet. Similar with Gladiator and Hyperion showing that kind of strength. In similar level is Surfer and Morg destroying a planet by a strength contest, but they actually needs (and it is shown) to boost their strength with Power Cosmic.

Second is strength contest between Thor and Hercules, where they strength didn't destroy planet, but was going to push it out of its orbit (it destroyed chain of mountain).

Then is WB Hulk and Red She Hulk destroying a planet by a side effect of their clash, it is below Thor's and Thanos' feats, because they striked each other not only made a pressure without striking.

Next is Gladiator destroying a planet with his punch.

I could look for more feats like that and some of them are in PM I've send to You.

@czarny_samael666: he has cut it in half

@czarny_samael666: Wrong

1,Thanos and drax just destroy a unknow size of planet,and that need each other force together make planet itself ebb and flow out of balance,that make planet explosion

2,WB hulk destroy planet by energy release and that need red she hulk help did it

3,Gladiator destroy a death planet,also unknow of size

Thor and Hercules never push out planet in orbit,stop lie,that just a panel,not a feat

He would need to be as wide as that Moon to do that. He just made a small hole in it IIRC. Imagine something as small as human body flying through something as big as moon.

@czarny_samael666: Why can't Superman win in character? He speed blitzes many times in character so it's only a matter of time before he resorts to that tactic enabling him to avoid Thor's melee and ranged attacks. Fighting OOC just ensures Superman's victory even more.