timandm's Superior Spider-Man #1 - Hero or Menace? review

I want to bitch-slap myself but... I LIKE this Spider-Man

A part of me wants to bitch-slap myself for liking this 'Superior Spider-Man" but...sigh... I like it. I might even like it a lot... I honestly thought I might just not read the series until they bring Peter Parker back, and we all know that's going to happen eventually. So, I almost didn't bother, but my curiosity got the better of me and...I LIKED It!!!

Without giving away spoilers, let me just say a few things.

  • Doc Ock's mind

I've often wondered by Peter Parker didn't rely on his genius more. Imagine he had... Well, Doc Ock, other than being an evil p---k, is all about using his mind. So put that in Peter Parker's body and... Well, that's what we get here.

  • Peter Parker's wit verses Doc Ock's arrogant and caustic snide remarks

Doc Ock could never match Peter Parker in witty quips, but somehow his arrogance and snide remarks work great in place of those witty quips from Spidey that we've loved for decades.

  • Confidence

Peter Parker is a humble man, which is good, but he so often doubts himself and his own abilities... Otto Octavius, on the other hand, is cocky to the point of being arrogant. But let me point out the difference between cocky and arrogance here.

Cocky - Supremely confidence (think jet pilot)

Arrogant - Having an elevated sense of self-worth.

People who are cocky, are simply very VERY confident in their own abilities. They believe in themselves. Otto simply takes the confidence too far, BUT it is refreshing to see a Spider-Man who does NOT doubt himself... I'll likely get tired of it soon enough, but I have to admit, it is nice to see...

  • The Downside

I absolutely do not want him and M.J. getting romantic... To me, that would be rape and I don't want it happening to M.J... ..or anyone for that matter.

I couldn't help but remember the time that The Chameleon pretended to be Peter Parker and slept with Parker's roomate... That was just wrong... That WAS rape and I hate that he got away with it. I HOPE M.J. will be repulsed by the differences she see's in Peter...

So...bottom line. I like it... I could enjoy this for a while. Also, I can see how this could be a positive thing for Peter when he does finally come back. Sure, Otto is an evil P---k but Parker could learn a few things from him....

Okay, now I have to bitch-slap myself...

9 Comments
Posted by The Lobster

No offense, but it's not rape if she consents to it. That's the definition of rape, forcing sex on another against their will. If Mary Jane or Peter's roommate agrees to having sex with Peter (even if it's not actually Peter) than it's not rape. They said yes to the offer. 
 
If they found out later that they slept with the wrong person, than that's their fault. They should have said no.

Posted by Timandm

@The Lobster said:

No offense, but it's not rape if she consents to it. That's the definition of rape, forcing sex on another against their will. If Mary Jane or Peter's roommate agrees to having sex with Peter (even if it's not actually Peter) than it's not rape. They said yes to the offer. If they found out later that they slept with the wrong person, than that's their fault. They should have said no.

But it's not consensual... If she does sleep with this otto-parker guy, it is because she 'thinks' she's sleeping with Peter Parker. She is consenting to sleep with Peter Parker, NOT Otto Octavius...

Let's say, a person wants to walk into the secret labs of a hi tech company and perhaps try out their new devices and get a feel for them.... Now, this person isn't an employee, and is actually someone who is banned from the company's property.

So then, this person puts on a disguise and passes them self off as an employee and gains access to the labs where he or she is actually banned....

Now, is that person, in your opinion, guilty of breaking in and entering? Or was it perfectly legal because the company 'chose' to let that person into their lab?

M.J. 'thinks' she's talking to and hanging out with Peter Parker. if they have sex, it will be because she THINKS she's having sex with Peter Parker. It won't be consensual....

Posted by The Lobster
@Timandm said:

@The Lobster said:

No offense, but it's not rape if she consents to it. That's the definition of rape, forcing sex on another against their will. If Mary Jane or Peter's roommate agrees to having sex with Peter (even if it's not actually Peter) than it's not rape. They said yes to the offer. If they found out later that they slept with the wrong person, than that's their fault. They should have said no.

But it's not consensual... If she does sleep with this otto-parker guy, it is because she 'thinks' she's sleeping with Peter Parker. She is consenting to sleep with Peter Parker, NOT Otto Octavius...

Let's say, a person wants to walk into the secret labs of a hi tech company and perhaps try out their new devices and get a feel for them.... Now, this person isn't an employee, and is actually someone who is banned from the company's property.

So then, this person puts on a disguise and passes them self off as an employee and gains access to the labs where he or she is actually banned....

Now, is that person, in your opinion, guilty of breaking in and entering? Or was it perfectly legal because the company 'chose' to let that person into their lab?

M.J. 'thinks' she's talking to and hanging out with Peter Parker. if they have sex, it will be because she THINKS she's having sex with Peter Parker. It won't be consensual....

Otto is Peter Parker, it's no different if Peter went from socially awkward nerd and became an abusive alcoholic on his own free-will. They changed the character from point A to Point B but he's still Peter Parker. While it's Otto's mind it's still Peter Parkers body. Cut him, it's Parker's blood. Take a photo, it's still Parker's image. Clone him, it's Parker's DNA. Otto IS Peter Parker in a structural sense. He's not impersonating Peter Parker, he IS Peter Parker. 
 
So she'd still be having sex with Parker. 
 
It's a tough case to argue, but this crime pretty much falls in the rape by deception category. But that still implies that someone is pretending to be someone else. Otto isn't pretending to be Peter, he IS Peter. It'd be kind of like if a clone had sex with the original's partner. Structurally it's still the same person so her consenting to that person is still valid because it IS the same person.  
 
It's a tricky and very complicated case, but seeing how it's still Peter's body. Yes I don't think it'd counts as rape, it's still a sick twisted thing to do, but it doesn't count.
Posted by Timandm

@The Lobster : Yes, it is still Peter's body. but that doesn't mean it's really Peter Parker...

How about this, do you think Dare Devil killed Bulls Eye? or did a Demon, using Dare Devil's body, kill Bulls Eye? How about Ben Grimm during Fear Itself? Did Ben Grimm murder a bunch of people in New York City, or did a powerful Asgardian entity murder those people using Ben's Body? It was Dare Devil's body, and it was Ben Grimm's body, so does that mean it was them that committed those murders?

Now, you say Otto isn't pretending to be Peter, but HE IS... He has not told ANYONE that he, Otto Octavius, switched bodies with Peter Parker. When he speaks to himself, he calls himself Otto, not Peter. He still thinks of himself as Otto, and he thinks of Parker as Parker.

When one falls in love with someone, they don't just fall in love with their body.... Well, they SHOULDN'T fall in love with just their body. M.J. loves Peter for who he is as a person. She's known him for most of her life and loves his heart, his courage, his compassion, and all those in-trenchant things about a person you cannot touch. Otto is simply wearing Peter's body and trying to live Peter's life, but he ISN'T Peter Parker.

What about the Chameleon? Do you not think that was rape?

Posted by The Lobster
@Timandm said:

@The Lobster : Yes, it is still Peter's body. but that doesn't mean it's really Peter Parker...

How about this, do you think Dare Devil killed Bulls Eye? or did a Demon, using Dare Devil's body, kill Bulls Eye? How about Ben Grimm during Fear Itself? Did Ben Grimm murder a bunch of people in New York City, or did a powerful Asgardian entity murder those people using Ben's Body? It was Dare Devil's body, and it was Ben Grimm's body, so does that mean it was them that committed those murders?

Now, you say Otto isn't pretending to be Peter, but HE IS... He has not told ANYONE that he, Otto Octavius, switched bodies with Peter Parker. When he speaks to himself, he calls himself Otto, not Peter. He still thinks of himself as Otto, and he thinks of Parker as Parker.

When one falls in love with someone, they don't just fall in love with their body.... Well, they SHOULDN'T fall in love with just their body. M.J. loves Peter for who he is as a person. She's known him for most of her life and loves his heart, his courage, his compassion, and all those in-trenchant things about a person you cannot touch. Otto is simply wearing Peter's body and trying to live Peter's life, but he ISN'T Peter Parker.

What about the Chameleon? Do you not think that was rape?

I'd say that while they weren't in control of their actions, they are still responsible. It's the same as the sleep walking debate. About that guy who slept walked over to his wife's families house and killed everyone. He wasn't responsible for their actions cause he was in a subconscious state, but he still killed those people. 
 
He may be Otto in the spiritual sense, but in a physical sense he is Peter Parker. So he is both Otto Octavious and Peter Parker. But he's still Peter Parker physically. 
 
Indeed, M.J. knows Peter, which is why she should know that something is wrong and refuse to even go near him. If she's not smart enough to see that there's something wrong with this new Otto-Parker, than it's her own fault. Which is the same for the those who slept with someone thinking they were someone else. They should know their partner well-enough that it shouldn't happen but they shouldn't also be put in that situation.
 
The Chameleon wasn't actually Peter Parker, cut him he still bleeds the blood of the Chameleon. So what he did was indeed rape. This is different because of the fact that Otto has Parker's DNA so technically he is Parker.
Posted by Timandm

@The Lobster : Well, I do see your point. but I still believe, while Otto may be wearing Parker's body, he isn't Parker.

I will say, however, that even though I do think it would be rape, there's no way that he could ever be convicted of rape. Even if one could prove, in a court of law, that Otto had possessed Parker's body, there are no laws against such a thing... So he could never be convicted of a law that doesn't exist...

Posted by The Lobster
@Timandm said:

@The Lobster : Well, I do see your point. but I still believe, while Otto may be wearing Parker's body, he isn't Parker.

I will say, however, that even though I do think it would be rape, there's no way that he could ever be convicted of rape. Even if one could prove, in a court of law, that Otto had possessed Parker's body, there are no laws against such a thing... So he could never be convicted of a law that doesn't exist...

Than I guess we shall shake hands say "Good Debate" and agree to disagree.
Posted by Timandm

@The Lobster said:

@Timandm said:

@The Lobster : Well, I do see your point. but I still believe, while Otto may be wearing Parker's body, he isn't Parker.

I will say, however, that even though I do think it would be rape, there's no way that he could ever be convicted of rape. Even if one could prove, in a court of law, that Otto had possessed Parker's body, there are no laws against such a thing... So he could never be convicted of a law that doesn't exist...

Than I guess we shall shake hands say "Good Debate" and agree to disagree.

Wow... So not used to people in forums with a dissenting opinion, being courteous and mature... We tread unfamiliar waters here... LOL!!!

Yeah, we agree to disagree. and even though I disagree, I do get what you're saying...

Posted by The Lobster
@Timandm said:

@The Lobster said:

@Timandm said:

@The Lobster : Well, I do see your point. but I still believe, while Otto may be wearing Parker's body, he isn't Parker.

I will say, however, that even though I do think it would be rape, there's no way that he could ever be convicted of rape. Even if one could prove, in a court of law, that Otto had possessed Parker's body, there are no laws against such a thing... So he could never be convicted of a law that doesn't exist...

Than I guess we shall shake hands say "Good Debate" and agree to disagree.

Wow... So not used to people in forums with a dissenting opinion, being courteous and mature... We tread unfamiliar waters here... LOL!!!

Yeah, we agree to disagree. and even though I disagree, I do get what you're saying...

If I wanted to not be courteous and mature I'd rant about it over youtube (Which I do) or go to the IMDB forums (Which again, I do). Comicvine is my go to place to have civil intellectual debates. 
 
As do I, I understand where you're coming from even though I find some aspects of it iffy.

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