Lobdell Talks About Starfire

Posted by Mercy_ (92085 posts) - - Show Bio

Disclaimer: DO NOT TURN THIS INTO A SEXISM THREAD. THIS IS ABOUT STARFIRE SPECIFICALLY AND HER CHARACTERIZATION, AS WELL AS LOBDELL'S ANSWERS.

Source

(This is only an excerpt of the portion pertaining to Starfire)

Mike: Obviously the big talk for this month has been the stuff with Starfire. Can you tell us a bit about who she is to you, maybe even who she's become to you now in light of the uproar over her characterization?

Scott: Who she is is pretty much who she is in the first issue. She is an alien who doesn't see the world the same way we do. Shocking! LOL!

Okay, maybe not so shocking.. considering that even on Earth there are many different ways to see the world around us. Heck, people have actually gone to war with each other over their interpretations over who God loves more. I've been to the Middle East where there were three doors to be seen in the entire town, and I've lived in doorman buildings along Central Park -- and trust me when I say that the people who live in each have very different outlooks on things like community and possessions and family.

She is a princess from another world who spent years as a slave in some of the harshest death camps in the universe. To think that we have any idea how her unique world view has been forged by these experiences feels otherworldly to me.

And while I know this is going to make some people angry, the constant wailing and gashing of teeth and tearing of clothing and the shouts of "Unclean! Unclean!" that have made their way across the internet have not altered the pending storyline at all.

How could it? Imagine you are watching a movie and some people in the audience start shouting at the screen... so one character on the screen starts doing what the audience tells her to do. Then another group starts shouting, no, she should do this instead! It would be chaos! LOL!

The story that was pitched is the story that is being written and we'll see how people feel about it when the story is read in its entirety.

Moderator
#1 Posted by jrock85 (2874 posts) - - Show Bio

He also said recently that Starfire was only being sarcastic when she said that she doesn't remember the Titans. *shrugs*

#2 Posted by Joygirl (15369 posts) - - Show Bio

He sounds like a pretty cool guy. eh takes away Starfire's memories and doesn't afraid of fanrage.

#3 Posted by SC (11962 posts) - - Show Bio
@The Dark Huntress said:

Scott: Who she is is pretty much who she is in the first tissue. She is an alien who doesn't see the world the same way we do. Shocking! LOL!

 
Aha.. sorry... just had to... 
Moderator
#4 Posted by WildStyle (331 posts) - - Show Bio

@jrock85:Really? Lol. News to me.

#5 Posted by EnSabahNurX (2310 posts) - - Show Bio

@WildStyle said:

@jrock85:Really? Lol. News to me.

yea it was in some interview on CBR i think he said jason's remarks to roy about star is not completely honest and that he was being sarcastic...etc So star's memory is most likely intact otherwise as a writer he would have a hell of a time writing character who can't remember a darn thing about the people she spends so much time with

Besides he said in an interview prior to the new 52's release that her relationship with nightwing happened so...fingers crossed on her character in the next few issues

#6 Posted by Hawkeye446 (3940 posts) - - Show Bio

@SC said:

@The Dark Huntress said:

Scott: Who she is is pretty much who she is in the first tissue. She is an alien who doesn't see the world the same way we do. Shocking! LOL!

Aha.. sorry... just had to...

Hahaha, awwwwwwww :(

#7 Posted by entropy_aegis (13631 posts) - - Show Bio

Teen Titans histroy is officially OUT.

#8 Posted by Morpheus_ (29873 posts) - - Show Bio
@entropy_aegis said:

Teen Titans histroy is officially OUT.

I don't think so, at least not entirely. It was stated that the team we saw in TT # 1 are (or, rather, will be) the first to call themselves that way, but what was mentioned in RHatO is still applicable. But anyway, past continuity has been pretty sketchy in the DCnU, with few notable exceptions, so we'll have to wait and see.
Moderator
#9 Posted by aztek_the_lost (30740 posts) - - Show Bio

I like this guy

Moderator
#10 Posted by lykopis (10756 posts) - - Show Bio

@The Dark Huntress said:

Disclaimer: DO NOT TURN THIS INTO A SEXISM THREAD. THIS IS ABOUT STARFIRE SPECIFICALLY AND HER CHARACTERIZATION, AS WELL AS LOBDELL'S ANSWERS.

Source

(This is only an excerpt of the portion pertaining to Starfire)

Mike: Obviously the big talk for this month has been the stuff with Starfire. Can you tell us a bit about who she is to you, maybe even who she's become to you now in light of the uproar over her characterization?

Scott: Who she is is pretty much who she is in the first issue. She is an alien who doesn't see the world the same way we do. Shocking! LOL!

Okay, maybe not so shocking.. considering that even on Earth there are many different ways to see the world around us. Heck, people have actually gone to war with each other over their interpretations over who God loves more. I've been to the Middle East where there were three doors to be seen in the entire town, and I've lived in doorman buildings along Central Park -- and trust me when I say that the people who live in each have very different outlooks on things like community and possessions and family.

She is a princess from another world who spent years as a slave in some of the harshest death camps in the universe. To think that we have any idea how her unique world view has been forged by these experiences feels otherworldly to me.

And while I know this is going to make some people angry, the constant wailing and gashing of teeth and tearing of clothing and the shouts of "Unclean! Unclean!" that have made their way across the internet have not altered the pending storyline at all.

How could it? Imagine you are watching a movie and some people in the audience start shouting at the screen... so one character on the screen starts doing what the audience tells her to do. Then another group starts shouting, no, she should do this instead! It would be chaos! LOL!

The story that was pitched is the story that is being written and we'll see how people feel about it when the story is read in its entirety.

The first bolded sentence is very interesting. He uses the word "otherworldly?" Well, he must be an extra terrestrial because obviously the story he pitched originated from his ideas. Oh, but he's a storyteller. He owns the character I see. Never mind the character had a well received fan base prior to the relaunch and he decided to re-create her. Oh. Lived on Central Park - been to the Middle East. Gotcha.

Again, the second bolded portion is interesting as well. "Unclean! Unclean!" Good to know that he is at least aware that many Starfire fans feel he's soiled a well-loved character.

Thanks for the warning buddy. Your new Starfire rang hollow with me and knowing that she will continue along this vein confirms me not picking up this book.

#11 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

I thought for sure I'd replied to this article in another thread. Lemme track down my response.

...

My response from the thread "New Scott Lobdell Interview":

"His answer on the Starfire issue struck me as a big deflection. "Oh some people are different from other people so you can't say she can't be like that and yeah we're staying the course cause we can't change just cause people don't like it or it wouldn't work cause some other people might like it the other way." Never addresses the core concerns with how he wrote her. Never gives his vision for what he was going for vs. what people with concerns saw. Basically read like a big dismissal of the issue, which I think is unfair for those with concerns."

Also, I don't like seeing creators use abbreviations like "LOL" in an interview. I don't really have a justification for that sentiment, I just don't like it.

#12 Edited by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@lykopis said:

Again, the second bolded portion is interesting as well. "Unclean! Unclean!" Good to know that he is at least aware that many Starfire fans feel he's soiled a well-loved character.

Yes, that part bothers me as well. He's clearly being defensive. He's casting his critics as puritanical zealots who view sexuality as broadly negative, totally ignoring the fact that the party which is most critical and feel most aggrieved are those who were fans of the character. And those fans were perfectly fine with her being a cheesecake-heavy, sexual character. It shows once again that he's ignoring the actual points of the criticism. Or focusing on the most extreme and simplistic critics and painting all of them with the same brush. A shame really.

#13 Posted by lykopis (10756 posts) - - Show Bio

@fodigg said:

@lykopis said:

Again, the second bolded portion is interesting as well. "Unclean! Unclean!" Good to know that he is at least aware that many Starfire fans feel he's soiled a well-loved character.

Yes, that part bothers me as well. He's clearly being defensive. He's casting his critics as puritanical zealots who view sexuality as broadly negative, totally ignoring the fact that the party which is most critical and feel most aggrieved are those who were fans of the character. And those fans were perfectly fine with her being a cheesecake-heavy, sexual character. It shows once again that he's ignoring the actual points of the criticism. Or focusing on the most extreme and simplistic critics and painting all of them with the same brush. A shame really.

Well said. Exactly my take on it, thank you for this..

#14 Posted by aztek_the_lost (30740 posts) - - Show Bio

@fodigg said:

Also, I don't like seeing creators use abbreviations like "LOL" in an interview. I don't really have a justification for that sentiment, I just don't like it.

it's either that or *laughs*

Moderator
#15 Posted by SC (11962 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost said:

@fodigg said:

Also, I don't like seeing creators use abbreviations like "LOL" in an interview. I don't really have a justification for that sentiment, I just don't like it.

it's either that or *laughs*

 
Matt Fraction throws in a few ZOMG's and Garth Ennis has also put in a few %&%$ROTF%&$WTF*%&$&$*MAO%$&$* on occasion as well.  
 
I also heard Bendis likes to touch the interviewers ears... not sure how that is relevant but/and you didn't hear that from me. 
Moderator
#16 Posted by aztek_the_lost (30740 posts) - - Show Bio

@SC said:

@aztek_the_lost said:

@fodigg said:

Also, I don't like seeing creators use abbreviations like "LOL" in an interview. I don't really have a justification for that sentiment, I just don't like it.

it's either that or *laughs*

Matt Fraction throws in a few ZOMG's and Garth Ennis has also put in a few %&%$ROTF%&$WTF*%&$&$*MAO%$&$* on occasion as well. I also heard Bendis likes to touch the interviewers ears... not sure how that is relevant but/and you didn't hear that from me.

I like that, a creator who makes things exciting...if I ever become a famous comic writer, I'm going to do every interview with one hand in my pants...see how that goes...

Moderator
#17 Posted by SC (11962 posts) - - Show Bio
@aztek_the_lost said:

I like that, a creator who makes things exciting...if I ever become a famous comic writer, I'm going to do every interview with one hand in my pants...see how that goes...

 
Nice, nice! I'd going to pretend I am the main character of whatever book I am writing. Also a very inappropriately hyper sexualized version of that character, and also of course will speak in third person.  
 
"Well yes, mighty Thor really, really enjoyed writing a story where he fought Loki verily. How much did Thor doth enjoy writing this? Erotically is how much. Thor tries to channel thy Walter Simonsen for this story, so lots of space adventuring and buxom planets and sexy Horse face aliens. Thor really happy to have this gigeth at Marvel. Like floating on cloud nine naked" 
 
I feel sorry for any interviewer who interviews us both on the same day (he might even hit the jackpot and get to interview Alan Moore as well before or after..)
Moderator
#18 Edited by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@aztek_the_lost said:

@fodigg said:

Also, I don't like seeing creators use abbreviations like "LOL" in an interview. I don't really have a justification for that sentiment, I just don't like it.

it's either that or *laughs*

Well, it depends on if it's a live interview or if the interviewer is just sending a list of questions via email to the interviewee, who then types up responses. I guess maybe that's why I don't like it? It makes it obvious (or seem like it is) a fully text-based interview instead of a transcription of a live interview.

#19 Posted by aztek_the_lost (30740 posts) - - Show Bio

@SC said:

@aztek_the_lost said:

I like that, a creator who makes things exciting...if I ever become a famous comic writer, I'm going to do every interview with one hand in my pants...see how that goes...

Nice, nice! I'd going to pretend I am the main character of whatever book I am writing. Also a very inappropriately hyper sexualized version of that character, and also of course will speak in third person. "Well yes, mighty Thor really, really enjoyed writing a story where he fought Loki verily. How much did Thor doth enjoy writing this? Erotically is how much. Thor tries to channel thy Walter Simonsen for this story, so lots of space adventuring and buxom planets and sexy Horse face aliens. Thor really happy to have this gigeth at Marvel. Like floating on cloud nine naked" I feel sorry for any interviewer who interviews us both on the same day (he might even hit the jackpot and get to interview Alan Moore as well before or after..)

HA! I would love to read your interviews...

but I don't either of us can compare to the horrors of interviewing Alan Moore :P

Moderator
#20 Posted by rawr (88 posts) - - Show Bio

@entropy_aegis said:

Teen Titans histroy is officially OUT.

Out? I am not quite sure of that. I assume you mean in his continuity he isn't using any of the pre-new52 Teen Titans stuff. However, in Batwoman#1 Flamebird references her time with the Teen Titans and so it seems that at least in that book pre-new52 Teen Titans continuity is still somewhat in play. We won't know how much is erased until the new Teen Titans book comes out.

As for Lobdell, he has the creative rights to take the characters any way he pleases and as much as the #1 made me want to burn it with fire... it is sales that will dictate whether his book flops.

#21 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@rawr said:

@entropy_aegis said:

Teen Titans histroy is officially OUT.

Out? I am not quite sure of that. I assume you mean in his continuity he isn't using any of the pre-new52 Teen Titans stuff. However, in Batwoman#1 Flamebird references her time with the Teen Titans and so it seems that at least in that book pre-new52 Teen Titans continuity is still somewhat in play. We won't know how much is erased until the new Teen Titans book comes out.

There seems to be some confusion between the creative team on if there was or was not a previous Titans team. From a recent NYCC panel:

Teen Titans editor Bobbie Chase then came onto the stage to talk about her book,
...
Not only are these character meeting each other for the first time, Chase said, in the New 52, this is the first incarnation of Teen Titans, ever.

So yeah. The gist seems to be that those references were for meetings between those characters that did not involve an official "titans" team setup. There's also a quote out there where Didio basically says that "eventually the Perez era will not exist."

As for Lobdell, he has the creative rights to take the characters any way he pleases and as much as the #1 made me want to burn it with fire... it is sales that will dictate whether his book flops.

If only sales corresponded with taste.

#22 Posted by rawr (88 posts) - - Show Bio

@fodigg said:

If only sales corresponded with taste.

From your lips to the masses' subconsciouses.

Thanks for the clarification. I guess Batwoman is the one book that is really bending all the new52 continuity rules then. (Okay I am sure there are other ones, I just ain't reading them.) They aren't even calling her Flamebird (Plebe!) anyway so I doubt it will be a problem.

#23 Posted by fodigg (6094 posts) - - Show Bio

@rawr said:

Thanks for the clarification. I guess Batwoman is the one book that is really bending all the new52 continuity rules then. (Okay I am sure there are other ones, I just ain't reading them.) They aren't even calling her Flamebird (Plebe!) anyway so I doubt it will be a problem.

As far as Animal Man and Swamp Thing are concerned, no revamp happened.

As for Flamebird, well I'm sure it comes down to "she was Flamebird and worked with some of the other "New Teen Titans" but there was never an actual team named the Teen Titans so it was all just individual team-ups. Or something. I dunno. DC has not been very clear.

#24 Posted by ReVamp (22859 posts) - - Show Bio

I didn't like her characterisation. It has nothing to do with sexism, but the way to grow her character isn't by making her forget Dick. Its by making her work through her past relationships.

Just my 2 cent.

#25 Posted by Lonestar88 (170 posts) - - Show Bio
@fodigg said:

@lykopis said:

Again, the second bolded portion is interesting as well. "Unclean! Unclean!" Good to know that he is at least aware that many Starfire fans feel he's soiled a well-loved character.

Yes, that part bothers me as well. He's clearly being defensive. He's casting his critics as puritanical zealots who view sexuality as broadly negative, totally ignoring the fact that the party which is most critical and feel most aggrieved are those who were fans of the character. And those fans were perfectly fine with her being a cheesecake-heavy, sexual character. It shows once again that he's ignoring the actual points of the criticism. Or focusing on the most extreme and simplistic critics and painting all of them with the same brush. A shame really.

This! This so much! He took the easy route and didn't address the actual problem at all. I'm always willing to let a story play out, but based off his reaction, I doubt anything will change. Seems like he took a really interesting character and made her lifeless and easily replaceable.
#26 Edited by God_Spawn (35982 posts) - - Show Bio

I still gotta jump on this series. I know I'm gonna love it.

Moderator
#27 Posted by B'Town (2336 posts) - - Show Bio

@Lonestar88 said:

@fodigg said:

@lykopis said:

Again, the second bolded portion is interesting as well. "Unclean! Unclean!" Good to know that he is at least aware that many Starfire fans feel he's soiled a well-loved character.

Yes, that part bothers me as well. He's clearly being defensive. He's casting his critics as puritanical zealots who view sexuality as broadly negative, totally ignoring the fact that the party which is most critical and feel most aggrieved are those who were fans of the character. And those fans were perfectly fine with her being a cheesecake-heavy, sexual character. It shows once again that he's ignoring the actual points of the criticism. Or focusing on the most extreme and simplistic critics and painting all of them with the same brush. A shame really.

This! This so much! He took the easy route and didn't address the actual problem at all. I'm always willing to let a story play out, but based off his reaction, I doubt anything will change. Seems like he took a really interesting character and made her lifeless and easily replaceable.

Yep, This. All of it.

There are so many other books, I can put my money towards. I hear there is a new Dexter book coming out, now that sounds entertaining. :D

I'm not pulling another issue of Outlaws. If hell freezes over and some drastic earth shattering change occurs, I may... may consider trying another issue, but I doubt it.

#28 Posted by entropy_aegis (13631 posts) - - Show Bio

@rawr said:

@entropy_aegis said:

Teen Titans histroy is officially OUT.

Out? I am not quite sure of that. I assume you mean in his continuity he isn't using any of the pre-new52 Teen Titans stuff. However, in Batwoman#1 Flamebird references her time with the Teen Titans and so it seems that at least in that book pre-new52 Teen Titans continuity is still somewhat in play. We won't know how much is erased until the new Teen Titans book comes out.

As for Lobdell, he has the creative rights to take the characters any way he pleases and as much as the #1 made me want to burn it with fire... it is sales that will dictate whether his book flops.

NYCC Young Justice panel clearly stated that it's out.

#29 Posted by BecauseISaidSo (99 posts) - - Show Bio

@lykopis: I hear you. Apparently in issue #6 which will come out Feburary 15, 2012, they will mention how Kori met up with Jason but I don't think it's going to tell about the whole Starfire "forgetting" her memories. I'll have to wait and see because hey somebody has to read it to find out what's happening.

#30 Posted by BecauseISaidSo (99 posts) - - Show Bio

Scott Lobdell is like Matthew McConaughey, he says that he is listening to you but he is not about your criticism and only looking for the positive comments. He finds Starfire as just an alien instead of a living being. He says that she is faking her memory loss but yet has explained why. If Roy had ask Starfire if she remembered the Teen Titans then he would know Starfire more than Jason Todd does, I mean the guy has known Starfire for how long compaired to Roy??? All Lobdell is doing is just making Starfire a alien sex-symbol and saying it's in her ditzy alien nature.And no just because her adittude has changed does not make her a strong character let alone a female character. Right now she is a sex fighting item and I really hate to say that because I love Starfire and I want her character to be a strong warrior that is not just a booty call. I want her to be like Wonder Woman but in her own way, also Kara looked up to her and Kori was her friend when she felt like an outsider. If that Kara was present in the "new" universe what would she think and say to her. And what I truely hate is that stupid stupid stupid mole on her face, and for GOD'S SAKE WHY IS IT PURPLE THERE'S NOTHING PURPLE ABOUT HER BUT HER OUTFIT!!! We need writer's that are not from the 1970's-1980's Marvel era, but more to either people who did work with DC or new faces. Like for instance Tony Daniel, I hate it that he is writing Batman but I did love him for his original work like The Tenth. I've said this many times and I will say it again, people need to stick with what they are good at!!!

This edit will also create new pages on Comic Vine for:

Beware, you are proposing to add brand new pages to the wiki along with your edits. Make sure this is what you intended. This will likely increase the time it takes for your changes to go live.

Comment and Save

Until you earn 1000 points all your submissions need to be vetted by other Comic Vine users. This process takes no more than a few hours and we'll send you an email once approved.