Feelings on the future relationship between Mary Jane & SSM

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#1 Edited by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

Not good at expressing my feelings here, so please bear with me.

With the current status-quo, with Dr Octopus taking over Peters life. I feel I need to say something.

Not with the fact that he took over Peter's life, but the fact that the relationship that will more than likely happen between him and Mary Jane. For a long time I have followed her story through out Amazing spider-man and other issues, as close as I follow Peter's exploits. And to see a relationship unfolding between the two really make me feel nauseous when ever I think about, so much so I have to lie down and remind myself that this is a story and nothing else, I can tell you it's been difficult.

Especially seeing this (SSM#2)

Superior Spider-man #2

And to top if off, I can't help thinking of what will happen to her emotionally, when she eventually does find out it was not Peter but Dr Octopus she was with. I believe it would be devastating for her and even if Peter does return, that trust and love she once had for him will be shattered and more than likely never recover. Because all Peter will be is as a reminder of what she did. In short it could very well mean the end of the Peter & Mary relationship forever, not even as friends.

I know it's irrational having these feeling & reactions over a fictional character, but I can't seem to help it. I guess for a long time (YEARS), since I was 8, Peter Parker and Mary Jane have been big part of my life, so much so, I have began treating them like real people and to have this happen to them really feels like I was just kicked it stomach and it will be a long time before I recover.

So I was wondering if anyone out there feels the same as I do, and would like to express their feelings on it.

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#2 Posted by Strider92 (16599 posts) - - Show Bio

I honestly think Slott is just trolling us with this. Covers can be very misleading (look at the Ghost Rider Vs World War Hulk one for example). I do not believe that Spider-man and Mary Jane will be getting "together" as such but more to the point that she will be a more integrated part of Superior's life. Ie: Questioning him when he does something out of character, shunning down his advances on her etc..... I think Mary Jane will just play a big part in Superior but no necessarily a love interest.

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#3 Posted by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

@Strider92: I hope so

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#4 Posted by PunyParker (11340 posts) - - Show Bio

@Strider92: This really feels.....just wrong....they are "togrther" in #700.......lets hope you're right

#5 Posted by silverageguy (43 posts) - - Show Bio

In the words of Benjamin Grimm "what a revoltin' development!" After 50 years this is how Marvel rewards its loyal Spiderman fan bsse? first, they destroy the greatest love story in comic book history with a satanic bargain, then they erase 20 years of history.Now they put one of his greatest enemys into his body,give him his life, and kill off Peter Parker. It doesnt matter if Peter returns at some futute date. Shame on the Marvel editorial board for plunging us down this rat hole in the first place. This is no way to celebrate the 50th anniversary of a beloved American icon. I just cant tolerate this kind of convoluted nonsense. I will not be part of this travesty anymore.

#6 Posted by guttridgeb (4832 posts) - - Show Bio

Its kind of creepy...

#7 Posted by Overseer (404 posts) - - Show Bio

If they don't get together then I will still feel VERY dirty until Peter returns and sets the world right. If they do... then I will call it as I see it. Namely as Marvel peeing on Peter Parker's grave.

#8 Posted by Superguy0009e (2265 posts) - - Show Bio

I think what Slott is trying to do is use Mary Jane as an anchor for Otto. Maybe she can put him on the path to good while Peter isn't around.

Give this time, we have no idea what will come from this.

#9 Posted by darthfury78 (881 posts) - - Show Bio

We all know that Dr. Ock is Slott's favorite character.

#10 Posted by gotwillpower (679 posts) - - Show Bio

It's not that bad. I think the interaction in 700 was much more "nauseating" (And in 698? I was really worried then). Superior isn't the same person though. It's not truly Doc Ock, so it's not as bad. Nevertheless, anyone other than the authentic Peter Parker with Mary Jane is messed up.

#11 Posted by Mutant God (3023 posts) - - Show Bio

A guy switches body with another guy and living that guy's life seems so wrong the relationship is one lie especially to Mary Jane

#12 Edited by PunyParker (11340 posts) - - Show Bio

Is it me or...hot red hair....tentacles....EBEbeowjdpsjfddf no no no no...STOP!!

ock you sick bastard! not me....HIM!!

#13 Edited by NightHaunter (111 posts) - - Show Bio

I think either Bleeding Cool or CV had a good little piece on whether this is rape.

Personally I think any sexual interaction involving Superior SM is creepy and wrong. If a woman sleeps with Otto believing he is Parker he has deceived them and raped them. I think it could be a valid part of the story if the deception part is explored, and he doesn't just start a relationship with MJ.

Makes me glad Gwen isn't alive to see this!

#14 Posted by Teerack (6606 posts) - - Show Bio

It literally makes me sick. It's rape, and it's disgusting.

And if Mary Jane is fooled by Doc Ock's ruses and never figures it out she does NOT love Peter Parker. I like Peter and Mary, but if she can't see through this her "love" for him in my eyes will always been tainted and I will never consider her Peter Parker's "true" love again.

#15 Posted by muhabba (301 posts) - - Show Bio

@silverageguy said:

In the words of Benjamin Grimm "what a revoltin' development!" After 50 years this is how Marvel rewards its loyal Spiderman fan bsse? first, they destroy the greatest love story in comic book history with a satanic bargain, then they erase 20 years of history.Now they put one of his greatest enemys into his body,give him his life, and kill off Peter Parker. It doesnt matter if Peter returns at some futute date. Shame on the Marvel editorial board for plunging us down this rat hole in the first place. This is no way to celebrate the 50th anniversary of a beloved American icon. I just cant tolerate this kind of convoluted nonsense. I will not be part of this travesty anymore.

You are my soul mate. I agree 100% Plus if MJ & Superior Spider-Man hook-up with her thinking it's actually Peter, that's rape. How is this a good idea?

#16 Posted by JakeN7 (12645 posts) - - Show Bio

Stop crying "rape" people. Superior Spider-Man is basically a hybrid of Peter and Otto. He's pretty much a completely different person (not to mention he's still a fictional one.) It's not as if the nerdy, chubby, dude with a bowl cut is violating her with his tentacle arms. She's choosing to do whatever she's gonna do consensually, albeit under false pretenses.

@Strider92 said:

I honestly think Slott is just trolling us with this. Covers can be very misleading (look at the Ghost Rider Vs World War Hulk one for example). I do not believe that Spider-man and Mary Jane will be getting "together" as such but more to the point that she will be a more integrated part of Superior's life. Ie: Questioning him when he does something out of character, shunning down his advances on her etc..... I think Mary Jane will just play a big part in Superior but no necessarily a love interest.

They tongue wrestled in #700 though...

@gotwillpower said:

It's not that bad. I think the interaction in 700 was much more "nauseating" (And in 698? I was really worried then). Superior isn't the same person though. It's not truly Doc Ock, so it's not as bad. Nevertheless, anyone other than the authentic Peter Parker with Mary Jane is messed up.

^ This

#17 Posted by Moonchilde (1601 posts) - - Show Bio

@Teerack said:

It literally makes me sick. It's rape, and it's disgusting.

And if Mary Jane is fooled by Doc Ock's ruses and never figures it out she does NOT love Peter Parker. I like Peter and Mary, but if she can't see through this her "love" for him in my eyes will always been tainted and I will never consider her Peter Parker's "true" love again.

^This.

#18 Posted by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

I should also add to that I also can't help thinking of what will happen to her emotionally, when she eventually does find out it was not Peter but Dr Octopus she was with. I believe it would be devastating for her and even if Peter does return, that trust and love she once had for him will be shattered and more than likely never recover. Because all Peter will be is as a reminder of what she did. In short it could very well mean the end of the Peter & Mary relationship forever, not even as friends.

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#19 Posted by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio
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#20 Posted by muhabba (301 posts) - - Show Bio

@JakeN7 said:

Stop crying "rape" people. Superior Spider-Man is basically a hybrid of Peter and Otto. He's pretty much a completely different person (not to mention he's still a fictional one.) It's not as if the nerdy, chubby, dude with a bowl cut is violating her with his tentacle arms. She's choosing to do whatever she's gonna do consensually, albeit under false pretenses.

@Strider92 said:

I honestly think Slott is just trolling us with this. Covers can be very misleading (look at the Ghost Rider Vs World War Hulk one for example). I do not believe that Spider-man and Mary Jane will be getting "together" as such but more to the point that she will be a more integrated part of Superior's life. Ie: Questioning him when he does something out of character, shunning down his advances on her etc..... I think Mary Jane will just play a big part in Superior but no necessarily a love interest.

They tongue wrestled in #700 though...

@gotwillpower said:

It's not that bad. I think the interaction in 700 was much more "nauseating" (And in 698? I was really worried then). Superior isn't the same person though. It's not truly Doc Ock, so it's not as bad. Nevertheless, anyone other than the authentic Peter Parker with Mary Jane is messed up.

^ This

It doesn't matter if he is a composite of two people or not. If he and MJ are intimate it is technically, legally, morally, and in every way, rape. If a man climbs into a woman's home in the middle of the night, dressed as her husband and has sex with her, it is rape. This being comic books it is possible for someone to wear someones body like clothes but it makes no difference, it is still rape. Just because it wouldn't be violent & he wasn't forcing himself on her, it's rape. There's no way around it.

#21 Posted by gotwillpower (679 posts) - - Show Bio

@muhabba: lol First of all, they haven't had intercourse yet. Second, who the !@#$ cares? We haven't even read Superior Spider-man yet!

#22 Posted by fodigg (6146 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't think they'll just throw them into an intimate relationship. I think we'll get a lot of close calls. Certainly it is and should be creepy. Otto is not Peter and this relationship will be built on false pretenses. The mitigating factor (the mind merge) doesn't eliminate those false pretenses either. If Slott does go into that territory, I hope he approaches that question head on rather than ducking it like so many other stories have that deal with similar fantastical bait-and-switch romances.

#23 Posted by ngroove (321 posts) - - Show Bio

@silverageguy said:

In the words of Benjamin Grimm "what a revoltin' development!" After 50 years this is how Marvel rewards its loyal Spiderman fan bsse? first, they destroy the greatest love story in comic book history with a satanic bargain, then they erase 20 years of history.Now they put one of his greatest enemys into his body,give him his life, and kill off Peter Parker. It doesnt matter if Peter returns at some futute date. Shame on the Marvel editorial board for plunging us down this rat hole in the first place. This is no way to celebrate the 50th anniversary of a beloved American icon. I just cant tolerate this kind of convoluted nonsense. I will not be part of this travesty anymore.

AMEN to that!

#24 Edited by ngroove (321 posts) - - Show Bio

@Teerack said:

It literally makes me sick. It's rape, and it's disgusting.

And if Mary Jane is fooled by Doc Ock's ruses and never figures it out she does NOT love Peter Parker. I like Peter and Mary, but if she can't see through this her "love" for him in my eyes will always been tainted and I will never consider her Peter Parker's "true" love again.

Don't take it out on poor Mary Jane - Take it out on Spider-editorial, for continuing it.

Seriously, Mary Jane IS Pete's true love / soulmate - every one else, is either too bland (ex. Debra Whitman, Carlie Cooper), or too skanky ( ex. Black Cat), or has and will be too bland or skanky, subjectively my part, because she AIN'T Mary Jane! After all, if she ain't Mary Jane, you know it is so NOT destinied to last, could break as quickly as four issues, six issues, two years, gosh, how many times has Pete been dumped between 1962-1987, 2008-2012...

#25 Posted by NightHaunter (111 posts) - - Show Bio

@animehunter said:

There's an interview with Dan Slott I believe everyone should read. Personally it didn't alleviate any of my anxiety over the situation.

http://www.newsarama.com/comics/dan-slott-amazing-spider-man-700-post-game-spoilers.html

Slott really is a bit creepy. If he was stupid enough to have them just enter a relationship (I wouldn't have a problem if the rape aspect is explored) I imagine the backlash would finish him.

And honestly if you don't think this is rape you're a moron.

#26 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

@Strider92: Why am I the only one who finds it strange and actually sort of insulting that Mary Jane doesn't suspect anything whatsoever in regards to "Peter's" behaviour? I mean, he constantly refers to her in a massively dis-respective manner and just brushes off everything she tries to say. Being the one who "knows him best", she should've caught on instantly.

Moderator
#27 Posted by Strider92 (16599 posts) - - Show Bio

@Deranged Midget: This is exactly what makes me think Slott saying Spider-man and Mary Jane getting back together is a play on words. I have a feeling that Mary Jane is going to suspect something and try and find out whats going on with Peter by keeping him close but intimately close. They won't be getting back together but they will be "together". Mary Jane will most likely just be playing a big supporting role rather than a love interest. At least thats how I see it.

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#28 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

@Strider92: Well, if the cover to the second issue is any indication, Mary Jane is evidently disturbed by the kiss. Obviously, most covers are misleading but we can assume that Ock will try to pursue the relationship even further and perhaps, MJ will begin to catch on or she might've already been contacted by Carlie in regards to what Peter said to her before she was caught in crossfire.

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#29 Edited by Strider92 (16599 posts) - - Show Bio

@Deranged Midget: I think something like that will most likely be the case. I can't see a MJ/SpOck thing working (I've decided to call Superior Spider-man SpOck lol!)

On another note I finally decided on an avatar. I've been through like 6 today but i'm finally happy!

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#30 Posted by TDK_1997 (14899 posts) - - Show Bio

I was surprised that MJ couldn't find out that something was different with Peter.He was calling her woman through the whole issue and she was fine with it.

#31 Posted by Deranged Midget (17599 posts) - - Show Bio

@Strider92: LOL! SpOck? That's pretty clever!

@TDK_1997: I know right!? For someone who claims to know him best, she is pretty oblivious.

Moderator
#32 Posted by Earth616 (174 posts) - - Show Bio

@TDK_1997 said:

I was surprised that MJ couldn't find out that something was different with Peter.He was calling her woman through the whole issue and she was fine with it.

I WAS THINKING THAT EXACT THING!!!!! How could she not know!?!?!?!?

#33 Edited by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

@Earth616 said:

@TDK_1997 said:

I was surprised that MJ couldn't find out that something was different with Peter.He was calling her woman through the whole issue and she was fine with it.

I WAS THINKING THAT EXACT THING!!!!! How could she not know!?!?!?!?

I don't think she had any reason to suspect at the time, but if Carlie mentions to her what Peter said to her at the police station, then it's more than likely things regarding his behavior would fall into place.

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#34 Edited by Teerack (6606 posts) - - Show Bio

@ngroove: I'm sorry but it may be the editorial staff's fault she's tainted but she is now and forever will be tainted. You can go on thinking she is Peter's true love, but I will never see her that way, and I know I'm not alone in this point of view.

MJ is joining the forever tainted club with Gwen Stacy.

#35 Posted by Lamenoire (193 posts) - - Show Bio
@gotwillpower said:

It's not that bad. I think the interaction in 700 was much more "nauseating" (And in 698? I was really worried then). Superior isn't the same person though. It's not truly Doc Ock, so it's not as bad. Nevertheless, anyone other than the authentic Peter Parker with Mary Jane is messed up.

in 700 Ock point was to" get something Peter didn't have for a long time". it was truly nauseating since he was in fact trying to get revenge on Peter through MJ... 
 
But we can see that it is gone in 15.1. This was a relief to me
#36 Posted by Lamenoire (193 posts) - - Show Bio
@muhabba:  
I want to point out something first. I agree with you : it is wrong.   
But only morally.
It is not Chameleon pretending to be peter. Legaly, Otto is now Peter Parker. otto isn't petending to be Peter Parker like Chameleon did. 
 
And technically, Superior is kind of an hybrid between them... In your opinion, if a part of otto's personnality went in Peter, it would be the exact same thing ?
#37 Posted by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

@Teerack: I'm sorry but I can't agree with your statement for both MJ and Gwen.

Gwen made a mistake and showed remorse for that decision.

Mary Jane, she is unaware of the situation, so the blame can't be place on her and remember it was Spider/ock who kissed her not the other way round, even if it was, remember she thought she was kissing Peter.

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#38 Edited by Teerack (6606 posts) - - Show Bio

@animehunter: Considering "Peter" has been acting so different you can actually put all the blame on MJ. And if it really was "true" love just looking like someone shouldn't be enough for her to be fooled. I'm willing to bet she'd do the Chameleon if he pretended to be Peter.

#39 Edited by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

@Teerack: but as I said in a previous post

She didn't have any reason to suspect anything at the time, but if Carlie mentions to her what Peter said to her at the police station, then it's more than likely things regarding his behavior would fall into place.

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#40 Posted by gotwillpower (679 posts) - - Show Bio

@Lamenoire said:

@gotwillpower said:

It's not that bad. I think the interaction in 700 was much more "nauseating" (And in 698? I was really worried then). Superior isn't the same person though. It's not truly Doc Ock, so it's not as bad. Nevertheless, anyone other than the authentic Peter Parker with Mary Jane is messed up.

in 700 Ock point was to" get something Peter didn't have for a long time". it was truly nauseating since he was in fact trying to get revenge on Peter through MJ... But we can see that it is gone in 15.1. This was a relief to me

Oh, I don't think 15.1 is the end of it. I'm sure there are plenty more stomach-churning moments to come!

#41 Posted by r3d_rob1n (541 posts) - - Show Bio

@animehunter said:

There's an interview with Dan Slott I believe everyone should read. Personally it didn't alleviate any of my anxiety over the situation.

http://www.newsarama.com/comics/dan-slott-amazing-spider-man-700-post-game-spoilers.html

Slott says in this article, "it's the readers who are going, No! No! No! No! He's a menace! I don't like him! The readers have become J. Jonah Jameson." He wants the reader to become Jameson and turn against the new Spider-man, but why should I spend money to read about a character that I now despise? Doc Ock was one of Spidey's greatest villains, it is fun to read about him when Spidey thwarts him, but this twist in the story is a gross miscarriage of storytelling. The villain just defeated and killed one of the most noble people in the Marvel Universe, and now he is embarrassing every single hero that he comes into contact with. He is taking advantage of the Avenger's trust, Mary Jane's trust, Aunt May's trust. How can anyone view Spidey the same again after this travesty.

Marvel infuriates me. They had a perfect chance to retire Peter in a respectful way if they chose to do so. There were a number of ways that this could have gone down that didn't tarnish Spider-man and Peter. They could have reintroduced a better plotted clone saga (especially with Jackals recent resurgence), they could have injured Peter and had him become a guiding hand to a new Spider-man while still lending his unique character to the book. Instead they have put the mind of a murdering psychopath into one of the most beloved and powerful members of the Marvel Universe.

We all know this won't last forever, but in a way it will. Just as One More Day lives in infamy, so will this. Peter may return someday, but Spider-man and his supporting cast will never be the same. Change is not always a good thing.

#42 Posted by muhabba (301 posts) - - Show Bio

@Lamenoire said:

@muhabba: I want to point out something first. I agree with you : it is wrong. But only morally.It is not Chameleon pretending to be peter. Legaly, Otto is now Peter Parker. otto isn't petending to be Peter Parker like Chameleon did. And technically, Superior is kind of an hybrid between them... In your opinion, if a part of otto's personnality went in Peter, it would be the exact same thing ?

My point is that it doesn't matter who is in Peter's head. As long a MJ thinks it is the real Peter, it's rape. Not violent, not forceful, but rape non the less.

#43 Posted by Funkypanda123 (115 posts) - - Show Bio

Wait didnt peter make a deal with the devil so if he gets with mj againg aunt may dies :D

finally ow old is she like 150 its about time tey killed her of pete (otto)cant alway be a wimpy for her

Shes lived long engouh

#44 Edited by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

Found this article you might find interesting, Nothing official thought, that's what I a really want, an official statement from Marvel regarding this relationship.

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/12/26/rape-redemption-and-the-amazing-spider-man-spoilers/

One of the things he says, is

She is certainly not consenting to have sex with Doctor Octopus. But the sex that she would be having, she seems totally to be consenting to. Indeed, Dan Slott specifically writes this scene so that Doctor Octopus is the one who is voicing his consent, Mary Jane Watson is the instigator here..

This statement really bothered me, because the only reason she would have instigated it, is because she doesn't know it's not Peter, and I doubt she would have if she did know, and to say it's ok because she instigated it, is a slap in the face of what's right.

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#45 Posted by PunyParker (11340 posts) - - Show Bio

@animehunter: Whoa,whoa.....ok,express feeligs, bit c'mon the "Supreme court" and all this are a bit too much....its a fictional character....i dont care if its rape,or not...i care about Mary Jane who i got to love though so many years.....if it was any other woman in another comic,i wouldnt give a damn.....

#46 Edited by animehunter (2006 posts) - - Show Bio

@PunyParker: Like you, If it wasn't Mary Jane I wouldn't be this involved, as for the article I only pointed to it because it gave a different view to the discussion.

Online
#47 Posted by TDK_1997 (14899 posts) - - Show Bio

@Deranged Midget: I was like 'Seriously?Come on MJ!He called you woman a couple of times,does Pete speak like that.'

#48 Posted by PunyParker (11340 posts) - - Show Bio

@TDK_1997 said:

@Deranged Midget: I was like 'Seriously?Come on MJ!He called you woman a couple of times,does Pete speak like that.'

Yeah,you've got a huge point there....

#49 Posted by GundamHeavyarms (701 posts) - - Show Bio

This is my only reservation about Superior. "Spock" sleeping with mary jane under false pretenses is sexual assault. I am interested in reading about how Ock will destroy peter's life. He may pretend to be a hero, but his ego and childish attitude will come through, he calls himself the superior spider man. When peter returns he will probably have no job, the avengers will see him differently and he'll be on the outs with mary jane. He'll be the outcast loner again.

#50 Posted by PunyParker (11340 posts) - - Show Bio

@GundamHeavyarms said:

This is my only reservation about Superior. "Spock" sleeping with mary jane under false pretenses is sexual assault. I am interested in reading about how Ock will destroy peter's life. He may pretend to be a hero, but his ego and childish attitude will come through, he calls himself the superior spider man. When peter returns he will probably have no job, the avengers will see him differently and he'll be on the outs with mary jane. He'll be the outcast loner again.

This is the PERFECT unnoficial reboot.....

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