who else thinks it is terrible that she woman decimated over half of the mutant population, I mean come on hero have to go get regular jobs, how sad and pathetic it would be to see Nightcrawler at the drivethrough for McDonalds

Slight says:

"who else thinks it is terrible that she woman decimated over half of the mutant population, I mean come on hero have to go get regular jobs, how sad and pathetic it would be to see Nightcrawler at the drivethrough for McDonalds "

pathetic i think id laugh my ass off

Sips his chocolate milk.

...

Throws it into the garbage.

Darkchild says:

"Slight says:

"who else thinks it is terrible that she woman decimated over half of the mutant population, I mean come on hero have to go get regular jobs, how sad and pathetic it would be to see Nightcrawler at the drivethrough for McDonalds "

pathetic i think id laugh my ass off"

he'd look more normal than some of the staff in my nearest macdonalds:s

She is right now. It's not only what she did, but why she did it that really makes her a wench. She basically committed a form of genocide to "get back at Daddy".

In an instant she more damage than her father ever did for far more selfish reasons.

And from what we have seen in Endangered Species, she really doesn't care.

The Enigma says:

"Darkchild says:

"Slight says:

"who else thinks it is terrible that she woman decimated over half of the mutant population, I mean come on hero have to go get regular jobs, how sad and pathetic it would be to see Nightcrawler at the drivethrough for McDonalds "

pathetic i think id laugh my ass off"

he'd look more normal than some of the staff in my nearest macdonalds:s"

ROFLMAO!

Nope. I love Wanda now. She was kinda pathetic before, now she's one of Marvel's heavyweights.

Darkchild says:

"The Enigma says:

"Darkchild says:

"Slight says:

"who else thinks it is terrible that she woman decimated over half of the mutant population, I mean come on hero have to go get regular jobs, how sad and pathetic it would be to see Nightcrawler at the drivethrough for McDonalds "

pathetic i think id laugh my ass off"

he'd look more normal than some of the staff in my nearest macdonalds:s"

ROFLMAO!"

LMMO

MK

Wanda is not evil. She's a character who never got mental help. Her life has always been pretty f*cked up, and her relationship with Magneto was pretty bad. It isn't that she doesn't care what she did. She appears to not even remember. Did I mention her kids? Ya'll know, the ones she loved and cared for that were abruptly taken from her?

Pania says:

"She is right now. It's not only what she did, but why she did it that really makes her a wench. She basically committed a form of genocide to "get back at Daddy". In an instant she more damage than her father ever did for far more selfish reasons. And from what we have seen in Endangered Species, she really doesn't care. "

I dont think she was concious of her actions though...like i dont think her intent was to do what she did, it just sort of happened

she did it because of all the terrible things that happened because of human/mutant relations so she "tried" to get rid of one of the problems and put everyone on equal ground

I like Scarlet Witch.

Sucks that she erased almost every mutant on earth...But she's ok in my book.

Sorry, no.

Read her speech just before she did it.

"He..he only wanted you to be happy. Look what you have done to us, Daddy. Pietro was right...you...you ruined us before we even had a chance. Why would you treat your own children this way? Babies. Why? Because you actually thought you were better than everyone else. The arrogance of you. You think because we're mutants we're better than them. That we deserve to rule. That's what you wanted and what I gave you. But look...look what it becomes. Even when you get what you want, you're still this horrible man. We're not the next step. We're not gods. We're freaks!! Look at us Daddy!!! We're freaks!! Mutants!!! You chose this over us and you ruined us!!! Daddy...No more mutants."

Nothing about making the world a better place, just a hysterical rant at her father.

And she was very conscious of what she was doing in that moment. She said it, and she did it. It wasn't case of "I'm really mad!...Oops!" It was "I'm going to wipe mutants off the face to the earth...look I did it."

And in Endangered Species, the message she was giving Hank both in Hank dream and when he encountered her in Wundergore was "Leave it alone." She doesn't want to fix it, she doesn't care.

Post Edited:2008-04-04 15:49:11

Oh....Did'nt know that.

Thanks.

sure she said it, sure she meant it, but she may not have intended for the "magic" to happen. lol. idk...i dont think it was intentional but just a rant

Pania says:

"Sorry, no. Read her speech just before she did it. "He..he only wanted you to be happy. Look what you have done to us, Daddy. Pietro was right...you...you ruined us before we even had a chance. Why would you treat your own children this way? Babies. Why? Because you actually thought you were better than everyone else. The arrogance of you. You think because we're mutants we're better than them. That we deserve to rule. That's what you wanted and what I gave you. But look...look what it becomes. Even when you get what you want, you're still this horrible man. We're not the next step. We're not gods. We're freaks!! Look at us Daddy!!! We're freaks!! Mutants!!! You chose this over us and you ruined us!!! Daddy...No more mutants." Nothing about making the world a better place, just a hysterical rant at her father. And she was very conscious of what she was doing n that moment. She said it, and she did it. "

Insane yes. For one thing, she and Pietro were adopted and raised by a loving couple until they were well into their teens before they ran into Magneto.

However, many criminals qualify as emotionally disturbed, and I don't think that excuses them from responsibility for their actions.

Pania says:

"Insane yes. For one thing, she and Pietro were adopted and raised by a loving couple until they were well into their teens before they ran into Magneto. However, many criminals qualify as emotionally disturbed, and I don't think that excuses them from responsibility for their actions. "

pixelized says:

"sure she said it, sure she meant it, but she may not have intended for the "magic" to happen. lol. idk...i dont think it was intentional but just a rant"

No, it was intentional. That much was pretty clear.

One thing that proves that was despite being within the range of Dr. Strange protective spell that protected everyone else at "ground zero", the Magnus clan still had their powers wiped. Magneto, Pietro, Polaris, Wanda, all of them depowered despite everyone around them keeping their abilities. They were deliberately targeted.

Post Deleted.

White Mage says:

"Pania says:

"Insane yes. For one thing, she and Pietro were adopted and raised by a loving couple until they were well into their teens before they ran into Magneto. However, many criminals qualify as emotionally disturbed, and I don't think that excuses them from responsibility for their actions. "

Burned alive. And while I don't think that it excuses her actions, I also don't think that it is accurate to say that she warped the universe just to get back at Magneto."

Why wouldn't she? I'm not saying she did, but why would that be so unlikely? She was/is crazy. She killed her own husband and destroyed the Avengers. Why would Magneto be beyond her wraith?

I'd say that rant she gave makes it pretty clear what was motivating her at that moment.

There are a lot of people who try very, very hard not to blame Wanda for what happened. But that fact is she said "No more mutants", and there were no more mutants. If someone says "I'm going to kill that person" and then they go kill that person, we can that first degree murder. I don't really know what makes Wanda did so different.

The incidents with her children really started the downward spiral towards insanity. Throughout her fight with the Avengers, she kept saying that no one would take them away from her again, and to stay away from them.

I agree. But there where signs before that as Dr. Strange explains in the final issue of Avengers Dissembled. She broke down on a couple occasions. Personally I love that she was fully aware of what she did, and how she basically told Beast to f off. I cant wait to she what Marvel does with her.

i think her intent was her family [magnus, pietro, lorna] but it went out of control and hit others

I love Wanda. The amount of power she holds is sick. I actually like that the mutant population dropped. There were getting to be too many of them and most were just forgotten or never brought up but once. This gave them a way to get rid of them and not have to worry about them.

Granted I do not agree with everyone who got depowered but I think the idea was good.

pixelized says:

"i think her intent was her family [magnus, pietro, lorna] but it went out of control and hit others"

No, she didn't say "No more powerful family", she said "No more mutants"

Quite frankly, in eliminating mutants so she could not have done more harm to her father if she killed him. By eliminating mutants, he took away everything he had based his adult life on, his adult identity, everything he lived for. By doing that she tore him apart, compared to that, killing him would have been a mercy. He has not been that emotionally torn down since his daughter died and his wife abandoned him.

She was looking to hurt him in the worst way she could, and she did.

Post Edited:2008-04-04 16:20:26

I know so is Emma Frost I liked it when Jean and Scott were together

NEW VENOM says:

"I know so is Emma Frost I liked it when Jean and Scott were together"

Well when she's written by Bendis, whaddya expect? I truly do not believe Scarlet Witch would ever do such a thing. Bendis reduced her to nothing but a mad woman, who really is above what she did.

Bottom line: Bendis if a f*wit.

But she has. Lets not forget she started out as a member of the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants. She's snapped and attacked the Avengers on a couple separate occasions. I guess people have mixed feelings about the new Wanda but I love her.

Yeah, this was hardly the first time Wanda has lost it and turned on her friends.

Honestly, given the number of emotional break downs she has had in the capes-and-tights business, I wonder if after escaping the Brotherhood Wanda should have just married a farmer in Transia and settled down.

Post Edited:2008-04-04 20:49:45

I do wish Marvel would focus on the Magneto, Quicksilver, Wanda, and Polaris family dynamic as much as they do the Summers family. I'm so sick of that family it isn't even funny.

Gambler says:

"I do wish Marvel would focus on the Magneto, Quicksilver, Wanda, and Polaris family dynamic as much as they do the Summers family. I'm so sick of that family it isn't even funny."

Can we let them get rid of Vulcan first. :) lol

But yeah I would like to see them do more with that family, really get Polaris integrated into it.

Andferne says:

"Gambler says:

"I do wish Marvel would focus on the Magneto, Quicksilver, Wanda, and Polaris family dynamic as much as they do the Summers family. I'm so sick of that family it isn't even funny."

Can we let them get rid of Vulcan first. :) lol

But yeah I would like to see them do more with that family, really get Polaris integrated into it."

Uh oh lmao, Pania's gonna go off now hahahaha, she doesn't care for Polaris being Magneto's daughter. In fact she claims it isn't true.

I liked Polaris and loved that idea back in the 90s when I first read about it.

Same here.

Now now, I never said it wasn't true. I said the evidence supporting it at this point in time is very shaky. All we have is one DNA test conducted under very suspicious circumstances. Magneto has never even spoken about the matter on panel and he has never in all of both their long history acted like she was his kid as he did with the twins.

I don't like it because it really doesn't do anything for either character. Magneto is too old and set in his ways for having kids to affect him as a character. We saw that with the twins. In the case of Polaris, it was actually detrimental to her as a character. She basically became Magneto's mouthpiece and a piece of tail for bobby to chase after like she was in the 1960's. She doesn't need to be made into someone's daughter, especially a character so overpowering as Magneto to whom she basically just becomes a toady. She needs to grab Rogue and go off an a road trip to get her character integrity back after being linked at the hip to one guy (Havok) or another (Magneto) for most of her life on panel.

And PAD needs to write it. He's the only one who made Polaris interesting in and of herself.

I also have to admit a personal bias because a bunch of nutjobs with a Lehnsherr family incest fetish from the CBR forums were going around multiple websites saying that not only was Polaris Magneto's kid, but that they had slept together while she was on Genosha. Having that ingrained into my mind, the entire association is now very icky to me.

Pania says:

"I also have to admit a personal bias because a bunch of nutjobs with a Lehnsherr family incest fetish from the CBR forums were going around multiple websites saying that not only was Polaris Magneto's kid, but that they had slept together while she was on Genosha. Having that ingrained into my mind, the entire association is now very icky to me."

That's quite understandable. o_O

Gloom says:

"Pania says:

"I also have to admit a personal bias because a bunch of nutjobs with a Lehnsherr family incest fetish from the CBR forums were going around multiple websites saying that not only was Polaris Magneto's kid, but that they had slept together while she was on Genosha. Having that ingrained into my mind, the entire association is now very icky to me."

That's quite understandable. o_O"

nods at Gloom

What she said.

Gloom says:

That's quite understandable. o_O"

Yeah, at first I was neither-here-nor-there about it Polaris being Magneto's kid. I saw the problems, which I outlined above, but I could see where the soap opera drama was fun to. (And it is very soap opera-y in an already melodramatic family, which is kind of another problem: With all the melodrama between Mags and the Twins, how the heck can Polaris stand out? Either she joins the twins in hating her father or she joins her father and falls into his shadow. She doesn't have any unique options and she isn't strong/interesting enough to stand out on her own.)

But then I ran into those clowns online and that was the end of any positive feelings I might have had about the retcon.

Pania says:

"Yeah, this was hardly the first time Wanda has lost it and turned on her friends. Honestly, given the number of emotional break downs she has had in the capes-and-tights business, I wonder if after escaping the Brotherhood Wanda should have just married a farmer in Transia and settled down.
Post Edited:2008-04-04 20:49:45"

Pania says:

I also have to admit a personal bias because a bunch of nutjobs with a Lehnsherr family incest fetish from the CBR forums were going around multiple websites saying that not only was Polaris Magneto's kid, but that they had slept together while she was on Genosha. Having that ingrained into my mind, the entire association is now very icky to me. "

Name one.

I never said that nor do I know anyone at CBR who has said that. That said I have mocked out scenes that could be implied to have sexual under currents and joked about it. That is not to say I have ever said any member of the HoM in the 616 has had sex with each other nor do I believe that. In the 616 there is no shortage of scenes that can be misinterpereted and it is fun to joke about such scenes like the one below.

However, when it comes to actual making incest textual the way Marvel has in the Ultimate Universe I am completely against that. It no longer becomes a joke when it is textual, and I don't think Loeb understood that.

Even if she doesnt remember that doesnt make the fact that she erased over half of the mutant population. Think about it now normall people (humans) have the chance to pretty much take care of the rest of the mutant populace. Professor X, and others worked soo hard to make the world better and now its like he has to start from the begining again. And if she wanted to get back at her father then she should have joined the X-MEN or some other super hero team. That would've gotten under Magnetos skin.

jmc247 says:

Name one.

Scans_daily, on which you posted scans "proving" various forms of "Lehnsherr family incest" over, and over, and over, and over, and over. And over. I even remember you arguing about it passionately in the case of one set of X-Factor scans. I remember you and your friend throwing a fits and deleting comments and finally withdrawing from the community.

People make a joke about Wanda and Pietro every once in a while, "twincest" and "hahaha" and THEY MOVE ON. You posted about nothing but, and kept putting the same scans up, it got to be practically daily at one point.

It went beyond a joke into a sick obsession.

I never said that nor do I know anyone at CBR who has said that. That said I have mocked out scenes that could be implied to have sexual under currents and joked about it. That is not to say I have ever said any member of the HoM in the 616 has had sex with each other nor do I believe that. In the 616 there is no shortage of scenes that can be misinterpereted and it is fun to joke about such scenes like the one below.

You didn't mock them, you didn't joke about it, you posted every scrap of evidence, every scan you could find that "proved" that Magneto had slept with both his daughters and you posted them over and over and over and when people refuted it, you got upset.

It certainly didn't seem like you were "joking" at the time.

Quite frankly, I think Loeb took the fun out of it for you. Because real incest is not something titillating and provocatively forbidden. It's sick. Now it's a case of "Oh, sh*! That fanfiction about Polaris being raped by Magneto isn't a fun sexual fantasy anymore."

You can backpedal all you want, but the truth is if it was a joke, you were obsessed with it and took waaaay to far. It wasn't funny and frankly, for myself, you pretty much ruined the Polaris-Magneto relationship. I can't look at that now without seeing all those scans you put up over and over and over.

Post Edited:2008-04-07 07:13:30

Pania says:

"jmc247 says:

Name one.

Scans_daily, on which you posted scans "proving" various forms of "Lehnsherr family incest" over, and over, and over, and over, and over. And over. I even remember arguing about it passionately in the case of one set of X-Factor scans. I remember you and your friend throwing a fits and deleting comments and finally withdrawing from the community. People make a joke about Wanda and Pietro every once in a while, "twincest" and "hahaha" and THEY *MOVE ON*. You posted about nothing but, and kept putting the same scans up, it got to be practically daily at one point. It went beyond a joke into a sick obsession.

I never said that nor do I know anyone at CBR who has said that. That said I have mocked out scenes that could be implied to have sexual under currents and joked about it. That is not to say I have ever said any member of the HoM in the 616 has had sex with each other nor do I believe that. In the 616 there is no shortage of scenes that can be misinterpereted and it is fun to joke about such scenes like the one below.

You didn't mock them, you didn't joke about it, you posted every scrap of evidence, every scan you could find that "proved" that Magneto had slept with both his daughters and you posted them over and over and over and when people refuted it, you got upset. It certainly didn't seem like you were "joking" at the time. Quiet frankly, I think Loeb took the fun out of it for you. Because real incest is not something titillating and provocatively forbidden. It's sick. Now it's a case of "Oh, sh*! That fanfiction about Polaris being raped by Magneto isn't a fun sexual fantasy anymore." You can backpedal all you want, but the truth is if it was a joke, you were obsessed with it and took waaaay to far. It wasn't funny and frankly, for myself, you pretty much ruined the Polaris-Magneto relationship. I can't look at that now without seeing all those scans you put up over and over and over.
Post Edited:2008-04-06 21:21:29"

Post Deleted.

jmc247 says:

"Pania says:

"jmc247 says:

Name one.

I remember you and your friend throwing a fits and deleting comments and finally withdrawing from the community. People make a joke about Wanda and Pietro every once in a while, "twincest" and "hahaha" and THEY *MOVE ON*. You posted about nothing but, and kept putting the same scans up, it got to be practically daily at one point.

I fought with you constantly not because you didn't support twincest or any other kind of incest between any member of the HoM, because I certainly do not support real textual incest between any member of the HoM.

And, unlike a very few at Scans Daily I certainly did not celebrate when Loeb turned the Ultimate versions of the character incestual, because I am completely against that. I fought with you over Lorna's parentage almost every time. The threads would become flame wars because you would claim Lorna is not a member of the HoM and you know it.

The most I have ever done is to claim PAD made a dream seqence that can be misconstured as being sexual. But, that as I said before are the kind of scenes I consider funny those that can be misconstured but do not make incest textual like Loeb's scenes, but while there are one or two for Lorna there are tons for the twins that I and others posted. Why didn't you post that the twins weren't his kids?

Considering 90% of the incest crap on Scans Daily were jokes and different scenes about them? Because the deep down reason you hate the idea of Lorna being Magneto's child is not because of me or anyone else, it is that it potentally messes with your vision of Magneto's past and you worry some writer will come along and turn Magneto into a jackass or monster and have him kill Lorna's mother.

I have not nor ever have supported the idea Marvel should actually have real textual incest between any member of the HoM and I am completely against what Loeb did in the Ultimate Universe.

Yeah right. We aren't talking about what we fought about, we talking about what you posted.

You posted every scan that could be misconstrued as incestuous over, and over, and over again. And when you actually started arguing with people about it? Sorry, it simply wasn't funny anymore.

Not that after seeing the same scans with the wink-wink-nudge-nudge for the 20th time it was funny to begin with.

Post Edited:2008-04-07 09:36:08

Pania says:

You posted every scan that could be misconstrued as incestuous over, and over, and over again. And when you actually started arguing with people about it? Sorry, it simply wasn't funny anymore. "

The only arguement I had was if PAD intended for it to be a scene that can be misconstued or not, I believed he did some others believed he didn't.

Maybe, they were right and I was wrong, maybe I was right and they were wrong. It really doesn't matter.