Comic Vine Review

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Arrow #208 - The Scientist Review

5

Barry Allen makes his debut!

For the most part, Arrow's been taking the "Christopher Nolan Batman" approach to the Emerald archer's world. They've aimed to ground Oliver, his villains and his allies in a more realistic setting (realistic compared to most comic book inspired media, that is), but tonight, that finally all changes. There's been plenty of buildup about metahumans in the show since learning about what everyone is searching for on the island and, more importantly, the introduction of none other than Barry Allen. "The Scientist" finally gives us our first look at powers in the Arrow-verse and, I won't lie, it was pretty awesome.

First and foremost, you can't have a super-strong and super-durable dude without some exceptional action sequences, right? It seems like the creative team was well aware of that and we're treated to a handful of 'em. Let's just say the debut of super-strength doesn't disappoint and it takes quite a toll on our hero. I was particularly impressed with the stunt work during a truck sequence and the final moments of the last fight.

The show also delivers on some major plot progression, too. Honestly, I was worried Barry Allen's debut would mean blatantly hitting us with too many obvious references. Thankfully, there's only a handful of them and they're all smirk-inducing. Another one alluding to how he'll get his powers appears a couple times and keeps you guessing whether or not the big moment will happen. Not only that, this episode also dedicates a fair amount of time to showing us who Barry Allen is and justifying his trip to Starling City. Down the road, it'll be very interesting to see how Grant Gustin adapts Allen's boost in confidence when he'll no longer have such bad luck with traveling. Furthermore, I really dug the chemistry he had with Felicity. She's such a likable character so it's fantastic to finally see her make such a strong connection. Plus, the way it'll all ends is a superb attention-grabber. Oh, and comic fans (which you probably are seeing as you're Comic Vine and all that...) are sure to love the developments from the island (no one really thinks he's dead, right?).

I'm a big fan of the action in this episode, but if Oliver already knows what he's up against and basically had prep time, why didn't he try a more effective trick arrow during their second brawl? He realized he should use an electric arrow against Bronze Tiger in a random encounter, so it's odd to see him try to knock out a dude that powerful with just his fists and bow. Holding him in place with the foot shots was cool and what followed certainly looked good, but talk about a tactical fail.

The CW tends to get a bad rep when it comes to drama, but truthfully, I'm usually just fine with the romantic subplots in this show. In fact, I enjoyed the tension and eventual conflict they built between Oliver and Felicity. However, the whole Moira and Malcolm element felt way too much like a soap opera for my taste . Sure, it was able to give us a name drop we've already heard (which they're still apparently mispronouncing, but whatever), but overall, I really wasn't feeling that part of the plot.

There was a lot of hype behind this episode and honestly, I think it lived up to it. Sure, I wanted to facepalm when Oliver tried to go Rock 'Em Sock 'Em Robots with a superhuman foe (their version of Solomon Grundy) and I wasn't feeling the drama with Moira, but this episode delivered big time with everything else. The action was great, there's some decent laughs scattered throughout, and the plot took some big steps forward to build the tension for next week's mid-season finale. Fairly minor complaints aside, I'd say this episode has earned 5-stars.

Viners, what do you think of the latest episode? Let us know below or create a user review!

101 Comments
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Posted by Anim

Genuinely cool episode... They were soooo close with that chemicals and lightning scene... Also, its cool to hear Oliver say that he has taken down someone with "similar abilities" before when talking about taking on Grundy when he has already taken down Slade....Presumably..arrow through the eye...like the mask we saw in the first season......would love to see that fight..

Edited by Fallschirmjager

@commander_kane said:

@fallschirmjager: Wait what happened? I must've missed that part. How they mentioned Zoom?

Barry was talking to Felicity and Ollie about his parents dying. I don't remember it quote for quote but he basically mentions a part about a Blur moving through the house and him ending up "20 miles away from his house"

He never said Zoom, but he was describing the scene in Flash: Rebirth and it was also VERY similar to the New 52 scene with Reverse-Flash.

Posted by comicbookfan93

@darkbeam: I think it's because he used a Lazarus pit

Edited by UltimateSMfan

@captain13: Agreed with your points except superman, he isn't motivated to be a hero because his planet blew up, he was raised to be that way and then his adoptive parents just happened to die as well. Nobody had to die for him to realise with great power comes great responsibility.

Edited by Guardiandevil83

Can someone explain to me why Clark killed Barrys mom? I know he may have been pissed by Smallvilles cancellation but damn dude, exessive.

Posted by Commander_Kane

@fallschirmjager: Ohhhhhh. Now I see. Didn't catch that at first. Thanks for clearing it up!

Edited by Hastalavista

Great! So there might be superpowers in this show! I am so looking forward to see Barry's transformation into the Flash! But will we see this in Arrow or in his pilot show? And when is that pilot show time?

Edited by kidhero999

@webling said:

4/5 Loved the references and Raider's-like action sequence of Ollie boarding the truck. That thunder in the scene with Barry next to the chemicals AND THEN THEY DIDN'T DO IT! I forgot that this was a two-parter so the ending was really abrupt. Felicity mentioning the arrows not being good enough after Allen already mentioned how to improve them made Ollie's decision to use regular ones look really boneheaded. Oh well they'll hit the rule of three for that when they pick up that thread next episode so Ollie can take down strong people. Also no Laurel in this episode. Thank you!

References I picked up on: Kord, Reverse-Flash, Red Arrow (blood on the arrow [maybe I just want that to count so it'll happen already]). I missed the Grundy one.

Looking forward to next week.

@matkrenz RWBY!

I thought the whole black for stealth was a nod to Batman and the aliens bit a ref to Superman, etc.

Posted by silent_bomber

@muyjingo said:

@k4tzm4n I'm not sure Arrow, or the Nolan movies are mispronouncing Ra's

It's an Arabic term that means Demons Head. If you take the Arabic "رأس الغول‎" and put it in something like Google Translator to hear it pronounced, it is pronounced like they do on Arrow.

I've also asked this to Arabic speaking friends before who have said both are correct.

TAS pronounced it a certain way. Not necessarily the correct or only way.

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

Edited by MuyJingo

@silent_bomber said:

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

I don't erally think it matters what the creator said, as they can be wrong like anyone else.

Given there is a canonical story explaining the pronunciation however, that's actually really cool.

Do you know what issues that story was in, I'd love to read it.

And my apologies to @k4tzm4n

Posted by entropy_aegis

@muyjingo said:

@k4tzm4n I'm not sure Arrow, or the Nolan movies are mispronouncing Ra's

It's an Arabic term that means Demons Head. If you take the Arabic "رأس الغول‎" and put it in something like Google Translator to hear it pronounced, it is pronounced like they do on Arrow.

I've also asked this to Arabic speaking friends before who have said both are correct.

TAS pronounced it a certain way. Not necessarily the correct or only way.

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

The creator got it wrong,calling him Raysh outright alters the meaning,he is no longer head of the demon,more like feather of the demon lol.

Edited by silent_bomber

@entropy_aegis said:

@silent_bomber said:

@muyjingo said:

@k4tzm4n I'm not sure Arrow, or the Nolan movies are mispronouncing Ra's

It's an Arabic term that means Demons Head. If you take the Arabic "رأس الغول‎" and put it in something like Google Translator to hear it pronounced, it is pronounced like they do on Arrow.

I've also asked this to Arabic speaking friends before who have said both are correct.

TAS pronounced it a certain way. Not necessarily the correct or only way.

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

The creator got it wrong,calling him Raysh outright alters the meaning,he is no longer head of the demon,more like feather of the demon lol.

No, as explained his name pronunciation is explicitly stated as being from a fictional dialect, nothing about its real world Arabic meaning has any bearing on anything. Stories specifically state that nobody speaks like him anymore he destroyed his people, and virtually all history of his people.

So, at the end of the day his name can't be pronounced in any real-world manner, as plot wise Batman would never have been able to find Ra's place of birth if this was the case.

Also, from what I've heard the funny way his name is pronounced is due to Denny asking a Hebrew speaker for advice, leading Ra's to have a weird Hebrew/Arabic combination name.

I don't know how true that is, as there's a lot of contradictory info on this online.

@muyjingo said:

@silent_bomber said:

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

I don't really think it matters what the creator said, as they can be wrong like anyone else.

Given there is a canonical story explaining the pronunciation however, that's actually really cool.

Do you know what issues that story was in, I'd love to read it.

And my apologies to @k4tzm4n

Its mentioned in Birth of the Demon.

Posted by MuyJingo

@silent_bomber: I read that although it's been a while...must have glossed over that point. Hmm.

Time to read it again :)

Edited by danhimself

definitely didn't catch the Grundy reference but I knew that they were calling him Cyrus...just never knew that one of Grundy's aliases was Cyrus Gold

Posted by spidershamrock

Incredible episode, loved every minute. But why did Oliver shoot Roy? Totally unnecessary.

Posted by k4tzm4n

Incredible episode, loved every minute. But why did Oliver shoot Roy? Totally unnecessary.

Roy was going to further investigate the matter and ultimately, that could lead him to a super-human and super-durable character who would have no gripe killing him. Put on the spot, Oliver must have thought literally disabling Roy was the best way to prevent Roy from sneaking around and pursuing it. I'd say an arrow to the knee leg is better than having your neck snapped. It's a drastic and rash move, but Oliver likely thinks he's protecting Roy from the superhuman threat until he can resolve it himself.

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Posted by RoTheKid

Yep, this was an awesome episode indeed. This season is clearly way better than last season so far! Can't wait to see the mid season finale. :)

Edited by War Killer

I loved this episode. Seeing superpowers finally making an appearance was great to see and Barry was cool, I really liked his character and look forward to seeing more of him in the future.

Posted by clemj

@jayskee said:

Loved it. Can't wait to see Gustin in the flash costume. Did anyone else catch that Reverse Flash reference?

I so much want to see what they do with it!

Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

Can't believe how many people missed the Zoom/Reverse-Flash reference. A blur (that Barry saw a face in) wrecking his home and killing his mother when he was a child? Yeah that's totally Zoom.

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Edited by spidershamrock

@k4tzm4n: i get that but, when he does want to recruit Roy, this is definitely gonna be a stumbling block. I think Thea will be killed by Malcolm and Roy will be trained by Oliver as a way of helping him through it/getting her back if she is kidnapped.

Edited by k4tzm4n

Can't believe how many people missed the Zoom/Reverse-Flash reference. A blur (that Barry saw a face in) wrecking his home and killing his mother when he was a child? Yeah that's totally Zoom.

Who missed it? I mean, Barry Allen slowly talked about it for us, haha.

Online
Posted by YourNeighborhoodComicGeek

@k4tzm4n said:

@yourneighborhoodcomicgeek said:

Can't believe how many people missed the Zoom/Reverse-Flash reference. A blur (that Barry saw a face in) wrecking his home and killing his mother when he was a child? Yeah that's totally Zoom.

Who missed it? I mean, Barry Allen slowly talked about it for us, haha.

That's what I'm saying. So many people (that know Zoom's character) somehow did not pick up the reference.

Online
Edited by ccraft

He played Barry Allen very well, one of my favorite episodes of this season.

Edited by Theroach

Okay I know I'm late because the episode aired yesterday. But I loved the look on Malcolm's face when Moira told him that she contacted ra's al ghul and my god how awesome was Barry Allen and that major tease in the lab during during that storm. The Grundy reference past me. I found out about it on an arrow wikia page.

Edited by Theroach

dude i have the same theory. i think thea will be killed and roy will be trained by oliver to avenge her death and to honor her he will go by speedy which was revealed to us as a nickname oliver gave to thea during the first season

Posted by Mega_spidey01

Barry allen was awesome ! can't wait to see more of him in the flash show.

Edited by spidershamrock

@theroach: i could also see Thea being brainwashed and trained by the League and then tries to kill Oliver and Roy a couple seasons later

Posted by Mr_Winchester

@jayskee said:

@k4tzm4n said:

@jayskee said:

Loved it. Can't wait to see Gustin in the flash costume. Did anyone else catch that Reverse Flash reference?

For sure. Definitely seemed like a huge teaser for what's to come in his pilot episode.

If I see the Reserve Flash done right on live action tv I will be like this

Can't believe I thought I was the only one who would've identified it! Epic reference.

Posted by mkukie68

Once Barry started describing the Zoom murder, I basically turned into a justin bieber fangirl. Not proud of it but I was stoked about last night's episode

Edited by sweatboy

"Arrow's been taking the Nolan Batman approach", not necessarily. Yes, the parallels of billionaire playboy having to survive in harsh conditions and being taught by mercenary ninja types to reinvent the image are there. But rite of passage stories are a common thing. Tarzan killing his leopard, Hercules' Nemean lion and Mowgli vs Shere Khan are (though not exactly the same) can be similar premises. Robinson Crusoe and the Tom Hanks movie immediately come to mind, but only as far as surviving on the island, not the ninja stuff. And not the trained by a badass villain bit. There were some real life Robinson Crusoes like Robert Knox too. Plus, it follows GA Year One too. I think the island is a good idea and is what makes GA something to respect. Plus the PTSD really appeals me, Batman Begins didn't do anything obvious with that

Barry's parents weren't always dead. He had a great family life before he died in Crisis, and in the old tv show, and when was it? After rebirth that they made Reverse Flash kill his parents? It's more of a flashpoint thing than anything

Edited by entropy_aegis

@entropy_aegis said:

@silent_bomber said:

@muyjingo said:

@k4tzm4n I'm not sure Arrow, or the Nolan movies are mispronouncing Ra's

It's an Arabic term that means Demons Head. If you take the Arabic "رأس الغول‎" and put it in something like Google Translator to hear it pronounced, it is pronounced like they do on Arrow.

I've also asked this to Arabic speaking friends before who have said both are correct.

TAS pronounced it a certain way. Not necessarily the correct or only way.

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

The creator got it wrong,calling him Raysh outright alters the meaning,he is no longer head of the demon,more like feather of the demon lol.

No, as explained his name pronunciation is explicitly stated as being from a fictional dialect, nothing about its real world Arabic meaning has any bearing on anything. Stories specifically state that nobody speaks like him anymore he destroyed his people, and virtually all history of his people.

So, at the end of the day his name can't be pronounced in any real-world manner, as plot wise Batman would never have been able to find Ra's place of birth if this was the case.

Also, from what I've heard the funny way his name is pronounced is due to Denny asking a Hebrew speaker for advice, leading Ra's to have a weird Hebrew/Arabic combination name.

I don't know how true that is, as there's a lot of contradictory info on this online.

@muyjingo said:

@silent_bomber said:

Its pronounced "Raysh", the character's creator has said this in the past.

The real world pronunciation doesn't make sense in the context of his backstory. Batman discovers the small area where Ra's is originally from because its strictly the only place in the world that has ever pronounced it "Raysh"

Ra's destroyed his home town, and purposefully attempted to erase all evidence of it ever existing.

Batman only managed to find information on Ra's due to the way Ra's pronounced his own name.

I don't really think it matters what the creator said, as they can be wrong like anyone else.

Given there is a canonical story explaining the pronunciation however, that's actually really cool.

Do you know what issues that story was in, I'd love to read it.

And my apologies to @k4tzm4n

Its mentioned in Birth of the Demon.

Yes the meaning does have a bearing,he's the "head of the demon" not something else of the demon,the creator made a mistake out of ignorance and it stuck simple as that.

Amazing how fans are totally willing to overlook the flaws in the source material.

Posted by TheAcidSkull

Probably my favorite episode so far.

Posted by silent_bomber

@entropy_aegis said:

Yes the meaning does have a bearing,he's the "head of the demon" not something else of the demon,the creator made a mistake out of ignorance and it stuck simple as that.

No, how its pronounced in traditional Arabic has no bearing on anything, because the comic has specifically stated its not traditional Arabic in the first place.

"Feather of the Demon" is nonsense, I just checked, Feather is pronounced "Reesha"

Nobody is arguing that its pronounced Reesha Al Ghoul.

I also checked the Hebrew pronunciation for Head, and sure enough its "Raysh" (closer to Rrraysh)

So, as said earlier the pronunciation is a mixture of Hebrew and Arabic based on a fictional dialect of Arabic from a place that doesn't exist in the real world.

The fact that the pronunciation started off as a mistake is irrelevant, because its been explained in Batman canon and fully incorporated into Ra's back story.

and all of this is meaningless anyway as its a name, and names are pronounced and spelled however the parents want them to be pronounced and spelled.

---------------------------------------------

It essentially went like this (me paraphrasing, not actual quote)

Ra's - "My name is Rraysh Al Ghoul"

Batman - "Ah, like head in Hebrew and Al Ghoul in Arabic, Head of the Demon"

Ra's - "Yup"

Batman - "That's an odd way of saying that, you must be from (small fictional village) in (that area)"

Ra's - "Curses!, you've discovered something about me"

Robin - "Holy strange pronunciation Batman!"

-----------------------------------------------

Lets play this out the other way

Ra's - "my name is Raz Al Ghul"

Batman - "ah, the Arabic for Head of the Demon"

Ra's - "Yup"

Batman - "so you're from, er, somewhere in the middle east?"

Ra's - "Yup"

Batman - "Damn I have absolutely no way of narrowing down where you were born, guess I've lost"

Robin - "You suck Batman, I'm going to go and become Green Arrow's sidekick instead"

Posted by Theroach

I wonder how far are they going to go with the chemistry between barry and felicity. Like when the flash show comes on is, she going to be a recurring character and become his love interest and what about iris or is he suppose to be a younger flash and he meets iris when he gets a little older.

Edited by k4tzm4n

@sweatboy: The Nolan remark wasn't comparing the specifics of Oliver and Bruce's story but instead talking about how they're handling the world:

"They've aimed to ground Oliver, his villains and his allies in a more realistic setting (realistic compared to most comic book inspired media, that is), but tonight, that finally all changes."

Online
Edited by CrazyScarecrow

@captain13: Superman was never really completely motivated by his dead parents. He was interested in his Krypton heritage and all that, but a lot of it was because he wanted to put his powers towards the betterment of humanity.

Batman was dead parents.

Robin was dead parents.

Wonder Woman was never about dead parents.

Green Lantern was only dead parents when it came to his job at Ferris Aircraft.

The Flash's dead parent and convicted father only gave him motivation when it came to being a police scientist.

Aquaman was never motivated by his dead parents.

Martian Manhunter was a mix of wanting to put his powers to good use for his new home, planet Earth, and his child and wife that died.

Cyborg's parents are still alive.

Green Arrow was never motivated by the death of his parents either.

Posted by Taasden

@sweatboy: The Nolan comparison wasn't made because of the plotlines. It's the fact that Arrow tries to ground the more superhuman elements of its source material (ex. Black Canary has sonic devices instead of a scream, Solomon Grundy took a Japanese stem cell serum, Brother Blood wears a mask and uses drugs) just like Nolan's Batman movies did (Bane wears a painkiller-dispensing mask instead of using Venom, Ra's al Ghul's immortality is psychological not actual, etc).

I'm really digging this approach. It takes a lot of creativity to put that kind of a spin on it.

Posted by TDK_1997

This is by far the best episode so far but the only problem I had with it was Barry Allen.He was a good character and all and the casting of this actor wasn't that bad but this just didn't seem like Barry to me.It was more like a Peter Parker CW version for the Arrow show.

Edited by LiveLaughLove1010

@knightofthechronicle: I know me either, I just realized the person's name was Cyrus aka Solomon Grundy! I also thought that Hal Jordan was going to be in this season of Arrow because in the last season they had referenced "Green Lantern" as part of a flashback with the aircraft scene that showed Ferris Airways but I don't remember what episode was that. Anyways I loved Grant Gustin's Portrayal of Barry Allen, I am really excited for the rest of the season!

Posted by MadeinBangladesh

Great episode. Man, if Arrow and Flash are not tied with the movie universe, I'm gonna be super-pissed.

Edited by godzilla44
Posted by Rabbitearsblog

Great review!! I really enjoyed this episode also and introducing Barry Allen to the mix was so awesome!!!

Edited by DaseanComerWCR

One of the best episodes on one of my fravorite shows

Posted by MuyJingo

@entropy_aegis

No, as explained his name pronunciation is explicitly stated as being from a fictional dialect, nothing about its real world Arabic meaning has any bearing on anything. Stories specifically state that nobody speaks like him anymore he destroyed his people, and virtually all history of his people.

So, at the end of the day his name can't be pronounced in any real-world manner, as plot wise Batman would never have been able to find Ra's place of birth if this was the case.

Also, from what I've heard the funny way his name is pronounced is due to Denny asking a Hebrew speaker for advice, leading Ra's to have a weird Hebrew/Arabic combination name.

I don't know how true that is, as there's a lot of contradictory info on this online.

Its mentioned in Birth of the Demon.

OK, so I just re-read BofD.

The only thing that is stated is that he took his name from a local dialect that no longer exists. Batman didn't track down his place of origin due to his name, and there is little reason to assume that the local dialect would have differed fundamentally in the pronunciation of that phrase, especially with "al ghul" staying the same.

But, I actually like your explanation a lot. I just don't think pronouncing it the way they do on Arrow is by any means incorrect.

And, given that the Ra's on Arrow and the Ra's from the Nolanverse are not comicbook counterparts and do not have the same origin story, the correct Arabic pronunciation is actually the correct pronunciation for those universes.

Edited by silent_bomber

@muyjingo said:

@entropy_aegis

@silent_bomber said:

No, as explained his name pronunciation is explicitly stated as being from a fictional dialect, nothing about its real world Arabic meaning has any bearing on anything. Stories specifically state that nobody speaks like him anymore he destroyed his people, and virtually all history of his people.

So, at the end of the day his name can't be pronounced in any real-world manner, as plot wise Batman would never have been able to find Ra's place of birth if this was the case.

Also, from what I've heard the funny way his name is pronounced is due to Denny asking a Hebrew speaker for advice, leading Ra's to have a weird Hebrew/Arabic combination name.

I don't know how true that is, as there's a lot of contradictory info on this online.

Its mentioned in Birth of the Demon.

Batman didn't track down his place of origin due to his name.

Here -

"Coincidence? hardly, your father made a mistake taking his name from a local dialect, that told me something about him. So, for years I've financed expeditions to this part of the world."

Dialect - a particular form of a language which is peculiar to a specific region or social group.

Ra's Al Ghul cannot be pronounced in the normal Arabic way, as if that was the case all Batman would've known, was that Ra's was from somewhere in the Middle East, that's not a clue.

Posted by MuyJingo

"Coincidence? hardly, your father made a mistake taking his name from a local dialect, that told me something about him. So, for years I've financed expeditions to this part of the world."

Dialect - a particular form of a language which is peculiar to a specific region or social group.

Ra's Al Ghul cannot be pronounced in the normal Arabic way, as if that was the case all Batman would've known, was that Ra's was from somewhere in the Middle East, that's not a clue.

1. That doesn't matter as far as the versions on the characters on on Arrow and in the Nolanverse, who do not share the rich, fantastical history of their comic counterpart. In these cases, the traditional Arabic is correct.

2.You haven't contradicted the point I made, in any way. The pronunciation could still be very similar to the traditional Arabic with a particular enunciation, or different emphasis on syllabuses. There is nothing to support "raysh" as the correct pronunciation.

It's a matter of interpretation.

Edited by silent_bomber

@muyjingo said:

@silent_bomber said:

"Coincidence? hardly, your father made a mistake taking his name from a local dialect, that told me something about him. So, for years I've financed expeditions to this part of the world."

Dialect - a particular form of a language which is peculiar to a specific region or social group.

Ra's Al Ghul cannot be pronounced in the normal Arabic way, as if that was the case all Batman would've known, was that Ra's was from somewhere in the Middle East, that's not a clue.

2.You haven't contradicted the point I made, in any way. The pronunciation could still be very similar to the traditional Arabic with a particular enunciation, or different emphasis on syllabuses. There is nothing to support "raysh" as the correct pronunciation.

It does however prove that the "usual" pronunciation is incorrect, for the reasons stated above. The comic is extremely clear, Ra's Al Ghul has a noticeable, specific pronunciation that differs from the norm and is from a local dialect that makes it distinctive, and not in widespread use.

It also proves that there is no grounds for saying that "Raysh" is incorrect from a plot point of view.

Which just leaves you with the character's creator saying its pronounced "Raysh", and no contrary evidence, or grounds to support that it isn't.

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