toplel's forum posts

#1 Posted by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@foamborn: Good luck trying to explain that to them. Like I said, it's just stirring up sh*t to avoid the actual issue.

@jogga: Trace back the conversation and figure it out. I'm not going to spell it out, again, why it sucks for them both.

#2 Posted by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@akintoussaint: Yes, people have been criticizing it since it started and it has nothing to do with Batman.

They were hints that a lot of people found interesting but it didn't harm either character or the plot, so criticizing the entire Timmverse based on about 10 minutes of harmless scenes is a poor attempt at shifting blame.

@carterleavyy: Yeah, you just proved my point. SM/WW shippers think KC being well received means so was their ship, even though Waid admitted he really didn't know what to do with Diana and just made her a plot device.

SM/WW is detrimental to both characters, though mostly to Diana, but fans will gloss over that fact, sometimes because an angry, c*nty Diana is their definition of a good Diana.

#3 Edited by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@akintoussaint: So you haven't seen the bitching that went on in the Convergence thread when it was announced Clark and Lois would have a baby? Or the countless times Lois is put down and Diana is claimed as the only one worthy of Superman? Really now?

And it was never intended to be developed. They only kept hinting it because the fan reaction was so positive. They couldn't do it, probably, because Batman Beyond had already aired and there would've been continuity errors.

@carterleavyy: It was poo in the same way every other version is; it relies on Diana either being an aggressive c*nt to contrast with Superman or being depressed, in both cases requiring Superman's intervention to save her.

Just because KC was critically acclaimed doesn't mean Diana or her relationship with Superman were too; that's an association fallacy.

#4 Edited by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@dernman: I should've mentioned I meant SM/WW fans, but try to consider the context yourself.

@superguy1591: Batman fans seem to be cool with whatever works. You're making bold claims about his fanbase and Timm without anything to support your point.

You're an example of what I'm talking about yourself. You're ignoring a crappy characterization of Diana in SM/WW for something that didn't even happen in the JL/JLU, just because you get to use Batman and his fans as scapegoats.

Get one thing straight; BM/WW never happened. It's always been hinted at at best. SM/WW has happened several times, and it's been bull pucky every time. If you think Diana was desperate in the Timmverse, go and read Act of God. Or better yet, don't.

#5 Edited by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@superguy1591: I didn't say you specifically, but SM/WW fans in general. While I agree Lois has had her fair share of poor depictions, when written at her best, there really isn't any other character in the Superman mythos that clicks better with Clark than her.

I like Superman and WW too and their team ups can be fun, but that's not what's happening right now. BM/SM aren't mandatorily required to be f*cking each other, so you don't have the writer forced to make them fit into a setting they won't fit into, unlike SM/WW. Their romance is the reason why they're together in the first place, and that romance is terrible.

I didn't accuse the entire Superman fanbase but the SM/WW fanbase, which consists almost entirely of Superman fans. Learn the difference.

Your view of Diana is overly simplistic, like saying you like Superman cause he can fly or Flash because he goes fast. Everyone fights in comics, even Alfred occasionally drops thugs. And because of that, you might find her characterization more agreeable than other people do.

I'll ignore your jab at Batman fans because I know the last issue of Endgame left you a bit sore, but I'll say that I've never seen them bitch about Selina or Talia or how only Diana is worthy of Bruce. It's almost always "Eh, I liked it in the JL/JLU, so I wouldn't mind seeing it done again" or some variation of it.

@foamborn: Pretty much, yeah. You can actually see it with other stuff as well. A fanbase will ignore legit criticism by labeling it as haters just hating on it and other ad hominems. It happened a lot with MoS.

#6 Edited by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@foamborn: There is no competition. It's all dust the shippers throw up to hide the fact that they don't really have anything to argue with when it comes to Diana and how she's written in SM/WW.

#7 Edited by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

Hint? It is the BvS suit. Or suits.

Agreed on the cowl ears. The new Bat symbol doesn't look too bad either.

#8 Posted by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@superguy1591: Lois is an ordinary woman to Superman fans, unworthy of his affections. It's why you have thread after thread bitching about how he deserves better and even their biological incompatibility is brought up to somehow justify Diana being capable and worthy of popping out his kids.

Lois may be a trophy to you, but in order to avoid her you're making one out of Diana too. And this is precisely why shipping is cancer.

#9 Posted by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@superguy1591: Riiiight. I want Diana with Batman. Tell me more, because you seem to know a lot more about me than I do myself.

This whole fiasco is about having Diana as a trophy for Clark. Don't even try to pretend otherwise.

#10 Posted by toplel (975 posts) - - Show Bio

@superguy1591: Apparently the reasons aren't so obvious. Please elaborate.