Hulk Respect Thread

Hulk Respect Thread

Hulk is one of the greatest fictional characters ever.

at first glance Hulk might seem like a boring character, people often confuse him with a plot devise too, i mean a big green man who smashes things? sounds kinda repetitive, but really, it's not. Truth be told, you can't like hulk without liking banner, because it's the dynamic that really draws you to the character. Banner is a a wimp, he is really weak physically, yet he is put in charge of one of the most powerful beings on earth, and how does one deal with that? I mean how can this weakling control such a powerful beast ? thing is, banner is the personification of Will and Strength of character.

Hulk is everything banner has locked up his entire life, and the funny thing is, he never gives in, he always knows that giving in to the rage might cause some harm to others around him. this shows how powerful he really is, the "Strongest there is" line which hulk frequently uses is tied to banner, because it's his will power and Raw emotions which gives the Hulk power. We've all been there, we've all wanted to cut loose before, there is always that voice that keeps telling you that you really want to punch someone in the face. now imagine that only multiply it by a 100, and you might understand banners situation. Banner and Hulk hate each other, which means that in reality Banner hates himself, or at least This "aspect" of himself. Hulk could fight the biggest baddest villain in the Universe, and still the greatest Foe he ever had is himself, this "jekyll and Hyde" concept doesn't always work, but it does here, because Banner's Sympathy is what makes hulks rage so awesome, and it's hulks rage what makes banner sympathetic.

But the greatest thing is that Hulk himself isn't a monster either, he never hurts the innocents, and there have been multiple times where he has protected the people who had called him a monster, this shows that even at his worst, hulk is by all means a hero. This all comes from bruce banner. you can imagine his mind as a huge hallway of doors, with each door holding it's one secret(aka Hulk). did that image since in? good, because it's important. Hulk is a type of character you can't get bored with, which is funny because most people would disagree with me, but then again most people haven't read his stories and have no idea what they are talking about.

The writers did a very good job of giving Banner and personality disorder because that way we can have many versions of the hulk which manifests based on the different aspects of banner, therefore giving each hulk his own distinctive look and personality. We have Joe Fixit who represents banners wild, Brash teenage self, and we also have the traditional Savage Hulk who has a heart of gold yes is always angry and misunderstood. My personal favorite would be Green scar, a Noble hero who would sacrifice himself for his family and friends any day of the week. This brings me to my next point, with a character like hulk, he can be written in any genre. it could Be dark and gritty or it could be light hearted and fun. and IT would work, because when you have a character like superman, he best works best in fun light-hearted stories, but with hulk, that doesn't matter.

i've gone a bit of track here but the point is that hulk is an awesome character, the kind that has substance and depth. People can say hulk is boring but if that were true he wouldn't have had an ongoing for 12 F*cking years.

"Then why do you suddenly look scared? Maybe you see that you could be ten times stronger than Hulk, and it still would not matter. Not when all Hulk has to do is become ten times as mad!!"

-Hulk/Bruce Banner

Hulk Smash!

Indestructible Hulk #1

Banner makes a purification unit.

Hulk Moves So fast That he is seen as a blur.

Mad Thinker says hulks power is incalculable and Hulk resists a quantum Molder which ultron used to soften and reshape adamantium. He healed pretty easily and the owned Mad tinker.

Indestructible Hulk #2

Banner creates a catalytic Converter, which could prevent numerous cancers as stated by tony stark.

Hulk knocks iron man around while his blasters don't even slow the Hulk down and then proceeds by saving tony from explosion so quickly that he isn't even seen.

Indestructible Hulk #5

Hulk Vs Atuuma! hulk is swallowed by a magical monster who's skin is impenetrable but it won't stop him! in fact, he sends attuma flying so hard down the creatures throat, the beast actually goes down back into it's nest.

Avengers #3

hulk Draws Blood from hyperion and fights him head on with no sing of stopping.

A+X #7

Not Only does banner outsmart tony by making a code even he can't break, but he also one-shotted an hulk-buster unit while tony was getting demolished.

Secret Avengers #4

Hulk Tramples a Raid Of Iron patriots, who in fact were not really drones , but sentient, which means they had normal human, real life reflexes to go along wit their arsenal.

Indestructible Hulk #6

elements as usual have no effect on Hulk, Obviously. and as you can See Bruce Banner's Armor can protect him as well.

Indestructible Hulk #8

HULK jumps into an absolute zero fountain and has barely a scratch on him, banners armors did help, but the armor didn't cover his body completely.

Also Thor and HULK literally shatter the ground into dozens of cracks.

Indestructible Hulk #9

Hulk Shrugs of Thor-level Ordinance( one of them being a molecular desintigrator) twice in the same issue

Indestructible Hulk #10

Hulk not shrugs off a a Gun that rewrites molecules on a SUBATOMIC LEVEL.

Superior Spider-man Team-Ups #1

A Mind Controlled evil Hyperion shoots lasers at hulks Face, which is easily shrugged off.

Indestructible Hulk #11

The time-stream affects any normal human and completely destroys them, Shield needed someone who could take the punishment and survive it.

so naturally They Select hulk for this job.

Hulk also Moves like a Blur. Dodge that Spider-man.

Indestructible Hulk #12

Hulk Sblitzing.

Indestructible Hulk #13

Banner says that when hulk is pissed off he Runs really fast, sow when he was banished it didn't take him long to get back. also hulk tore through a INVULNERABLE Wall.

One of The chronarchists is unable to Stop Hulk by stopping time, and despite him trying to age hulk to death he quickly recovers after the ray stops hitting him

Indestructible Hulk Special #1

Banner talks about how Hulks Strength is incalculable and mentions that he has fought very powerful beings.

Indestructible Hulk #14

Hulk Uses his speed,strength and size to "nut tie" Fin Fang Foom.

hulk Survives the effects of the Time-stream without his armor. it really shows off his durability.

speaking of which, Hulk is not killed by the Same gamma Bomb which had created him. It has in fact increased his power.

Indestructible Hulk #15

Hulk breaks the time-Barrier.

Long-Shot Saves the Marvel Universe #2 (Respect Killemall and Green_Skaar for the analysis)

The In-betweener( a Galactus Level character ) is split into two separate parts. The Order takes control of Shield and restrains hulk. He states himself that he is wasting his energy containing someone as powerful as hulk.

When hulk was released, the In-betweener easily takes control of Dr.Strange, Wanda, Deadpool and Ghost rider, stating that "At least I have regained most of my power now that it is not diverted into holding hat thing."

Doctor strange thought that hulk was actually the Chaos side of the In-betweener because so much energy was put into restraining the Hulk.

Dr.Strange himself states that he has fought in-betweener before- Check feat here: (http://www.comicvine.com/hulk/4005-2267/forums/great-testament-to-hulk-s-power-1514999/#21

Infinity #6

Corvus and Proxima Vs The Hulk. Hulk looses the battle, but he is completely fine when the weight of a star is holding him down.

Hulk even manages to stand up partially, which is a sign of him getting stronger and angrier.

Indestructible Hulk Annual #1

easily surviving the destruction of an island point blank.

Avengers Assemble #22

Transformation timing.

Avengers #24

Hulk Pushes a ship( to crash into a moving planet) so hard it ignites.

Uncanny Avengers #19

Pym, Stark and Doom harness hulks power to repel an enormous celestial being called Exitar. Basically, Hulk did his job for some time, until Dooms machine collapsed.

Marvel Knights Hulk #2

Surviving a Gamma Bomb. Again.

HULK #1

Hulk shrugs of Adamantium bullets when weakened.

Hulk goes through a glass tampered with Negative Zone Particles.

Original Sins: Hulk Vs Iron Man #3-4

Hulk flat out owns iron man even though Tony uses a hulk buster suit and sets and entire city against Hulk.

Hulk #5

Hulk states himself that as his power seemed to have grown over the years

Hulk effortlessly rips of a Dormant Ultrons adamantium hand.

212 Comments
214 Comments
Edited by guttridgeb

Awesome thread :D

Posted by RaynorJ

Great thread, i hope we see much more feats from Indestructible Hulk.

Posted by Doomnaut

Two thumbs up!

Edited by TheAcidSkull
Edited by Fuchsia_Nightingale

I like that he comes in different colors

Edited by Fuchsia_Nightingale

I like that he comes in different colors

Very entertaining thread by the way

Edited by TheAcidSkull
Posted by dum529001

Bruce Banner comes to the realization that the Hulk is incurable in indestructible Hulk #1:

Once again, it should be noted that Hulk is incurable because he is indestructible. Bruce Banner himself notes this when he says" I've come to believe the Hulk is indestructible" in indestructible Hulk #2:

Posted by medulaoblaganda

I wanna see hulk face off against mangog, juggernaut, and Ronan the accuser

Posted by RaynorJ

Shouldn't a thread like this be a sticky? IMO it should always be at the top of the front page for everyone whose curious to see.

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

Shouldn't a thread like this be a sticky? IMO it should always be at the top of the front page for everyone whose curious to see.

^_^ That' a big compliment !:D

Posted by RaynorJ
Posted by TheAcidSkull
Edited by Deranged Midget

Wicked update dude!

Moderator
Posted by TheAcidSkull
Posted by RaynorJ

How did the Hulk push the ship? I mean did he jump from somewhere or was he propelled by some boosters on his feet?

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

How did the Hulk push the ship? I mean did he jump from somewhere or was he propelled by some boosters on his feet?

He Jumped, I don't know from where thor, probably the surface of Marks as far as I understood.

Edited by RaynorJ

@theacidskull said:

@raynorj said:

How did the Hulk push the ship? I mean did he jump from somewhere or was he propelled by some boosters on his feet?

He Jumped, I don't know from where thor, probably the surface of Marks as far as I understood.

That's cool, wish we knew the distance of his jump it might have been a completely new feat, but this alone is cool enough. And again it shows how Hulk doesn't need a mask to breath/survive in space.

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

@theacidskull said:

@raynorj said:

How did the Hulk push the ship? I mean did he jump from somewhere or was he propelled by some boosters on his feet?

He Jumped, I don't know from where thor, probably the surface of Marks as far as I understood.

That's cool, wish we knew the distance of his jump it might have been a completely new feat, but this alone is cool enough. And again it shows how Hulk doesn't need a mask to breath/survive in space.

yup, hickman still sucks.

Posted by GreenScar1990

Cool feat.

Hulk leaping from a planet and striking a space station with such force that it goes soaring in a blaze of glory.

@theacidskull And Hickman may not be perfect, but Waid & the Marvel Execs/Editors suck the most IMO ('Cause a lot of Waid's Hulk feats aren't this cool). They're the ones who regressed the Hulk in a near mindless, uninteresting, one-dimensional growling brute; and Banner into a selfish, narrow-minded, whiney jerk.

Posted by RaynorJ

When i think about it Waid has done some good justice to the Hulk, we may not have many strength feats the only ones that stand out are that his strength was incalculable and that he punched a time barrier(which are cool but are not solid feats as they can be questioned) but he is a seriously durable guy i mean so far in Waids run nothing hurt him quantum molder, ocean floor pressure, absolute zero fountain, Thor ordinance level weapon, survives the time stream And he established that the Hulk is really fast in several instances. So i gotta give him credit for that.

His biggest fault is that he doesn't focus(pretty much ignores) Hulk as an individual he only sees him as a weapon or in his words "a force of nature" he doesn't really see him as his own character. Also Hulk seriously lacks some cool and worthy villains. Everything else is passable if he would only fix those 2 issues i feel like i could enjoy every chapter but as it stands i really can't...

Edited by Bezza

Having been a critic of this series, I read through Issue 17 belatedly today and thought it was a bit more like it. Issue 18 is promising.

This thread also shows that there have been some darn good showings by Hulk in the series so far.

Overall though, whilst the Hulk has been durable enough, where are the Hulk "smash" episodes and feats of general awesomeness that we got in many of the Pak stories?

Online
Edited by RaynorJ

@bezza said:

Having been a critic of this series, I read through Issue 17 belatedly today and thought it was a bit more like it. Issue 18 is promising.

This thread also shows that there have been some darn good showings by Hulk in the series so far.

Overall though, whilst the Hulk has been durable enough, where are the Hulk "smash" episodes and feats of general awesomeness that we got in many of the Pak stories?

Not just in Pak stories, that was present in pretty much all the Hulk stories, even Jason Aaron(whose Hulks series as we all know is pretty terrible) had a few of those moments, like the time Hulk caused earthquakes around the entire Earth just by punching someone.Waids Hulk "smash" moments are meh and boring.

I have read Superman Birthright(written by Waid) recently and i have to say the series was amazing, i really loved it and i have some new found respect for Superman as well as Waid. Butttttt..... The more i read the issues the more i realized that Waid is not the right writer for someone like the Hulk and that is evident in the Indestructible series itself.... He isn't even a good writer for Superman in the long run, for what he did with those 12 issues is amazing but you can easily see how he can not hold that for long, not on a Superman book. The guy is made to write origin stories, character defining archs and street levelers.

All that is not helped by the fact that we are not getting any good and worthy villains. In comparison Thor has Gorr and will also have Galactus and Mangog.... Wow, just wow and what does the Hulk get? Some lame time travelers who can't even hold their ground against 3 kids from the wild west and can get overpowered by even Banner himself. I am sorry to say this but no matter how promising the issues may seem no matter how much faith you have in Waid i can guarantee you, there will be no awesome Hulk "smash" moments and there will be no challenging villains. We will just have to learn to live with it as long as Waid is in charge and hope Hickman and others provide us with those moments in their series.

Posted by GreenScar1990

@raynorj said:

@bezza said:

Having been a critic of this series, I read through Issue 17 belatedly today and thought it was a bit more like it. Issue 18 is promising.

This thread also shows that there have been some darn good showings by Hulk in the series so far.

Overall though, whilst the Hulk has been durable enough, where are the Hulk "smash" episodes and feats of general awesomeness that we got in many of the Pak stories?

Not just in Pak stories, that was present in pretty much all the Hulk stories, even Jason Aaron(whose Hulks series as we all know is pretty terrible) had a few of those moments, like the time Hulk caused earthquakes around the entire Earth just by punching someone.Waids Hulk "smash" moments are meh and boring.

I have read Superman Birthright(written by Waid) recently and i have to say the series was amazing, i really loved it and i have some new found respect for Superman as well as Waid. Butttttt..... The more i read the issues the more i realized that Waid is not the right writer for someone like the Hulk and that is evident in the Indestructible series itself.... He isn't even a good writer for Superman in the long run, for what he did with those 12 issues is amazing but you can easily see how he can not hold that for long, not on a Superman book. The guy is made to write origin stories, character defining archs and street levelers.

All that is not helped by the fact that we are not getting any good and worthy villains. In comparison Thor has Gorr and will also have Galactus and Mangog.... Wow, just wow and what does the Hulk get? Some lame time travelers who can't even hold their ground against 3 kids from the wild west and can get overpowered by even Banner himself. I am sorry to say this but no matter how promising the issues may seem no matter how much faith you have in Waid i can guarantee you, there will be no awesome Hulk "smash" moments and there will be no challenging villains. We will just have to learn to live with it as long as Waid is in charge and hope Hickman and others provide us with those moments in their series.

Which is why I want Waid to get his story told and leave the series. I wouldn't have a problem if Hulk were treated as a character, fight against foes of his caliber and above and triumph, and acknowledge the events/characters/history that made an impact on Hulk/Banner. But it's quite obvious that Waid has no real intention to give us fans what we want, which is the things that we listed time and again that the series desperately needs.

Edited by RaynorJ

@greenscar1990: It's not that Waid does not want to give his fans what they want it's the fact that he doesn't know how to do it properly. He thinks that talking about how strong the character is, is equivalent to showing how strong he is. Which is far from it. He thinks that guys that are a decent match for a Hulk at his base level are the biggest threats he should face and come across in his series.

I stick to what i said "The guy is made to write origin stories, character defining arcs and street levelers." He is great for writing the man behind the mask even the man with the mask but he is not the right guy for writing powerful characters... I dunno if it's his fear from perhaps overdoing it or making it look silly or because he just doesn't have the same opinion as the rest of the writers on how strong the characters should be and how to convey that strength, i just know that he isn't doing it any justice. He should have gotten a mini series to write of his own like the Marvel Knights, give him a few issues to write his little story on Banner, show off his intelligence and all. But putting such a writer on someone like the Hulk and having him write his series for years is nothing short of a tragedy. Sure he is not gonna fck up the Hulk or anything like that, but he is not gonna bring anything for the character itself.

Since the Indestructible series debuted it sold over 100 000 issues in the first month and took the 5th place that month. So there is definitely a audience for it that's interested, even Thor my current favorite standalone book from Marvel debuted at 10th place that month but now it sits at the 39th place while Hulk sits at 55th place and is constantly dropping another 1-2k readers with each issue.... Does anyone from the editorial care? Does Waid know and/or care? Do they think that's normal or ok? By the time Waid finishes his book, Indestructible Hulk is gonna be below My little pony in terms of sales... and i am not kidding....

There needs to be a change and not in Waids writing because like i said, Waid is just not the guy that can write Hulk, he will never be and you guys will never see some the things you are hoping for, NEVER. What needs to change is the writer himself. No disrespect to Waid, but he already has Daredevil and Green Hornet and he is perfect for those types of characters, while Hulk is a complete contrast and is putting to much of a strain on him to write 3 books at the same time...

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj: I agree with SOME of the things you said but not all. Still, I want to see how the current arc plays out before making a proper conclusion.

Plus 21 is going to be a new point one as far as I'm concerned.

Posted by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: It's gonna play out just the same as everything else, i don't see any reason why it would fundamentally be any different. But will we see.

Why 21? Are there some new previews for it?

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

@theacidskull: It's gonna play out just the same as everything else, i don't see any reason why it would fundamentally be any different. But will we see.

Why 21? Are there some new previews for it?

Nope, every series is getting a point ONE where the status quo changes, I'm assuming it's 21 since that is when banner HYPOTHETICALLY breaks up with shield.

Posted by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: I don't see why that would have anything to do with the Hulk? So Banner quits Shield? So? I mean it's still gonna be a Banner story, it's not like Waid is gonna say "ok that was enough of Banner time to switch it to Hulk and have him fight Mangog". Hulk was mindless while under Shield he will continue to be mindless in the future, as long as Waid is in charge. You are putting way too much optimism into this but that's ok it's your own right, but after reading Waids Superman i have a much better understanding of him and i know that not much of anything will change in terms of Hulks character, his villains and awe-inspiring moments of his strength.

I did wish it would all come true because between me being wrong and us getting a Hulk series we want and deserve i wouldn't mind being wrong all day long if that was what it takes, but somehow all the history i gathered i seriously doubt it. Waid is not the right writer for Hulk, period.

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

@theacidskull: I don't see why that would have anything to do with the Hulk? So Banner quits Shield? So? I mean it's still gonna be a Banner story, it's not like Waid is gonna say "ok that was enough of Banner time to switch it to Hulk and have him fight Mangog". Hulk was mindless while under Shield he will continue to be mindless in the future, as long as Waid is in charge. You are putting way too much optimism into this but that's ok it's your own right, but after reading Waids Superman i have a much better understanding of him and i know that not much of anything will change in terms of Hulks character, his villains and awe-inspiring moments of his strength.

I did wish it would all come true because between me being wrong and us getting a Hulk series we want and deserve i wouldn't mind being wrong all day long if that was what it takes, but somehow all the history i gathered i seriously doubt it. Waid is not the right writer for Hulk, period.

Well I'm still liking the series( not nearly as much as I did) and I would like to see more of Hulk either ways but we can't really say what waid is planning, or what he has in mind to be really honest. I have to say that power wise waids been doing fine, however it's the villains and Hulk action that is seriously lacking, but again we have no idea how things will turn out, so lets wait an' see.

maybe, but I'd rather have waid than geoff Or Snyder. But Parker is still the Ideal option.

Edited by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: I am gonna be cocky here and say that whatever Waid is planning does not involve the Hulk. It involves him as much as a weapon nothing else. Waid is doing fine in terms of Hulks durability, when it comes to Hulks strength he isn't really giving us anything tangible.

Waid is not the worst writer the Hulk could have but that doesn't change the fact that he still isn't the right writer for Hulk. Guys like Daredevil and Green Hornet are his thing, guys like Hulk are not and giving him anything more than a 12 issue arc or his own mini-series is a terrible move. Nothing is gonna change the status quo we have, Bruce quitting Shield(if it at all happens) is not gonna change a damn thing, because Banner joining the Shield is not the problem, the problem is in the writer himself.

Edited by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj: We'll I think i'm speaking for the both of us when I say that we hope you are wrong :) (Joking obviously)

who would you want then tho?

Edited by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: No joke, i hope too... But....

Jeff Parker seems like a good choice, though ideally i would like for Pak to return :) nothing would make me more happy.

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

@theacidskull: No joke, i hope too... But....

Jeff Parker seems like a good choice, though ideally i would like for Pak to return :) nothing would make me more happy.

Yeah, that would be great. But pak seems out of the question since most of his projects are already in motion. guys got to much on his plate.

Now Jeff Parker? that's be awesome!

Posted by Bezza

@raynorj said:

@theacidskull: I am gonna be cocky here and say that whatever Waid is planning does not involve the Hulk. It involves him as much as a weapon nothing else. Waid is doing fine in terms of Hulks durability, when it comes to Hulks strength he isn't really giving us anything tangible.

Waid is not the worst writer the Hulk could have but that doesn't change the fact that he still isn't the right writer for Hulk. Guys like Daredevil and Green Hornet are his thing, guys like Hulk are not and giving him anything more than a 12 issue arc or his own mini-series is a terrible move. Nothing is gonna change the status quo we have, Bruce quitting Shield(if it at all happens) is not gonna change a damn thing, because Banner joining the Shield is not the problem, the problem is in the writer himself.

I agree with you, but isn't it ironic that Waid has written two of the best graphic novels ever involving Superman so clearly he DOES know how to write good stories with top end characters, but hasn't really got a grasp on what Hulk fans want. Speaking as a Hulk fan, I want Hulk to smash, I want him chucking tanks about, going toe to toe with powerful foes and generally giving it some! I have just ordered a copy of "Heart of the Monster" which I am sure will demonstrate what we are missing under Waid!

Online
Posted by RaynorJ

@bezza: I've read Superman Birtright and that's a whole different beast, because it explores the origins and the character of Superman himself, the book is not interested in showing his top feats(sure there are a few impressive speed feats) but in terms of power and strength there is nothing really the most impressive thing is him lifting a giant tank... That's very low end for Superman but the book is not about that those 12 issues where perfect for what they where and that's what i was looking for when i ask Lvenger to recommend me some Superman books that deal more with the character itself. That's why i said Waid is not really good in the long run when it comes to powerhouses, to make things even worse he is writing a Banner story not a Hulk story.

Waid doesn't know how to properly represent a powerhouse, from what i hear he has the same problem as Bendis.

Posted by Bezza

@raynorj:

I must admit I haven't yet got birthright, I was merely thinking of the good reviews it generally gets. I have got Kingdom Come and I think waid does a good job with all the meta humans, but admittedly there aren't a lot of power feats to speak of, its just a good story about what could happen in the future when our heroes are all old. Maybe we should get Morrison to write a Hulk story!

Online
Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj: Waid at least is a proper writer, Bendis is a hack.

Posted by Bezza

@theacidskull:

ooh, that's harsh ! I am currently reading the Daredevil Volume 1 by Bendis and helped by some stunning artwork think its absolutely brilliant....

Still, I am quite looking forward to IH issue 18...might actually get some Hulk battle action..

Online
Posted by RaynorJ

@bezza: Well in his interview Waid said that he isn't interested in action(which stunned me because hellooooo it's the freaking Hulk) so any action we might get will be minimal. And that's what i expect from issue 18 as well.

Edited by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj said:

@bezza: Well in his interview Waid said that he isn't interested in action(which stunned me because hellooooo it's the freaking Hulk) so any action we might get will be minimal. And that's what i expect from issue 18 as well.

Where does he state this?

@bezza said:

@theacidskull:

ooh, that's harsh ! I am currently reading the Daredevil Volume 1 by Bendis and helped by some stunning artwork think its absolutely brilliant....

Still, I am quite looking forward to IH issue 18...might actually get some Hulk battle action..

it's not harsh, Bendis sucks currently, I respect his previous work, but fact is fact.

Lets hope so :)

Posted by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: http://comicsbeat.com/interview-mark-waid-on-daredevil-hulk-insufferable-and-rocketeer/

Waid: I think Sandman may have been the winner of that, although Ultimo was also a really good suggestion, so I could go either way. I think what’s cool about that is that I had a few good ideas I would intend for brawlers that Hulk normally doesn’t trade punches with. And so in the grand spirit of letting the fans do my work for me, I went on Twitter and solicited a bunch of suggestions and I got some great ones. Some of them were already on my list, like Gladiator and a couple of others, some of them were kind of inspired but I think Sandman was one of the ones that was suggested and I think that was the hands down winner of my favorites. He can hit but Hulk can’t hit him.

That said that’s just the fight scene stuff, which I honestly don’t care as much about. What I care more about with Hulk is getting back to core principles. Which is the Hulk is a creature of rage, the Hulk is a force of nature that is out of control and trying to figure out a way to reconcile that with the idea that he’s also an agent of SHIELD. I wasn’t quite sure what to do until we hit upon the notion of Banner going to SHIELD and saying, “I will do X, Y and Z for you as a scientist and in return you have the Hulk. In return don’t think of Hulk a bomb, think of Hulk a canon you can aim and when you have a problem somewhere in the world, when you have something where subtly and fineness is not really an issue, that’s when you drop the Hulk in and he does your dirty work and then scope him up and bring him back to the lab and I go back to work again.” That’s the mission statement of the book now and I really like what we’ve come up with.

Posted by GreenScar1990

@raynorj: Which is why Waid needs to tell his Banner story and leave. No big epic fights for a Hulk title?! Why does he think we get this title! Giving us epic smash moments, great feats of power and strength, vastly powerful and unique villains, epic emotional events and interesting characters are some of the merits we expect from the series!

We expect more out of Hulk/Banner than what Waid's given us thus far! I mean, look at Waid has done. He's reduced Hulk to a near mindless, one-dimensional, growling, snarling beast; and turned Banner into a whiny, narrow-minded, selfish jerk. Not good. Not good at all.

The problem is not just the writer, but the Marvel Execs/Editors as well. They don't know what to do with the Hulk. There is no plan. We're at a point now akin to before Peter David first came on to the character and similarly before Pak came aboard and gave us Planet Hulk. What we really need is a writer who loves the character (not just Banner) and actually has a passion for telling big, epic, powerful, emotional stories with progression given to Hulk & Banner.

Greg Pak left the series with a solid end in "Heart of the Monster", giving Hulk/Banner solid progression throughout his entire run. He left the character at a perfect point where, if someone who was passionate and loved the character, could have taken the reigns and continued Banner/Hulk's progression as a character. Unfortunately, Marvel Exces/Editors screwed us all over by handing him to Jason Aaron & Mark Waid. Two big mistakes in a row.

Maybe they'll get it right the 3rd time, eh?

But that's what irks me the most. Banner/Hulk have regressed several steps back since Greg Pak left the series. Usually there is a reason for this happening, a reason for why a character changes (examples: Gray Hulk & Merged/Professor Hulk in PAD's run). However, neither Waid or Marvel have given us no reason at all for Hulk/Banner's regression as a character. They basically took everything that writers like Mantlo, PAD and Pak did... and flushed it down to toilet.

After the 'Agent of TIME' arch, I expected to have Hulk back to Gravage/Green Scar levels of power and intellect, for that was Waid's lame excuse for dumbing the Hulk down. Now that that arch is over... we still have the same growling, snarling, uninteresting beast that we began with! What the hell?! When are we going to get the real Hulk/Banner back?

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj: Mhhhh that doesn't mean that there won't be action right? I see that waid is more interested in the story, which is understandable but don't you think he'd realize that in a Hulk book there has to be action? This is the guy who gave us one of the best fights In daredevil.

Posted by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: It means there wont be any good action. Fighting will always come second to him and it will be treated as a must rather than something he wants to do and it is showing. Tell me in these 17 issues of Indestructible Hulk have we gotten 1 good fight scene? Name just one for me? Because we have got Hulk action in pretty much every issue, but not a single one of it is really good when you think about it. He gave us one of the best fights in Daredevil because he is a street level writer, others and i have said this time and time again he knows how to write street level guys not powerhouses. We will never get a satisfying Hulk action scene, unless it satisfies you that Hulk finishes all of his fights in a few panels and does it without any awesome/cool moments or against any worthy villains. I remember when fights used to take whole pages and even several issues, but nope here they are treated as a nuisance. I actually think Waid could write a descent Banner story if he wasn't forced to write a few pages of fight scenes in every issue, something he clearly doesn't like doing and doesn't know how to properly do with someone like Hulk and someone like Superman even.

I pretty much agree with everything Greenscar1990 said.

Posted by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj: Well he has one more chance to prove himself, otherwise I'll have to agree with you on the fight scenes. This issue pretty much states clearly that THERE is going to be a big ass fight scene.

Lets wait'n'see.

There is also one last writer I've taken into consideration. Cullen Bunn?

Posted by green_skaar

@raynorj: Well he has one more chance to prove himself, otherwise I'll have to agree with you on the fight scenes. This issue pretty much states clearly that THERE is going to be a big ass fight scene.

You mean with Pym/Stark/Beast? Hmm call me unimpressed, Hulk needs tested and that's not a real test at all. Also that Waid interview talking about Sandman being a great opponent made me sad.

Edited by RaynorJ

@theacidskull: It promises that but we have seen 3 preview pages of the issue and none of them show any sings of actual fighting. And it still doesn't erase that 17 issues went down without a decent action scene.

After that let's start a petition to remove Waid from the Hulk series lol jk.

I dunno he writes guys like Venom, Spiderman and Deadpool which are again street level guys and he did Fear Itself which isn't really a good thing. Jeff Parker seems like the best choice so far.

@green_skaar:

Yea i hate when superheroes fight among themselves. Someones always pulling punches and it usually ends in a tie. The only time i like it is when big powerhouses square off. But in this instance since we know plot shield wont let Ironman get squashed i don't have much too look forward to and yea in Waids eyes guys like Sandman are more than a match for Hulk.

As long as Waid runs the show, Hulk will never be "tested" and he will never get a worthy opponent. It makes me really sad as i read Thor God of Thunder and see him get Gorr, Galactus and Mangog while the best opponent Hulk got was Attuma... meh....

Edited by TheAcidSkull

@raynorj: @green_skaar: You guys need to be more optimistic

Prepare for the worst, Hope for the best.

Also about Cullen bunn, I think he'd be good because he loves action, a lot. Remember Toxin Vs Venom?

Edited by green_skaar

@raynorj: @green_skaar: You guys need to be more optimistic

Prepare for the worst, Hope for the best.

Also about Cullen bunn, I think he'd be good because he loves action, a lot. Remember Toxin Vs Venom?

I'm still hopeful, however 17 issues in I have less patience. I actually enjoy IH over all, I just want Hulk challenged, that's all.