Tevnoba

@HulktheUltimate said:

@TheMightyAvenger: Nova is powerful enough to destroy a solar system, he'd just go galaxy to galaxy destroying them at extremely quick speeds in his final form until he is finished. Besides, have you heard FF Advent Children? The song itself is enough to make you run and cry.

Your lack of knowledge of what you talk about is cosmically astounding.

@tron_bonne said:

@*Void*: @demifiend: @lord_oraculous016:


The only one that existed before all creation was TOAA. He created Nemesis, but he created her alone. She was the one who created the 1st existence. Genesis was the paradox of the 1st and recreated it with a hard reset or rather; he turned the power off and then turned it back on. Some characters where spared in a "saved data memory card" (extra-dimension) and that included Shuma-Gorath, Dr. Strange, & all of the extra-dimensional concepts (Principalities etc...) In all technical reasoning, Dr. Strange, Shuma etc... are older than Galactus, Phoenix & Eternity due to the Genesis paradox. However, in addition to the genuine recreation of Genesis, Time was no longer linear! Genesis created "turns of events through cause & effect" also known as Quantum realities that string together a multiverse.

This means, while TOAA was the one who created the 1st sentience and that sentience created existence, Genesis was the one who redefined existence into a multiverse, which puts him closer to the center of the totsie pop. Phoenix, Wanda, Legion, Entropy, IGV, Thanos with the IG, Anyone with the HOTU, Marquis of Death, Mad Jim Jaspers, anyone with the Ultimate Nullifier, Goddess Gaea, Chaos King, Abraxus, PR-Molecule Man are only soft/hard resetting their own respective universe within that entire multiverse. That mean that they can't really go as far back as Genesis had, therefore they couldn't have "existed before existence". The only beings that could where the beings during the 1st initial recreation. (Extra-dimensional beings are not tied with the multiverse: There are only ONE of each of them. 1 Vishanti, 1 Genesis, 1 Nemesis, 1 Cyttorak, 1 Raggaddorr, 1 Dormammu etc....) [In contrast to cosmic beings residing in the multiverse: There are multiple Galactuses, multiple Eternities etc....]

Dr. Strange on the other hand is another paradox. When Genesis allowed him to witness the recreation. He already existed before existence, and the only Dr. Strange that remembers this is..... THE REAL DR. STRANGE. All the other Dr. Stranges we see currently since the Genesis incident are copies of himself. He did this to protect himself from Dormammu and possible Shuma-Gorath too since they too existed while Genesis gave life to the multiverse. The real Dr. Strange is the most powerful. As the realities stretch further into the multiverse, each Dr. Strange gets weaker. IE: How current Strange is weaker than Infinity War Strange etc..




Basically what I meant above is that before Genesis (Sise-Neg)... TIme was LINEAR.... You can only go back and forth in time..... It just goes one way.... This linear time is 616.
After Genesis.... Time turned into NON-Linear......

For every choice an individual character makes..... A new universe is branched off of the main time-line.....

Data - "For every event that does not happen; actually DOES happen, in quantum realities......."

You like to give Genesis (Sise-Neg) way too much credit.

@TitsteR said:

@Tevnoba said:

There used to be a Marvel-Rankings page, but it is no longer there.

This? That's because it was wrong.

Tier 1 : 1st Class Beyond

• The One-Above-All
• Pre-Retcon Beyonder
• Cytorrak (inside of realm)
• Protege
• Cyttorak (outside of realm)
• Anyone with the Heart of the Universe
• Thanos with the Heart of the Universe

Tier 2 : 2nd Class Beyond

• The Living Tribunal
• Pre-Retcon Molecule Man
• Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet
• Nebula with the Infinity Gauntlet
• Magus with the Infinity Gauntlet

Tier 3 : 1st Class Multiversal Abstract or Scale

• Eternity
• Infinity
• Death
• Oblivion
• The Phoenix Force
• The Alien Entity
• Infiniti IG Nemesis
• Genesis ( Sise-Neg)

Tier 4 : 2nd Class Multiversal Abstract or Scale

• White Crown of the Phoenix
• Abysss
• Shuma Gorath (inside realm)
• The Sword in the Star
• The Legion or "Prime Evil"
• The Darkness
• Nth Man
• G-Force
• Mysterium
• Edifice Rex
• Korvac (Power of Six Abstracts from What if?)

Tier 5 : 3rd Class Multiversal Entity

• The Infinites
• Shuma Gorath (in between realms)
• The Beyonders
• Masters of the Matrix
• Hunger

Tier 6 : 1st Class Universal Abstract Entity Dimensional God

• The Entity (What If?)
• Master Order
• Lord Chaos

• Shuma-Gorath (outside realm)
• The Other
• The Dreaming God
• The Ankh
• The Enigma Force
• Uni-lord
• Abadon (Original when it was the embodiment of it's own universe)
• Lectra and Phaedra
• Zokk and Maftra the twin gods of Therea
• Anthropomorpho
• The Trion
• Galactus (fully powered)
• The Creator
• The Creator's Staff
• Job Burke
• Scrier (usurping the Creator's Staff)

Tier 7 : 2nd Class Universal Abstract Entity Dimensional God

• Sire Hate
• Mistress Love
• The Seven Friendless

• Entropy
• Epiphany
• Enmity
• Empathy
• Expediency
• Eulogy
• Eon
• Epoch
• Valka
• Unbeing
• Origin
• Goblin Force
• Trion Juggernaut
• Those Who Sit Above in Shadow
• The Vishanti
• Nightmare
• Hell-Lords inside their own pocket dimension
• Mephisto
• Raggadoor
• Cinnibus
• Denak
• Chthon
• Tiboro
• Helleyes
• Llan
• Arioch
• Adversary
• Inanna
• The Darkforce Dimension
• The Dragon of the Moon
• Archenemy
• Maya
• Great One

• Atlez
• Atleza
• Zalkor
• The Fallen Stars(Adam K'ad-Mon, Cleito, Evenor, Mr.Termineus, Sorrow)

Tier 8 : High Level Metaphysical Semi-Abstracts

• Galactus (highly fed)
• In-Betweener
• The Celestials
• The Absolutes
• The Makers
• Mirage
• Mad Jim Jaspers
• Time Twisters
• Time Keepers
• Hunger (embodiment of Hunger)
• Uni-Mind
• Anomaly
• He Who Summons - Leader of the Watchers
• Kronos
• He Who Remains
• Captain Britain (with Excalibur and Amulet of Right)
• Merlyn (with Energy Matrix)

Tier 9 : Minor Omnipotent Level Upper Class Reality Warpers

• Cosmic Cube Beings
• Known Developed Cosmic Cube
• Beyonder(retconed)
• Kubik
• Shaper of Worlds
• Supremor (I)
• Kosmos
• Star Thief I (Defender character)
• Vaangard
• Molecule Man
• Sword of the Elder Gods
• Devourer of Souls (With power of the Elders)
• The M'Kraan Crystal
• Mikhail Rasputin
• Lifestone Tree

Tier 10 : Metaphysical and Semi-Abstract Level

• Galactus (average)
• The Dreamqueen
• The Watchers
• Abrogate
• Stranger
• Vortex
• Demogorge (Atum)
• Rune Thor
• 8th day Juggernaut
• Daydream
• Hawk God
• Xorr, the God Jewel
• Wise Man and the Three Wise Men
• Walker
• Deathurge
• Stardust (The Body)

Tier 11 : Elder Gods

• Odin (Fully powered)
• Elder Gods
• Chthon
• Demiurge
• Set
• Gaea
• Elder Gods of the Hyborian Age
• Crom
• Mitra
• Asura
• Seth
• Surtur
• Adam K'ad-Mon
• King Thor
• Hell-Lords outside their own realm
• Mephisto
• Raggadorr
• Cinnibus
• Satannish
• Tiboro
• Llan
• Dormammu
• The Adversary
• Inanna
• Dragon Of The Moon

Tier 12 : Low Level Metaphysical-High Class Mutants: Reality Warping Level

• Franklin Richards
• Proteus Piecemeal
• Kelly
• Donna
• Haven (Radha Dastoor) and her son combined
• Composite Ngh and Ahh
• Jonz Rickard
• Alfie O'Meagan
• Jamie Braddock
• Hutch
• Mysterious Fan Boy
• Yazdi Gem

Tier 13 : Multiple Planetary-Star Scale: Skyfathers Upper Class Team Wreckers Lower Class Reality Warpers

• Other Skyfather Pantheons ( Odin (varies), Zeus [Olympian], Osiris [Egyptian], Manitou [Anasazi], Anu [Annunaki], etc.)
• Council of Godheads members.
• Doctor Strange (Fullest)
• Hyperstorm
• Cleito
• Evenor
• The Silent Ones
• Master of the Sun
• Star Thief ( Adam Warlock Foe)
• Elders of the Universe
• Architect
• Astronomer
• Caregiver
• Champion
• Collector
• Contemplator
• Ego
• Explorer
• Father Time
• Gardner
• Grand Astrogator
• Grandmaster
• Judicator
• Obliterator
• Possessor
• Runner
• Trader
• Arcadia Deville
• The Futurist
• Mister M
• Alpha the Ultimate Mutant
• Cosmic Skyfathers
• Veeda Leebre
• Kronnit
• Zuras
• Mentor
• Ghaur psionic final form
• The One Above (Deonists worship)
• Skup Collins
• Scatterbrain
• Orphan
• Overshadow
• Soul-Eater (Spirit Mold)

Tier 14 : Planetary-Star Scale: Death Gods Lower Class Team Wreckers High End Psionics Composite Beings

• Thanos
• Death Gods ( Pluto, Hela, Seth, Yama, etc)
• The Bottle Imp
• Supreme Intelligence
• Demonstaff
• Hunger (Fantastic Four foe)
• Shadow King
• Undying Ones
• Lord Tantalus
• Lord Khult
• Holly-Ann Ember
• Xemnu the Titan
• Bysshe
• Paloma
• Germain Royce
• Cloud
• The Dance
• Kaluu
• The Protector
• Touchstone
• Psi-Lord Franklin Richards
• Mantis
• The Walkers
• The Defiler
• Meggan and the Fairies
• Huntarr
• Mindstar
• Doctor Strange (varies)
• Modred the Mystic
• Nebulon
• Supernalia
• Varnae
• Kulan Gath
• Urthona
• Ultimus
• Thoth Amon
• Sleepwalkers
• Super-Adaptoids
• Audit
• Franklin 2099
• Moleculon
• Mangog
• Onslaught (Varies)
• Young Gods' Uni-Mind
• Overmind
• Armaziel, Tzadqiel, and other Cosmic Angels Asuras

Tier 15 : Top Tiers

• Thor
• Silver Surfer
• Morg
• Beta Ray Bill
• Firelord
• X-Man (Shaman)
• Adam Warlock
• Magneto
• Ikaris

• Sersi

• Black Bolt
• Quasar
• Maelstrom
• Captain Marvel (Mar-vell, Genis-Vell, Phyla)
• Kro
• Thena

• Emperor
• Val-Or
• Moondragon
• Sundragon
• Avatar
• Apocalypse
• X-Man
• Gladiator
• Hulk (in enraged state)

There are a number of incorrect placements on your list as well.

There used to be a Marvel-Rankings page, but it is no longer there.

@Hohenheim_of_light said:

@Thor's hammmer said:

PR Beyonder. GEB isn't actually omnipotent.

Neither is PR Beyonder, unless someone can explain why PR Molecule Man was able to go toe to toe with him.

He did not go toe to toe with him, he was canceling some of his power, but was loosing ground faster and faster.

@OblivionKnight said:

@Tevnoba: The Presensce(in Vertigo, especially the Lucifer series) is established as an omnipotent being, while Michael and Lucifer are given the two aspects that makes one omnipotent. It doesn't matter who's really omnipotent, cause I've heard about the other guy(Primal Monitor?), and, as it seems in Vertigo, the Presensce is omnipotent and the only ones above him are seemingly the writers, which is the same for every character.

"Omnipotence" is relative. Heck, Thanos was Omnipotent when he used the Cosmic Cube, then again when he used the IG, and yet again when he had HOTI / HOTU. There are hundreds of occurrences of characters claiming or be called Omnipotent, when they clearly are not. Eternity is technically Omnipotent within himself, The Infinity Being is Omnipotent, Shuma/Cytroakk/Mephisto are all "Omnipotent" within their realms, the list goes on and on and on and on . . . .

Claims/Lables of Omnipotence only last until something supersedes them. The Presence has stated that he was created by something else, hence he is not omnipotent and therefor neither are Lucifer+Michael or GEB.

@Prince CortSether:

Sise-Neg's feat was not everything - why? Because he absorbed the "magic" and there is more to the universe/multiverse/megaverse of Marvel than just "magic".

This is Galactus as his supposed "Full Power", which means there is no earth/universe left (because he would have to consume it all to be at full power). I say Big G takes it.

Harry has no chance on any of the rounds.

First of all, it is said that Michael + Lucifer = The Presence and that The Presence = GEB (or maybe just less than) - it is unclear, but does not matter.

THE PRESENCE (with or without GEB). and by extension Michael + Lucifer are NOT the Supreme being of the DCU! Even all of them together are not the Supreme being of the DCU, and therefore are not truly OMNIPOTENT!, PR Beyonder was.

PR Beyonder wins by default.

Lognshot wins.