Storm Calling's forum posts

#1 Edited by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

Storm.

#2 Edited by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@stormcell said:

@storm_calling said:

@stormcell said:
@storm_calling said:

@stormcell: That post had nothing to do with what you said about her connection to the biosphere. My point was that the writer felt there was a clear distinction between the way her and Iceman were immune to the cold. I've already stated that she is impervious to the weather when she has a connection to the biosphere;however, it's still protection, and relies on her influence over them for it. That issue(UXM 285) makes it clear as well.

It relies on her connection to the life force of the Earth, not her influence over them. Here's the thing, both her imperviousness to cold AND degree of control over the elements are dependant on her connection to the life force of the planet. (As we both agree on, even if her bond with the life force is fractured, she still has control over the elements, but that control is lessened.) You are attributing her being impervious to cold being relient on both, the connection AND influence over the elements when it only has to do with the former, not the latter.

And she still has resistance, but her immunity is lessened. Both are clearly reliant on her connection to the biosphere, and are both effected when that connection is compromised. I'm not going to debate this in two threads though, so if we're continuing our debate we need to keep this in the thermodynamics thread.

While I agree to restrict our debate on her powers to the other thread, why in the WORLD would I disagree with what you've just said here? This is what I've been trying to get you to see all along. At first, you were trying to say that her immunity is dependant on both her connection to the life force of the Earth AND her influence. I was just trying to get you to drop that second part about the "influence" thing as it has nothing to do with her immunity. Rather, both the immunity and influence/control over the elements are connected to her unity with the life force of her environment. You have FINALLY seen the light! :D Now, if you can word this on your website EXACTLY as you've worded it here, it would be AWESOME! HAHAHAHAHA! I TOLD you round 5 of our debate would have an impact on ya! ;) Now, back to the other thread...

Umm no, my point was that she still has to have some influence in order to be immune, and that her control and immunity is a direct result of her connection and influence over the weather. I don't know what you're talking about or how you came to that conclusive, but it's grossly offensive and I am not about to have words put into my mouth.

#3 Edited by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@stormcell said:

@storm_calling:

1) "If that's your best shot, I better make this short and sweet" does not mean he's telling her, "I'm going to throw this bolt back at you." It simply means that her attack isn't gonna stop him, so he's just telling her that he's going to finish the fight right then and there.

I didn't say he was telling her he was about to throw her lightning back at her, I said she knew he was about to attack. She didn't know this in her fight with Magneto or Arcade until after the attack was thrown back. And in Magneto's case, he setup an interference field to instantly throw her bolts back at her midway through WHILE she was casting it. The same occurred with Arcade's lightning trap. No matter which way you spin it, the situation is completely different. The one Magneto cast in the following issue was a lot quicker. Juggernaut tanked, then gloated, and then warned he was going to finish her. She had much more time to prepare than in the other two instances.

2) We know from the Juggernaut situation that Storm can instantly adjust for the energy surge of a lightning bolt.

No we don't. You came to that conclusion on your own. And even in that case, she didn't tank the bolt to even PROVE that she could actually adjust to energy surges at that point. So you have no case.

You have to try and come up with silly weaknesses that don't make sense when taken into account with the rest of her powerset and the way her powers work, thus such weaknesses become indefensible and nullified as PIS.)

I didn't come up with anything. These were clear weaknesses established on panel. You are the one adding to the context to further your own theories about her powers.

I don't recall him telling her, "I'm going to make this short and sweet by throwing your lightning back at you." If I were she, that guy is a walking tank. I would think he's probably going to walk over to where I am and deck me, thus making it "short and sweet" that way.

We get to come to that conclusion based on before and after showings under Claremont's pen. What we can't do is claim PIS simply because "we jumped to the conclusion that a prior showing "may" contradict a later showing". If an explanation can be given, such as her simply being prepared for her bolt to be turned against her(since it was established that she can compensate), or he hit her with a higher energy surge than she put out before(since his bolt was red and hers was orange), then there is no reason to make every single instance that has followed for over 40 years of indicating the case, PIS. Especially considering they outweigh that one instance that you cite as your source. Just going by that one instance I could simply claim PIS on the fact that later showing have proven otherwise(even outside and within Claremont's pen). You are fighting a hopeless battle, and I have no reason at this point to change my mind.

Didn't Magneto tell Storm, "I can take all you can dish out and more," before he set up that field which bounced the lightning back at her? This is no different from Juggernaut's "short and sweet" comment.

This was already after she had fired the bolt at him. The panels are up there for you to see. After she fired her attack, he immediately setup an interference field to repel the attack back at her. There was no warning, since it can be concluded that the bolt was intercepted mid-strike and instantly hurled back at her. Just because she saw him create the field doesn't mean she would be able to compensate in time for the attack. You came to that conclusion based on her fight with Juggernaut, when all you have to do is take into account that she may have simply been prepared to compensate, but was too weak to resist.

3) She did not fly out into that raging blizzard when she was in the jet. Sienna did her damage VERY early on in the story when she shot down their plane. That is what created that blizzard that was "too cold" for Storm. (TOTAL PIS!!!!! :::angry emoticon and staring daggers at Lobdell::: ) She was out in the cold from the get go and had no problems. What happened, a severe blizzard swept in and that is what she tried to tame only to get fried out. (PIS PIS PIS PIS...for infinity). In order to dispell that blizzard, she would have had to alter weather over Antarctica. In Uncanny 121, in order to quell that blizzard that threatened Canada, she altered weather over all of North America, which is MUCH larger than Antarctica.

Umm, that blizzard was not the size of the northern hemisphere...She channeled the blizzard through her body and then spread it across the continent to disperse it. The blizzard that she faced was over Canada, which is much smaller than Antarctica.

The blizzard in Antarctica had already come into play by the time she flew out of the jet. She even mentions that the weather patterns were "askew", and Xavier notes that they would surely perish in the blizzard if they didn't have the shelter of the craft.. Shortly after she landed the jet, a piece of the jet dropped on top of them and she proceeded to disperse the blizzard, and only then did she burn up trying to quell it.

4) I am SO GLAD that you finally admitted that writers sometimes ignore parts of Storm's powers for the sake of telling their stories. This is what I have been harping on ALL ALONG and you've been disagreeing with me.

When did I say they didn't? At what point did I say characters weren't written down to further the plot? I've already addressed that Claremont does write his characters down but he doesn't devalue them. With Storm, he never really defined a weaknesses for her at that point and was still developing her character, but he did make it clear that she would be effected by surprise lightning strikes, and NEVER went back on his word with it. Also, despite him writing out that Storm couldn't use her powers under water, the same issue has her recognizing that she could and does so anyway. So despite him forgetting about the instance in X-men Unlimited, he still had her use it against in a case where she was trapped underwater. So, no devaluing there.

I knew I would FINALLY start to rub off on ya! ;) Now, I am going to apply this thing that you have finally admitted to the Storm vs. Magneto instances. In Uncanny 121, Storm was given the ability to detect energy in the environment as she tracked down Vendicator via the trace amounts of energy his suit left in the atmosphere. That was a power we saw in that one story and didn't see it again for a long, LONG time. The point I was making earlier in our discussion was if Storm had been written with that ability in Uncanny 150, Magneto would not have been able to catch her awares with that bolt as she would have sensed him putting that magnetic field above her head which attracted a bolt from the sky down upon her. So, the point I was making is while CC tried to give Storm a weakness to lightning (outside of her mind and body being weakened as it was in the Juggernaut situation), he also gave her other abilities that nullified the vulnerability he tried to give her, thus he had to ignore some aspects of her powers in order for an unworthy foe like Magneto to have a way to beat her.

Still not correct, and I don't know how you jumped to that conclusion when I have been arguing against the fact that it has been established and remained consistent from the beginning. This is becoming quite a bit tedious and repetitive at this point. You can either agree to disagree or I'm calling it quits. You're not changing my mind and I'm not changing yours. If you want to make a secondary thread about her powers. Be my guest.

#4 Edited by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@stormcell said:
@storm_calling said:

@stormcell: That post had nothing to do with what you said about her connection to the biosphere. My point was that the writer felt there was a clear distinction between the way her and Iceman were immune to the cold. I've already stated that she is impervious to the weather when she has a connection to the biosphere;however, it's still protection, and relies on her influence over them for it. That issue(UXM 285) makes it clear as well.

It relies on her connection to the life force of the Earth, not her influence over them. Here's the thing, both her imperviousness to cold AND degree of control over the elements are dependant on her connection to the life force of the planet. (As we both agree on, even if her bond with the life force is fractured, she still has control over the elements, but that control is lessened.) You are attributing her being impervious to cold being relient on both, the connection AND influence over the elements when it only has to do with the former, not the latter.

And she still has resistance, but her immunity is lessened. Both are clearly reliant on her connection to the biosphere, and are both effected when that connection is compromised. I'm not going to debate this in two threads though, so if we're continuing our debate we need to keep this in the thermodynamics thread.

#6 Edited by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@stormcell said:

@storm_calling:

1) When I said if Storm knew the bolt was coming, it would not have hurt her, I was referring to what Uncanny 150 said. I then brought up the PIS in the first fight between Storm and Magneto because she CLEARLY knew the bolt rebounded off that interference field Magneto created and bounced back at her, yet she was still hurt by this. I don't have a problem with the Juggernaut situation since Storm's powers are limited by the strength of her will and body both of which were being negatively affected by that severe claustrophobic attack thus making her vulnerable to the bolt as was clearly established in that situation.

Magneto created an interference field midway through her attack on him. The same happened when Arcade's lightning trap instantly redirected her attack back at her. What Juggernaut did was completely different and he even warns her that he was about to attack before he did. "but if that's your best shot - I better make this short an' sweet", He then proceeds throwing it back at her. This wasn't an instant or automatic redirection attack, since he very clearly took time to absorb the attack and warns her before he tossed it back at her. No issue ever stated that she only needed to be aware to be automatically immune. She needed to be aware And able to compensate to withstand the attack.

2) Actually, some of the other X-Men believed Storm to be their best weapon against Juggernaut when Colossus, etc failed, IIRC. So, actually, she thought her attack WAS going to be successful. Storm was easily the most powerful X-Man there as Phoenix Force Jean Grey was not present.

What are you talking about? He tanked her attack and warned her he was about to finish her off.

3) Storm's temperatures would not have risen instantly to critical when she first left out of the jet in Unlimited issue 1 because she did not fly out into a raging blizzard. Throughout the whole issue, she was able to withstand the ambient cold temperatures of Antarctica, but the blizzard's temperatures was too much for her, according to Lobdell (which is PIS since Claremont CLEARLY did not go with this explanatinon of Ororo's powers as she was flat out immune to the cold. Thus, CC had Storm tank much colder temperatures than an antarctic blizzard with no problems whatsoever).

She flew out into the raging blizzard to land the X-jet(that was crash landing at that point). She was already within the raging blizzard at that point. Xavier and Scott were being protected from the blizzard by the jet.

4) I rag on Lobdell since he was the only writer who ever used that explanation for Ororo's resistance to cold. All other writers before and after had Storm flat out immune to cold and able to withstand any cold temperature as long as she was attuned to the life force of wherever she was located.

It was an addition to her powers that he wanted to expand on because Claremont never really got into the mechanics of her immunity.

5) Sienna's blast did a lot of damage to the EM field which caused the blizzard as a side effect, true, but the blizzard itself was MUCH weaker than what Shaman created and even more weaker than what Deluge did. What was so dangerous about Sienna's teleportation was that it created a hole in the EM field which created a vacuum that would have killed anyone caught up in it. Storm summoned winds strong enough to move herself and her teammates away from the vacuum. Again, the blizzard that hurt Storm was nothing compared to what Shaman and Deluge dished out.

The blizzard was fueled by the damage to the electromagnetic spectrum. It was never stated how powerful the blizzard was, but even Betsy and Bishop pointed out that it was a lot worse than normal blizzards. As for them escaping the vacuum, it's not like she was trying to disperse the vacuum. She used her own winds to counteract the effects of the pull. The blizzard was simply too big for her to disperse, but she could still maneuver through it without feeling the effects.

Not only that, but the issue cited the reasoning for Storm not being able to dispell the blizzard being she would have had to alter the weather over the entire continent of Antarctica to do so. Lobdell asserted that for all of her power, she cannot alter that much of the Earth's ecosystem. All of this is PIS as there are numerous stories out there showing Storm doing far more than these limits Lobdell tried to place on her in this issue. I have already cited the examples in earlier posts. No weakness Lobdell gave Storm in that one story carries any water and it has clearly been ignored (and rightfully so) by all subsequent writers.

I've already said that portion of the issue was WIS/PIS, but Claremont has done relatively the same thing. In X-men Unlimited 39, he had Storm manipulate the liquid medium, only for her to once again have to rediscover this ability in X-treme X-men. Writers tend to ignore some of past occurrences to propel their stories. The Deluge issue hadn't even been created at that point, so until then Storm's powers had only spanned across a continent(Canada 3,854,085 sq mi), and even then dealing with weather of that scale nearly killed her. Antarctica was much larger at 5,400,000 sq mi.

#7 Posted by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@storm_calling said:

@jhazzroucher said:

Looks like Alaxandra is reading the Storm ongoing solo: http://instagram.com/p/yQ93r5E-77/

This was such nice news! It's almost like she read @thunderbolt30 and I's post.

I've checked that. I also checked her pictures to really know how she really looks. She's not a lady who can look fierce. I just hope I'm wrong though. And maybe it has something to do with her eye brows.

I don't think it effects my opinion on her casting, but it does show that she is willing to try to do the best she can with what she has to work with. At the end of the day she was picked for the role and not the other way around. So I am willing to give her a chance if she's this invested,

#8 Posted by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@storm_calling: I'm sorry, but there was no where I can find that stated she's Omega. Not even in the wiki. But I did find a video called Omega Level and this guy said Storm is not an omega and I believe him.

I never said she was omega level. She's a potential omega level mutant though, and that has been indicated on panel twice. Scans are on the previous page.

#9 Posted by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio

@stormcell: That post had nothing to do with what you said about her connection to the biosphere. My point was that the writer felt there was a clear distinction between the way her and Iceman were immune to the cold. I've already stated that she is impervious to the weather when she has a connection to the biosphere;however, it's still protection, and relies on her influence over them for it. That issue(UXM 285) makes it clear as well.

#10 Posted by Storm Calling (3710 posts) - - Show Bio