Cyclops vs Wolverine - who understands the Phoenix Force better?

Recently in Avengers vs X-men, we saw Captain America ask Wolverine for information about the Phoenix force, and later refer to Wolverine as his 'expert' on the matter (Cyclops was, of course, duly unimpressed). Mind you, Wolverine seems like he'd be a pretty good source on the matter (given how much the Phoenix Force seems to show up in his dreams and whatnot), but could he possibly understand Phoenix better than Cyclops? After all, Cyclops was not only married to Jean Grey, but he also dealt with the Phoenix quite a bit in Warsong (and in multiple hosts...). Cyclops has spent more time with the Phoenix, was there when Jean killed herself on the moon all those years ago, he would have been there for Jean to talk to about the Phoenix Force if she ever needed a shoulder to cry on, and in general seems like he would better understand how devastating the Phoenix could be.

So who do you think would be a better source of knowledge on the issue?

21 Comments
21 Comments
Posted by BurningDoom1

I would think that both of them have no clue. I'd think that only telepaths have any real understanding of the Phoenix Force. And even then, only former hosts TRULY know the intentions and though-process of The Phoenix Force. To everyone else, all they see is a nearly-unstoppable cosmic force of destruction.

Posted by WarMachineMarkV

- Cyclops would be more familiar with the Phoenix than Wolverine by far. Being married to jean and having a mental link with said host gives him a unique perspective.

- Cap went to Wolverine because he had to, if he asked all these questions to Scott it would take about 30 seconds before he figured out what the Avengers stance was on things. Logan was not the best source, he was the best available.

Posted by Rabbitearsblog

Cyclops should know about the Phoenix Force better since he had a relationship with Jean Grey and Jean Grey was the host of the Phoenix Force for many years.

Edited by Squares

@BurningDoom1:Wow, I hadn't thought of it like that. Excellent point! Allow me to rephrase the question: Given that neither Wolverine nor Cyclops has the ability to truly understand the Phoenix Force, which comes the closest to understanding?

@Rabbitearsblog: Yes, that's exactly what I said.

@WarMachineMarkV: Oh yeah, the mental link, I'd forgotten about that. But the mental link seemed as though it only allowed them to know whether the other was still alive, as far as I can remember. And come to think of it, wouldn't Rachel be a better source?

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@BurningDoom1 said:

I would think that both of them have no clue. I'd think that only telepaths have any real understanding of the Phoenix Force. And even then, only former hosts TRULY know the intentions and though-process of The Phoenix Force. To everyone else, all they see is a nearly-unstoppable cosmic force of destruction.

Posted by WarMachineMarkV

@Squares:

- Yes Rachel would be a better source, but being Scott's future-pseudo-kid and a former host, Cap could not ask without it potentially getting right back to Scott. If anything I can see Rachel having sympathy towards Hope knowing what she went through herself with the Phoenix.

- Cap just went to the best source of info available that would keep the conversation in confidence in his opinion.

Posted by Squares

@WarMachineMarkV:As I recall, Rachel isn't really talking to Cyclops right now, what with running away with Wolverine and everything.

@Jnr6Lil: ...Thanks for the input?

Posted by WarMachineMarkV

@Squares:

- Anything involving the Phoenix is going to to make Rachel put aside their current personal differences, this is not something she is going to keep a secret just to spite Scott, the stakes are far too high

Edited by Squares

@WarMachineMarkV:I'll take your word for it. Also, future-pseudo-kid is a pretty good way to describe Rachel.

You mentioned in an earlier post that Rachel would sympathize with Hope, know what she's going through and such, but I don't think she would, really. When Rachel manifested the Phoenix, she did it in what can be called, in comparison, an incredibly peaceful manner (she was moping while holding a holoempathic crystal that Jean had imprinted, I believe) and didn't have to go through the confusion Hope seems to have experienced. After all, it's kind of like Rachel expected to host the Phoenix Force, what with Jean having it and all, and as such wasn't really afraid of it. Maybe her version of Jean Grey never went all Dark Phoenix...

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@Squares: Yes

Posted by Squares

@Jnr6Lil said:

@Squares: Yes

What are you saying 'yes' to?

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@Squares: your question

Posted by Squares

@Jnr6Lil: 'Yes', as an answer, doesn't make sense in the context of the question. I would appreciate further elaboration.

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@Squares: Whatever

Posted by Squares

@Jnr6Lil:Did you mean 'yes, Rachel would be a better source of information'?

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@Squares: No, yes thanks for the input

Posted by Squares

@Jnr6Lil:That doesn't make much sense. Do you mean 'you're welcome'?

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@Squares: No

Posted by Squares

@Jnr6Lil:Right. I beseech you, start making sense or leave.

Posted by AssertingValor

cyclopse easy, he has been far more involved with jean over the years.........

Posted by Jnr6Lil

@Squares: Your wasting time on me then the topic