seekquaze's forum posts

#1 Edited by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

@outside_85 said:

A) The sailors needed to die in order to preserve the secrecy of the Amazons existence.

B) The Amazons never showed joy when they killed. The mother of a boy child was even shown as being devastated when it was taken from her.

C) Mmm, yes, seduce and leave. Sure, no one will notice that dozens of superhuman women show up around the coastal cities of the Mediterranean every 30 years or so for a bit of snu-snu before vanishing in row boats.

D) You seems to confuse hatred for what the Amazons consider a necessary action.

So can I ask you something; is Ra's al-Ghul a combined man and woman hater because he's killed hundreds of thousands of each? Is Vandal Savage? Brainiac? Is the US a Japan hater because it felt it needed to wipe out two cities along with thousands of civilians rather than target the armed forces only?

A. A clear disregard for their lives and like I stated there were alternate ways around it.

B. Most mothers have an emotional connection to any children born of them. It still doesn't change that Amazon society as a whole considered males worthless and unworthy of life.

C. A way easily around that is instead of procreating every 30 years or so space it out more so a few women every year or so go out and maybe go further inland. It would take a bit more effort, but is doable.

D. It is not necessary the way they do it. It is the easiest way with again a clear disregard for male life that easily comes across as hatred.

As for the others you mention, different cultural backgrounds so trying to equate them is most likely a mistake. But, from what I know Ra's Al-Ghul thinks little of humans in general and thinks women are inferior. Vandal Savage thinks only of himself. Brainiac I doubt hates people because that puts too much emotion into it. All of them think they are superior so other beings are not worth hating because they are so far beneath them. They are like ants. And may easily be what the Amazons as well. If so, frankly in their case I do not know which is worse.

Also, going back to the original post it raises the question of why Wonder Woman has concern for the lives of others including men when by all accounts the culture she was raised in at best (or worse) has no regard for the lives of men and engage in a practice that was considered barbaric centuries ago or based on comments they made as well hate men in general.

#2 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

And thats coming from you? Have you tried reading these books without the preset notions of wanting to hate them before you touched the cover?

As I said, they are puffing their chests, in hopes perhaps he will go away. Besides it's not clear if it's Hermes they smell or Zola being pregnant with a god.

Because the Amazons are still a traumatized people, to them loving a man is now impossible, they've had to reduce men to a resource they only need to get into contact with every 33 years.

I am still waiting for someone to come up with an intelligent alternative to killing the sailors, and I've been 'waiting' for quite a few months now.

Because they were useless to Amazon society, an unnecessary additional mouth to feed, nothing more.

Because I hate coming here seeing people scream and shout because they don't or won't understand the mechanics behind the choices of the characters on the page.

The Amazons of the New 52 cannot be man-haters, not matter how much you like to think they are, because, so far, none of the things they've done have been motivated by a hatred of men.

The callous killing of sailors and of the male infants shows a clear disregard for the lives of males if nothing else. Wonder Woman has shown a compassionate nature toward everyone from an early age despite Ares himself trying to train her. The thought of having to kill an infant horrified her even though she thought it might be necessary. The Amazons though showed a clear disgust for men with their willingness to kill them so needlessly.

If they Amazons wanted to have children, but not let the fathers know it would only have been slightly more complicated for them to go out into the world, seduce men with one-nights stands and leave. They then could put any male children up for adoption. Instead, they took the easiest path and killed everyone. Such disregard for life borders on if not outright hatred. So yes, they do come across a man-haters and for whatever reason Hippolyta deliberately hid this aspect of their society from Diana.

#3 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

I've read the first two trades of the New 52 Wonder Woman and was wondering why she is so compassionate given the environment she was raised on. The Olympian gods are more like their mythological selves than the nicer versions that showed up in past Wonder Woman titles save Ares. The Amazons came across to me more like the traditional man-hating warriors of Greek myth than the lovers of peace from past versions of the character as well. Why then did Wonder Woman turn out so compassionate? Did Hippolyta just raise her differently? I know certain unpleasant facts about the Amazons like what they did to males born to them were hidden from Diana.

#4 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12:

I already have. I have never disputed the claim of the Hulk having super-speed. The question is how fast and what type. And as some have stated there are differences between running speed and combat speed. Characters like Hulk and Thor tend to be portrayed more all over the place then more traditional speed characters like Quicksilver or Spider-Man. Before the current run the Hulk's running speed was emphasized perhaps a couple of times. He always relied on leaping instead of running. Like other top-tier characters he has some degree of super-reflexes, but it usually comes off as less than someone like Spider-Man because are shown landing several blows before the top-tier can land a blow of their own. I have yet to hear or see of an example of Hulk displaying agility like Spider-Man or Beast.

#5 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12 said:

@seekquaze:

I know that scan, catching a ''cape'' after Sentry passed him throw, is not really impressive actually. Since he is catching him at the last moment.

This post explains why you need super speed for super leap ;

@dum529001 said:

You can have great strength through great mass but speed is what's needed to leap great distances before gravity pulls you back down.

It is still a speed/reflexes feat which is what you wanted. There are different levels of speed/reflexes. There is the Quicksilver level of speed and reflexes which is usually the highest. A few characters like Spider-Man are typically portrayed as below that, but above everyone else. Others like Thor and Hercules are portrayed anywhere from barely above regular humans to being far faster. Sentry is usually portrayed more on Quicksilver's level so it is impressive. No normal speed human could accomplish that.

At best you need some form of super-speed to properly harness your muscles to move fast enough. However, there is a reason Quicksilver prefers to run places instead of leaping. He does not have the super-strength to make the same long distance leaps. Hulk's leaps rely more on his strength. When Quicksilver leaps it relies more on his speed. The way your writing reads it sounds like you think Hulk has Spider-Man or even Quicksilver level speed and agility when nothing I have ever seen or heard indicates he does.

#6 Edited by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio
@erkan12 said:

@seekquaze said:

Hercules and Thor has always been portrayed as physically equal.

True, and that doesn't mean he can defeat Thor in combat. Hercules didn't showed any speed/reaction feats like Thor did. So your scans proves that Thor can't fly without mjolnir and it seems his speed and agility comes from himself, mjolnir only gives him flight.

Hercules has dodge the Sentry and caught the Sentry's cape when the latter was attacking him. The Sentry has caught bullets and proven to have both superhuman speed and reflexes. Therefore, Hercules has superhuman speed and reflexes. Virtually all superhuman beings have this to some degree. Only it is rarely show the same way it is with speedsters. And what does any of this have to do with Hercules defeating Thor in combat?

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@erkan12 said:

Leaping great distances only needs strength.

Wrong again. Show me some one has no super speed/reflexes (unlike Thor and like Thing or Colossus) and he can leap great distances... It is simple, they can't do that without speed.

Look at this, even Spidey using Hulk for travel. Lol.

Why is speed needed? Why? The all-around increase in muscles that comes from super-strength usually translates to some degree of greater speed.

And yes Spider-Man is using the Hulk for transport in that image. Spider-Man cannot leap as far as the Hulk and there are no buildings to swing on. You keep claiming I am wrong only for me to prove myself correct in every instance. You keep asking me for proof so name me one time Hulk has demonstrated the type of agility associated with Spider-Man and Beast? Name me a time he has leaped off of a wall, a ceiling, and another wall.

#7 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12 said:

@seekquaze:

Good scan. But i still doubt about Hercules, i made mistake about Thor, since i forgot that he has super speed/reflexes too (even without mjolnir)

*That also proves Thor can't fly without Mjolnir*

However Wonder Man can fly already, that doesn't count.

Characters such as Thing, Hercules, Colossus, Juggernaut i really doubt they can do same just because they have super strength. They still need speed, reflexes and agility for super leaping along with the super strength.

Hercules and Thor has always been portrayed as physically equal. Most people who think all of Thor's extra powers come form his hammer at worse usually admit he and Hercules are equal in a straight physical sense. Hercules has the It requires great leg strength to lift alot of the things he does besides great arm strength. Some of the handbooks state he can leap great distances.

Wonder Man could not fly in that instance. So yes it does count. When Wonder Man was first created and for decades he could not fly. It is why in older comics he is sometimes seen with a jet pack or rockets. It is also why in this case Wonder Man is leaping instead of flying. Why would he need to leap if he could fly?

Leaping great distances only needs strength. Speed, reflexes, and agility is necessary if you are going to leap off of ceiling and walls the way Spider-Man and Beast do. To my knowledge Hulk has never done that.

#8 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12 said:

@seekquaze said:

Yes, they can. Leaping only requires leg muscles to cross long distances. The leaping like Spider-Man or Batroc the Leaper is different from the versions guys like the Hulk use. I have never seen or heard of the hulk leaping around like Spider-Man.

Show me your proof then. You are claiming something without any proof. The reason Hulk has super leap is not just super strength. Only Beast and Spidey can do that but much more shorter version, and both of them has great agility and reflexes.

When Superman was originally created he did not fly. He got around by super leaping like in the film Man of Steel.

Below is an instance of Thor super-leaping:

Below is an instance of Wonder Man super-leaping:

There is your proof that characters besides Hulk can engage in super-leaping. They normally do not do it because they do not need to. Thor and Wonderman can both usually fly. But leaping great distances requires great leg strength. Hulk can leap farther than Spider-Man because his leg strength is far greater. Spider-Man and Beast can leap all over the place because of their agility, but the greater the distance the greater the strength needed.

#9 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

I know Hercules is most famous for the strength of his arm, but his leg strength is supposed to be up there as well. Heck, it would be necessary to carry some of the weights he has lifted. I seem to re call him kicking a bulldozer once and sending it flying. Can anyone name any feats of his that focus on his leg muscles like leaping great distances or kicking something really hard? I

#10 Posted by seekquaze (737 posts) - - Show Bio

@erkan12 said:

@seekquaze said:

@erkan12 said:

@seekquaze said:


Can Thor fly without Mjolnir? In theory yes by summoning winds like Storm. And even if he cannot so what? Hulk cannot fly either.

True, but Hulk has super leaping

Do does Hercules, Thor and virtually anyone else with super-strength in their legs. I only brought it up because you kept bringing it up for some reason.

Actually they can't. It requires not just super-strength, also it requires super-reflexes/agility/speed like Spiderman. And Hulk's leaps are much higher than Spidey's leaps.

Yes, they can. Leaping only requires leg muscles to cross long distances. The leaping like Spider-Man or Batroc the Leaper is different from the versions guys like the Hulk use. I have never seen or heard of the hulk leaping around like Spider-Man.