seekquaze's forum posts

#1 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

@scouterv said:

I don't see any reason he couldn't lift it. I think the various stories showing he would kill are reason enough to say that he could lift the hammer if Death is the only thing stopping him. Lord Superman, Superboy Prime, The High Councilor, Ultraman, and Brutaal are all Superman willing to kill. Lord Superman and High Councilor are probably even more correct in their judgement (overall, but not case-by-case,) to choose to kill people like The Joker and Doomsday. I have to believe that, given the fact that it's infinitely possible that Superman would kill someone under the right circumstances like any of the other "warriors" discussed here, he should be able to lift the hammer.

And I guess when you put it like that really anyone could lift the hammer. I'm not huge into Marvel so maybe I'm missing something, but perhaps there are some universes where Thors' analogue is unable to lift the Hammer?

The problem is you are looking at Odin's idea of worthiness. Superman's no-kill philosophy varies from absolutely no to under extreme circumstances depending on the writer and version of Superman. At the end of the day, Superman is not a warrior which is what sets Thor and Superman apart. The killing aspect is a part Walter Simonson once stated to indicate that difference.

Superman should lift it because his soul is more pure and divine than Odin's andt hus should break his enchanment by sheer force of willpower. I mean Superman is God made more Holy than other Gods.

I know in DC Superman is often portrayed as some sort of universal messiah, but again you are comparing something closer to a Christian idea of worthiness to a Viking idea of worthiness. In many stories, Superman is vulnerable to magic and Mjolnir's worthiness clause is magic.

#2 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

Thor wouldn't have fought Hulk. If Thor knew what the Illuminati did to him, he would believe what Hulk's doing is not his problem. Heck he would probably confront them too.

I think Thor would take issue with Hulk invading New York. He might fight Hulk to remove him from the city, but he would definitly confront the Illuminati about their actions and force them to take repsonbility for exiling the Hulk. Remember, they were not the cause for the destruction of Sakaar. The Red King's men placed a damaged warp drive on the ship hoping it would destroy the Hulk and underestimated it because they had no idea how it worked. Hirom's people brought the Hulk to Sakaar by controlling the wormhole and whatever space drive the Hulk's ship had was not a hyperdrive.

#3 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

Its close, but sadly I would lean toward Ares. Heimdall was placed on the bridge not for his skill, but super-senses. He does not go adventuring and often just stands there. I imagine he trains but it doesn't make up for experience.

Physical strength matters some in sword fights though less than in a fist fight. He should be more skilled due to his constant training and fighting. If worse comes to worse he has his healing factor to fall back on. Overall, I give it to Ares 6/10

#4 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

So, why he isn't with Sif now?

Sif wants Thor to focus on Asgard and when they marry settle down. One of Thor's flaws is he cannot stop adventuring. So Thor takes Sif for granted. She is either left waiting at home or is "one of the boys" when Thor goes adventuring.

#5 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

@kgb725 said:

@seekquaze: Hes ill equipped fighting in space ? You brought up Earth. Also saying there are two ships doesnt make sense when you said there was only one.

When did I bring up Earth? The original post was who can Thor beat that Hulk cannot. Anything space related is something hulk is going to have trouble with if not be unable to defeat because he is ill equipped to fight in space. He has no long distance attacks. He cannot teleport. He cannot fly. The best he can do is leap and hope he can get in distance of and destroy an alien ship in one blow. And given an alien ship could potentially blast him out of the way or withstand his attack his chances of beating one are far slimier than Thor.

#6 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

@kgb725 said:

@seekquaze: If there 2 ships ? Really your question was what if there was an alien ship not two which Hulk would most likely go through

All of those are possible scenarios and why Hulk is ill-suited to fighting in space. Space ships in Marvel are a lot like ninjas. How dangerous they are depends heavily on the story. The Kang Dynasty story had Kang's ship be impervious to Thor. Yet Secret Invasion had Thor and a few others take out the Skrull fleet with ease.

#7 Edited by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

@kgb725 said:

@seekquaze: He could most likely destroy the ship in one hit if not hed land in it.

And if it had an energy shield? And what prevents the ship from using its weapons to blast him off? And if there are two ships?

#8 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

@kgb725 said:

@seekquaze: When has Thor beaten Mangog when hes not amped? An alien warship in earths orbit Hulk has jumped into space from Earth on panel. Thors soul may have been pure but how is that a victory I thought that was surfer anyways

Thor bfr removed Mangog one time thought I admit he had helped. During Jurgen's run. I know he had some magic armor that helped him fight Thanos, but I thought his battle with Thanos and Mangog destroyed all of that. He would have lost to Mangog except he shoved Mjonlir down the beast's throat and let loose an energy blast. Mangog is virtually invincible on the outside, but was vulnerable on the inside.

Thor has fought Mephisto several times with mixed results depending on how powerful Mephisto is being portrayed in the story. Thor once buried Mephisto under a combination of rock and lava while in Mehisto's own realm. Another time it was a draw. A third had Mephisto try pulling the same trick he did on Surfer one time by swallowing them to contain the person within Mephisto's own body. The Surfer escaped due to purity of spirit. Thor escaped because of his indomitable will. I probable mixed the two up since Mephisto is often going on about how noble Thor is and that is one reason he is one of Mephisto's key targets. I would count it as a victory because it is a way of defeating Mephisto. On a good day, Mephisto cannot be defeated through brute force. Thor can defeat Mephisto on a spiritual level Surfer cannot. Both Thor and Surfer have their souls within a body which ironically protects Mephisto from their purity. When the body is removed and only pure soul the goodness of Surfer at least is too much for Mephisto to handle. Surfer tends to lose in straight physical contests against Mephisto, but for Mephisto the battle that truly matters is a spiritual one that both Thor and Surfer have Mephisto beat on.

For the alien warship, Hulk jumps into space and then what? You would have to hope the Hulk has enough force to destroy the ship because he won't be getting a second chance if he jumps beyond Earth's gravity. He will float there unless he gets a rocket pack and then has to hope said warship does not open fire upon him. And how far can the Hulk jump? What if the war ship is in orbit as far away as the moon? That is over 200,000 miles. I know Rhulk once did it. Is that standard? And even if the Hulk can jump that far you still have the same problem of can the Hulk destroy it in one shot? Thor has the advantage he can fly, strike multiple times, and defend himself if need be.

#9 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

I would say Mangog is one. Mangog usually exist at a high enough strength level he would manhandle the Hulk who is vulnerable to physical attacks that are high enough. Thor can only beat him using his other powers. An alien warship in Earth's orbit is another. Hulk would not be able to reach it. Mephisto is probable another. Mephisto is usually beyond the physical and Thor has only defeated the hell lord in the past thanks to his own purity of soul. Thor has defeated the Silver Surfer in the past in direct combat. Hulk's only victory was against a severely weakened Surfer.

#10 Posted by seekquaze (606 posts) - - Show Bio

I agree the series did have potential. It would showcase Hercules's fighting skill and use of magical weapons rarely shown when he is at full strength. He could have become a street hero battling mythological threats and having to think instead of relying on brute strength. The first six issues when read together are not a bad story.

I think the problem was the execution. The first story arc went on for about an issue too long and had several major plot holes. Hercules is mortal so how can he hear prayers? Cycnus had been killed by Ares and had hated him for thousands of years. Now he wants to bring him back? The reason given felt like a cope out that Pak and Lente did not know about his appearence is Dark Reign: Ares and threw the line out. Ares is supposed to be Herc's greatest fear and a major threat in the face of Fear Itself? Why? And what make Cycnus think Ares would not kill on on the spot since it was all over the news on how Ares had changed. Marvel Ares has always been one of the weaker Olympian gods especially when you throw in Hecate. Prayers now empower gods? Though that struck me more due to Hecate's spell.

Spider-Island was an unnecessary crossover probable meant to drum up spells. Anansi failing at the end to who was it...Elektra? was another example of Pak and Lente's inability to write powerful gods. Incredible Hercules suffered from it with Neptune, Hephaestus, Hera, and Hebe. These issues focused too much on comedy reinforcing the image of Hercules the Buffoon.

The last two about Zeus I thought were the best. Aside from exploring more the relationship between Hercules and Zeus the latter is such a hypocritical butthole that is fun to see his self-image bubble popped. There is no one on Olympus aside from Hercules truly loyal to Zeus or who would miss him. And even Hercules is iffy.