SC's forum posts

#1 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@laflux: To use chess as an analogy. I don't mind the pieces being used, just the strategy being played. One of the relatively exclusive strengths of wrestling is that plans can be modified fairly quickly, but creative/Vince seem too fickle, so we should be getting slow builds that don't need constant revision because WWE has given us that in the past but also be lucky in that WWE can cater to all its fans/audience by changing what isn't working.

For many, since we don't know how long Brock Lesnar is around for, he becomes a limited commodity. One of Vince's reasons he talked about ending the streak was looking around to see who could capitalize on it ending and who were viable candidates, with only Brock being the one. Now a year later its kind of a similar question except with Brock being in Taker's position.

I am looking forward to Wrestlamania, its nice that its unpredictable for me, but usually I prefer Mania being the culmination of great story lines and wrestling and character development. This year thats really lacking. I am hoping the Raw after is great.

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#2 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@dextersinister said:

@sc:

Have you seen how some Thor fans who admit to liking this new change get treated?

There is getting treated a way by random strangers on the internet and then there's getting treated in a way by comic websites and newspapers.

Yes random strangers will give you sh*t for opinions but you get articles about how your a sexist for not liking this, there's a big difference.

Sure there are differences, like for one articles aren't so personal or direct or tagging you constantly. I am not aware of Comic Book Resources or ComicVine walking around singling out individuals and telling them that they are sexists. Well there was that one time Newsarama started accosting individuals on the street, but I think that was due to the alcohol.

Also comic websites and newspapers are calling people who don't like current Thor series sexist? What do they call people who are between like and dislike, like me? Half sexist? Slightly sexist? Also why should I care about that false accusation? Assuming there are even websites that are specifically accusing any and all as sexist for simply not liking this, instead of employing some sort of tautology. The point is that specific groups of people don't own a monopoly on false accusations, and its unfortunate when people are accused of false things, but its not just individuals who don't like current Thor decisions. Quite a lot of people who like and are even just okay with current Thor direction get thrown false accusations, especially where are they are the minority (Thor forum) and it goes multiple ways when interactions are simplified and generalized. The idea of being critical of others for throwing around false accusations before throwing some as well is a great example of how funny people can be.

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#3 Edited by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgaard said:

@sc: Thanks... I m more elucidated how the comics sales work, i really want to be assertive this time, but is very hard not think that this person also was undermining the facts to sell her story...

Well I am not sure if she was undermining the facts to sell her story. Like is the OP of this thread undermining facts to sell a story? I don't think either of them are, not sincerely (I made a joke about OP actually being a feminist but that was just a joke) I'd be more inclined to think they the evidence fits there belief and because of the nature of evidence and belief they are partially accurate and when people are partially accurate about anything they tend to focus on that rather than the parts where they aren't accurate. The reason why its important to extend good faith to others over their sincerity is because of reciprocity. If you are willing to take others at face value, its a good signal to others that they can take you at face value as opposed to second doubting or questioning your own motives. Like if we accuse that writer of having an agenda to sell the idea of female Thor because of her own personal agenda having nothing to do with good story telling/characters, or Thor in general, we could be right, but the writer could just accuse us of thinking that because of our own agenda which she could make up. So conversation essentially turns into two individuals/groups flinging accusations. Though unfortunately often in interactions people will make such accusations anyway even if you extend some courtesy on goodwill, but hey, you can only control your own actions and attitude, not others. ^_^.

Are you interacting with them in their article? Often a friendly and understanding if not neutral attitude helps others modify or alter their opinion.

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#4 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@trickyman86 said:

@sc: my bad about that and yeah idk i don't have the stats or anything but i feel that often times things change just to avoid the backlash from specifically the SJW's and the media because i feel its pretty obvious the media always latches on to topics that SJWs complain about

S'alright. Oh well there was that hilarious episode of Law and Order, but I think thats a media thing in general. Media and news often simplifies things, generalizes them, does a really bad job of taking an accurate and in-depth approach to things. I don't think this means catering to SJW's specifically, really just the majority of people. For every example of a mainstream media source doing something that seems to cater to SJW's there is a mainstream media source talking about science in a way thats really painful.

A lot of people at CV fall into the young, male demographic, myself included, lots of us know comics and video games well, and so I can see why many of us would find that Law and Order episode really painful and cringe worthy over how it presents certain ideas, in such a warped, and simple to the point of parody way. Then again, as someone with a certain degree of understanding about science, there are many painful threads about science at CV, and many painful oversimplified science articles in the mainstream. Its not so much that mainstream media is trying to cater to anti-science types. Its just they care more about being accessible to a majority. Same as politics, sports, lots really.

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#5 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgaard said:

OK... So with your knowledge on the subject what is you opinion on articles like this Feminist Thor selling way more comic books than dude Thor ? The numbers were manipulated, TGOT issue 1 sold (110443 not 65513) and doesn't acknowledge any context... Do you think it would be fair to use the word propaganda?

Its not a very good article. I mean its not horrible, but it has some inaccurate info and using issue one numbers in comics for comparisons is generally problematic. Most series issue ones sell big and experience a heavy drop off with following issues. Usually the higher the numbers as well, the bigger the drop off. So say a book sells two hundred thousand for issue one, will experience a significant percentage drop off (say 50 percent) than a book that starts off at one hundred thousand. Plus there are other certain factors like variant covers. While issue one issues usually get a few variants, those numbers aren't always equal and so variant covers need to be accounted for. So its generally better to wait for a couple of issues to use for comparison depending on what you are comparing.

Creative teams are a factor, economy, was TGOT a part of Marvel Now? I think it was, but if it wasn't then thats something that could hurt its sales/in the sense Marvel Now could have helped it.

Propaganda fair to use? I am not sure, I would be inclined to chalk it up to some ignorance and some data errors instead. I think that there overall general point as best as I can tell it, is fairly accurate and valid and thats that many peoples belief that female Thor would be a huge failure and would "suck" and (wouldn't) sell well because people wouldn't fall for this PR stunt and cheap gimmick was well wrong (in the financial sense) and that the company whose business is to sell comics would be able to sell a book around this creative change and that people would be interested would occur. I don't know if thats there point for certain though or their history/credibility.

I remember back when this announcement first happened, when arguments first happened, I actually made predictions about its sales that actually turned out pretty accurate because its not about whether you like the concept or execution (I think concept is interesting and that current execution is average) sales is more about knowing how casual fans operate and not being swayed by how online website fans make arguments or find preference.

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#6 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@trickyman86: Sorry had to delete your edited in image, CV rules have a no swearing (specifically F word) policy. Stephen Fry is awesome though.

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#7 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@trickyman86 said:

@sc: heres the thing tho yeah some people like lets say MK and some people don't like it but it always seems that the ones who are against something win and get things changed so people who like it cant enjoy it anymore. While, the sjws dont even buy the stuff that they change and they could just have easily ignored instead of ruining it for others

I think that happens sometimes, people being denied something because others complain, but thats either a business decision and a business would be bad if they only weighed the amount of people who complain instead of balancing the weight of something who complain about something versus those who want and would buy something. Or its say… an artistic/creative/ethics decision. Which also plays into business decisions but may factor in decisions that sacrifice certain practices that could be considered good business.

SJW's not buying the stuff they get changed, well yeah thats a bit weird in some contexts, but thats a people thing, like consider all the people who would oppose the "SJW's" over the Batgirl cover, how many of them were buying Batgirl and would have gotten that variant cover anyway? Which is okay, many people, its the idea of creative freedom and expression that they were arguing for, for others it was appropriateness and other stuff. In the end though its not the SJW's fault, its DC and the artist who drew the image (if we take DC at its word) because they made the end decision. Its the company who is offering something but then withdraws something it based on complaints, not the people who are complaining or the people who are demanding the opposite. Its… complicated. Lots of people complain about things that are never removed, because the people selling the thing probably have strong figures and evidence to suggest that its better business to sell than conform to some complaints. Some will modify or adjust or conform though and I doubt whether big businesses do it without money/publicity being a big factor. Which is to say I think people overestimate the power of the "SJW's" or misunderstand how businesses work. Unless I am underestimating the power of "SJW's" and there are so many SJW's that businesses do have to conform to them, in which case its just smart business practice, the same way I have to deal with the fact majority of people don't buy the comics I like and they often get cancelled with less than 10 issues **shrugs**

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#8 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@asgaard said:

Tracking sales is more than about mathematics, its about context. I didn't read an article no, I have tracked comic sales since I have started reading comics, I find it interesting as well as occasionally reading into the business aspects of Marvel/DC. I also knew a bit about business, advertising and marketing. You won't be able to google for one article, you'd have to learn about general business practices, advertising/marketing and use that with the raw data certain sites have on comic sales and then there are also a few websites that offer analysis on what some of that data means as well.

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#9 Posted by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio

@deathpoolthet1000: Yes but singling out a certain group as having an exclusive trait when its not limited to them is a bad argument. Not saying you are making that argument, but many people who would criticize and mock "McHeroes" are going to make poor arguments, block people, so on, similar behavior as they "McHeroes" they are so opposed to and critical of. Some people refer to it as the pot calling the kettle black or similar.

I don't know the circumstance of a comic writer blocking an individual on Twitter. I'm a rape victim, why would that suddenly make my opinion about a cover more valid than anyone else's? It doesn't. Maybe he blocked them for trolling or he does't have time to explain his position. Maybe he is skeptical of the idea of people using a traumatic experience that happens to thousands as a way to support the position over something like a comic cover? Maybe he is an insensitive jerk face? Maybe he is a hypocrite McHero? I don't know, I won't pretend to either.

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#10 Edited by SC (14365 posts) - - Show Bio
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