Defending/Criticizing Gratuitous Nudity and Sexy Sex Blog #674332

First off let me establish one thing, this is a blog entirely about Starfire, Catwoman, Starling, Aquaman, and Voodoo.  (what do you mean there are already other threads covering that?) Let me establish another thing, whether you support or criticize the exploitation or empowerment of the former characters, your a hypocrite. The last thing I want to establish is that I am in no way being paid by DC Comics to help in their new form of marketing by having all comic websites threads dominated by talk of their comics though some sort of free publicity viral marketing. Oh, wait you want to go back to the hypocrite thing eh? Fair enough, let me justify. None of you actually care about gender issues, balance, exploitation, or empowerment, the adequate justification of sexual themes or acts or the gratuity of the former, really, because let me present the following to you. This forum. Only one thread in it. Given how blatant and exaggerated and gratuitous the nudity and sex present in this graphic novel its, there should be tons of people shouting at each other and telling each other they are wrong. There is not, even though this story is filled with images like this.    
 
 Female Nudity, Male Nudity, implied Cougar... Lion.. uhm 
That, is a nude comic book character. In the buff, absolutely nothing left to the imagination. Where are the arguments for this poor exploited/empowered characters? Oh, so you might make the excuse, but SC, those are lions, its okay that they are naked, but I mean, sorry, but thats racist. Lions are people too. I have not seen this much gratuitous exploitation since that filth Lion King (but you already know all the subliminal messages Disney put in that don't you?) Not convinced yet? Lions in nature are nude and so this is just "realism" apparently? Uhm, but the lions in the picture above are talking??!?!?!? Thats the official rule. Character talks, character needs pants, or has to talk in a Donald Duck voice. No exceptions. Otherwise its overly sexualized, gratuitous... just why? Hmmmn, you don't sound convinced? Okay, well let me try and demonstrate how these lion characters are actually more fleshed out and therefore because of their emotional and intellectual realism and resonance - class as the type of characters wear thereby their lack of clothing translates from naturally normal to obscene.   
 
**THERE WILL BE MINOR SPOILERS on the Story Pride of Baghdad, BUT ONLY TO PROVE YOU WRONG - YOU SHOULD STILL BUY THE BOOK SO YOU CAN SEE HOW WRONG YOU ARE FIRSTHAND**
  
Pride of Baghdad was a Graphic Novel released in 2006, its brought to us by Brian K. Vaughan and Niko Henrichon, if you haven't realized it yet, *smile* the protagonists of this story are lions. Four lions, we have Zill, the default alpha male of the group,  Safa, the weathered, and wizened lioness, who is half blind, and maybe a tiny bit bitter in old age, Noor, a young mother lioness, who wishes for freedom, and her cub Ali. We get to know our protagonists pretty fast, they start out in a situation which is unusually dramatic already, and almost page after page we get new scenarios, new situations, new questions, which results in rapid character development and evolution, and sheds more light on our lions personalities. So for any of you still going under the, this is just an animal and not a human so its not nudity logic, I say rawr to you, rawr!   
 
Price of Honor? 
Honor and matters of morality? Strictly humanoid affairs? Not in this book, one of the more interesting moments is when Zill and Safa, after escaping from the Zoo that denied them their freedom, but are now starving and near death, come across the dead body of one of their Zoo Keepers and argue over the ethics of eating him. He is already dead, but Safa argues that they shouldn't eat the flesh of one of the humans that fed them and cared for them at the Zoo, and generally kept them alive whilst they were in captivity? Zill reasons they meat is meat, food is food, and they are hungry. Its a fairly deep moment. Whilst not strictly cannibalism, it strikes on many of the same philosophical themes and questions. These are lions sure, but they are treated as and portrayed as intelligent and articulate as any humans could be. One is even arguing the notion that is more honorable to respect the dead than to sate their hunger. The other defends their stance, because he is aware that not only is he starving, but so are the other characters. Funnily enough, this is not the first time, this topic of base hunger versus higher ideals conflict. The character of Noor, has an idealized notion of life beyond her caged environment at the beginning of the story. She wants freedom, she wants it for her and her child. She argues, negotiates, bargains and haggles with an antelope, pleas with an antelope, liberation from their prisons is within their grasp. She has a plan, and the keepers (humans) who are so weary around the lions, she knows lowers their guard around the antelope, so if only the antelope were to gore the humans, and retrieve the keys, and then the monkeys... Noor goes on to explain her plan to the weary antelope. The antelope is aware of the natural order of things though. It is engaging in discussion with its natural predator. The lion could sooner rip out its throat of not for the protection of the bars separating them. The antelope walks away from Noor who tries to appeal to its conscious and higher intellect. She gives her word, wouldn't it be worth the risk, for freedom? Noor eventually gains her freedom though other means, and with her pride, free of the prison of the iron bars she encounters the antelope again, on the outside, alone and vulnerable. This is our main characters first chance to hunt for their meal, but Noor dissuades her fellow lions. She has a point to make, and she wanted the antelope to know they could have both been freed sooner if only they had trusted her. She sacrifices filling her stomach to hold onto her own constructed ideals. Usually only humans are this pretentious, uhm, I mean, moral... but the lions here, they have honor and morality, and a code, (and they should have pants too) and it makes for a really captivating story (albeit a very gratuitous and sexy story)  
 
 Takes a skilled artist to get emotional range with Lion characters
  
Deep 
Touching moments, human (humanoid) vulnerabilities and sentimentality, strictly a human/human like alien affair? Nyeh, why? Pride of Baghdad is full on interesting and well played moments exploring what it means to be a lion... a human, an intelligent creature. We see the optimism and youth of Noor, clash with the pessimism and experience of Safa. Safa who values and prefers the security and safety of the Zoo to the world outside. Zill, the alpha male but one who is yet to grow into that role. Zill who reminisces of the horizon and of the setting of the sun. Ali, who is just a cub, and ignorant on almost everything and so very vulnerable, in youth. Us the reader, we are put though a gauntlet of emotions witness to these characters anger, sadness, joy, fear, awe, jealousy, heartbreak, curiosity, regret, pain, and much, much more. Its hard not to get emotionally attached to these characters. Some could argue that even though they are lions, they exhibit more personality than several human/humanoid characters in comics who might seem to be solely defined by one or two personality characteristics... how does this effect the story? Positively I like to think... its so much easier to care about a character, any character when they have an actual personality, even if that personality is raw and under developed, and somewhat alien or different to us regular humans. Then they transcend being pretty art pictures and actually become characters worth reading about. By the way, for as long as my blog is, I don't actually really reveal any of the bigger secrets and mysteries of Pride of Baghdad, so if your sick of all the controversy going on with certain other books, why not try and pick up a book a few years old now, but with even more gratuitous nudity, and sex scenes, but with actual three dimensional characters and... well yes. *evil grin* (yes this entire blog is an advert for a book I like)
27 Comments
28 Comments
Posted by thehummingbird

Okay I am reading this now now now! I post long THB response sometime today -red-

Posted by Timandm

O...M...G... How you could paste blatant and gratuitous nudity in here?!

So... You're actually suggesting we read a graphic novel LITTERED with images of naked males? I don't have a problem with images of naked females but naked males?! GROSS!

Sigh... Gone are the days when a mouse on panel would wear pants but no shorts?

Gone are the days when a duck would wear a shirt but no pants? (Honey addicted bears as well.) Although, they would wear towels wrap around their waist after a shower.. But the point is, at LEAST they had on SOMETHING... But THIS stuff you've posted here just reminds me of that porn that Disney put out a few years back; The Lion King... or something like that..

Posted by SC
@thehummingbird said:

Okay I am reading this now now now! I post long THB response sometime today -red-

 
Yey! I need you to post again as well, otherwise its not fair!! *red* 
 
 
@Timandm said:

O...M...G... How you could paste blatant and gratuitous nudity in here?!

So... You're actually suggesting we read a graphic novel LITTERED with images of naked males? I don't have a problem with images of naked females but naked males?! GROSS!

Sigh... Gone are the days when a mouse on panel would wear pants but no shorts?

Gone are the days when a duck would wear a shirt but no pants? (Honey addicted bears as well.) Although, they would wear towels wrap around their waist after a shower.. But the point is, at LEAST they had on SOMETHING... But THIS stuff you've posted here just reminds me of that porn that Disney put out a few years back; The Lion King... or something like that..

 
lol *shrugs* I like consider myself a modern day Larry Flynt or something... 
Moderator
Posted by Timandm

@SC: Larry does pictures of naked men?

Posted by SC
@Timandm:  I think he prefers the term, Visual Static Photo Representitive Art or something...  
 
i think you would like this Graphic Novel by the way *grin* Its got a nice heart to it. Some other adult themes as well. 
Moderator
Posted by Timandm

@SC: I'll give it a shot... If i can find it. So, do you have some of your own art work posted?

Posted by SC
@Timandm said:

@SC: I'll give it a shot... If i can find it. So, do you have some of your own art work posted?

 
I am thinking about making a thread for some of it later, but I am one of those types that can manage to turn a persons compliments into a criticism and a criticism into a personal attack when it comes to art lol   
 
I have a section for some of it in my gallery *red* (most of that stuff I copied over from comic pages though) - I hope I got Wonder Women's elbows right for you ;)
 
Moderator
Posted by Timandm

@SC: These are great! Do you draw for comics?

Posted by SC
@Timandm said:

@SC: These are great! Do you draw for comics?

 
Oh, no, I am far too slow, and nit picky to actually draw for comics. Maybe one day when I learn to actually finish a drawing I can draw for my own free web comics lol Thank you for the kind words all the same *smile* 
Moderator
Posted by Timandm

Well, how about illustrating a novel???

Perhaps, illustrating a novel for a first time author who can't afford to pay an artist? The novel sells, you get exposure... (the good kind of exposure not the... oh you know what I mean.) I know someone who wants to submit and AMAZING novel soon but he can't even write legibly let alone draw...

Posted by SC
@Timandm said:

Well, how about illustrating a novel???

Perhaps, illustrating a novel for a first time author who can't afford to pay an artist? The novel sells, you get exposure... (the good kind of exposure not the... oh you know what I mean.) I know someone who wants to submit and AMAZING novel soon but he can't even write legibly let alone draw...

  
Oh hmmmn, actually thats a pretty good idea.  Novel you say? 
 
I have worked a little in children's books.  I think my country's novel industry is too small lol
 
Wait, isn't all exposure good exposure? *smile*
Moderator
Posted by CATPANEXE

interesting article.

way OT here, but it weird-ed me out since last night I was tasked to draw as many different lions as possible and define as many different emotions

and characteristics through them, no joke. Get out of my head SC, the lions there are sleeping tonight!

Posted by SC
@CATPANEXE said:

interesting article.

way OT here, but it weird-ed me out since last night I was tasked to draw as many different lions as possible and define as many different emotions

and characteristics through them, no joke. Get out of my head SC, the lions there are sleeping tonight!

 
Thank you CATPANEXE!!  
 
lol that sounds like a fun project! Uncanny in timing too. 
 
lol, thank you for that link too, song, it was nice *smile* 
Moderator
Posted by Timandm

@SC:

Wait, isn't all exposure good exposure? *smile*

Not according to my wife... :-)

But you know how women can be... But, um.. don't tell her I said that...

Yes, I know someone who has written a novel about the beginning of all things magical... It actually starts at the beginning. It doesn't begin with something like:

- Ten thousand years ago a powerful weapon was forged...

- The dragons were all but gone now...

- He was the last of his great race...

So, it's about how magic enters the world and how all things fantastical began...

Posted by Hawkeye446

Hahahaha. That entertained me... I really need to read that book :(

Posted by Kal'smahboi

Does anyone want me to point out where penises should, but do not, appear in the lion comic?

Posted by PowerHerc

I both defend and criticize nudity in comics.

Posted by SC
@Hawkeye446 said:

Hahahaha. That entertained me... I really need to read that book :(

 
Well given how much everyone is talking about nudity and sex and gratuity, and cheesecake and all that, I really needed to remind people... something.. I am not sure what... maybe remind people... that I am not from around here... oh no wait. My message was that Lions are humans too! So make sure you get your pets neutered.  
 
Oh and that Pride Of Baghdad is an awesome read. lol  
 
Thanks for posting *smile*
Moderator
Edited by Hawkeye446

@SC: Hahahahhahaha....

Any time SC!

Posted by SC
@Kal'smahboi said:
Does anyone want me to point out where penises should, but do not, appear in the lion comic?
 
The scene where Mufasa catches baby Simba hanging from the Coconut Tree with Rafiki on the ladder wearing a trench coat?  *smile*
 
@PowerHerc said:

I both defend and criticize nudity in comics.

 
I think that is because often, you make sense and know and recognize that it depends on the story and who the comic book is for. *smile*
Moderator
Posted by PowerHerc

@SC said:

@PowerHerc said:

I both defend and criticize nudity in comics.

I think that is because often, you make sense and know and recognize that it depends on the story and who the comic book is for. *smile*

Thanks, and that's exactly right.

In some stories it makes sense and is nice to see. In others it should never happen because of the demogrphic the book is aimed at.

Posted by Grand Marvelous

New Book Idea: Porn Avengers. Marvel make it happen. I promise it'll be better than Dark Reign if it has nothing to do with Sentry. Completely nude Avengers. Only the men though.

Posted by Raiiyn

RRRRAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWWWRRRRRRRRRRR

I am absolutely appalled that you can read such blatantly sexual books... Perv.

**runs off to go find copy of book**

Posted by SC
@Grand Marvelous:  Thats actually a really good idea. Introducing the All New, All Nude the Nude Avengers. See the Stars and Stripes with Captain Au Naturale, feel the thunder down under with the hippie nudist god of Nakedness Thor, Repulser Rays Set to Bare with the Unarmored Iron Man. Watch them face off against such villains as Kang the Clotherer, and Loki, god of jeans and uh... I thought about this way too much...  
 
@Raiiyn:  Thank you Raiiyn. I think you will like book. Lots of cute, cool, funny and dramatic edge!  
 
@lykopis: Yes, thank you for recommending too and for posting on thread! 
Moderator
Posted by Raiiyn

@SC: I am sure I will =) Very happy I came across this blog ;P I will definitely let you know what I think ^.^

Posted by SC
@Raiiyn:  I have given you enough time now, so what did you think of Pride of Baghdad?  
Moderator
Posted by Raiiyn

@SC said:

@Raiiyn: I have given you enough time now, so what did you think of Pride of Baghdad?

I think that this is the most breathtaking story I have ever read. I just.. words don't even begin...

I adored this book so much... Safa is amazing and the flow.. just.. My heart strings! This is officially my favourite story of all time.