saturnssailor

This user has not updated recently.

108 621 26 9
Forum Posts Wiki Points Following Followers

saturnssailor's forum posts

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#1  Edited By saturnssailor

@nickzambuto: Tim actually had some prior training. When he approached Dick he had been trained by the best a rich kid could get without going too far away (which is to say very good, but nowhere even close to Damian's teachers' levels). I would guess that he was about black belt level. Then before Bruce let him actually become Robin he had 6 months - 1 year of intensive training around the world including with Shiva.

According to a height and weight chart for kids Tim would have been about 5 feet, 100 pounds and Damian about 4 feet 4 inches and 70 pounds.

So Tim would have had the advantage of more than a half foot and 30 pounds.

Damian would have the advantage of superior training, much better knowledge of the batcave and not being afraid to hurt Tim.

They're both very intelligent so I don't think that would really factor in as too much of an advantage to either of them.

The way I see it Damian would win, but it wouldn't be super easy like many seem to think.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#2  Edited By saturnssailor

@JokerTheShining said:

Damien (Robin)

John Stewart (Green Lantern)

No real opinion on John Stewart, but I definitely second Damian.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#4  Edited By saturnssailor

Cancel Dark Knight replace it with Red Robin or a bat!kids book.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#5  Edited By saturnssailor
No Caption Provided

@Durakken:

In the scan to the left from Red Robin #12, Tim clearly states "Two things happened today, Ra's. The first is that I became an emancipated minor."

It was less the emancipated part that I was focusing on than the "minor." However the fact the he is referred to as an emancipated minor shows that he definitely meant the term "minor" to be the definition by US Law which since 1995 has been someone under the age of 18.

Another way to track his age is Sebastian Ives, one of his friends and schoolmates. At the beginning of the Red Robin series it is shown that they have Math class together. You can assume that they are seniors as the class is calculus which has a majority of seniors taking it (though some juniors do too). Ives was in Robin #1 at the very beginning of the Knight saga and while No Man's Land might have affected him (if he didn't get out quickly which I think he did) the others wouldn't have. So Ives would have been a maximum of 1 year behind which means Tim would have been the same.

No Caption Provided

This is easily doable as Tim could have taken home study/home school/online classes during One Year Later (and I think he came back early from that anyways) and he wasn't in No Mans Land for the entire thing.. Also the Red Robin comics were only 26 issues long and in Red Robin #10, Vicki Vale states that "[Tim hadn't] attended for weeks". She was trying to make it sound as bad as possible so in all likeliness he had been gone for less than a month at that point ( If it had been more she would have said "in over a month"), but to stay on the safe side lets call it 9 weeks which is just barely under being able to say months. If you assume that it moves at the same rate after that too. 10 weeks for 10 issues means 26 weeks for 26 issues, about a half year.

For what age Tim was when he entered school... If you use the fact that Tim's birthday is July 14th and assume that Gotham is not located in Indiana or Missouri. Tim would have started school in August when he was 5 years and 1 month old. Then he would have entered his freshman year of high school at age 14 (and 1 month). This means that Knight fall probably happened when Tim was a freshman (further supported by the fact that he couldn't drive as "Tim"). I don't have any scans showing how long Knight fall lasted so I'll take your word that it was a year. Do you know where it states that length of time for Knight Fall?

So.....

Tim introduced= 13

Tim becomes Robin= 13.5

Knight Fall= 14-15 (Freshman)

No Mans Land= 15-16 (Sophomore w/ online or summer classes to catch up)

One Year Later= 16-17 (Junior)

Red Robin= 17-17.5 (Senior)

tl;dr: In RR #12 it states that Tim is a minor so 17 or under. He has his friend Ives who was in the same grade as him from KF-RR. Tim was a freshman in KF and a senior in RR.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#6  Edited By saturnssailor

If you'd asked me a year ago. DC all the way. I love the character and all the interaction and I could never follow if Jean Grey was dead or not.

Now. It depends on the day, but mostly I'm looking into Marvel and in denial about the reboot that destroyed almost everything I loved about DC.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#7  Edited By saturnssailor

I think that every character that grew up with some sort of family that cared about them and treated them right (ex. Bruce Wayne, Peter Parker, Dick Grayson, etc.) can't win. They may have had extremely sad pasts, but only one hero can have the saddest past and it takes a lot to beat out all the other heroes. What exactly counts as someone's past is all opinion so I've stated where I think each character's "past" ends.

Possible Winners

Laura "X-23" Kinney

Past ends when: She joins the New X-Men

PRO: Cloned from Wolverine. Tortured because the head of the project she was made in hated Wolverine for killing his father. Her "mother"/creator cared about her, but almost never showed it and almost never made any move to try to stop them from hurting X-23. Later she was forced to kill her "mother" because of a trigger scent and the only way she knew to show that she cared was to ask "What is my mission?". She then became a prostitute for an abusive pimp.

CON: Her mother did care, though she rarely showed it and in the end tried to break her out.

Cassandra "Batgirl" Cain

Past ends when: She becomes Batgirl

PRO: Abused by her father. Made to kill at age 7. She then wandered the streets until saving Commissioner Gordon and becoming Batgirl. The way the man looked when she killed him haunted her until the reboot.

CON: Her father did love her in his own way and though it doesn't say what she did to live on the streets that part of her life becomes the same as many other characters.

Jason "Red Hood" Todd

Past ends when: He confronts Batman with the Joker.

PRO: He lived on the street alone because his mom cared more about drugs than him. After becoming Robin he and Bruce started fighting, escalating when he may or may not have pushed a rapist to his death. He later found out his mom was not really his biological mom and went to find his biological mom who was stealing money/drugs from a relief organization in an impoverished area. She betrayed Jason to the Joker so that she wouldn't get caught. The joker proceeded to beat him half to death with a crowbar and then blow him and his mother up. He was later resurrected and wandered the streets catatonically until Talia al Ghul found him. She put him into the Lazarus pits which woke him up then she gave him a bag and pushed him off a cliff after telling him that Bruce hadn't killed the Joker for what he did to Jason. Jason captured the Joker to try to force Batman to either kill the Joker or him. Being Batman, Bruce found a third option and threw a batarang that bounce off a wall and partially slit Jason's throat. Jason was replaced by another Robin.

CON: Bruce did truly care about him and he seemed to really enjoy life as Robin. After Talia found him he traveled around the world getting stronger.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#8  Edited By saturnssailor

X-23 or Tim Drake.

Right now if I had to choose I'd go with Tim Drake since he's being re-established and has so much more to lose in personality, background, who he is, etc. than an already pretty established character like X-23.

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#9  Edited By saturnssailor

Hank "Antman" Pym. He met the representation of the universe and it punched him. When Spiderman and Deadpool were having a "Your momma" jokes contest Deadpool said "Your mother's so fat, Hank Pym had to beat her up in the back of a quintjet". In the Avengers Animated movie he is portrayed as full of himself and he leers and Black Widow even though he's married.

Julian "Hellion" Keller. He started off as a good character (egotistical and rude, but a good 3D character with lots of positive tributes) and then for the sake of a comic (X-23) with a main female character, he was changed into a 2D typical creepy, obsessed guy who was just there to prove that they weren't going to be in a relationship and that she was happy being independent and single.

These might apply as they were both two good characters who were changed dramatically because of women. Though I think that Hank Pym was changed into such a disliked character because of actual women (he became known as a wife-beater and it all went downhill from there for him).

Avatar image for saturnssailor
saturnssailor

108

Forum Posts

621

Wiki Points

9

Followers

Reviews: 1

User Lists: 3

#10  Edited By saturnssailor

@Durakken:

No Caption Provided

Though your timeline is more realistic as to how much can really happen in a year no more than 4 years passed between your year 13 and year 23.

When Tim was Red Robin (RR #12) he became an emancipated minor meaning he couldn't have been more than 17 at the time.

I don't when Damian was conceived and if he grew up at a normal rate or not, but that could possibly be a way of finding out characters ages in relation to him and what was happening when he was concieved.