MonkeyToe

@jsphsmth said:

@MonkeyToe: ? I used the word apprehensive because most people don't like change. I wrote nothing about anybody's ability to understand the concept of the multiverse. There was no attempt by me to insult anybody. I welcome all new and lapsed readers to the DCnU because it means that the industry will survive a little longer, which allows me to continue a hobby that I have enjoyed for close to 40 years.

I very specifically said that my comment wasn't directed at you. I was just giving some context on what the opinion seems to be from veteran fans about rookie fans.

@jsphsmth said:

I am amazed to see so many people are still apprehensive about DC developing the multiverse. I guess it makes sense as most new readers haven't been exposed to it, but the idea of James Robinson developing his own Earth should excite everybody, even more so when it involves him and the JSA.

As a new reader I resent that the so many of DC's readers think I am too stoopid to understand the premise that their are multiverses in the DC Universe (This isn't pointed at you, just at the overwhelming opinion that it is too soon to introduce an alternate reality). I'm not sure where this opinion is coming from but it seems to originate with long time DC fans calling into question the understanding of their inferior new fan-cousins. I have seen far less new DC readers complaining about the introduction of Earth-2.

I'm not sure why everyone thinks it's too soon to introduce an alternate reality in the DCnU?

@Buckshot said:

@texasdeathmatch said:

@MonkeyToe: Nice copy and paste, though entirely superfluous, since the OP used the "classic" image of Midnighter. So its safe to assume we're using that version.

Now now, he's just trying to help. Though I agree, I don't think the DCnU version is very much improved. Let's take a look.

"In the new 52 Midnighter's ability to predict the outcome of any situation still exists, but appears to have been supplemented by a form of precognition as well as enhanced knowledge. He is able to finish other people's sentences before they have thought about it, and when Stormwatch's map of alien threats to Earth materialized in front of him and Apollo, he instantly knew what it was. WS Midnighter has performed similar feats. Check back in thread where I mentioned his trouble sense and some of the non-combat-related predictions he has made. And there are also more that are beyond even what I mentioned.

He has significant resistance to telepathic attacks, as he was able to resist the Scourge of Worlds' attempt to use the Martian Manhunter's telepathy on him. WS Midnighter had anti-telepathy bugs in his head and other anti-telepathy measures in his head to prevent most kinds of tampering. He could also use those bugs to broadcast his thoughts.

He mentions that he has carbon-fibre muscles that presumably enhance his strength. As I've mentioned, WS Midnighter's strength is considerable, allowing him to block and trade blows with characters that can toss multiple tons. The carbon-fibre thing existed in WS too, even down to his bones. At one point his powers were turned off and the guy fighting him said even with everything off, punching him was still like punching concrete.

Harry Tanner, reputed to be the world's greatest swordsman, struggled to land even a single blow on Midnighter since the latter could predict every move he would make. Midnighter against the world's greatest (human) swordsman in the WSU.

After a few seconds of fighting, Midnighter immediately knew what Harry's power was. WS Midnighter knows that the second he sees someone.

He has demonstrated the ability to move so stealthily that the Manhunter and Hawksmoor could not hear or sense his stalking them until it was too late. WS Midnighter could move so stealthily someone with his own senses couldn't tell he was coming and his clothes absorb light or something so he's even harder to see in the dark.

His suit enhances his durability; WS Midnighter didn't need enhanced durability from his clothes, even in a white tee he could take bullets without them doing very much damage. And that's before getting into all his redundant internal systems, like an extra heart and all that.

he was able to survive unaided in hyperspace for a while." It was normal space and Midnighter has done that too. In the second image he has no powers. He's also survived (and fought people) in anaerobic environments on other occasions.

The major reason I made the point that I made was because someone pointed out that a well placed EMP could potentially take out his battle computer, which would be moot if it was due to precognitive abilities, which is, I admit, the only 'improvement' I can see with the above comparison. I admit that I am not very familiar with the Midnighter Pre-DCnU (I didn't ready DC back then) I just wanted to throw in my two cents because I like the character in the new comics.

@Nightstar1 said:

@GiveUpNed: @GiveUpNed said:

@Nightstar1 said:

Comic books are a valid literary form? Also, in this case, that someone who wants meaningless sex isn't a woman. It's a man, who is speaking and acting for a woman,, or at least an "animal in a woman's body".

Comic books are very much a valid literary form. The man didn't speak for her, as you can see, Starfire does what she wants, when she wants. In Red Hood and The Outlaws #6 Starfire explicitly states clothing is meaningless and you shouldn't connote them to a past experience.

Scott Lobdell (a man) is the person who writes the words she speaks, and Kenneth Rockafort (a man) draws the actions which Scott Lobdell (man) wrote. It wouldn't mean anything, except that she's claiming to speak for "liberated" women, all while acting like a frat boy's wet dream. Starfire states that past men/clothing don't mean anything to her as she's sniffing the gloves of a man from a past relationship. Irony is ironic, isn't it?

You keep using that word! I do not think it means what you think it means!

@texasdeathmatch said:

@MonkeyToe: Hah well don't worry, you've been included. That's an interesting fact about MN, I had no idea they gave him precog in the New 52. You should check out some Authority trades though, they're pretty fun reads. And you get to see some ridiculous Midnighter feats.

I will take it under advisement!

@Illuminatus said:

@MonkeyToe said:

@texasdeathmatch said:

@MonkeyToe: Nice copy and paste, though entirely superfluous, since the OP used the "classic" image of Midnighter. So its safe to assume we're using that version.

I suppose. But like I said, it hasn't been officially stated as such and we're using the bigger, badder versions of the preds, it seems only fair we use the new and improved Midnighter.

The "new and improved" Midnighter may appear as superior to the pre DCnU version of the character, but the "new and improved" version lacks sufficient feats, so it stands too reason that the OP intended for the use of WS Midnighter.

@texasdeathmatch said:

@MonkeyToe: Eh, from what I've seen from the new Midnighter, I don't think he's considered more "improved" than the older counterpart.

@Illuminatus Doesn't he hold off that gi-normous monster for several panels/pages before Apollo can finally save his ass?

@texasdeathmatch by improved I only meant that he's not relying on a computer anymore but the power seems to border on precognition. I don't really know much in regards to the old Midnighter, I just wanted to feel included!

@texasdeathmatch said:

@MonkeyToe: Nice copy and paste, though entirely superfluous, since the OP used the "classic" image of Midnighter. So its safe to assume we're using that version.

I suppose. But like I said, it hasn't been officially stated as such and we're using the bigger, badder versions of the preds, it seems only fair we use the new and improved Midnighter.

So I vote Midnighter!

Since it wasn't stated which Midnighter we're talking about here, I thought it would be important to point out that:

"In the new 52 Midnighter's ability to predict the outcome of any situation still exists, but appears to have been supplemented by a form of precognition as well as enhanced knowledge. He is able to finish other people's sentences before they have thought about it, and when Stormwatch's map of alien threats to Earth materialized in front of him and Apollo, he instantly knew what it was. He has significant resistance to telepathic attacks, as he was able to resist the Scourge of Worlds' attempt to use the Martian Manhunter's telepathy on him. He mentions that he has carbon-fibre muscles that presumably enhance his strength. Harry Tanner, reputed to be the world's greatest swordsman, struggled to land even a single blow on Midnighter since the latter could predict every move he would make. After a few seconds of fighting, Midnighter immediately knew what Harry's power was. He has demonstrated the ability to move so stealthily that the Manhunter and Hawksmoor could not hear or sense his stalking them until it was too late. His suit enhances his durability; he was able to survive unaided in hyperspace for a while."