Laurcus

@Roddy010 said:

@Laurcus said:

@Roddy010 said:

@Laurcus: Lol Please don'\t I'm currently on the second one so I don't want to ruin it. I guess we can agree to disagree then. Kratos is very formidable but I don't see him taking down Sora.

Fair enough lawl. Lemme just put it this way, Kratos gets so strong in God of War 3 it's absolutely retarded. I won't say any more than that for spoiler's sake.

Lmao I just about imagine. have you played Ascension yet?

Yes I have. And Kratos actually has a few interesting feats and pieces of gear from it. The multiplayer is also pretty ballin'.

@Roddy010 said:

@Laurcus: Lol Please don'\t I'm currently on the second one so I don't want to ruin it. I guess we can agree to disagree then. Kratos is very formidable but I don't see him taking down Sora.

Fair enough lawl. Lemme just put it this way, Kratos gets so strong in God of War 3 it's absolutely retarded. I won't say any more than that for spoiler's sake.

@Roddy010 said:

@Laurcus said:

@Roddy010 said:

@Laurcus:

I'm aware of what Sora has done. You're talking to a huge KH fan. Still looking forward to KH 3 in fact. The Disney Hercules' feats from KH are very inconsistent with his feats of tossing Titans into orbit. He struggles with Cerberus after all. And gameplay wise, Sora is unable to hurt him with his golden aura up, which for some odd reason is taken down by throwing barrels at him. Sora also has not beaten Hercules in raw strength. He defeats him in combat, which is far from the same thing.

Me too but it's gonna be awhile before we get our wish lol. As far the battle We're looking at characters at their best here and Hercules even in his Disney incarnation has shown feats that rivaled Kratos. Heck I've seen Kratos hurt by lesser beings then he's taking on Ares. Sora was still strong and quick enough to effect him.(let's not forget Hercules said he was not holding back in the fight) My point is that if he can hurt characters like Hercules then Kratos should be no problem.

You cannot assume that because something is the same size as Atlas that it is as strong as him, or that it has as much durability. That is speculation. Here's some rough math for you. From the tip of my index finger to my first joint is about 1 inch. Kratos is 6-6.5 feet tall. In game we can see how Kratos compares to the size of Atlas' finger. Kratos reaches from the tip of Atlas' finger to about 1/3 of the way to the first joint. So, if I was Atlas, Kratos would be roughly a third of an inch tall to me. I am 5 feet 11 inches tall. So, Kratos would need to be about 215 times taller to be equal to Atlas. Let's assume that Kratos is only 6 feet tall, so the difference in our height is only 1 inch. It's pretty difficult for me to lift 100 pounds because I'm an out of shape nerd. So, let's make me more like an Olympic athlete and say that I can lift 500 pounds. So, let's multiply my lifting strength by my size. 500*215=107,500. So, if I was 5 times stronger than I am now, and then I grew to be the size of Atlas, assuming my strength increased linearly, I'd be able to lift about 53.75 tons. Even if you further doubled my strength to account for Atlas having 4 arms, that's still only 107.5 tons, which means Atlas is still 55,813,953,488,372,093,023 times stronger than me, even accounting for the size difference and multiplying my strength by 10.

This is all fine and dandy for Kratos but it still doesn't support Sora not being able to hurt Kratos. All that shows is that Kratos is really strong/durable (when it calls for it). Sora has fought people >/= Kratos's strength level anyway.

The only "god" Sora has ever fought was Disney Hades, who doesn't have any impressive feats, and for that matter neither does Genie Jafar.

I used the term "gods" loosely what I meant were the many bosses Sora. Most of which who had power that contends with the Gods Kratos fought.

The tallest man made structure in the world is the Burj Khalifa in Dubai, at 2,722 feet tall it dwarfs other skyscrapers. It only weighs 500,000 tons. So even Sora's feats of chopping up skyscrapers in his fight against Xemnas are pretty insignificant to the kind of strength and durability that Atlas and Kratos have.

Sora was able to cut through six of these building in one strike with no problem at all. His strength is sufficient enough to hurt Kratos. That's the point I'm trying to make. Also what defenses does Kratos have against Sora's magic?

KH Hercules is not necessarily equivalent to the Disney Hercules that he's based on. I mean, just look at the Final Fantasy characters. Cloud is clearly depowered in the KH universe, as is Squall. You can't take feats from the TV show and movie that Disney Hercules is from and automatically say that Hercules in KH is capable of the same thing, therefore Sora is equivalent to that.

Kratos resists Hades trying to rip his soul out. The Claws of Hades are powerful magic weapons. Start of the video.

Hades kills a Titan with this ability. That's some extreme magic resistance. He also has the Golden Fleece, which is a powerful defensive item capable of reflecting things like Gorgon stares and even Zeus' lightning.

I don't believe that anything Sora has fought could contend with one of the God of War gods.

Cutting through six buildings is not equivalent to the damage that Kratos can tank. Even if those buildings were equal in size to the largest building ever made, that's still only 3 million tons. That's still only 1/1,000,000,000,000th of the weight that Kratos has been shown to tank. That's still astronomically far from Sora being able to hurt Kratos.

And Kratos has not been shown to be hurt by any "lesser" beings in cutscenes, only in pure gameplay.

You make really good points but I still don't see Sora failing to hurt Kratos, sextillion durability and all. Kratos is not the invulnerable God you are making him out to be. He's can still be hurt and Sora has enough strength to do just that. On top of that is his speed will allow him to evade and counter Kratos's attacks.I honestly don't see how Kratos will tag Sora anyway. Also having your soul ripped out is completely different than having time itself seize or being crushed by gravity forces.(physical magic) so I can see him resisting this form of magic but I don't see Kratos countering these.

I'm a number's guy, and by the numbers, I just don't see Sora hurting Kratos lol. I don't believe Kratos is invulnerable though, he's just much stronger than Sora. There are many characters that can beat Kratos, but I do not think Sora has shown the raw output necessary to hurt Kratos.

And while Sora does have better combat speed than Kratos, Kratos' Blades of Exile can move incredibly quickly, and Kratos has used them to tag faster opponents before.

Gravity magic doesn't seem all that strong to me. It's essentially just pressure created by magic, which is exactly what Kratos should do well against. And Hades' soul ripping attack is magical based, so that's an extremely high end feat which should not be dismissed.

Also keep in mind that so far I've only argued base form Kratos' feats. I'm assuming that for this fight Kratos would have Hope. Serious question, are you aware of how powerful Hope Kratos is? Because I will gladly explain it and post videos if you aren't familiar with the ending of God of War 3.

@goblin123 said:

is there a transformation for Goku higher than SSJ4 that I missed?

Sort of. There's Super Saiyan God, from the new movie "Battle of Gods" which came out in select theaters in Japan on the 12th, and releases nation wide in Japan on the 30th. Super Saiyan God seems extremely powerful, but there's not enough showings or statements about it to really compare it to SS4 yet.

The movie takes place during the 10 year time skip in the Buu saga, not in GT, which makes it even harder to gauge its power.

@Roddy010 said:

@Laurcus:

I'm aware of what Sora has done. You're talking to a huge KH fan. Still looking forward to KH 3 in fact. The Disney Hercules' feats from KH are very inconsistent with his feats of tossing Titans into orbit. He struggles with Cerberus after all. And gameplay wise, Sora is unable to hurt him with his golden aura up, which for some odd reason is taken down by throwing barrels at him. Sora also has not beaten Hercules in raw strength. He defeats him in combat, which is far from the same thing.

Me too but it's gonna be awhile before we get our wish lol. As far the battle We're looking at characters at their best here and Hercules even in his Disney incarnation has shown feats that rivaled Kratos. Heck I've seen Kratos hurt by lesser beings then he's taking on Ares. Sora was still strong and quick enough to effect him.(let's not forget Hercules said he was not holding back in the fight) My point is that if he can hurt characters like Hercules then Kratos should be no problem.

You cannot assume that because something is the same size as Atlas that it is as strong as him, or that it has as much durability. That is speculation. Here's some rough math for you. From the tip of my index finger to my first joint is about 1 inch. Kratos is 6-6.5 feet tall. In game we can see how Kratos compares to the size of Atlas' finger. Kratos reaches from the tip of Atlas' finger to about 1/3 of the way to the first joint. So, if I was Atlas, Kratos would be roughly a third of an inch tall to me. I am 5 feet 11 inches tall. So, Kratos would need to be about 215 times taller to be equal to Atlas. Let's assume that Kratos is only 6 feet tall, so the difference in our height is only 1 inch. It's pretty difficult for me to lift 100 pounds because I'm an out of shape nerd. So, let's make me more like an Olympic athlete and say that I can lift 500 pounds. So, let's multiply my lifting strength by my size. 500*215=107,500. So, if I was 5 times stronger than I am now, and then I grew to be the size of Atlas, assuming my strength increased linearly, I'd be able to lift about 53.75 tons. Even if you further doubled my strength to account for Atlas having 4 arms, that's still only 107.5 tons, which means Atlas is still 55,813,953,488,372,093,023 times stronger than me, even accounting for the size difference and multiplying my strength by 10.

This is all fine and dandy for Kratos but it still doesn't support Sora not being able to hurt Kratos. All that shows is that Kratos is really strong/durable (when it calls for it). Sora has fought people >/= Kratos's strength level anyway.

The only "god" Sora has ever fought was Disney Hades, who doesn't have any impressive feats, and for that matter neither does Genie Jafar.

I used the term "gods" loosely what I meant were the many bosses Sora. Most of which who had power that contends with the Gods Kratos fought.

The tallest man made structure in the world is the Burj Khalifa in Dubai, at 2,722 feet tall it dwarfs other skyscrapers. It only weighs 500,000 tons. So even Sora's feats of chopping up skyscrapers in his fight against Xemnas are pretty insignificant to the kind of strength and durability that Atlas and Kratos have.

Sora was able to cut through six of these building in one strike with no problem at all. His strength is sufficient enough to hurt Kratos. That's the point I'm trying to make. Also what defenses does Kratos have against Sora's magic?

KH Hercules is not necessarily equivalent to the Disney Hercules that he's based on. I mean, just look at the Final Fantasy characters. Cloud is clearly depowered in the KH universe, as is Squall. You can't take feats from the TV show and movie that Disney Hercules is from and automatically say that Hercules in KH is capable of the same thing, therefore Sora is equivalent to that.

Kratos resists Hades trying to rip his soul out. The Claws of Hades are powerful magic weapons. Start of the video.

Hades kills a Titan with this ability. That's some extreme magic resistance. He also has the Golden Fleece, which is a powerful defensive item capable of reflecting things like Gorgon stares and even Zeus' lightning.

I don't believe that anything Sora has fought could contend with one of the God of War gods.

Cutting through six buildings is not equivalent to the damage that Kratos can tank. Even if those buildings were equal in size to the largest building ever made, that's still only 3 million tons. That's still only 1/1,000,000,000,000th of the weight that Kratos has been shown to tank. That's still astronomically far from Sora being able to hurt Kratos.

And Kratos has not been shown to be hurt by any "lesser" beings in cutscenes, only in pure gameplay.

@Fernando072295REBORN said:

@Laurcus: You're comparing kid buu to Uub? I think it was more than easy to see that the intention was to show that Uub had a long ways to go to get his power up like before. Not that Goku is now ssj3 level in base form. That's pretty ridiculous in my opinion.

After 5 years of training I think it's more than fair to say that Uub is at least equal to Kid Buu. You're also ignoring base form Goku vs Rildo.

@Fernando072295REBORN:SS3 Goku in the Buu saga is not as strong as SS3 Goku in GT. You should read my post.

@Roddy010: I'm aware of what Sora has done. You're talking to a huge KH fan. Still looking forward to KH 3 in fact. The Disney Hercules' feats from KH are very inconsistent with his feats of tossing Titans into orbit. He struggles with Cerberus after all. And gameplay wise, Sora is unable to hurt him with his golden aura up, which for some odd reason is taken down by throwing barrels at him. Sora also has not beaten Hercules in raw strength. He defeats him in combat, which is far from the same thing.

You cannot assume that because something is the same size as Atlas that it is as strong as him, or that it has as much durability. That is speculation. Here's some rough math for you. From the tip of my index finger to my first joint is about 1 inch. Kratos is 6-6.5 feet tall. In game we can see how Kratos compares to the size of Atlas' finger. Kratos reaches from the tip of Atlas' finger to about 1/3 of the way to the first joint. So, if I was Atlas, Kratos would be roughly a third of an inch tall to me. I am 5 feet 11 inches tall. So, Kratos would need to be about 215 times taller to be equal to Atlas. Let's assume that Kratos is only 6 feet tall, so the difference in our height is only 1 inch. It's pretty difficult for me to lift 100 pounds because I'm an out of shape nerd. So, let's make me more like an Olympic athlete and say that I can lift 500 pounds. So, let's multiply my lifting strength by my size. 500*215=107,500. So, if I was 5 times stronger than I am now, and then I grew to be the size of Atlas, assuming my strength increased linearly, I'd be able to lift about 53.75 tons. Even if you further doubled my strength to account for Atlas having 4 arms, that's still only 107.5 tons, which means Atlas is still 55,813,953,488,372,093,023 times stronger than me, even accounting for the size difference and multiplying my strength by 10.

The only "god" Sora has ever fought was Disney Hades, who doesn't have any impressive feats, and for that matter neither does Genie Jafar.

The tallest man made structure in the world is the Burj Khalifa in Dubai, at 2,722 feet tall it dwarfs other skyscrapers. It only weighs 500,000 tons. So even Sora's feats of chopping up skyscrapers in his fight against Xemnas are pretty insignificant to the kind of strength and durability that Atlas and Kratos have.

@Agent9149 said:

@Laurcus said:

@beautifulrevery said:

Bloodlust? Sora goes final form, uses Stopga, spams Thundaga and then juggles Kratos with his telekinetic keyblades until he dies.

Things like juggles are gameplay mechanics.

I don't see how Sora has the damage to put Kratos down. The guy has at least 3+ quintillion ton durability. Virtually everything Kratos has would one shot Sora. Strong enemies, (even normal enemies) also have resistance to stop. Kratos has shown extreme magic resistance when tanking Zeus' and Hades' attacks in their fights, and his resistance can be considerably enhanced with the Golden Fleece.

Can you please show me feats from actually game play to back this up?

1:00

Atlas holds up the Earth, which weighs ~6 sextillion tons. Kratos is able to hold back Atlas's fingers to keep from being crushed. The 3+ quintillion tons thing is a conservative estimate saying that Atlas' finger strength is roughly equal to 1/2000th of his normal strength. Keep in mind this is also base form Kratos from God of War 2, not Kratos with his ridiculous power up from the end of God of War 3.

This is why I have no respect for most people's opinions concerning DBZ. Anyone that thinks Vegito wins doesn't know what they're talking about.

Let's say, for argument's sake, that SS3 Gotenks during the Buu saga is twice as strong as SS3 Goku, and Mystic Gohan was twice as strong as SS3 Gotenks. I'm gonna be generous to base form Super Buu and say that he's equal to SS3 Gotenks. Based on their showings, he's a little weaker, but I'm gonna amp him up a bit just to make a point. I'm also gonna say Piccolo is half as strong as Gotenks, amping him up a bit, as that, by this calculation, would put him equal with SS3 Goku. Therefore, Super Buu + SS3 Gotenks + Mystic Gohan + Piccolo = 9x stronger than SS3 Goku.

I'm gonna be generous to Vegito now, and say that he's 5x stronger than Super Buu with the above characters absorbed. I think by his showings he's closer to 2-3x stronger, but whatever, ignore that. So Super Saiyan Vegito = 45x stronger than SS3 Goku in DBZ.

In DBZ, SS3 Goku is roughly equal with Kid Buu. Uub is Kid Buu reborn. In GT, after training with Goku for 5 years, Goku and Uub fight. Goku wins this fight in base form, albeit with extreme difficulty. So, assuming Uub with 5 years of training = Kid Buu, base form GT Goku = SS3 Goku from Z. So, just SS1 should put Goku ahead of Vegito at this point, but let's go on until this becomes full retard. Early on in DBGT Goku fights General Rildo. Goku and Rildo are both in their base forms, and Goku is winning. When Trunks shows up to help, Goku warns him that Rildo may not look like much but he's 5x stronger than Majin Buu. This indicates that my previous calculation is in fact wrong, Goku is closer to 5x stronger than Buu in his base form, which also indicates that Uub became roughly 5x stronger than Kid Buu during his 5 years of training.

So if you trust the first calculation which is based purely off Goku's fight with Uub, then SS1 GT Goku = 50x stronger than SS3 DBZ Goku. If you trust the second one, which is based off Goku's fight with Rildo, then he's 250x stronger than SS3 DBZ Goku. This of course doesn't take into account SS4, which is an overall increase of x4000, or x80 more than SS1. So based on the first calculation, SS4 Goku is 4000 times stronger than SS3 DBZ Goku, which makes him 88.8 times stronger than SS1 Vegito. Based on the second calculation, SS4 Goku is 20000 times stronger than SS3 Goku from DBZ, which makes him 444.4 times stronger than SS1 Vegito. And either one of these is still actually lowballing SS4 Goku, as this assume he went SS4 with the same power level he had against Rildo, so it does not take into account all the injuries he suffered at the hands of Baby, Super 17 and Omega Shenron. Dat Zenkai.

But I'm sure people too stupid to read and understand my post will dismiss it as "DBZ math" and "ABC logic" instead of trying to come up with a real argument, or god forbid, admitting I'm right.