"Solar could defeat The Spectre... though its hard to say sometimes with Aztar... The Spectre's power is sort of funny when it comes to fighting the serious Heavy Hitters "
Yeah, but the OP says in the strongest incarnation, so you're really only considering their best showing against a heavy hitter.
Dr. Manhattan has a legit control over atoms, as seen by both his ability to vaporize things and his ability to put himself back together from merely atoms.
There's no reason to believe that Superman could beat him, or that Superman's atoms are immune to his control.
Kratos has cannon strength feats that completely contradicts his constant struggling
you have to learn how to tell gameplay PIS apart from cannon,for example:
1) in every single TPS/FPS,your characther can take bullets and will heal over-time,despite then being (cannon-wise) regular humans,this is seen in Uncharted,Killzone,Red Dead,etc.... this also includes burning wounds,falls from high heights,etc...,during cut-scenes,all it takes is a single bullet to kill/seriously injure then 2) in Devil May Cry,Dante can be killed by regular sword wielding enemies on gameplay,during cut-scenes (the real cannon) he is stabbed several times and downright laughs at it 3) the game Bayonetta is hard as heck because her enemies are vastly powerfull during the gameplay,cannon-wise (cutscenes) Bayonetta is seen one-shoting everything thrown at her and displays much more power than she does during gameplay
so yeah,Kratos struggling with minotaurs,statues,etc... is all gameplay PIS,Kratos's real strenght allows him to overpower Chronos,Hydras and Atlas,the end
in fact,cannon-wise,a pre-Ares-pact Kratos one-shotted a giant sea lizard and Satyrs (the hardest regular enemy seen in God of War 1's gameplay....heck,even his Spartan friends managed to take down Satyrs) http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/7137/m12j.png http://img547.imageshack.us/img547/6073/m13.png http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/355/51367852.png http://img832.imageshack.us/img832/836/19475144.png "
Sure, there are some gameplay mechanics but in all seriousness, they all fit Kratos' strength level pretty well, he was never written to be very strong compared to characters like Thor. He was never written to be very durable either, Dante from DMC is more durable then Kratos is, remember that Kratos was impaled by Ares in GOW1. So story wise, Kratos has done nothing to suggest he would be a match for Thor physically. "
You're comparing those gameplay mechanics to Kratos being stabbed by a giant sword thrown by a giant God?
Kratos was overpowering giant creatures before he even gained powers before becoming the God of War. Those "struggling to move statues" and such are definitely not applicable.
Either way, there is definitely more to this battle than who's stronger/more durable, physically.
"@Jezer:@Supermanwithatan01: Speed Force is not the most powerful force out there, you're making it seem like the Flashes and the Speed Force is God, lol dude i have pointed out tons of facts and scans that support Gold Superman Prime 1 Million and Kal Kent being fully capable of taking out the Flashes, i still have yet to see a feat from them that Rivals anything that Gold Supes did lol. And none of you have yet to post any scan that convinces me that Flashes speed and momentum stealing abilities would work on such beings as Kal Kent and Gold Supes, and posting scans of current supes getting his speed stolen doesn't count because current Supes is nothing to Kal or Gold Supes, i gotta see a scan of the Flashes actually being able to do this to Kal or Gold Supes because just saying that they would with no vital proof or evidence is irrelevant and redundant at this point. And if you want to see know and more about Gold Supes and his time with the Source then you really need to read DC 1 Million Comics. And trying to compare pointless and meaningless Scenarios that don't have anything to do with the battle thread or the characters itself is quite silly and a bit off topic... For example the comment below
@Jezer Said:
That's like saying an average karate master can beat a vampire, because he knows this this and this technique and move. Let's just ignore the fact that he isn't fast enough to use those moves before the vampire kills him.
Yea you're never going to prove a point like this sorry buddy but that was a pointless comparison along with the other meaningless Scenarios you tried to compare and has nothing to do with the characters and what is taking place in this thread lol.
That is illogical not logical LOL.
The Supermen Win "
Cool story bro.
Now, I didn't read the whole thing, but by the second line I realized that all you were saying was "blablabla I don't understand the feat system! I don't understand how to judge battles!"
Tell you what, if you get a legit comicvine poster, who actually knows how to argue, to agree with you and what you're saying, I'll pretend that anything you say or post is actually worth my time to read.
I mean, I could be taking a dump with the time I'd have to spend showing you the 100 or so ways you're wrong, just so you could ignore it because you don't understand it.
Protip: I suggest anyone else with common sense do the same.
See, here's another problem: people don't seem to understand how the feat system works.
I asked you to post proof of why Flashes abilities won't work on them, instead you post random feats of them doing random things, and then act as if you posted something significant.
I'm gonna resist the urge to refute this thing sentence by sentence.
" Well considering the fact that Gold Superman Prime 1 Million has personally trained with the Source which is apart of the Presence who is far beyond the speed force, " Great. I mean, I haven't read any scan that shows he's trained with the Source, but I'll just believe you. So, when he trained, the Source taught him how to resist the powers of the Speed Force? If not, I don't see the significance of you mentioning this. I could have trained with Bruce Lee, that in no way means I'm not gonna feel the power of a punch from Muhammed Ali if it lands on me.
"also Prime 1 Million leaned a vast array of powers during his time with the Source / Presence, as well as being inside of the Super Sun for 60 thousand years," Cool. Did one of those powers include resisting the powers of the Speed Force? Oh wait, the scan doesn't specify, so you can't prove it does. Since it doesn't say what powers that Prime gleaned(sic), there's no point in bringing that up.
" Prime during his travels has fought and defeated powerful evil Gods and fought battles we can't even imagine, I have scans of his feats which would support why he beats the Flashes." First part is irrelevent, there's no point in simply copying what it says in the scans. Second part is just untrue. There are no speed feats for him, that show that he won't look like a statue or snail to the Flashes. There are no invincibility feats that show he can't be harmed by their punches or Speed Force attacks.
"Oh yea and SMP1M power scale is a Universal power if not a bit higher... This guy did things i never seen the Flashes exhibit in any of there scans. " First part, Irrelevant. Second part is also Irrelevant with the added fact that Flashes have done things that Superman Prime has never "exhibited in any of his scans."
"One more thing Gold Supes has possession of the last known GL ring of his timeline and has also mastered and modified its abilities with his new found powers." Irrelevant AND also incorrect. How exactly did he modify its abilities in the scan? ALL it shows him doing is making a giant crushing hand. That's not impressive, whatsever. Furthermore, how do you modify the power of a weapon that works by doing whatever is based on a person's imagination/willpower? ._. If he's sooooo powerful, why didn't he crush Solaris using his own power?
"Here is Gold Superman Prime granting great powers that are gleaned from the very edge of time and space, Powers far superior to any Meta Human aka Super Powered Beings. " Yeah, it's called vague exaggeration.
"Here is Gold Superman Prime 1 Million bringing back Lois Lane from the dead with a single strand of DNA." Yeah, with the Superman from the 5th Dimension, not on his own. Read your own scans. Of course, none of that is relevant to this fight.
"Here is Gold Superman Prime bringing back Krypton and everyone that died in the past. the feat was effortless as well lol. And i can honestly say the Flashes have nothing on this feat." According to the previous scan, it looks like HOURMAN is the one who did it. Of course, it'd be clear if you weren't missing a scan. Read your own scan. And again, this feat has nothing to do with this battle.
"I think the Scans and Feats speak for themselves. I have never seen any Flash display these kind of abilities. Not Ever." Cool story bro. I've never seen Flash display the ability to turn into a wolf, or the ability to fight on the astral ability. Thus, Flash can't beat a werewolf OR a someone with psychic abilities? ....yeah, that's logical. Because, if he's never displayed it, he obviously can't beat them. Oh wait, that's not how the feat system works lol.
NOW, I could do the same exact thing with your Kal Kent scans, but I'm way too lazy.
You don't even try to argue or back up your side, your argument boils down to: "Kal Kent and Superman Prime 1 Million can do this this this and that. They can do so many amazing things!! Thus, they can beat the Flashes"
Basically, it ignores logic. That's like saying an average karate master can beat a vampire, because he knows this this and this technique and move. Let's just ignore the fact that he isn't fast enough to use those moves before the vampire kills him.
LOL that's like saying that someone who speaks every language, is good with computers, can kickbox, can publically debate, knows 50 ways to kill a person, and can seduce a billion women... can beat someone who's shooting them point blank with a gun, before they can even finish thinking the word "fuuuuuc". No matter how amazing those feats are, none of that matters if he can't dodge the speed of a bullet.
" @Supermanwithatan01: They won't be able to steal anything from Kal Kent or Gold Superman Prime 1 Million for that matter, as i said and posted time and time again, The Speed Force is not the strongest force out there, there are others beyond it. "
Do you have any proof that Kal Kent or the Gold Superman are immune to the effects of Speed Force powers?
If not, it doesn't matter how "strong" (vague term) you think they are compared to the Speed Force, because being powerful or more powerful doesn't make them immune to its power.
If you post a scan of a time when one of its abilities didn't work on someone, because they were to strong, I might give you the benifit of a slight doubt.
Btw, someonelse already posted a feat of one of these Flashes running across the entire Universe, from planet to planet. Why even mention that about Flash 1 Million if the others could do it, as well?
Furthermore, instead of simply saying "Kal Kent is more than a match for him", why not explain how AND what makes him a match?
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