JBBuc

This user has not updated recently.

208 0 21 4
Forum Posts Wiki Points Following Followers

JBBuc's forum posts

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@somayareece: Does her main villain have to be a female? All of the history with Circe, Cheetah, et al seems a bit limited. I'm not sure what the current Vandal Savage arc is (if there is one), but I'd vote for him as Wonder Woman's Lex Luthor. Vandal is, for such a briliant character, the most under-utilized awesome villain in DC.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Since I have to assume that both are in character, Superman's propensity to 'hold back' would prove fatal against an immortal, death-obsessed, cosmic-powered sociopath.

Thanos wins.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

I have to agree with @moi245. Every character has haters. But by and large, I think most people see Wonder Woman as an iconic character and a huge part of the DC universe. If anything, so-called feminists are the ones who seem to have the biggest problem with her.

But I'm not going to get into that again.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@kiba said:

@brunnhilde: so successful and popular characters need to go away to make room for some C lister that can take their place? It's not Captain America's fault Falcon never made it big and I shouldn't loose a character I like to "make room."

I have to admit, that made me laugh out loud. But as much as I would like to mock the ignorance of that statement, it actually proves my point.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

is he really the most powerful if he can't beat Batman? Because, you know... Batman can beat everyone too.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

#6  Edited By JBBuc

This is an interesting question, but a tough one to answer for me. It's hard to imagine Joker in Marvel because I don't feel like this type of character plays in the Marvel Universe. Joker, Riddler and Penguin can be thorns in the side of DC's premier hero, but to me they would feel like throw-away characters in Marvel.

So, if this character is supposed to be around for more than one mini-series, because he would feel too gimmicky in Marvel, he would have to be up against someone who is street-level, not prone to using deadly force and is not super powered. Not that he couldn't antagonize Spiderman for a while, but I think Spidey just has too many physical advantages. Daredevil might be the best option for Joker to set his sights on. Captain America is too well supported, as is Black Panther. Joker's only chance to succeed would be to isolate his target. Again, this is why brooding, go-it-alone Batz is his rival. But in Marvel, brooding, go-it-alone types have far more lethal reputations.

On second thought... I really hate the very idea of The Joker in Marvel, so I'm going to revise all that and say that he fixates on Tony Stark and gets fried in 10 issues.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@joey_destroyer_of_worlds: That is true, which is why it's so disappointing that there is so much vulgarity in so small a sample size. It's particularly disappointing for me because my kids (who are 10 and 7) became huge Deadpool fans after playing Marvel vs Capcom. So they were all excited about the movie, but I couldn't even let them watch the first trailer because it was even THAT was MA. I'm talking multiple f-bombs, masterbation reference and overall excessive violence. There is no way I can let them watch the movie. It sucks because we have been doing all of the Marvel movies and even gone back and watched the X-Men and Spiderman movies from back in the day. This is the first one that they are not going to be able to see.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

Killer Frost doesn't just generate ice, she fuels herself by absorbing heat and converting it to cold energy. Captain Cold's weapons don't shoot ice, they generate energy beams that reduce the target's temperature to absolute zero.

These two annihilate team fire while Mr Freeze and Sub-Zero kick back and munch on snow cones.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

@brunnhilde:I have said it before, and I'll say it again... I truly respect you as a bright and thoughtful person.

But I entirely disagree with you.

@brunnhilde said:
@namasthetu said:

I think you misunderstood what I was saying. They need to put the time and effort into making new characters of (insert anything diverse here). Taking an established character and tacking on a new "feature" comes off exactly like that. It becomes some innane alteration as stupid as many others made to characters over the years. Time and development establishing a new character indicates commitment and can result in a more subtle and thoughtful approach to whatever diversity they incorporate. Besides it is time for many comic characters to be retired and a natural replacement process is a much better approach than "hey Superman's a brother now" which makes him that glorified token character by default. We shouldn't be talking about "hey Wonder Woman's a she-male now!" We should be talking about new, well written characters that happen to be she-male, black, or whatever. My argument has nothing to do with being a white male because while you got my gender correct, you did not get my racial and ethnic background correct (yes some White, along with Romani, Native American, Black, and Latino). I have also been a life long feminist and am engaged to a bisexual woman and i'm pretty sure one of my adopted sons is gay. What this thread suggests is that characters who are "different" have to tag along on the established thunder of other characters. I insist they can soar on their own. Yeah I am selfish, I want characters that look like everyone I know, and are like the people I know, and i want them to succeed on their own merits like I know they can.

Those characters were created white in the first place on grounds of normative whiteness which even as we speak is well and going strong, if they rectify that now for the sake of diversity, I personally feel like that's a pretty good reason for doing it. In cases where race and sexual orientation are not structural aspects of the character's identity, I don't see why they can't just change them, at least temporarily. I feel like little mexican kids deserve a crack at Superman you know, not just a no-name token mexican character. And I don't see anything wrong with using the tremendous iconic power of a character like Superman as a springboard for diversity, I think it's clever. Having said that, I understand the nostalgia associated with it but it's for a good cause.

I think you are making a couple false assumptions.

1. That any character created has to be a token one rather than possessing a full range of character traits.

2. That turning an established character into "X" doesn't token-ize the change despite this being the reigning cultural perception that this is the case (as well as being academically verifiable).

3. People who are of "X" group can't identify with people who don't look like them. More specifically that making a character "X" means they will be positively perceived by other people of "X" subgroup. As a Native American and Roma male I can tell you that most characters made with said background are actually a little offensive to me because they either always have magical powers that outsiders associate with them (Forge, Mirage, Warpath, Doctor Doom), and/or they possess almost no cultural heritage (Scarlet Witch, Quicksilver). While I give Marvel cred for having such characters around, I roll my eyes at them frequently. This wouldn't be an issue btw if it were only some characters because let's face it, there's a lot of stereotypical stuff surrounding all cultures in comics. The X-Men examples are the most annoying because magic Native American powers have to be tacked onto mutant native Americans apparently to make them interesting. Doctor Doom bothers me less because he is about as non-Roma as you can get in so many ways and never really makes any attempt to represent. As a side note, much credit to Marvel for acknowledging that the Roma were systematically wiped out in the holocaust also.

The problem with making Superman Mexican is that he's not going to really be Mexican, that is the character will not have a Mexican experience without major rewrites to the history. It would be such a change that you may as well forget making him Superman, unless of course you're having Superman pass the mantle on. Indeed as a current resident of Kansas I would be very amused to watch all the xenophobes out here react to a character with a genuine Mexican heritage be handed the mantle. Indeed I would love to see Clark come home and meet the right person to assume such a mantle. Such a change would have to be gradual and take place over years to be appropriate though to do both the character that exists and the new character justice. I would relish Superman's immigrant origins passed on in such a way and I do find it appropriate.

So full circle to transgendered Wonder Woman. Personally I think that taking away a female character to make a transgendered one isn't really increasing diversity, especially THE iconic female character. It's also insulting in many ways because many physically powerful women spend so much time enduring insults as to their actual gender. It really makes no sense also without completely altering her origin, which is more integral to her as a character than most. If they are going to transgender someone I'd rather see it happen to Green Lantern whose personal life needs a kick in the pants anyway. I would want them to do it right and take us through the transformation, address the personal issues and such. He may actually be a great one to do it with because we could get multiple voices of how other Lanterns perceive it as a sounding board for different cultural conventions.

Ultimately when it comes to DC in particular I wish they would actually reinvent their universe instead of constantly remaking it the same way. For a franchise that reboots itself so often, they don't seem to make much real change in approach or take advantage of the opportunity. I know it would piss a lot of people off but frankly i would kill off the entire Justice League except Wonder Woman and maybe one or two others, leaving them to rebuild. The original characters would live on in memory and their legacy could really mean something in universe. Maybe they don't need to die either, Batman could certainly live on with permanent disability and while it's been briefly done before, it would be more interesting to see the long term change. Anyway just my musings. I think we want the same thing, I just think we have very different visions of how to get there.

@namasthetu: Well said. I would just like to add on to a few of your points. First, your 3rd point is spot on to me. People who feel like they can not identify with or appreciate characters that don't look like them need to ask themselves what their real motivation is. For example, I could get hung up on the fact that Superman's skin is 'white' and hate on the industry for racial bias, or I can identify with the fact that he grew up in a working class environment after being taken in by a couple with limited means. Gay fans should be able to easily identify with Superman's constant struggle of feeling like he has to live a double life. He can't 'come out' and reveal who he really is because he is afraid that he will not be accepted. See my point? Does he actually HAVE to be gay for gay fans to relate to him? Does he have to have dark skin for minorities to identify with him as an alien trying to fit into a foreign culture? I like Superman. I like Thor. On the other had, Batman is a uber-wealthy womanizer with 'peak human' physical attributes who gets over-pushed as supremely intelligent. There is nothing that I like about Batman. Nothing at all. Can't relate. But I don't need a new black or 'less fortunate' Batman, because I have plenty of other characters to enjoy that are not so unrelatable for me. All characters don't need to be all things to all people.

I also agree with your point on the specific transgendered issue. It is an argument that I hadn't even considered. Changing a female character into a caucasian female-identified male is not really adding diversity. It would be akin to remaking Luke Cage into a comic book version of Eminem.

Whenever I reply to these diversity inspired threads, I always say the same thing. I am all for diversity, but I don't see why making Sam Wilson the new Captain America is better than giving Falcon a higher profile. And you know, I would have said 'why not give Falcon his own title', but that probably wouldn't sell.

At the end of the day, that is the real problem. Everyone wants to point an accusing finger at the companies for all of their white male centerpieces, but when these companies give female and minority characters their own runs, fans don't buy them at the same rate that they buy the institutional standards.Let me give you an example:

Image comics original Stormwatch was a great title. It was well written, the art was awesome and it was packed with diversity. There was a black character as the leader (Battalion) , an Asian in the 'Powerhouse' role (Fuji) and several strong female members (Synergy, Diva, Fahrenheit), and yet it failed top the sales of 'Invincible', which was your standard Superman modeled, white-male hero book. It failed because, generally speaking, buying fans were resistant to a team lead by a black character. So while I appreciate the sentiment of making Sam Wilson the new Cap, I question how effective it will be because I am just not sure the buying fans are going to purchase a Sam Wilson title at the same rate that they bought Steve Rogers or Bucky Barnes. These companies are in the business to make money. Why should they spend the money to print runs for female and minority characters if fans aren't going to pull those titles. They stick Spiderman and Batman in every book because that's who the people buy. If the masses truly wanted more Misty Knight, Marvel wouldn't hesitate.

So at the end of the day, if DC wanted to introduce a new female-identified male character, fine. Have at it. I'm sure there are a few out there who would buy it. But changing Wonder Woman the same vein that they changed Shining Knight (who is now a male-identified female) would be a complete disaster.

And no one would buy it.

Avatar image for jbbuc
JBBuc

208

Forum Posts

0

Wiki Points

4

Followers

Reviews: 0

User Lists: 0

I am going to slightly beat a dead horse here... In my opinion, this is image portrays the ideal Wonder Woman physique.

No Caption Provided

WW should be a balance of athletic/muscular and feminine/sensual. That was, to me, the original Wonder Woman concept. Superman was the ultimate man, Wonder Woman was the ultimate woman. And to be honest, I just don't see why that has become "wrong".