Hooperman

On your blog post, Fodigg, on forging an original identity for Tim I totally agree. I really don't like Bat-moniker female names, I find that so uninspiring. Instead of two robins and three bats they should celebrate Huntress and Catwoman more as integral characters (they're both more dynamic than Bat-girls steph or rejuvenated Babs). On reversals of gender would it not be interesting to have Tim, distanced from the group and a bit shadier, to become Hunter - a Rule 64 Huntress? Or finally introduce Bat-Boy! :P

I guess my main argument is that making Dick Red Robin would have solidified him as a mature main player. We all agree he's not handled well, too flippant and Nightwing's being used as a Bat sidekick anyway. I just thought the Red option might finally free him from these bonds.

Batwoman is great. She's the only one worthy of the Bat title I think. I prefer the Bat-family members to have their own images like Robin, Huntress, Nightwing or Catwoman which is why I'm always annoyed they have to have Bat-girls all the time. Uninteresting. Bat-Woman earns her title though as an equal and opposite answer to Batman, separate and not subordinate; independent and worthy. I would like her included in the Bat-family more though. If Jason Todd gets a call in everyone of Bats stories these days then so should she.

We'll never get to see Batman Beyond in continuity. If Tim were to become a prototype for Terry I think it's be an awesome start. He's always off with the Titans so it'd take him out of Gotham mostly and he'd be more suited to space-fairing and fighting with Gods and monsters. We already dealt with a few Batmen at once! I think we could deal with these two.

I was thinking over what DC should do with Nightwing and it occurred to me that the Red Robin mantle has been misappropriated. It doesn't suit Tim or Jason as it was created for Dick Grayson. He should take it back and become a big league hero in his own right. Meanwhile, Tim's attempt to break out as his own hero aren't fairing too well as the Red Robin identity is too amorphous, especially since they changed the costume to that ridiculous feathery thing. Since it's widely believed that Tim is the most suitable inheritor of the Batman mantle, eventually, Tim should be trained as his replacement. He should be the Batman Beyond, kitted out with high-tech armour and flightsuit and sent away on missions involving the Teen Titans and JL, to places a regular dude in a cape would be ill-fitting. This would be more realistic and more satisfying as a progression. I write more about it here!

In order to elevate Dick to the big leads I believe he needs to shuck the Nightwing identity as it's more of a transitory one...a rejection of the Robin persona. Dick should come back to his roots, reclaim the mantle of Red Robin, Cowl and cape included, have is own UQ in the Bunker and take Damian as his side-kick. He'll never be in the big leagues if he's just a 21 year old kid who leaves his duds on the floor and acts like a glorified side-kick to bats. I think the prestige of the Red Robin, coupled with the maturity he showed as Batman would finally allow him to break out. I argue this better here.

I completely agree that the character's been mishandled. I don't think it's to do with the red suit, or being in Gotham. It's to do with the fact that Nightwing was never strong enough as an original identity - he's either too cool for shool, or a glorified sixth Ranger side-kick. He grew so much as Batman, with the Bunker, the flying Bat-Car and having Damian that it's so disappointing to see him back by himself, throwing his uniform on the floor and such. In Morrison;s run he became such a strong leader and being Nightwing again feels like a down-grade. He needs to move on out of his adolescence and become the Red Robin, as predicted in Kingdom Come.

I argue more extensively for this here!

Can we leave the childish "you know nothing about Dick Grayson" stuff. It just reminds me of the forum negativity so rampant with fans. Everyone's argument pretty much boils down to "He's Nightwing because he's Nightwing". If there were internet forums in the 80s people would've screamed bloody murder at the thought of anyone else being Robin and Dick being someone else. I think people get too quickly attached. Nightwing is as important as Robin. I think Dick Grayson deserves better. He doesn't even have an HQ, or equipment. Why not give him Damian as a side-kick at least as the dynamic worked so well. Having this 21 year old who throws his uniform on the floor doesn't feel like a real, living, breathing vigilante.

Well, they're opinionated because they're just an opinion :P and I'm not writing in the most serious tone either. I'm a huge Dick Grayson fan and I just feel that Morrison progressed the character (which is pretty hard to do with a guy who's been around for 70 odd years) and took him to a new place. Reading Nightwing now just feels dull and a little pointless. I'm there for Grayson but Nightwing as an identity I think was a useful protest. He needs to move on.@joshmightbe said:

@Hooperman: It wasn't teenage rebellion, he wanted to be his own man instead of being the back end of "Batman and..." How would going back to the person he was when he was 12 be more mature than wanting to be out of his father figure's shadow?

Part of maturity is about the re-acceptance of your childhood self. His rejection of his father-figure manifested as Nightwing and to truly mature he could resolve those identity issues and reclaim the Robin mantle. His acceptance of his original identity and ownership of it but having it also be evolved into Red Robin would indicate a mature hero accepting his identity. Remember Nightwing was originally a vigilante on Krypton. Robin is Dick's only original identity.

You haven't read the blog post?

I know enough.