@newecho: Cap and Logan have used them multiple times throughout their careers. It may not be their go to option, but it doesn't completely throw away that option.
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Team 1. Team 2 obviously has the overall power advantage but I think team is capable of just holding out better against all of them than vice versa.
Steve vs Daredevil I have always seen as a toss up in pure h2h, however, Steve's shield I think is a better tool in comparison to Daredevil's clubs and he can edge a small 6/10.
Steve vs Luke. Luke would overall win due to his durability and strength, but Cap is significantly faster and more skilled. I do believe he can avoid Cage and at least neutralize him or temporarily slow him down via nerve strikes.
Steve vs Danny. Danny wins but I do think Steve between his shield and skill is capable of holding off Danny for a time before falling due to Fist's superior skill and damage output.
Wolverine vs Daredevil. Daredevil doesn't have the power to knock Wolverine consistently out, and unless you are Garth Ennis, Logan's healing factor has countered nerve strikes on numerous times. Logan has a penchant to start off not using his skill, but warms up and can do so and then I do find his showings slightly superior to Matt's. Logan's damage soak and output put him above Daredevil.
Wolverine vs Luke Cage. Luke is too slow and is a watered down brick in comparison to what Logan was made to beat. He can be dispatched by him relatively quickly.
Iron Fist vs Wolverine. I know some say Iron Fist wins, but I do find them relatively on par with each other in terms of fighting ability, but Logan and Fist both have the means to deal with each other. A good slash from Logan can change the game but a good punch from Danny can wreak havoc on Logan. So it depends on who gets that key blow first, so I say it is a coin toss.
Spider-Man vs Daredevil. Spidey wins via just having a massive stat advantage that DD can't compensate for and pull a win.
Spider-Man vs Luke Cage. Luke typically has the edge due to strength and durability, but Parker is significantly faster and with his WoS training, and with his knowledge of nerve strikes can take Cage with those strikes backed by his strength. Webbing can come into play too.
Spider-Man vs Danny. Danny has the strength to deal with him and some chi amp for his strikes, but I do think Parker's webbing and stats can balance it out and beat him.
So overall I find team 1 can hold out or beat anyone on team 2 better than vice versa.
How does team one win? Spidey is the only one who has a chance vs power man as the other two do not do pressure points that often(and don't bother showing the kid gladiator feat as that isn't a usual thing for James) Spidey is going to fight Luke and luke doesn't have to morals that spidey has so he will eventually knock him out and even if luke doesn't then he can keep him busy long enough for danny to win his fight and then its a double team on spidey... Matt would beat cap and can beat James most times.. He uses his skill much better than james and to popular belief, he is faster and more skilled than steve.. I don't see team one winning at all....
How is Spider-Man the only one who has a chance against Cage? Logan would destroy him.
Grayson was holding back on the ones I mentioned, you said he DIDN'T one-shot Cass though he did, he was shown to be very close to Slade's level through not superior and I never said he was, and aside from beating people Batman stalemated, I'd say he is.
He wasn't holding back on the ones you mentioned, that is a cop out argument because you keep focusing on out of context fights and high end showings. And he one shotted Cass when she was going after Slade because he needed Slade alive despite having multiple super powered opponents on the Teen Titans that could flatten Slade. It's a ridiculous showing and shouldn't be taken seriously. When she was on point he didn't land a single solid shot on her because she deflected, blocked, or dodged all of his attacks. Nightwing is nowhere near Cassandra's level of abilities.
He's always had it the writers just ignored the ability and didn't mention it, the times it was shown (he was speedily approaching gunman firing automatic gunfire once) it worked the same way: Predicting movement
And that makes the ability something that didn't catch on and virtually unusable. That would be like someone defending Gambit here and using his upgrade he supposedly got at the end of his solo but that didn't catch on in the ANXF series, or Gambit's Death persona despite it not being mentioned or shown since Second Coming.
Grayson's strength feats definitely outclass the few Remy has, his tech includes a 100,000 volt taser, a laser that cut through steel like nothing, knockout gas, flash bangs, and much more... His tech can turn the battle in his favor. His skill has let him contend with Deathstroke, beat down a man with invulnerability and super strength, defeat an immortal martial artist that was giving trouble to Batman with ease, defeated Metal Eddie a martial artist who stopped a bullet with his hand, showing his meta-reflexes, strength, and durability, destroy Ravager (martial artist with super reflexes, speed, strength, and pre-cognition), easily beat Hardshell (another meta with invulnerability), beat Hawkman and Hawkwoman in hand to hand... The list goes on, there is a huge difference in skill. Nightwing's got this.
I understand his variety, but you seem to fail to understand the problem when you keep bringing it up and why it is nearly pointless you keep doing so. And if I ignore context and focus on high showings too I can easily say Gambit has embarrassed Wolverine, Sabretooth, Gladiator, Daken, Tombstone, could've killed Captain America, etc. Bringing on consistency and fairness skillwise he has already shown he can battle close with Daredevil, Cap, and Blade. Nightwing has been beaten by Slade, beaten by Bane twice, couldn't touch Batman when Bruce didn't want him to, beaten by Ra's Al Ghul, given trouble by Roy Harper, Jason Todd, Shrike, and other people Bruce has beaten would beat or given good fights to. Nightwing isn't in his league but that doesn't really matter for this.
I don't think Remy is in Nightwing's league skillwise, but given how Nightwing tends to approach most fights and his CONSISTENT skill level, he isn't above people like Daredevil or Cap or even Wolverine if he's weakened. However, Gambit doesn't need to be either but he has shown to be able to combat people around and above Grayson's skill level and given his powers, he is more than capable of beating him before Nightwing's extra tech comes into play for a majority.
@acrokat: I'm not going to get into the context of every fight of every character I mentioned he hasn't one shotted, but I think it is absolutely ridiculous to think he holds back on all of those opponents, or that you're making it seem like one shotting Cass is a legitimate feat (when he couldn't even land a solid hit on her when she wasn't drugged up) or him being better than Slade (despite Slade generally being shown his superior) or possibly even Bruce based on how your statement is sounding (despite Bruce showing Dick couldn't lay a hand on him and again New-52 feats aren't applicable).
Then his move reading ability isn't consistent and not usable anyway and it didn't save him or play a notable part in those same fights I mentioned.
Intelligence (though this does depend on location), superior strength, superior striking power, superior equipment, superior durability, superior tactical thinking, superior skill, is probably more flexible, is just as fast and agile (maybe a little more so) and is cuter.
Strength, tech, and skill, but again, those are only such small margins that can't be compensated by Remy's own skill and abilities that Dick does not have an answer for to get a majority under these conditions.
@acrokat: Nightwing's face is open and the forces of Gambit's attacks aren't like taking a punch, unless you want to say Grayson can tank a grenade to the face and be fine. Dick didn't one shot Jason todd, Slade, Bane, Shrike, Cassandra Cain, Batman, Roy Harper, despite all of them having human durability except in the cases of Slade being enhanced and Bane just having freakish strength and pain tolerance for a human. And Gambit has also used the environment to take out his opponents, it is nothing that is going to give either the edge here. Dick goes in up close 90% of the time before using tech while Gambit tends to go and combine up close combat with his powers 90% of the time. Dick is not shrugging off a card explosion to sneak away into nothing only to appear and one hit KO Gambit. And you can't use New-52 feats here when this thread was made 7 years ago before the new-52 continuity existed whereas Gambit's continuity has remained intact so any new feats for him as long as he stays in the same form are usable. Dick brings no advantages here whatsoever that enable him to beat Gambit for a majority under these conditions.
@acrokat: Hitting harder doesn't mean he will just up and decimate Gambit with his strikes and can't be compensated by Gambit's powers. Guerrilla tactics aren't a key either when Gambit can and has done them as well, so unless you want to talk textbook smarts or perhaps leading a team, Grayson isn't bringing any edge in intelligence that matters. And I already mentioned Grayson is the better fighter but not enough to where it completely puts Gambit as a disadvantage when he himself has fought with characters like Wolverine, Daredevil, Captain America and Blade, some who are already above Grayson in terms of skill and stats. And throwing his escrima sticks, wing dings, or other ranged attacks will most likely be ineffective. Gambit has already gotten around Cap's shield, deflected Daredevil's billy club, and even used charged cards to block web balls shot at him from Spider-Man. I don't see Gambit getting caught by something like tear gas enough times for a majority win when Nightwing also tends to go up close in most fights. He only has a skill edge, possible strength edge, and while he has the tech edge, it isn't his answer for every fight. Gambit possesses enough skill to fight up close with him. He can match Grayson in his most notable attribute in his agility. Gambit has the better reflexes. And Gambit has a massive edge in firepower that Grayson has no defense for if he is caught. A small number of cards can toss around vehicles, a charged staff can level a house, and Gambit has become increasingly willing to charge his opponents. I'm not saying at all he is going to use that level of power, but because he can quickly ascend to that output puts Grayson at a disadvantage when he has no defense to tank attacks of Gambit that he can easily increase and take out Nightwing before he catches Gambit with one of his advanced tech attacks.
Gambit. I don't know where this nonsense of Nightwing outstatting him is coming from. Nightwing probably has him in physical strength due to Gambit having no strength feats what so ever. Gambit isn't an idiot in field tactics and is incredibly cunning so Dick being "smarter" isn't an edge.
I'll give Grayson the edges in fighting and tech. However, Gambit is capable of matching Daredevil in agility and was able to fight him while flipping around, he gave Cap a decent fight despite being underwritten. He was able to stalemate Blade pre-vampire. So Grayson isn't fighting a chump here. Gambit also has better reflex feats. The guy has some of the most consistent bullet swatting feats for a street leveler.
If it was a pure skill fight, I'd give it to Grayson. But between Gambits speed own skill and powers, I see no reason he doesn't take 6-7/10 in a great fight.