Justice League #12: Is there truly a justified reasoning?

As many, and perhaps very few know, I'm not a huge fan of Geoff Johns. I love his work on Aquaman and Green Lantern, but those are the minor exceptions. Ever since he was listed as the writer for Justice League alongside superstar artist Jim Lee, there was a decent amount of skepticism rising inside me. The first few issues were done fine, it was your basic superhero beat em-up that we expected from an early Justice League team-up. But one particular moment in the series has pissed me off beyond belief. In all of the series thus far though, not once has Superman nor Wonder Woman shown any innate interest in each other. There was the one time comment from Superman concerning Diana's strength in the battle against Darkseid's parademons as well as Diana's apology for the infamous sucker punch she landed on Clark after he attempted to calm her down in Justice League #12. So through that, it's deemed logical to force the two to pucker up?

Past the awkward stage I guess

But truly, besides those two instances, when has there ever been reasoning given for a relationship between Clark and Diana. Up to this point, they've spoken as much as a few sentences to each other in total. Considering they've been teammates for roughly five years, you'd expect Diana to at least know Superman's real identity or even refer to him by his Kryptonian name as she occasionally did in the Pre-52 universe. Honestly, Diana wouldn't have been my first choice for Clark's first love interest in the New 52, but at least they've attempted something new(sort of). My main problem with the entire situation is, as I stated not the kiss itself, but the lack of ANY sort of build-up towards it. Neither Diana nor Clark have shown any interest towards each other besides camaradiere as teammates and respect. From what was shown, Diana has spent the majority of the series focusing on her past relationship with Steve and how she has apparently avoided him all these years to keep him from danger. That's fine and all, but given all that Diana has gone through regarding the past few issues and Steve's "death", it'd be safe to assume that she'd attempt to avoid a relationship of any sort, despite how long it takes to open up again. And yet, after the entire ordeal with Graves and her visions showing her true feeling for Steve manifesting, she jumps directly to Superman with seemingly no regrets.

Yeah, I'll get the responses claiming how "similar they are", or "they're both alone and just want to be human", but truly, that's complete nonsense. Diana wants nothing of the sort. She has no interest in being normal or living among the humans as simple common folk as Clark does. She was raised as a Princess and hasn't been taught the same ideals and virtues that Clark was raised with. He's alone in the Universe for a reason. His entire race has gone extinct, and as such, his solitude was not of his own doing. He's been stated on several accounts to be the most powerful being on the planet and yet, he considers doesn't consider himself above the human race. Instead, he prefers to be one of them, live among them, to simply fit in. In what way does this make him similar to Diana besides the fact that they're both basically "gods" among men?

Some consider it a logical choice to pit the two together. They're both perfectly capable of handling themselves. One is a highly trained warrior with years of experience, while the other is nigh invincible and supposedly the most powerful being on the planet. Given their power-sets, they would have less to worry about compared to if they were in relationships with normal humans such as Steve or Lois for example. But instead of unbearably forcing the kiss so early on, would it really have been hard to creatively build up their relationship or interest in each other over the course of a few issues? Give the readers a reason to care for why they are together instead of just tossing it all together so blatantly.

I barely know you... but let's make out.

Could I possibly be overreacting or pulling the trigger too quickly? Perhaps, and maybe I should let events unfold over the next few issues or so, but thus far, this entire ordeal has seemed to be just like a massive publicity stunt to attraction further attention on top of the New 52.

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Edited by Frozen

In my opinion, Kingdom Come had a much better relationship between Superman and Wonder Woman. It had a connection to it, the new-52 version just seems unnecessary.

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Posted by Deranged Midget

@Frozen: And I agree because they actually had an established relationship already as close friends and teammates for decades. It made sense and even throughout the entire story, their relationship grew and was established.

How it was handled in Justice League was a sad excuse to sell comics IMO.

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Posted by Frozen

@Deranged Midget said:

@Frozen: And I agree because they actually had an established relationship already as close friends and teammates for decades. It made sense and even throughout the entire story, their relationship grew and was established.

How it was handled in Justice League was a sad excuse to sell comics IMO.

The relationship in Kingdom Come had a purpose. Lois was dead so we knew that Superman had become bitter and lonely, Wonder Woman was the only person that could actually change him. The new-52 version won't last and we know it. Lois will come into the equation sooner or later, it's just there. For the fans and the money, it has no meaning.

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Posted by Deranged Midget

@Frozen said:

@Deranged Midget said:

@Frozen: And I agree because they actually had an established relationship already as close friends and teammates for decades. It made sense and even throughout the entire story, their relationship grew and was established.

How it was handled in Justice League was a sad excuse to sell comics IMO.

The relationship in Kingdom Come had a purpose. Lois was dead so we knew that Superman had become bitter and lonely, Wonder Woman was the only person that could actually change him. The new-52 version won't last and we know it. Lois will come into the equation sooner or later, it's just there. For the fans and the money, it has no meaning.

More or less. Lois will become the eventual love interest again somewhere down the line, but it seems that DC is playing away from that card.

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Posted by Lvenger

Excellent blog @Deranged Midget: As you know I'm not a Superman/Wonder Woman fan by any means but they've just shoved the two together with no build up or deepening the relationship between these two characters. Plus she was still hung up over Steve in the Villain's Journey and now she moves onto Superman? It just seems off. They could at least create a new love interest for Superman or Wonder Woman but no they have to put the alien raised as a human and an Amazonian demi god princess who has no interest acting like a human together.

Edited by FadeToBlackBolt

I like how you tried to handle this calmly and logically, kudos, mate.  
 
I shall offer my retort, in true Fade-fashion; 
 
WHAT THE HELL WAS THAT CRAP? 
Since when was Superman the kind of prick to try and score with someone who is in the midst of grieving? They're both alone? My arse they're both alone. Wonder Woman has an entire island of people saying "Hey Diana, we're exactly like you, let's have an Olympiad". And Clark's "I'm so alone" excuse went out the window when Superboy, Supergirl and the Martian (someone who is actually alone) showed up. Pathetic pandering to morons, Geoff Johns and company should be ashamed of themselves, and frankly, should all be kicked in the face until dead.  
 
I would have ranted more, but I'm tired and this is already making me want to vomit.  
 
In short, DC; 

Posted by nickthedevil

Eh, I like it.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@Lvenger: Much appreciated for reading dude! Yeah, considering that it's a New universe, they'd consider creating a new love interest for Clark. But nope, we're stuck with rehashes of already experienced relationships that serve absolutely no purpose.

@FadeToBlackBolt: Thanks mate! And yet again, reading your comment made me burst out laughing.

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Posted by Deranged Midget

@nickthedevil: To each his own :)

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Posted by lykopis

@FadeToBlackBolt: omg --- my ribs...they hurt so much...

Posted by Wolfrazer
@FadeToBlackBolt:  Don't forget Krypto. :P Best dog ever! How can Superman be alone, when he has man's best friend?
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Posted by Inverno

I don't mind it but I don't have much hope this relationship will last (I give it a year and they will separate). And @FadeToBlackBolt's rant is hillarious.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@CaioTrubat: Haha yes, Fade's basically simplified my true thoughts into his little rant :P

@FadeToBlackBolt: Your bluntly honest rant has taking quite a precedence here on my blog!

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Posted by Nightcrawler23

Like the idea, but it needs better reasoning.

Posted by SandMan_
@nickthedevil said:

Eh, I like it.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@SandMan_: Bah, of course you do!

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Posted by Quintus_Knightfall

Why do they need some elaborate reason to make out? Or even a three issue build up? She's in a vulnerable state, he's playing the role of a sympathetic shoulder, aaaand they make out. Good enough for me.

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Posted by SandMan_
@Deranged Midget said:

@SandMan_: Bah, of course you do!

So sue me Hater!!! >:D
Posted by Deranged Midget

@Gambler said:

Why do they need some elaborate reason to make out? Or even a three issue build up? She's in a vulnerable state, he's playing the role of a sympathetic shoulder, aaaand they make out. Good enough for me.

Honestly, if she's in an emotional state and she needs a shoulder to cry on, there is no better person to utilize than Clark. But considering everything that's happened to her, we're expected to believe she'd instantly make out with Clark?

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Posted by entropy_aegis

I dont mind the relationship,it's the crap writing that gets to me.I picked up JL from issue #1-6 and was met with a mediocre Darkseid in a story that only needed 2 issues but needlessly stretched to half a year.Dropped the book and got issue 12 due to hype and was not so surprised to see that the writing was still stupid.

Posted by NlGHTCRAWLER

Haters gunna hate!

Kidding. This is pretty... odd I guess.

Posted by TDK_1997

I actually didn't have such a big problem with them making out.She was vulnurable then and he felt lonely so that delivered us the kiss.Not such a big problem.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@entropy_aegis: Only reason I'm still reading the series is for the SHAZAM back-up.

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Posted by Deranged Midget

@NlGHTCRAWLER: Odd? The blog or the situation?

@TDK_1997: See, that's where I disagree. She could've simply confided in Clark, become closer in that fashion and in turn, built up an established friendship or relationship and went on from there. But the entire situation felt extremely forced.

But everyone has their own opinion and I respect that.

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Edited by Guardiandevil83

@Deranged Midget said:

@NlGHTCRAWLER: Odd? The blog or the situation?

@TDK_1997: See, that's where I disagree. She could've simply confided in Clark, become closer in that fashion and in turn, built up an established friendship or relationship and went on from there. But the entire situation felt extremely forced.

But everyone has their own opinion and I respect that.

If Geoff is the writer I know he is perhaps this will lead to something bigger. Drama between Diana,Steve and Clark. Maybe it will spread worldwide, something either didn't want..it was just the moment, the setting, ect. Next thing you know Diana knows who she wants (Steve) goes to him, and he's like ''Btch I saw the tape." lol. Maybe Trevor and Kent will collide some how during the Trinity War.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@Guardiandevil83: That's not a bad assumption and perhaps he's purposely building up to something, I don't know, but as of right now. I'm not convinced.

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Posted by ComicMan24

I like this relationship and would like to see something more serious coming out of it. I like Lois and Clark as a couple, one of he most iconic in comics imo, but since she is with another and from what I saw not really romantically interested in either Clark or Superman (at least from what I got), why not let Clark try something else instead?

Posted by Guardiandevil83

@Deranged Midget said:

@Guardiandevil83: That's not a bad assumption and perhaps he's purposely building up to something, I don't know, but as of right now. I'm not convinced.

Don't worry I dont think anyone save for myself really is. lol

Posted by NlGHTCRAWLER

@Deranged Midget said:

@NlGHTCRAWLER: Odd? The blog or the situation?

@TDK_1997: See, that's where I disagree. She could've simply confided in Clark, become closer in that fashion and in turn, built up an established friendship or relationship and went on from there. But the entire situation felt extremely forced.

But everyone has their own opinion and I respect that.

The situation.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@ComicMan24: I'm all for Clark having a brand new love interest in the New 52, but I'd rather have him get together with a brand new character than something we've already seen before with Lois, Diana(in Elseworlds), etc.

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Posted by No_Name_

@Deranged Midget said:

@Gambler said:

Why do they need some elaborate reason to make out? Or even a three issue build up? She's in a vulnerable state, he's playing the role of a sympathetic shoulder, aaaand they make out. Good enough for me.

Honestly, if she's in an emotional state and she needs a shoulder to cry on, there is no better person to utilize than Clark. But considering everything that's happened to her, we're expected to believe she'd instantly make out with Clark?

I would if I were her.

Posted by k4tzm4n

@Deranged Midget said:

@Gambler said:

Why do they need some elaborate reason to make out? Or even a three issue build up? She's in a vulnerable state, he's playing the role of a sympathetic shoulder, aaaand they make out. Good enough for me.

Honestly, if she's in an emotional state and she needs a shoulder to cry on, there is no better person to utilize than Clark. But considering everything that's happened to her, we're expected to believe she'd instantly make out with Clark?

Just going to throw it out there... but Midas is back on the market. He's a great listener, loyal and quite caring. Plus, he totally has Kal beat when it comes to looks.

Staff
Posted by Deranged Midget

@Babs said:

I would if I were her.

I see, I'm curious as to why you would say that. I would assume that you're all for the relationship but I'm interested to hear some in-depth thoughts from the other side of the fence.

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Posted by kingjoeg

I'd make out with Wonder woman if she lunged at me out of the blue, just sayin.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@kingjoeg: Ha! That's a fair statement and Jim Lee definitely draws an absolutely gorgeous Diana, but I wanted to stand from a neutral stand-point while still trying to depict the purpose behind the potential relationship and if it was merely a selling point or if it's something that could blossom and truly change the status quo of the DCU as it's been stated.

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Posted by Dark_Vengeance_

I still have hope for Batman/Wonder Woman. she is the only one that I think could have a steady relationship with him.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@DarkKnightDetective: Interesting, what do you base a potential relationship of the two off of? JLU?

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Posted by Dark_Vengeance_

@Deranged Midget: JLU was the seed of the idea. they are both really alike.

Posted by danhimself

@Guardiandevil83 said:

@Deranged Midget said:

@NlGHTCRAWLER: Odd? The blog or the situation?

@TDK_1997: See, that's where I disagree. She could've simply confided in Clark, become closer in that fashion and in turn, built up an established friendship or relationship and went on from there. But the entire situation felt extremely forced.

But everyone has their own opinion and I respect that.

If Geoff is the writer I know he is perhaps this will lead to something bigger. Drama between Diana,Steve and Clark. Maybe it will spread worldwide, something either didn't want..it was just the moment, the setting, ect. Next thing you know Diana knows who she wants (Steve) goes to him, and he's like ''Btch I saw the tape." lol. Maybe Trevor and Kent will collide some how during the Trinity War.

it already is

Posted by danhimself

@Deranged Midget: you should check out Blackest Night: Wonder Woman #2...Wonder Woman's love for Bruce is what broke the hold of the black ring and allowed her to use a Star Sapphire ring

Posted by Deranged Midget

@danhimself said:

@Deranged Midget: you should check out Blackest Night: Wonder Woman #2...Wonder Woman's love for Bruce is what broke the hold of the black ring and allowed her to use a Star Sapphire ring

Really? That's interesting. I knew she broke free of the black ring because she possessed an incredible amount of love but I didn't know it was specifically because of Bruce.

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Posted by danhimself

@Deranged Midget said:

@danhimself said:

@Deranged Midget: you should check out Blackest Night: Wonder Woman #2...Wonder Woman's love for Bruce is what broke the hold of the black ring and allowed her to use a Star Sapphire ring

Really? That's interesting. I knew she broke free of the black ring because she possessed an incredible amount of love but I didn't know it was specifically because of Bruce.

this is from #2 where the Star Sapphire ring and Aphrodite are trying to break through the black ring's hold on Diana

and this is from #3 where Wonder Woman is using the Lasso of Truth on Merra to break through the rage of her red ring

Posted by Deranged Midget

@danhimself: Wow, so that's where that scan of the two kissing was from, very interesting. Thanks for showing me that.

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Posted by danhimself

@Deranged Midget: no problemo

Posted by Static Shock

I kinda liked it.

Posted by greenteaforme

I'm actually disappointed with both the Wonder Woman solo run and the JL titles.

I know Wonder Woman's solo run is receiving praise, but...it's just not Wonder Woman to me. They changed the most romantic origin story in comics into something generic. They changed all the gods' appearances, and a few of them look terrible and "wrong". (I love Demeter's make-over, though.)

You could stick just about any other character into the story and they'd be able to fulfill the same role as Wonder Woman is in her story. That is not a good thing.

In my opinion, if it were Cassie's story, I think it'd be amazing. Stick Donna with the Titans and give Diana a new story more suited to, well, Wonder Woman. This also lets Cassie and Diana keep their origins.

Wonder Woman was kicking ass in JL, but suddenly she's become an emotional wreck and an Amazon warrior seeking comfort in the arms of the nearest man just doesn't fly with me.

Clark and Diana were always the closest in the League, and their friendship and trust in each other was really special. And it was even more special because they were true friends, with no constant strange sexual tension or crushes.

I can't wait for the N52 to be over, to be honest. It's cute as a novelty, but it's unacceptable as the main DC universe.

Posted by jrock85

I've only stuck with it because of Jim Lee's art, but I can't justify picking this up anymore. That was quite possibly the most criminally absurd thing I have ever seen in a flagship comic. I find it hilarious that Superman is conveniently feeling estranged from humanity even though he hasn't expressed any such sentiments in his two solo titles and seems to be quite comfortable living in his adoptive homeworld. Speaking of which...WHERE'S THE F*CKING BEHIND THE SCENES COORDINATION, DC?!? Don't tell me that the Superman I saw in JL #12 is the same one I saw bungee jumping with Lucy Lane in his eponymous title a week earlier! And poor Diana. Poor, poor Diana. You simply cannot overstate the tremendous job that Brian Azzarello has done in portraying her as the magnificent character that she is in her solo title. Unfortunately, she's written in the flagship title as a belligerent sword-wielding maniac (f*ck you, Johns).

Come to think of it, I think Steve Trevor has been the most sympathetic character in JL (and I seriously doubt that it was by design). I mean, how can you look at the situation he's in and not feel for the guy?

  • He's deeply in love with a woman who doesn't have the same feelings for him.
  • He's fighting tooth and nail to protect the JL from smear campaigns and from forces that would see their destruction.
  • He's constantly mocked and ridiculed by the media for being "the guy that got dumped by Wonder Woman." ( I would imagine that these attacks are only going to increase once the world finds out that she's in a romantic relationship with Superman)
  • He gets kidnapped, beaten to within an inch of his life, manages to escape captivity, fight through hordes of whatever the hell those things were, and aids the JL in defeating Graves. Despite these acts of valor, Wonder Woman essentially tells him "you're fired." *facepalm*

Steve has exhibited strength of character that few people possess and is the ideal guy for Diana, IMO.

But anyway, I have never been in favor of Clark/Diana and all the reasons given by Johns and his cronies for this hook-up are contrived and misguided. Chief among my concerns is that this relationship will get shoehorned into Azz's run and completely derail the course he's set for Diana. Based on the interviews he's done, I'm pretty sure that this romance doesn't fit within his vision for the character.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@greenteaforme said:

Clark and Diana were always the closest in the League, and their friendship and trust in each other was really special. And it was even more special because they were true friends, with no constant strange sexual tension or crushes.

This is my problem. They've shown absolutely no connection towards each other and throughout five years, Diana knew nothing about Clark or Superman to be exact.

@jrock85: Very good and thought out post mate, I enjoyed reading that. My problem with the whole relationship situation is how it's going to fit into the various titles. Jurgens supposedly has set up a potential relationship for Clark at the end of Superman #12 with Lucy Lane, and Azzarello is undoubtedly refusing to alter his plans to fit into DC's playbook. It seems like this was a last second decision and was a complete shot in the dark for the other creators.

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Posted by greenteaforme

@Deranged Midget said:

@greenteaforme said:

Clark and Diana were always the closest in the League, and their friendship and trust in each other was really special. And it was even more special because they were true friends, with no constant strange sexual tension or crushes.

This is my problem. They've shown absolutely no connection towards each other and throughout five years, Diana knew nothing about Clark or Superman to be exact.

@jrock85: Very good and thought out post mate, I enjoyed reading that. My problem with the whole relationship situation is how it's going to fit into the various titles. Jurgens supposedly has set up a potential relationship for Clark at the end of Superman #12 with Lucy Lane, and Azzarello is undoubtedly refusing to alter his plans to fit into DC's playbook. It seems like this was a last second decision and was a complete shot in the dark for the other creators.

I meant that in regards to standard continuity, pre-New 52.

Posted by Deranged Midget

@greenteaforme: Oh I know what you meant! I was simply stating that in regards to New 52, Diana and Clark were nothing more than teammates and besides the camaraderie and respect shown between each other, nothing has indicated that any of this was possible.

But that's my opinion.

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