It's simply amazing how so many people downplay the Beast. For those of you who say Kraven can take Beast, you obviously haven't read this...
This X-Men issue demonstrates that Kraven doesn't stand a chance as Beast nearly goes berserk, and almost kills Kraven...with ease.
He's definitely overrated, hyper inflated, and over- exaggerated by fans and writers alike. Just check out the power grid comparison between the official rating and the fan ratings. (Taken from the OHOTMU)
@14NC3: @14NC3:
Like I said, If your are overall smarter than your enemy, you have the advantage. Beast is overall much smarter than Spidey. Your intelligence feats didnt take me by surprise. I already knew and have admitted more than once that Parker is brilliant. However, compared to McCoy, he's got nothing. Everything you posted for Spidey is standard Beast intelligence and doesnt even come close to curing the Legacy virus.
Btw, where does it say that this is a random battle? It just says the fight takes place in an abandoned gym. Since it doesnt say that there is no prep time, Beast can easily outsmart Spidey with prep time, making him the victor.
@laflux:
"Boy, you sure have a knack for using out of context Punisher scans, don't you? Anyone would tell you that Punisher going H2H with Peter is plot induced. And in the very next scan, Peter Speed Blitzes him. Thirdly, your taking instances from Classic Spider-Man who utilized his speed alot less than he did at the time the thread was made."
My point with those scans is that Spidey gets hit all the time by objects that arent nearly as fast as bullets. He's not as fast as you would like him to be.
"The scans of Beast you put up, one of them has him dodging Rockets, which are larger, slower and easier to dodge. In the other scans, he dodges Bullets yet, but he doesn't wait for the said bullet to reach a few feet before actually dodging them."
Yeah, Beast must be a miles away from the cops in this scan right? Beast dodges bullets. End of story.
"Webbing has an area of spread, and Spider-Man has used it to tag people with Speed Agility and reflexes equal to and greater than Beast (Shadow land Daredevil for example). He has used it to block Bullets, lasers and Rocket fire as well. Its more than capable of tagging Beast."
Do you have scans of Spidey effectively using his webbing against Beast?
"As for Beast's healing factor and durability, I am not saying that he isn't durable against Blunt trauma. What I am saying is that Spider-Man has beaten and knocked out characters with faster healing factors (Deadpool, nearly tearing off his jaw in the process, Angelo Venom, causing him to run off in fear) as well as more durable foes- Tombstone, Rhino, Gargan, Scorpion, Lizard etc."
Just because Spider-man has beaten certain characters doesn't mean he can do it all the time. All it takes is for you to show me a scan of Spidey defeating Beast, and I wont say another word about it.
"As for Berserk beast, and your feats in general as said, your using feats exclusively from 40 years ago to determine results from characters who are fighting at their said versions much later. Mind posting more recent feats? Also concerning Berserk beast, what on panel feats show his speed, reflexes and agility increase by the same magnitude as his healing? Simply going Berserk doesn't warrant that change, nor does scans of Beast beating up some fodder, something his none Berserk form would do without a sweat. The fact that Berserk Beast couldn't simply dodge the bullets from some no name goons and had to heal from them, leads me to believe that he is no faster than being Non-Berserk."
It doesn't matter when it happened. It's not like Beast's ability to go beserk has been taken away. You just hardly ever witness it due to his nature. Beast is one of the most patient characters in the entire Marvel universe, but when he gets pushed to the point of no return, its truly terrifying. Concerning bersek Beast. You want me to post scans of Beast with increased speed? Isn't that kind of the point of going beserk? You lose all control of your temper and your abilities become heightened. If they didnt, It wouldnt really be called "going berserk" now would it? Btw, your "Battle Forum rules state to use current versions at the time the thread was made, so no Berserk Beast would not be allowed (as he not current)" is flawed. Unlike The Other spidey, beserk Beast is not a different story arc and is current. The ability for Beast to go berserk always lies deep within him. It always has. Its part of his physicality and psyche. It has never left him and will always remain. That being said, I'm still fully convinced that If Beast went toe to toe with Spidey, Beast would go berserk and demolish him.
"I have also seen you mention Beast's intelligence. In what way does this translate to combat prowess? I can accept that Beast's intelligence is greater than Peter's (Though not by much), but in comic world there is often no correlation between book smarts and combat prowess. Wolverine is less intelligent than both Beast and Parker, as is Iron Fist, no one in their right mind would argue that are worse H2H fighters. Beast being intelligent means nothing to this battle unless prep is involved."
Are you arguing that Beast's superior intelligence to Spider-man would do him absolutely no good in battle? Beast being incredibly intelligent speaks volumes for me, and Beast just isn't book smart. His intelligence just shines in that department. If you are all around smarter than your enemy, you will have the greater advantage. This is always being portrayed in comic books, especially the silver age books. One reason why Silver Surfer defeats enemies that are much more powerful than him is because he outsmarts them. Btw, the rules didn't say there was no prep time. It just said the fight takes place in an abandoned gym. Throw in prep time, and Beast will definitely outsmart Spidey. No doubt about it.
"Using non-cannon video games battles and posting pictures of a defeated Spider-Man lend no credit to your debating skills. Why not show a video of Shuma-Gorath being beat up by X-23 in Marvel vs Capcom 3, following it up with a picture of Shuma covered in bandages? Both have exactly the same worth in a battle thread- that's zero if you were wondering."
Ha! Dude, that was a joke. I'll be here all week : )
"Back up your opinions with consistent facts and feats, rather than out of context scans, opinions or Wiki extracts."
I already have backed up my facts with scans which were,
Beast is just as agile and acrobatic as Spidey.
Beast has superior reflexes just like Spidey.
Beast can go uncontrollably berserk.
Beast has an instantaneous healing factor.
Beast Dodges bullets just like Spidey can.
Beast has razor sharp claws and teeth that Spidey is laughably vulnerable to.
The only feat that I havent backed up with a scan is Beast's high level of intelligence (I thought this was common sense and that everyone would accept the fact that Beast is much smarter than Spidey). Would you really like me to find a scan of Beast in the lab working on a cure for the Legacy virus? Give me a break.
As far as wiki on Beast goes, they cite all of their sources. As much as you would like to believe, they aren't just making stuff up. Do me a favor and find one statement on Beast's wiki page that is false would ya?
Btw, you do realize that your greatest advantage with this debate is that Spider-man is Marvel's boy scout. There is so much material on him and a lot writers have exaggerated his powers tremendously. I'm defending a character who is so overlooked and underrated, not just by comic book fans, but by writers in the industry as well. For every 1 source of material for Beast, there are hundreds for Spider-man. And for every 1 Beast fan, there are hundreds of Spider-man fans. IMO Beast does a pretty dang good job holding his own considering the low amount of material he's been given.
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