Follow

    Power Girl

    Character » Power Girl appears in 1721 issues.

    Kara Zor-L is the older, wiser, and stronger counterpart of Supergirl from Earth 2 but resides on the Prime Earth.

    The Curious Case of Power Girl

    • 78 results
    • 1
    • 2
    Avatar image for difficlus
    difficlus

    10659

    Forum Posts

    3482

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #51  Edited By difficlus

    I preferred her costume from JLA All Stars with the boob window gone.

    Avatar image for jrock85
    jrock85

    2882

    Forum Posts

    2684

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 8

    #52  Edited By jrock85

    @SC said:

    @jrock85: Ah well PAD for example lays on heavy amounts of social issues and loves to point out flaws in comics and also parallel his writing to what's going on in the real world, past and present. He is the first to blog about comics in the same way the poster you quoted did? Do you get what I am saying? People can intellectually invest in things instead of emotionally invest in them. Do you consider that angle? Since often its not about being influenced by the comic, but recognizing the affects of comics and other media and the also what symptoms create many of the problems and criticisms in comics. Acknowledging such things isn't just good generally but specifically comics and improving them. PAD again being a good example, because he over deconstructs traditional aspects of comics and subverts them.

    I Gotcha. PAD does address social issues in his writing, but I think his first and foremost intent is to entertain, kinda the same way Jon Stewart addresses politics (or at least that's my interpretation of his writing). To be fair to the aforementioned poster, I think there is merit to some of what she said, as I told her in a PM; but I think women are stronger than she gives them credit for.

    LOL I really thought that I was going to get to bed at a decent time tonight.

    Always a pleasure, SC. :)

    Avatar image for jrock85
    jrock85

    2882

    Forum Posts

    2684

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 8

    #53  Edited By jrock85

    @lykopis said:

    I enjoy comics for comics sake - but like most everyone, I have some criticisms. I do like how the Huntress series brought up human trafficking which is a big thing - especially over in Europe and the Middle East.

    I'm really enjoying that series as well.

    Avatar image for nerx
    Nerx

    15350

    Forum Posts

    7

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 18

    #54  Edited By Nerx

    No problem at all, that granny costume is probably a mistake. Not all characters need to be exemplary , some of them can be fanservice.

    Avatar image for sc
    SC

    18454

    Forum Posts

    182748

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 25

    User Lists: 0

    #55  Edited By SC  Moderator
    @jrock85:  Cheers. Oh and to be honest, I get what you mean about priorities, just we can see that with your examples, education, increasing awareness, and discussion about issues which are very real, exist and can be sold as entertainment and along those similar lines, personally, I am thoroughly entertained when reading posts/blogs drawing parallels between comics and real life - definitely more entertaining than Fractions X-Men run =p 
     
     
    @lykopis said:

    I enjoy comics for comics sake - but like most everyone, I have some criticisms. I do like how the Huntress series brought up human trafficking which is a big thing - especially over in Europe and the Middle East.

     
    Great point/example, I am enjoying that series too. Reminds me of older X-Stories. Definitely delivered a lot better than its last time in (coincidentally) Fractions attempt to bring up same subject matter in Uncanny. Criticism isn't some massive evil. Its fun and invites change and improvement. 
    Avatar image for skunkstein
    Skunkstein

    644

    Forum Posts

    0

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #56  Edited By Skunkstein

    I loved the previous custome... but that was purely for immature reasons, and honestly i DO understand a change i mean i was a Power Girl semi fan before but i was always like wtf, why would any self respecting woman fight in that.

    If i smacked on a thong, body glitter and a fishnet tv-shirt and decided to fight crime... people would look too.

    Now the new custome, even though i understand the change - is bad. I miss her cape which was honestly very cool and original, i would kept the boob size, the cape the, work on the pants and boob window... and please just remove the wrist wraps things, their horrible.

    I dont hope they overdue it and make them all all desexual them all. I want to see my buff heroes and sexy heroins kicking ass.

    Avatar image for chalkshark
    chalkshark

    1271

    Forum Posts

    407273

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 1

    User Lists: 6

    #57  Edited By chalkshark

    The classics never go out of style. As soon as that new car scent fades from DC's 52 initiative, I expect a lot of the character's costumes to revert to type. New artists are going to come in and decide that either they want to draw the character's original look, instead of JIm Lee's design eyesores, or they'll do a redesign to make it more their own. Newer, hungrier artists will tow the company line, but long established "A" listers tend to have the power to draw what they want. If Adam Hughes committed to doing interiors on Wonder Woman for the next 5 years, but only under the condition that he could depict the 1940's version of the character, DC would roll over in a heartbeat, starry-eyed over the higher profits they'd make on the title with Hughes in place as it's artist. Even if a new costume design hits big with the fan base, it won't last. In that instance, once the character returns to their original garb, the new costume lives on, draped around a new character. Think of Venom & U.S. Agent, who inherited their costumes from Spider-Man & Captain America. I doubt Powergirl's new look will last much longer than the Bart Sears design did.

    Avatar image for aero_gt
    Aero_gt

    846

    Forum Posts

    3

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #58  Edited By Aero_gt

    @aeka said:

    @jrock85: Whether or not you have friends who would or wouldn't chisel their bodies to look like Power Girl is beside the point. The point is the media is saturated with the constant message of "thin is beautiful and desirable, fat is seen as undesirable and unattractive," "big round breasts are preferred to small or sagging breasts," "round shapely butts are preferred to flat butts," and the list goes on. Comics are another form of media that reiterates this concept and goes the extra mile by sexualising and objectifying their female characters by posing them in cheesecake poses and even eroticising violence committed against them. This message is almost always exclusively aimed towards women that it even influences the way women feel about their bodies both consciously and subconsciously.

    In fact, most women don't go to those extremes for the sake of attaining an ideal body image.

    And you're basing this on what? Because what is seen in both research and therapy sessions with women is the exact opposite. If there wasn't a high enough percentage of women with body image issues or an epidemic of eating disorders that are linked to body image especially amongst young girls, this would neither be a heavily researched topic nor would educators feel the need to educate people on this topic. Please do not act like an authority on a subject matter you clearly know nothing about.

    You'd like to see an overweight female hero?

    I have a better question, Why CAN'T there be an overweight female hero?

    I already dislike fat superheros that are males so female superheroes that are fat will not even get looked at. Then, again that would be more of the real world standards especially in America, but I don't read comics for real world standards I read them for things not of this world or else I might aswell just read an autobiography of so schmoe..-3-

    Avatar image for aeka
    aeka

    47

    Forum Posts

    19

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #59  Edited By aeka

    @jrock85:

    I'm glad she exhausted herself because my bullsh*t detector was about to explode. ;D

    Seriously, lets just take comics for what they are: a form of art and entertainment, nothing more.

    Guess you forgot I can still read my inbox. So I'll keep this brief:

    1) As a male you DO NOT get to decide that women's issues are "bullshit" as you do not experience what women experience in American culture.

    2) Media does much more than "just entertain," it also influences how men and women perceive each other as well as themselves.

    If there was no truth to this, this would neither be a heavily researched topic nor would people heavily write about it. Reexamine your privilege and do some research before coming out with "bullshit" of your own.

    Avatar image for thecrowbar
    TheCrowbar

    4397

    Forum Posts

    0

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 2

    User Lists: 0

    #60  Edited By TheCrowbar

    @SamRevlon said:

    @TheCrowbar said:

    No. Seriously I hate this argument so much. If heroes aren't at their peak physical condition they're likely to get their asses handed to them by villains who in prison have nothing to do but train. A fat, curvy, overweight hero is a dead one.

    Nah, not necessarily - though most of the time if their running around being heroes that sorta keeps them fit. Not every villain is exactly what you call in shape either, physicality does play a role, but not to the extremes you make it.

    Your conclusion and your reasoning don't match. Not every villain is exactly in shape? So what? It just takes one villain to be in shape to overpower a hero. Especially in most comics where taking down the bad guy comes down to a physical brawl.

    Avatar image for samrevlon
    SamRevlon

    138

    Forum Posts

    0

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #61  Edited By SamRevlon

    @TheCrowbar said:

    Your conclusion and your reasoning don't match. Not every villain is exactly in shape? So what? It just takes one villain to be in shape to overpower a hero. Especially in most comics where taking down the bad guy comes down to a physical brawl.

    There is curvy and toned - at least for women and the same could be said that not every guy has to be ripped beyond control to win a match. I wouldn't mind seeing a few guys in the heroes pool that was cranked up like they just left prison. I don't know if your thinking that I'm stating that an extremely overweight character could win against someone extremely fit ( ? ) In which case I'm not: I understand that they will be sluggish with poor response, but I just saying that I'd like to see some different builds and body sizes. They could win even in a physical brawl too; there are a lot of factors to consider when a match takes place. Skill - Experience - perhaps the mentality of a hero, etc. It's not immediately over as you put it.

    Avatar image for sc
    SC

    18454

    Forum Posts

    182748

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 25

    User Lists: 0

    #62  Edited By SC  Moderator

    Great blog. Again I wanted to have my say without addressing anyone else's points though I'll probably cover familiar and already tread ground as their have been some excellent replies so far in the thread. Firstly, I as presented to me, with this one image by this artist, I actually aren't endeared with Power Girls new look. However thats as much to do with art style, and pose, and the boots and gauntlets and - really I'd prefer to see character drawn more, different angles, covers, panels different artists. Things that can change my perception and opinion of it. After all I did defend Starfire's new look, and criticize Harley's and artistically speaking Harley from what I have seen (I am behind on reading) is looking less vamped up and Starfire's use artistically is just very traditional. So seeing Power Girl in actual stories will invariably provide more context for me.  
     
    As for new costume versus old costume, I actually prefer the old costume, so far, and thats mainly due to me associating to Amanda Conner & Jimmy Palmiotti writing of that character which was fun, funny, painfully self aware, and it was a bit cheesecakey, but maybe because the artist was a woman, it wasn't one dimensional cheesecake. Power Girl's expressions and self awareness and sass pretty much made her personality and characterization the sexiest thing about her. Of course by the same token, if you redid that series with the character dressed in the new look, then that would thus be my preference. Ignoring additional contexts and just focusing on the aesthetics I have no real attachment to either. If her fans were unfortunate to have had me redesign the character, I would have used her older outfit as the base, and perhaps add a contrasting undershirt too her, add either matching leggings to her suit (white) or contrasting (black) make her hair a bit longer. Keep the cape, more importantly keep the cape pin, which I always thought was cool, keep the basic cut. Just add on really. In fact with a reboot/revamp and characters being changed some small, some big, I'd actually make Power Girl "plus sized model" size.  Before I explain why creatively this could be pulled off, I'll throw in another angle. 
     
    Another topic all this brings up to me, is something that's becoming more prevalent, is the business of selling ethics, morality, environmentalism, unapologetically politically incorrectness, feminism, diversity, and equality, among other things. I can understand why this happens, because that's money, and if you can spin your product a way that in another accurate sense is something like pro equality, or pro change, or pro ethics you can sell it to more money and make your product appear more appealing. The problem occurs when that spin isn't accurate, or is more inaccurate than inaccurate. Like many types of bottled water for example, as far as health and environmental benefits. Its clean, its green, its tasty and pure, but kind of not really. I won't say that DC (and Marvel too) is guilty of anything too serious here, but I can't help but feel they'd rather be perceived as changing the industry for the better as far as woman in comics is concerned, than actually putting hard effort into changing things. Jim Lee's comments as mentioned and what he was trying to achieve with female characters, I can appreciate and admire, especially as far as intent, but it just feels like token effort to me, and execution seems hung up on oversimplification. You can't just give a character pants to have them be taken more seriously, and I expect creators to be able to write and draw respectable characters in shorts and skirts as well. Mainly due to the varies contexts of layers that make up characters and how they are handled and received. As of now, its too early to see if Power Girl's new look is a superficial bandage over a hole that could have been fixed other ways or something indicative of something greater.  
     
    Back to my ego, and idea, making Power Girl plus sized. Lets say Power Girls breasts and breast window are aspects about the character which could be defining, casting whatever negative or positive connotations such an idea casts, why not make her a bit bigger to actually give some size diversity with female characters? It exists but not in the same way it does for males. Surprisingly there is more range between vaguely ambiguously ideal looking and fat, unfit, unattractive and incapable. Woman with prominent breasts tend to have prominent hips, so why not make Power Girl a bit larger, and I don't mean height. Think of a female shot put thrower or such athlete. Artists use models yes? A quick Google image search of plus sized models brings up a bevy of attractive, healthy looking, strong woman, that just aren't represented in comics. Power Girl's Kyptonian heritage essentially means she is going to be strong, fast, and fit no matter what, and hey, actually being a bit larger might actually aid her strength more than it would detract from her speed (if you want approach it from that way) I suppose changing a characters physical size might be too much of a dramatic shift though even for a revamp/reboot and... wait, well there was Amanda the Wall Waller. Her iconic look was changed - oh wait right movie, so Power Girl must have a movie coming out and so... oh not that either... well its important to have characters maintain identifiable and icon... oh wait she looks different now... so that's my 2 cents. Adding pants and covering chest holes isn't the only way to make a character more respectable, I really hope that's not DC's trump card, having diversity in body shapes with both genders is good (especially in light of there being more than just two types) and I think a plus sized Power Girl would have been awesome and easy to implemented all things considered. 

    Avatar image for jrock85
    jrock85

    2882

    Forum Posts

    2684

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 8

    #63  Edited By jrock85

    @aeka:

    Okay, I think I've figured out where we're not seeing eye to eye.

    What you've been asserting is that people's views of any group or subculture are socially constructed by the media they consume. While that's true in some cases, I don't think its necessarily true in regards to the comic book audience. Reports suggest that the average comic book reader is about 28 years old. I believe the vast majority of people in that age group are mature enough to differentiate between entertainment and reality (At least I hope so).

    @SC said:

    Back to my ego, and idea, making Power Girl plus sized. Lets say Power Girls breasts and breast window are aspects about the character which could be defining, casting whatever negative or positive connotations such an idea casts, why not make her a bit bigger to actually give some size diversity with female characters? It exists but not in the same way it does for males. Surprisingly there is more range between vaguely ambiguously ideal looking and fat, unfit, unattractive and incapable. Woman with prominent breasts tend to have prominent hips, so why not make Power Girl a bit larger, and I don't mean height. Think of a female shot put thrower or such athlete. Artists use models yes? A quick Google image search of plus sized models brings up a bevy of attractive, healthy looking, strong woman, that just aren't represented in comics. Power Girl's Kyptonian heritage essentially means she is going to be strong, fast, and fit no matter what, and hey, actually being a bit larger might actually aid her strength more than it would detract from her speed (if you want approach it from that way) I suppose changing a characters physical size might be too much of a dramatic shift though even for a revamp/reboot and... wait, well there was Amanda the Wall Waller. Her iconic look was changed - oh wait right movie, so Power Girl must have a movie coming out and so... oh not that either... well its important to have characters maintain identifiable and icon... oh wait she looks different now... so that's my 2 cents. Adding pants and covering chest holes isn't the only way to make a character more respectable, I really hope that's not DC's trump card, having diversity in body shapes with both genders is good (especially in light of there being more than just two types) and I think a plus sized Power Girl would have been awesome and easy to implemented all things considered.

    I think I see what you're getting at. You'd have redesigned PG to look something like Stompa?

    No Caption Provided
    Avatar image for kentheprofile
    KenTheProfile

    420

    Forum Posts

    130

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 1

    User Lists: 1

    #64  Edited By KenTheProfile

    to me the window or whatever was not the deal. it was the size of her breast. they still seem large even now. if the writings good i don't really see how it matters one way or the other. heck at first it did not even look like she would exist in the new 52. so Power gril anyway his good in my book

    Avatar image for bloggerboy
    bloggerboy

    896

    Forum Posts

    0

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 2

    User Lists: 0

    #65  Edited By bloggerboy

    What irks me most about the changes is that Power Girl called herself Supergirl in this new continuity. Sure this is a relaunch but that doesn't sound like the Power Girl I like. You know the woman who wanted to stood out.

    Her old suit was classic. Boob window aside (and some versions didn't have it) it was one of the best designed costumes with a perfect mix of white, blue and red. The way her cape was attached was just brilliant.

    This new design is too generic and too 90's styled.

    Avatar image for thirteen13
    Thirteen13

    421

    Forum Posts

    29

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #66  Edited By Thirteen13

    Honestly the first thing that draw my attention to Power Girl was her ample chest displayed by her "boob-window", but beyond her ample chest she seems like a good and interesting character with a good deal of personality.

    I don't like her new design not because of the loss of her boob-window (which if I am honest is slight ridiculous and makes it a little hard to take her seriously), but because IMO it simply looks awful and isn't even recognisable as Power Girl. I think she can have a new costume that is a little more modest and still be recognisable as PG. For instance, I came across this picture of Power Girl with what I think is a great costume...

    Even with the loss of her infamous boob-window and more skin covered it keeps other key elements of her old costume such as her cape and also leaves her arms exposed to show off her what should be impressive muscles as contrary to the usual depiction of super-heroines appearing model like in figure PG she is little more buff (sometimes drawn too buff) which is something I like about her.

    Avatar image for dementedtheclown
    dementedtheclown

    911

    Forum Posts

    162

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #67  Edited By dementedtheclown

    @aeka said:

    @jrock85:

    I'm glad she exhausted herself because my bullsh*t detector was about to explode. ;D

    Seriously, lets just take comics for what they are: a form of art and entertainment, nothing more.

    Guess you forgot I can still read my inbox. So I'll keep this brief:

    1) As a male you DO NOT get to decide that women's issues are "bullshit" as you do not experience what women experience in American culture.

    2) Media does much more than "just entertain," it also influences how men and women perceive each other as well as themselves.

    If there was no truth to this, this would neither be a heavily researched topic nor would people heavily write about it. Reexamine your privilege and do some research before coming out with "bullshit" of your own.

    Bullshit, its ppl like you who caused this unnecessary change, I'm a man and have no problem with all the arnold bodied superheroes out there, and never expected to look like them. My best friend has natural triple d's why the hell cant powergirl? Because having big boobs is sexist and makes girls think they need big ones? Give me a break. Thats like telling all the naturally big breasted women out there that their boobs are too big for them to be superheroes. Why not make all the females flat chested with burgas on, and all the males scrawny or fat?

    Avatar image for dementedtheclown
    dementedtheclown

    911

    Forum Posts

    162

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #68  Edited By dementedtheclown

    @Thirteen13 said:

    Even with the loss of her infamous boob-window and more skin covered it keeps other key elements of her old costume such as her cape and also leaves her arms exposed to show off her what should be impressive muscles as contrary to the usual depiction of super-heroines appearing model like in figure PG she is little more buff (sometimes drawn too buff) which is something I like about her.

    This! She had the most unique body type in DC, if she were ever a model she would be considered plus size, which is part of why she was awesome. Now she really is JUST A SUPERGIRL CLONE. Whats the point?

    On a personal note, I hate the hair.

    Avatar image for thirteen13
    Thirteen13

    421

    Forum Posts

    29

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #69  Edited By Thirteen13

    @dementedtheclown: Yeah agreed, beyond her large chest PG unlike other supermodel like super-heroines she had a distinctive and unique body type that was voluptuous, corn-fed and generally isn't portrayed much in comics or other forms of media, but now she looks like almost any other generic super-heroine. I thought it was good to have a depiction of a healthy, full-figured heroine that was proud of her body, though as I said the boob-window isn't necessary to show off her assets.

    BTW, when you say you hate her hair do you mean the horrible new resign? As that's another thing I really don't like about the resign as one of my favourite things about PG was her previous short and sassy hairstyle.

    Avatar image for dementedtheclown
    dementedtheclown

    911

    Forum Posts

    162

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #70  Edited By dementedtheclown

    @Thirteen13 said:

    @dementedtheclown: Yeah agreed, beyond her large chest PG unlike other supermodel like super-heroines she had a distinctive and unique body type that was voluptuous, corn-fed and generally isn't portrayed much in comics or other forms of media, but now she looks like almost any other generic super-heroine. I thought it was good to have a depiction of a healthy, full-figured heroine that was proud of her body, though as I said the boob-window isn't necessary to show off her assets.

    BTW, when you say you hate her hair do you mean the horrible new resign? As that's another thing I really don't like about the resign as one of my favourite things about PG was her previous short and sassy hairstyle.

    Yes the new hair looks too butch

    Avatar image for aeka
    aeka

    47

    Forum Posts

    19

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #71  Edited By aeka

    @dementedtheclown said:

    Bullshit, its ppl like you who caused this unnecessary change, I'm a man and have no problem with all the arnold bodied superheroes out there, and never expected to look like them. My best friend has natural triple d's why the hell cant powergirl? Because having big boobs is sexist and makes girls think they need big ones? Give me a break. Thats like telling all the naturally big breasted women out there that their boobs are too big for them to be superheroes. Why not make all the females flat chested with burgas on, and all the males scrawny or fat?

    Ah yes. The same tired old argument that hasn't been argued before, no less by a mansplainer who thinks he knows more about sexism than a woman who actually experiences it in daily life. Bravo! You deserve a gold medal for your derailing efforts.

    And for the record, if people like me actually caused change to DC comics, believe me, the reboot would not have been as controversial as it has been.

    Avatar image for dementedtheclown
    dementedtheclown

    911

    Forum Posts

    162

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #72  Edited By dementedtheclown

    @aeka said:

    @dementedtheclown said:

    Bullshit, its ppl like you who caused this unnecessary change, I'm a man and have no problem with all the arnold bodied superheroes out there, and never expected to look like them. My best friend has natural triple d's why the hell cant powergirl? Because having big boobs is sexist and makes girls think they need big ones? Give me a break. Thats like telling all the naturally big breasted women out there that their boobs are too big for them to be superheroes. Why not make all the females flat chested with burgas on, and all the males scrawny or fat?

    Ah yes. The same tired old argument that hasn't been argued before, no less by a mansplainer who thinks he knows more about sexism than a woman who actually experiences it in daily life. Bravo! You deserve a gold medal for your derailing efforts.

    And for the record, if people like me actually caused change to DC comics, believe me, the reboot would not have been as controversial as it has been.

    Kinda sad you blame your insecurities on the medias portrayal of women.

    I'm so tired of people bitching about shit like this, some people have what many consider "perfect" or "voluptuous" bodies, many also dress to show off there bodies.

    Why cant superheroes? and not all of them do.

    It's people like you who ruin these characters the way I've known them since I was young, people complaining cause they can, its harmless except to idiots who believe everything they see, and base their life around it. I like my superheroes slim, sexy, and muscular thank you very much. I'm a fat out of shape guy with long hair and a farmers tan, no superhero is shaped like me, but I'm not complaining in the least.

    I'd hate to see a DC run by a prude like you. Might as well make comics about everyday people doing everyday things if you want realism and conservatism that bad.

    I'll keep my half naked voluptuous women, and overly armored body building men, over this crappily redesigned powergirl anyday.

    Same with the horrible Harley Quinn redesign, people say that's too sexist also, n no its just too ugly, Harley was cute, now shes goth..

    Avatar image for dementedtheclown
    dementedtheclown

    911

    Forum Posts

    162

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #73  Edited By dementedtheclown
    No Caption Provided

    Nice upload btw {o:

    Avatar image for sc
    SC

    18454

    Forum Posts

    182748

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 25

    User Lists: 0

    #74  Edited By SC  Moderator
    @lykopis said:

    @SC: Your entire post was spectacular - I agree completely. If they were to re-introduce Power Girl in such a format, I would have loved it - kind that Mae West kind of physique and more importantly, the attitude to match? It's so disappointing the disconnect there between comic book companies and their readers. What you wrote is so perfect - I can't understand why they didn't do Power Girl in that way.
     
    Thank you Lykopis, and great comparison and reference with Mae West. The problem I think lies in the perception of safety. Comics despite all its talk of creativity and adaptation and innovation, can be so defensive, so status quo, so resistant to change. Many people in charge of big decisions with comics goal is to make money with comics, somewhat ironically this can backfire. Especially in industries where emphasis is applied to tradition, versus adaption. Comics industry is seeping with tradition, and usually success can be attributed to adaptation. The great inbetween is integration. Combining the best and most popular parts of each. Like despite Joey Q's negative fan criticism, there were many areas his decisions were flat out good for Marvel and the industry. TPB's being just one. That's the area of making your product more accessible to consumers though, since gender is a area that really hasn't had that same sort of innovation or push, at least not effectively. So even though change is constant in comics, its always change to the same. Any change touted as being this big creative or innovate move, in comics, usually ends up just being superficial. Actual, considered, deliberate change? Well that can be pretty elusive, much like I would say our Power Girl idea.  
     
     
    @jrock85:  Sort of, but I wouldn't use that picture example as a good example. Too much baggage, as far as art style, costume, angles, and so on. Larger frames, don't necessary mean, stronger or harder frames, and the character's build seems to suggest the two go hand in hand. Its why I used the term plus size model, though somewhat ambiguous and despite many plus size models actually being a bit small compared to reality and actual sized woman, its to illustrate that femininity isn't typified by petiteness, or hourglass figures (voluptuous, but only in the breast and butt, the waist is tiny) and thus larger woman can be as soft, and curvy, without going to opposite extremes, and petite and thin females, can have muscles too, but likewise, not in an exaggerated way. So its about subtle details. Much like comparing Thor's build, Cyclops, Nightwing's, Shang Chi, Gambit, Longshot, Wolverine. Kind of the same, kind of different. Maybe sometime I can draw an example of what I mean. Whitney Thompson or Crystal Renn or Mae West size when they were a bit heavier might be good reference points. Comics surprisingly can lack subtlety with inbetween points.  
     
     
    @dementedtheclown said:

    its ppl like you who caused this unnecessary change, I'm a man and have no problem with all the arnold bodied superheroes out there, and never expected to look like them. My best friend has natural triple d's why the hell cant powergirl? Because having big boobs is sexist and makes girls think they need big ones? Give me a break. Thats like telling all the naturally big breasted women out there that their boobs are too big for them to be superheroes. Why not make all the females flat chested with burgas on, and all the males scrawny or fat?

     
    Bacon Brizzle Cucumber Snowboard. I am pretty sure the poster you addressed doesn't work for DC, and I am pretty sure their creative decisions tend to be based on what they think will get them money. Instead of trying to appease ppl like them, especially with "unnecessary changes" - in fact, this sounds like some sort of argument applied by someone who is oblivious to what the actual criticism and argument is? Is that possible? I only ask because...  
     
    "I'm a man and have no problem with all the arnold bodied superheroes out there, and never expected to look like them"  
     
    That's great, good for you and good for me, but the criticism and argument here is not that there are the equivalent of Arnold bodied females are out there. That the argument and criticism is not that females feel bad that they can't look like such characters. So when people mention that as if they are making a point, I get a bit confused. Then again I am only 7 years old, maybe I don't get it? See to me it doesn't address that you don't see, nearly as hard bodied, athletic woman as you do hard bodies athletic men, and you don't see as many porn star build looking men, as you do porn star build looking females, and comparing the two? When its men? Athletic and strong looks, arms, and chests, muscles, win out over big groins, and well defined ass checks. Its almost as if its catering to the male projection of maleness is. With female characters porn star build wins out. Funnily enough again, its almost again, like its a flawed projection, instead of a considered and conscious distinguishing point. Somehow as well, the poses and outfits seem to further emphasize, detail and exaggerate these differences? That's odd? Except hey? I am happy? I don't notice, and so who cares about thinking?  
     
    "Because having big boobs is sexist and makes girls think they need big ones?" 
     
    Very sexist. Do you see big boobs on male characters? No? Not really? Blob before he was depowered? Sexist! Could be that they are fictional character. So I mean, if all the female characters have bigger "boobs" - sorry sex. If female characters sex. Boobs. Ass. Sex. Define. Boobs. Breasts. Chest. Legs. Bigger. Tighter. Tauter. Slimmer. Boobs. Big. Define. Its almost as if your reducing a character to their sex organs? Solely their sex? One dimensional character? Defining a character by things like their breasts? Oh wait, only if its a female character. So its not an emotional argument. "Oh mummy please buy me bigger breasts for Christmas, since Powergirl has big breasts despite a small waist and for some reason we are reminded in every angle panel and page" (though it can be that when combined with other factors and younger readers) its an intellectual point - because how many fans would Batman have if he lost al his villains, supporting characters, had to move to LA after leaving Gotham, lost his IQ and Prep making abilities and money in a strip poker game with Lady Gaga and sold his utility belt and Batmobile and batarang so he could by the worlds shiniest man thong and stood around al day posing with each of his stories focused on his Bat Bulge? Granted he might find a new type of fan, but they might not be there strictly for Batman.  Not that sex appeal isn't a big part of what makes Batman popular, and I am sure there are more than a few panels of Batman looking tasty to either gender. Its just not his one defining trait, nor is it one of his two defining traits. 
     
    "My best friend has natural triple d's why the hell cant powergirl?" 
     
    My best friend has three natural triple D's. She is trying to audition for the role of the three breasted mutant girl from Total Recall in the Total Recall remake. Why the jalapeño can't Power Girl? Oh oh... uhm, maybe because my friend is real, (well) and Power Girl is a fictional character and so nothing natural about her. So writers actually have creative control as far as presenting characters with equal amounts of body diversity, with equal amounts of sex emphasis, equal amounts of exaggeration, equal amounts of wish fulfillment and so on.   
     
    "Give me a break"  
     
    Okay - but lastly its not about flat chests or burqas on woman or fat or scrawny guys. Thats like an oversimplification systematic of not quite grasping the argument - or satire. If its satire, then yey. 
    Avatar image for raiiyn
    Raiiyn

    3683

    Forum Posts

    27441

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 3

    #75  Edited By Raiiyn

    @dementedtheclown said:

    @aeka said:

    @dementedtheclown said:

    Bullshit, its ppl like you who caused this unnecessary change, I'm a man and have no problem with all the arnold bodied superheroes out there, and never expected to look like them. My best friend has natural triple d's why the hell cant powergirl? Because having big boobs is sexist and makes girls think they need big ones? Give me a break. Thats like telling all the naturally big breasted women out there that their boobs are too big for them to be superheroes. Why not make all the females flat chested with burgas on, and all the males scrawny or fat?

    Ah yes. The same tired old argument that hasn't been argued before, no less by a mansplainer who thinks he knows more about sexism than a woman who actually experiences it in daily life. Bravo! You deserve a gold medal for your derailing efforts.

    And for the record, if people like me actually caused change to DC comics, believe me, the reboot would not have been as controversial as it has been.

    Kinda sad you blame your insecurities on the medias portrayal of women.

    I'm so tired of people bitching about shit like this, some people have what many consider "perfect" or "voluptuous" bodies, many also dress to show off there bodies.

    Why cant superheroes? and not all of them do.

    It's people like you who ruin these characters the way I've known them since I was young, people complaining cause they can, its harmless except to idiots who believe everything they see, and base their life around it. I like my superheroes slim, sexy, and muscular thank you very much. I'm a fat out of shape guy with long hair and a farmers tan, no superhero is shaped like me, but I'm not complaining in the least.

    I'd hate to see a DC run by a prude like you. Might as well make comics about everyday people doing everyday things if you want realism and conservatism that bad.

    I'll keep my half naked voluptuous women, and overly armored body building men, over this crappily redesigned powergirl anyday.

    Same with the horrible Harley Quinn redesign, people say that's too sexist also, n no its just too ugly, Harley was cute, now shes goth..

    How did this go from talking about a horrific costume design to accusing someone of having insecurities?

    I'm sorry, not all people who think that the overly sexual portrayal of certain characters indicates insecurities.

    I may not agree with ALL of Aeka's points, but seriously dude... how can a few comments about overtly sexual depictions ruin a character for you? Honestly, are you saying the only reason you'll stick to a character is because they are "half naked voluptuous women"?!

    Because I'm pretty sure THAT'S the issue here. It shouldn't be about how large a superhero's breasts are or how curvy their hips are, that's not supposed to be what defines the character... and if that's the only reason you're paying attention to a series... Then I'm pretty sure you're the one with the issues.

    Avatar image for aeka
    aeka

    47

    Forum Posts

    19

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #76  Edited By aeka
    @dementedtheclown: Kinda sad you blame your insecurities on the medias portrayal of women.

    Because the very real phenomenon of female objectification in the media and how this shapes peoples' views and treatment of women is clearly a sign of insecurity on my part! GASP!

    I'm so tired of people bitching about shit like this, some people have what many consider "perfect" or "voluptuous" bodies, many also dress to show off there bodies.

    Translation: I'm so tired of marginalised people fighting for equal representation in the media because it threatens my privilege!

    Why cant superheroes? and not all of them do.

    Because if male heroes were similarly scantily clad and posed like porn stars the way female characters are, then this would clearly not be an issue? Oh wait! IT WOULD! Because then the men would actually have something to complain about!

    It's people like you who ruin these characters the way I've known them since I was young, people complaining cause they can, its harmless except to idiots who believe everything they see, and base their life around it.

    Yes, shame on me and everyone else who dares to challenge the sexism and misogyny that's ever so rampant in American culture and subsequently reinforced in the media. Because hey! It's harmless to those who are privileged and don't experience such things, but anyone (including researchers) who calls out the harmful effects of media portrayals of marginalised groups is clearly an idiot! Absolutely! Ironically enough, I was under the impression progressive change wasn't the reason characters were "ruined" in the reboot to the point of media outrage.

    I'd hate to see a DC run by a prude like you. Might as well make comics about everyday people doing everyday things if you want realism and conservatism that bad.

    Because calling out sexism and misogyny as real problems is clearly the same as being shocked and offended by the acknowledgement that people are sexual beings and enjoy having sex with their clothes off (prude)! Thanks for letting me know how well you understand the concept!

    I'll keep my half naked voluptuous women, and overly armored body building men, over this crappily redesigned powergirl anyday.

    Congratulations! You just provided one shining example of exactly what female readers find problematic about comic portrayals of women in the first place! Sadly I doubt you'll be enlightened enough to realise the false equivalence of that statement or how it's even problematic.

    Nice upload btw {o:

    Because clearly an artist's sexualisation of Wayne and Bertinelli should stop me from liking their characters! Nevermind the fact they -GASP- have personalities. Stay classy.

    Avatar image for joygirl
    Joygirl

    21037

    Forum Posts

    482

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 43

    #77  Edited By Joygirl

    This is not an argument that can be won. Saying you liked the old Power Girl is just opening up a can of worms you don't wanna eat.

    Avatar image for aeka
    aeka

    47

    Forum Posts

    19

    Wiki Points

    0

    Followers

    Reviews: 0

    User Lists: 0

    #78  Edited By aeka

    @Thirteen13 said:

    Honestly the first thing that draw my attention to Power Girl was her ample chest displayed by her "boob-window", but beyond her ample chest she seems like a good and interesting character with a good deal of personality.

    I don't like her new design not because of the loss of her boob-window (which if I am honest is slight ridiculous and makes it a little hard to take her seriously), but because IMO it simply looks awful and isn't even recognisable as Power Girl. I think she can have a new costume that is a little more modest and still be recognisable as PG. For instance, I came across this picture of Power Girl with what I think is a great costume...

    Even with the loss of her infamous boob-window and more skin covered it keeps other key elements of her old costume such as her cape and also leaves her arms exposed to show off her what should be impressive muscles as contrary to the usual depiction of super-heroines appearing model like in figure PG she is little more buff (sometimes drawn too buff) which is something I like about her.

    I actually like that redesign for Power Girl. It's not exploitive but still plays homage to the original Power Girl costume.

    This edit will also create new pages on Comic Vine for:

    Beware, you are proposing to add brand new pages to the wiki along with your edits. Make sure this is what you intended. This will likely increase the time it takes for your changes to go live.

    Comment and Save

    Until you earn 1000 points all your submissions need to be vetted by other Comic Vine users. This process takes no more than a few hours and we'll send you an email once approved.