Odin......Sit Down.

#1 Edited by IncredibleMSJ (46 posts) - - Show Bio

Okay, I have mass respect for Odin and he is one powerful SOB. But I think it's time for him to lose. My reasons, hes been a real jerk lately, talking down about humanity and Thor, and I know hes an all-father but they get beat too, especially by your big space entities (Celestials, etc.) I know in the upcoming events in fear itself it is inevitable that he will face off against the Serpent and I'm sure he'll probably take a beating. But I would truly like to see Odin lose in a normal battle, not one as hyped up as fear itself. For example in the recent Thor issues where Asgard is about to face off with Galactus and Silver Surfer. My point being I think Odin is overdue for a humbling battle. Just wondering people's thoughts.

#2 Posted by jloneblackheart (5519 posts) - - Show Bio

I agree. I think Galactus is far more than any (or all) of the Asgardians Gods can handle, even with their cosmic armor.

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#3 Posted by vidarrodinson (137 posts) - - Show Bio

Man, You guys are in for a rude awakenning.  Odin is the all wise.  He has been honing his skills beating up Surtur every day for trainning.   This is his big pay-per-view event..  Now you will see Odin does what he does,  Be's the way he is, for reasons we mortals can't understand.

#4 Posted by seekquaze (612 posts) - - Show Bio

To be fair the more jerkish portrayal of Odin under Fraction is a tad unusual.  Odin has always been a bit pompous and condescending, but I don't recall ever to this degree.  Fraction has the pompous side down, but has yet to grasp the more nobler side of Asgardian speech.  On the other hand considering all Asgard's been through lately and the sheer stupidity Thor has demonstrated I can see why Odin is p.o.ed.  Thor makes one incredible moronic move after another, recalls Odin to clean up his mess, and then complain when Odin calls him out on his crap.  
 
I don't think Odin is going to lose to Galactus, but I get the feeling the Serpent in Fear Itself is going to be the one to humble Odin.  It is the way these stories tend to go.

#5 Posted by IncredibleMSJ (46 posts) - - Show Bio
@jloneblackheart: Yeah for sure! I mean hes destroyed countless planets each with their own pantheons  filled with gods and what have you. Im kind of tired of writers making statements of power by Galactus losing when he really shouldnt. Theres not many characters that stand up to big G pound for pound in the MU. 
#6 Edited by PowerHerc (84031 posts) - - Show Bio

No, Odin shouldn't lose just to lose. This has been happening to far too many characters lately.

Having him lose to anyone less than an abstract being or and equal like Zeus or Surtur would only make him seem weaker to readers when depicted in the future.

Odin needs to remain a top-level, legitimate, nigh-invincible bad-ass. No matter how arrogant, pompous or condescending he is.

Beating Galactus should be an impressive feat but, considering how much Galactus jobs these days, beating him just isn't what it used to be.

#7 Posted by IncredibleMSJ (46 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc: I agree that that is the case but I think Galactus would be an appropriate character to lose to... He is in the top tier of the marvel universe
#8 Posted by PowerHerc (84031 posts) - - Show Bio

@IncredibleMSJ said:

@PowerHerc: I agree that that is the case but I think Galactus would be an appropriate character to lose to... He is in the top tier of the marvel universe

You're right; if you're gonna lose to someone, it might as well be Galactus.

Still, I'd hate for Odin to start down the path Marvel put Galactus on, you know, where they use him as an opponent/jobber for anyone and everyone when they want to show how powerful he/she is by having him/her beat, stalemate or have a good showing against Galactus. Doing that to Odin would unnecessarily diminish everyone's perception of how powerful Odin really is, much like it has with Galactus.

#9 Posted by seekquaze (612 posts) - - Show Bio
@PowerHerc
I hope your right.  Galactus started out as the great cosmic force, but turned into the guest-star who gets plummled.  Odin has been largely protected to this due to mainly appearing in Thor and being the cosmic hero who fought what no one else could fight.  The moment a god becomes something Captain America can fight against and win they just come across as less godlier as seen in SIEGE where just about everybody and anybody were mowing down Asgardians.
#10 Posted by Ellocobruja (559 posts) - - Show Bio
@seekquaze: But they are not gods. 
 
Odin and the Asgardians are just very powerful extra dimensional beings who live a long time. 
In theory the Average person from Asgard is a no more powerful than a Inhuman, or mutant and less powerful than an Eternal (who are actually more godlike than an Asgradian) 
 
-Abby has spoken
#11 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio
@Ellocobruja:  That would more depend on your definition of what a god is. Marvel for example has a set narrative, that Asgardians are gods. Of course, in what sense? Eh, not a very strict sense. We know in some form they originated from the Earth itself. 
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#12 Posted by SC (13110 posts) - - Show Bio

Me, I think a lot more characters are due for a humbling before Odin. Odin has been humbled plenty of times before, straight up. He has contemporaries as well. Also I definitely don't want Galactus losing anymore, but I do feel many take for granted that the character has been creatively amped and amped over time. I mean, people criticize Superman and Hulk of power amping. This happened with Galactus as well, leaving guys like Odin and the Watcher in his wake. Favoritism doesn't just occur with guys like Spider-Man and Wolverine.  
 
I'd put Thanos as a character that meeds to lose some myself. Only times he has lost its "because he wanted to" it turned out to be a clone, etc etc Too much writer worship. 

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#13 Posted by Boobster (1608 posts) - - Show Bio

I want to see Galactus pummeling Odin to a bloody pulp. In the most brutal way ever.

#14 Posted by PowerHerc (84031 posts) - - Show Bio

@seekquaze said:

@PowerHerc: I hope your right. Galactus started out as the great cosmic force, but turned into the guest-star who gets plummled. Odin has been largely protected to this due to mainly appearing in Thor and being the cosmic hero who fought what no one else could fight. The moment a god becomes something Captain America can fight against and win they just come across as less godlier as seen in SIEGE where just about everybody and anybody were mowing down Asgardians.

Exactly. There is no way the average superhero, let alone normal heroes of any stripe, should ever be able to realisticly go toe-to-toe with gods.

#15 Posted by Thor's hammmer (7184 posts) - - Show Bio

Odin=Dormmamu and>Mephisto having him just get stomped on by Galactus wouldn't be right he should atleast put up a good fight. but I don't want him to win.
#16 Posted by ChadwickDavis (445 posts) - - Show Bio
@SC
 
"Me, I think a lot more characters are due for a humbling before Odin"
 
I agree completely, but before we get the Zeus, Hera, Loki, Sif etc. characters humbled I think  someone needs to put the "mortals" in their place. Tony Stark, Reed Richards, Namor, and Sebastian Shaw just to name a few.   
#17 Posted by Z3RO180 (6549 posts) - - Show Bio
@IncredibleMSJ: I want to know why odin is such a jerk to us mortals cause didnt he ues to love us for the cute little antiqes we get into??@PowerHerc: glatius cant be stronger than odin cause zeus beat him and he is the same power as odin......i might be wrong about zues and odins power level but they are ruffly the same power level.
#18 Posted by IncredibleMSJ (46 posts) - - Show Bio
@Z3RO180: Zeus was amped up by the Chaos king. So really that was a very powerful abstract defeating Galactus through Zeus, not Zeus on his own level. 
#19 Posted by Z3RO180 (6549 posts) - - Show Bio
@IncredibleMSJ: hmm that makes sence
#20 Posted by Thor's hammmer (7184 posts) - - Show Bio

can anyone think of a fight Odin has lost? cause I can only think of 5. 
Odin, Zeus and another Skyfather Humbled by Arishem the Judge.  
Odin after drawing every asgardian present in to the Destroyer and weilding the Odinsword along with the Uni mind made up of every eternal are bested by the fourth host.  
Odin is Defeated by Surtur when Surtur is weilding the twilight sword and the casket of ancient winters.  
Odin gets wooped when He faces A Super amped version of Doctor doom weilding Galactus's power plus a cosmic cube plus a bunch of other powers.  
He must have been defeated by the dark Gods at some time to be imprisoned by them. but I don't think there was ever an on panel fight.
#21 Posted by seekquaze (612 posts) - - Show Bio
@Thor's hammmer said:
can anyone think of a fight Odin has lost? cause I can only think of 5. Odin, Zeus and another Skyfather Humbled by Arishem the Judge.  Odin after drawing every asgardian present in to the Destroyer and weilding the Odinsword along with the Uni mind made up of every eternal are bested by the fourth host.  Odin is Defeated by Surtur when Surtur is weilding the twilight sword and the casket of ancient winters.  Odin gets wooped when He faces A Super amped version of Doctor doom weilding Galactus's power plus a cosmic cube plus a bunch of other powers.  He must have been defeated by the dark Gods at some time to be imprisoned by them. but I don't think there was ever an on panel fight.
Against the Dark Gods Odin was weak from battling Seth.  In a previous battle with Seth Odin had given his Odinforce to Thor, but drew power from the land and was dominating Seth till he got distracted and lost.  Odin lost to Surtur again when Odin had to commit suicide to defeat him.  So, Odin has been defeated a few times.  These are just non-jobbing loses because there either against characters on his level or powered-up beyond his level.  Odin holds victories or close to victories over the likes of Thor, Surfer, Annhilus, Surtur, Ymir and Thanos.  An impressive list.
 
Oh, Vishnu is the third skfyather you are thinking about. 
#22 Posted by Thor's hammmer (7184 posts) - - Show Bio
@seekquaze said:
@Thor's hammmer said:
can anyone think of a fight Odin has lost? cause I can only think of 5. Odin, Zeus and another Skyfather Humbled by Arishem the Judge.  Odin after drawing every asgardian present in to the Destroyer and weilding the Odinsword along with the Uni mind made up of every eternal are bested by the fourth host.  Odin is Defeated by Surtur when Surtur is weilding the twilight sword and the casket of ancient winters.  Odin gets wooped when He faces A Super amped version of Doctor doom weilding Galactus's power plus a cosmic cube plus a bunch of other powers.  He must have been defeated by the dark Gods at some time to be imprisoned by them. but I don't think there was ever an on panel fight.
Against the Dark Gods Odin was weak from battling Seth.  In a previous battle with Seth Odin had given his Odinforce to Thor, but drew power from the land and was dominating Seth till he got distracted and lost.  Odin lost to Surtur again when Odin had to commit suicide to defeat him.  So, Odin has been defeated a few times.  These are just non-jobbing loses because there either against characters on his level or powered-up beyond his level.  Odin holds victories or close to victories over the likes of Thor, Surfer, Annhilus, Surtur, Ymir and Thanos.  An impressive list. Oh, Vishnu is the third skfyather you are thinking about. 

 
Odin did not lose to Seth. Odin got distracted. Seth had an advantage and was abpout to strike but Hogun jumped in to stop Seth. Odin still defeated Seth in the End.  
both Surtut and Odin were dead at the end of that fight. So Odin didn't lose it was a draw both of them died.  
 
and Odin losing to an un-amped Surtur Kinda seems...wrong to me. 
 
Odin has Easily beaten Surtur in the past. and has even gone so far as to Defeat Surtur and banish him simply by willing it to happen.Odin also got the upper hand when Surtur was amped by the Twilight Sword. Surtur then also had yo Tap the Casket of Ancient winters to beat Odin.  
 
So if Odin can Defeat regular Surtur and banish him with a Thought and atleast Match an amped version, he shouldn't be getting beat by a regular version.  
#23 Posted by seekquaze (612 posts) - - Show Bio
@Thor's hammmer
No, Hogun defeated Seth.  He threw the Black Knight, who due to a curse had become an extension of the Ebony Blade, at Seth and it destroyed him.  After Odin is distracted and taken down by Seth he does not get up again until after Seth is defeated.  Surtur and Odin dying at the same time can easily be regarded as a stalemate depending on how you look at it and that would be the most common way.
 
Odin losing to Surtur is not wrong. It is true like you said in the earliest stories Surtur was easily bested by Odin, but back then Odin was pretty much God.  Things have changed since then because it would be boring if Odin had no rivals.  Since at least Simonson's run Surtur has been treated as a rival and equal to Odin.  When Odin became that huge warrior about all he could do was match Surtur's power.  I do admit Odin has superior knowledge of sorcerer and that is what allowed him to gain a temporary advantage over Surtur, but Simonson even had it so back when Odin and his brothers first met Surtur and merged their power they could not gain a victory over him.  That is why Thor with the Odinforce in Defalco's run could only get a temporary victory and admitted Surtur would soon revived to continue a battle and Thor was spent.  In Jurgen's run Surtur was at the very least equal if not superior to Odin. 
#24 Posted by Thor's hammmer (7184 posts) - - Show Bio
@seekquaze said:
@Thor's hammmer:  No, Hogun defeated Seth.  He threw the Black Knight, who due to a curse had become an extension of the Ebony Blade, at Seth and it destroyed him.  After Odin is distracted and taken down by Seth he does not get up again until after Seth is defeated.  Surtur and Odin dying at the same time can easily be regarded as a stalemate depending on how you look at it and that would be the most common way.  Odin losing to Surtur is not wrong. It is true like you said in the earliest stories Surtur was easily bested by Odin, but back then Odin was pretty much God.  Things have changed since then because it would be boring if Odin had no rivals.  Since at least Simonson's run Surtur has been treated as a rival and equal to Odin.  When Odin became that huge warrior about all he could do was match Surtur's power.  I do admit Odin has superior knowledge of sorcerer and that is what allowed him to gain a temporary advantage over Surtur, but Simonson even had it so back when Odin and his brothers first met Surtur and merged their power they could not gain a victory over him.  That is why Thor with the Odinforce in Defalco's run could only get a temporary victory and admitted Surtur would soon revived to continue a battle and Thor was spent.  In Jurgen's run Surtur was at the very least equal if not superior to Odin. 

 
A) Odin was weakend against Seth anyway. but being temporarily knocked over is not a victory for Seth.  
B) i'm not saying it's wrong. i'm just saying it's inconsistent. Classic Odin was much more powerful then Surtur and bested him Just by showing up to the battle! So Surtur later being able to match him, is inconsistent. But marvel's skyfather's have been dumbed down recently. Odin will almost definetly be beaten by Galactus but in the Earlier days Odin was often shown as more powerful.
#25 Posted by seekquaze (612 posts) - - Show Bio
@Thor's hammmer
I admit that is inconsistent with the Silver Age stories, but not for the last thirty years.  I would argue it is even a necessity.  If Odin was truly as powerful as portrayed in the Silver Age the only way Asgard could be threatened is for Odin to enter the Odinsleep over, and over, and over again.  That has has been done enough in comics and other media. Odin has to be given a few foes on his level.  Otherwise whenever Asgard is threatened there no real threat or need for Thor if Odin could just wave his scepter and fix everything. 
#26 Posted by Dracade102 (8167 posts) - - Show Bio

I hope the Serpent gives Odin a beat-down at the end of Fear Itself... But I want Loki to be the one to step in and save the day, or the one to give Odin the final blow. 

#27 Edited by IncredibleMSJ (46 posts) - - Show Bio

(Spoilers Kind of) Okay. Just read Mighty Thor 4. Couldn't be more disappointed in the outcome of the battle thus far although it is to be continued. This could have been the opportunity to put Galactus back in respectable terms of power but instead the writers decided to dilute his power more. He should have more respect in my opinion and not be used simply as a plot tool to showcase how powerful other beings are. I thought it was pretty clear that skyfathers were clearly beneath the cosmics.  AHHH!

#28 Posted by Kallarkz (3303 posts) - - Show Bio
@IncredibleMSJ said:
Okay. Just read Mighty Thor 4. Couldn't be more disappointed in the outcome of the battle thus far although it is to be continued. This could have been the opportunity to put Galactus back in respectable terms of power but instead the writers decided to dilute his power more. He should have more respect in my opinion and not be used simply as a plot tool to showcase how powerful other beings are. I thought it was pretty clear that skyfathers were clearly beneath the cosmics.  AHHH!
They also treated S.S pretty badly in this issue as well.
#29 Posted by MutenRoshi (851 posts) - - Show Bio
#30 Posted by IncredibleMSJ (46 posts) - - Show Bio
@Kallarkz: Yeah for real. I mean this is the same power level surfer who channeled the big crunch. He is a legit bad ass he should not simply just get pounded. Dont get me wrong cause thor is one of my all time favorite characters but I think Surfer should take this. And speaking of Thor did you, or anyone else, find his attitude a little odd in this series?(I sound like a dad)  Usually hes pretty respectful to his enemy and he seemed like some kind of child. Idk, just the talk of "you silver bastard" and things of that nature. Didnt seem too Thor esc. for me. I hope the second half of this battle is a little more realistic. 
#31 Posted by darth_fletcher (262 posts) - - Show Bio

I like the way they have Odin right now !!!
 He's the All-Father and all the other gods should just shut their mouths and do as they are told !!!

#32 Posted by CapitolPunishment (2303 posts) - - Show Bio

@IncredibleMSJ said:

(Spoilers Kind of) Okay. Just read Mighty Thor 4. Couldn't be more disappointed in the outcome of the battle thus far although it is to be continued. This could have been the opportunity to put Galactus back in respectable terms of power but instead the writers decided to dilute his power more. He should have more respect in my opinion and not be used simply as a plot tool to showcase how powerful other beings are. I thought it was pretty clear that skyfathers were clearly beneath the cosmics. AHHH!

Have you read #5 yet?

Galactus put Odin down, Odin is once again in the deep sleep

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