apparently the first credit scene leaked from thor 2 via video. i posted about it and the rate there going seems interesting as has weight to what we are discussing :)

After a while wouldn't banner/hulk have a harder time getting mad about things (build up a resistance to the things that bug them) to where it would take more and more each time to piss him off? At some time (being human) wouldn't he just get over it? so in the end shouldn't his power dwindle the more he hulks out?

Interestingly Thanos did compare Champion with The Power Gem to The Hulk when they fought.

i have this sudden urge to write a fanfic now involving marvel and dc fighting over the gaunlet.............................

Hulk would rip the man of steel in two like paper.....then eat him and sh*t him out in the phantom zone...just for fun, seriously the best thing for Supes to do would be to just walk away and let the beast calm down.

@gungunw: Hulk fans will say anything to make him out to be superior to Supes. I love the Hulk, but even I roll my eyes at times when people talk about him.

@tazzmission: Or at the very least possessed the Power Gem. Did you see what it did for Titania and Jen Walters?

He's (potentially) about as close as a non-abstract Marvel character can be.

I dont see how you can put a limit on emotion..

I prefer to think of the Hulk's power like throwing stones in a pond. Each stone equates to a stimuli that would anger the hulk. As you continue to throw stones in the pond, the ripples in it will become larger and larger. As he angers and calms and then angers again, his new strength builds on top of his prior strength and therefore could allow him to become "Theoretically" Infinitely strong. The problem then lies in the stimuli, not his capacity to become strong, for there is only so much that can physically happen that will push him to need to become "Infinitely strong."

Well it's how the brain works. There's only so much anger a person can feel.

As for the person who asked if Hulk can ever be killed. Yeah, he has actually died a few times. Always brought back though (obviously) and usually in the issue it happened (so they're not well known unless you read that specific comic).

@devilsmaydie: To a living breathing human brain perhaps. I need some specifics here not just 'how it works' hahaha.

@thereckoningday23: Something gets you mad. Then things start piling up and you get madder, then it gradually starts having less and less of an impact until it stops altogether. Say someone spits in your eye, then someone steps on your foot, embarrasses you, betrays your trust, breaks your heart, then you lose the people you love, someone tries to kill you, etc etc... Okay, now, what can make you madder from there? Eventually you will reach your breaking point. Once you get to the end of the little list of events I made someone calling you a name will do nothing to your state of mind.

In the comic world they haven't discredited this so you can't really just assume they're throwing it away. Maybe one day they will come out and say they're going by a fantasy set of rules for the mind regarding this sort of thing but until then this is pretty much what we have to go by. In the world of comics numbers and infinites are a writers hearty hyperbole breakfast.

You may not experience the end (don't know how mad you can get), in which case worst is relative. But not experiencing the limit doesn't mean there isn't one.

I don't know about being infinitelystrong because as some people have said, it's either he gets put down before that point, or he badly injures/borderline murders his adversary. It's just one of those what ifs you'd have to wait and see, or live the rest of your life speculating about.

@devilsmaydie: the problem with your comment is that everyone handles situations differently, in the comic book world this is also true. For example if a person continuously spits in another person's eye who's to say that the person with spit in their eye wants to ya know, "unlife"(deadpool) the person who spit. In some cases people have gone into blindrages without knowing. Now back to Hulk it has been done time and time again that the Hulk has been in these blindrages for long periods of time and hasn't stopped until he was exhausted, and now he pretty much doesn't need to rest so those blindrages can go on forever, but they don't. It has also been proven that Hulk expereinces pile-up effects, small stressors(stress) that buildup and anger the Hulk, for example the Hulk vs DP, Wade will 9/10 lose to the Hulk easily, but thats only because DP is the fly in Hulk's face that he can't swat unless he gets lucky or uses his brain a bit. So, after this sorta long post, Hulk has the capacity for infinite anger, and like someone stated before me "HULK IS THE STRONGEST THERE IS!" And thats a motto that he'll live and die by, its something that'll just piss him off even more if someone is beating him.

@ohnos: That doesn't actually prove there's no limit to how angry he can be. In slugfests wouldn't he just get madder and madder with each hit, and the affect of each hit done would be less and less to him? If that's generally how his rage worked then he wouldn't be knocked out in those fights, but he has been. He has even overloaded himself after a certain level of exertion. His rage doesn't constantly grow like that because that's not how emotions work (and emotion is what feeds his power). There was one fight with Thor ended in a standstill that lasted an hour. At some point his rage stopped increasing, the reason would be the things I mentioned earlier. He wasn't just constantly growing stronger to where he can overcome the opposing force. If what you said is true and that he'd just get more pissed if someone is beating him than this wouldn't happen, but it does. I'm not saying he couldn't get madder than the state he was in there but he wouldn't have gotten there from that situation alone.

But you seem to be saying something different and if what your saying is that there's no limit to how long he can be in a blind rage, that might arguably be true, but not for there being no limit on how intense those rages can grow. For all the Hulk is, he's still human, or at least tied to a human. Banner serves as a limit because emotional state sets these limits; "Hulk mad, Hulk getting madder" but then it's like "Hulk not seem to get any madder at you." The madder Banner gets the more of "Hulk" gets unleashed. Hulk is rage personified. Once in a Hulk comic that personality of Banner was actually destroyed and all that remained was the rage of the Hulk. Though the Hulk was slowly dying without Banner he was at his most powerful (screw certain modern interpretations with disregard to continuity by saying otherwise, this was intended to be his potential. But even humoring the idea that he could get madder than that it doesn't mean there's no limit, would only suggest it hadn't been reached yet). All the rage was there, no crisis or beating required to tape into it, nothing holding it back. But even then it wasn't infinite.

People can only take so much, I can only feel so mad at something, my rage can only go so far. We may think there are no bounds but it's simply not true. We reach our breaking point for how much of the anger we can have and of that anger we can take.

@devilsmaydie: well, you just proved something I'm going to put on this post, Hulk is not human, he is humanoid in looks but as you said he is just anger personified, Banner is the human, Banner is the emotional limit. If we only talk about Anger in human form (Hulk) then we are not talking about a human at all, Hulk is just a big bundle of gamma radiation that copied a Dr. Jeckle and Mr. Hyde story. Hulk, anger, is limitless in strength and anger/hatred as time passes. And about your slugfest point, its Banner who controls the Hulk, he turned anger into his slave pretty much, and since he controls his anger then he controls the limits and boundaries. Hulk without a host is like Godzilla in his meltdown stage.

There is no such thing as infinite anger..

There comes a point when you drop of the "wrathful lane" into the "depressing/frustrating lane".

If he somehow breaches that point, it would definitely result him an advanced kind of insanity.

Just saying.

@gibbet: This is what I say to people all the time.If Hulk and Superman were in a arm wrestling competition he would stand no chance.He would just lose when he transform into hulk his base strength is not that high.He has to get angry all the time.

@ohnos: But I also said Hulk shown in his purest form didn't show limitless strength (nor could it survive indefinitely without Banner), he fought with Thor for hours and didn't overpower him. And Banner has control over the Hulk but that's not the same as control over the limits of his rage (he can, eventually, turn into him at will and keep his control and humanity but he's not in direct control of his strength levels in a sense that its a dial he can just turn up). If he controls his limits then does that mean he decides to lose the fights he gets beat? Your point was that each hit makes him angrier and with each passing moment he gets stronger. But it's been shown many times not the case. If hit number one isn't enough to KO base strength Hulk then hit number 126 (or whatever, that number is just a placeholder) shouldn't be able to KO him, but as shown, it can.

I don't know if you see it but the thing you did in your post was admit that Banner limits the Hulk, because he's human (humans have emotional limits), and without Banner the Hulk can't exist. So there you go, even if that Hulk existing as it own entity had no limits (which is unfounded and contrary to his feats) to his strength this here has established the the limit.

@blayze365: Or it completely breaks the mind.

@devilsmaydie: wrong man, but also right (about one thing). Banner controls the Hulk, not full control, Hulk does fight back since they're two entities sharing the same body, so Banner can not turn down or raise Hulk's power like a dial, because its not that easy, imagine that the dial is-for the sake of proving a point xD- possessed by a ghost or demons, whatever, and every time you try to turn it it'll fight back but in the end you win most of the struggles while that demon/ghost wins only the some, now we bring this into Banner and Hulk with Banner being you and the Hulk being the possessed dial, Banner can calm down the Hulk causing him to go back to his base strength (as seen when the Hulk sees Betty) then reverting to Banner himself, but if Banner needs the Hulk's brute stength he can slowly unleash the Hulk, letting loose some or all of Hulk. So Banner is the limiter, yes I did say that, Banner is the weakness to Hulk as Hulk is the weakness to Banner, to clarify: Hulk wants to be let loose and can only be killed when Banner is out, while Banner has tried to end his suffering a lot and can never be killed when Hulk is out. Oh and in the comic book universe and real life, a dying raging monster will always be weaker than a healthy raging monster, so saying that a dying Hulk in his pure form is considered his limit in anger/strength is like saying a dying rampaging bull is at its full strength...which doesn't make sense at all when compared to a healthy rampaging bull, with LOTS more energy to spend.

Aahh.. but you see..

that hotheaded healthy bull won't keep growing angry, it'll eventually let up...

SIMPLY put..

Hulk will eventually get depressed and his strength would start shrinking..

@ohnos: Wrong. You do know the Hulk has died in comics before, right? And nearly died many times.

Oh andHulk wasn't losing any power without Banner in him, it was quite the opposite. You took him dying the wrong way, he wasn't unhealthy. He can never reach his potential with Banner in him but without him he was becoming too much. Basically reaching a level that would snuff itself out in the end. Which is why Silver Surfer tried draining him of gamma (like he did before) but without Banner to turn back into it was in a way killing him.

Hulk Strongest there is , would match any strength & surpass it like an infinite stream from another dimension , maybe thats why hulk can track down the infinity gem , Cube signature vibes naturally . Hulk VS Superman , i say Hulk smashes superman like a puny human , Superman is just a vulcan alien that for some corky reason he absorbs our suns energy ..but yet doesn't tan . Hulk is one giant living kryptonite for Superman , being that kyrptonite is the sum of the energy attached to planet debri created from his home planet being blown up, Banner got the Hulk Fusion thru Gamma Explosion ...... u get it ???

Riiight.....

Hulk without bruce banner would be fierce and go further beyond the line but also would eventually reach his limit and even faster without a "limiter"...

Never said anything about him dying..

From that point he would start getting weak, tired and might even revert to banner.

*If there was any way possible for him to get stronger it would be when he gets angry at himself for being angry in the first place*

..psche can be a funny thing..

@devilsmaydie: Dying is dying, you pretty much said that the Hulk is like a dying star with the final build up and explosion, but I also stated that a living Hulk can keep up the anger for much longer if Banner allows him to or if the Hulk fights Banner for control, which he has pulled off a few times. Oh and the comics that Hulk died in, were they canon?

And all Marvel comics made it obvious that without Banner or some source keeping him controlled that the Hulk would die or be completely brain dead.

@ohnos: Yes dying is dying, but the point I was making is that Bannerless Hulk was simply stronger than he was or can be with Banner. So Hulk as he normally is has that limitation. Hulk without him has a different one.

Hulk is not infinite in either way. Either his strength increases to the point that its too much for him, leading to his death (these are levels the human element keeps him from reaching). Or even with Banner, while he may be able to keep transformed he can't keep to those high levels. Because, like Blayze and others have said, either he reaches a point where he can't get any madder (so his strength would inherently reach a peak), he burns out (overdoes the emotional strain, which has happened), or he just eventually stops being angry at whatever was the cause for the transformation.

So if you're making the argument that he can be strong for an infinite amount of time, that might be true. After all he has been Hulk for extended periods of time with no real effort, but for that he's base Hulk, with maybe some spurts of added rage, til he returns to normal Hulk. So in that sense he might be infinitely strong (as the Hulk is always strong). But I don't think that's the question posed in this thread. Even you've used the term "much longer," that's not the same as infinite, so that point is theoretical but I'll give it to you. Now as for growing infinitely stronger, some rash character statements made aside, it's been shown not the case. And hopefully it's been explained well enough (it's kind of hard for me to find the right words to use, so for that I apologize).

As for his deaths, off the top of my head he has died in Defenders Go Demonic (but was revived) and he was also killed by Thor (but time was reversed), there are a few other times but I can't remember them all that well, Cable was one of them I believe, as was Abomination. But yeah, they're canon. He's died in noncanon books too but those are usually pretty stupid deaths.

@devilsmaydie: I agree with you on the noncanon deaths of the Hulk, they are pretty...out there or plain simple to the point that you think thats not the real Hulk at all. But on the infinite strength, its never been really explained, theres always hints and limits writers will put on the Hulk. Marvel hasn't really put out a limit on Hulk's strength, they do put out that if a character can kill him in just the right amount of time, you're not totally screwed. Hell, Wolverine could kill the Hulk if he went in for quick decisive blows and never let up to catch his own breath.

Listen to Peter David ;

''Hulk has no upper limit on his strength...''

@gungunw: Hard to gauge since Supes is always as conveniently strong or weak as he needs to be.

i think the hulk is infinitely strong. because he gets stronger when he gets angrier. one time he even lift mjolnir. (dont know wich issue) and he can adapt to every circumstances. because it is reveald that when in space or under water or were ever his skin gets thick. his internal organs are also diffrent than that of humans.

I think you guys are approaching the question the wrong way. It might be better to ask exactly what "infinitely strong" means. It means that hulk could have the power to lift a billion billion trillion gogillion suns....and more. It means that potentially hulk has access to unlimited energy. How is hulk absorbing and converting this energy? From his surroundings? It would mean anything he standing next to would be obliterated. If he is getting it from another dimension that dimension would also be obliterated too.

Infinite strength means infinite energy, which in turn means that we can assuredly rule out that the universe is finite. If he hulk has infinite strength then the universe must be infinite too. All the mass in our universe is believed to be finite therefore another dimension MUST exist OR there an infinite number of dimensions. This is something string theorists have suggested. Cleaery studying the hulk can teach us much about string theory.

The universe and everything in it is finite , yes the hulk has unlimited strength but eventually his strength is finite not infinite because, that would be illogical that being said it would take a long time for it to be finite, it is ddefinitely not infinite everything with begining eventually ends at some point no matter how you look at it.

Well tbh

"Beyonder once analyzed the Hulk's physiology, and claimed that the Hulk's potential strength had "no finite element inside."... So yea

@incarnum11: That statement from beyonder is illogical from a physics point, everything in the universe no matter how big or how long has a finite state at which that matter cannot advance foward heck even space and time eventually come to an end

So who is hulk to defy the laws that govern our very existence

Been watching and reading this stuff my entire life, You forget their not bound to the laws of reality. Impossible becomes possible without warning. however the best way to look at this is how do we view finite in the marvel universe? Even if we go head and state that the marvel universe is finite that's not quite stable. For example lets say that the marvel universe has a power limitation of 10 which happens to be the bad guys power limitation, the hulk must now become an 11 to defeat him therefore the level of finite is raised to accommodate the new power. In turn a stronger enemy must come... rinse repeat rinse repeat. While he may not be infinitely strong he will be as strong as he can be, his strength will never be limited because the state of the universe will change to accommodate it. So is the hulks power infinite, in my opinion its more of a perspective based on an ever changing universe.

On another note the idea of a beginning and end of space and time is nothing more then a theory, of the two big options the begining and end are only one side. There is still the theory that existence has always been. Even Stephen Hawking admits "We are not yet certain whether the universe will have an end". The universe is ether finite or infinite and without being able to generate more then a theory we cannot determine whether or not our universe let alone a fictional universe has a beginning or an end. Therefor if marvel universe is a finite universe then hulk will have the strength he needs, and if the marvel universe is a infinite universe then hulk potentially has infinite strength.

@incarnum11:

oh yes. the marvel universe........................................................................

the only universe where reality is distorted to accommodate one mans selfish anger and needs.

Yes.

So hulks strength is directly related to the size of the universe. All we have to do is determine exactly how and why the universe began, how many dimensions there are, find a unified theory of physics, and we can put this mystery to rest.

No, but he has the capacity to grow infinitely, as claimed by some brainy scientists in Marvel.

Has anybody ever concidered that since most are saying Hulk has a cap to his power due to the fact that theres only so much rage he can poses which means theres only so much power he can out put which then renders him more human than mutant meaning that even in his strongest form shown thus far hes only ever used 10% of his strength only difference is he was able to grow in strength while still out putting only 10% of his new found strength like a body builder which then means he just needs to be triggered into using all his strength and learning from that thus ablung him to become more powerful and sustaining that new level as a new base strength but the trigger would have to be something different other than anger. Example the movie lucy she as a human can only get so mad regardless of how much she improves on herself but thanks to an injection she was able to overcome her 10% out put of abilities granting her great power. If something similar happened to Hulk like another freak expirement gone wrong it could cause something in his mind to snap like its never snapped before giving him true limitless power

Well the Hulk has done many impossible things with just physical force. He has even punched large holes in space and time, and had a clash so powerful that it rang out and caused untold destruction in infinite universes. The second one seems to imply nigh infinite power. At minimum he fist has held over 100,000 times the amount of earths energy production and been far more intense than the center of a star. (Stephen hawking and others currently trying to rip space time apart said thats how much power they think it will take) and thats for a tiny hole. His holes where like a million times as big as the ones Stephen hawking and them are try to make. His limits are so insane most would call it unlimited or infinite.

The beyonder and celestials have called his potential for strength infinite. And thanos said fighting champion with the power crystal is like fighting the hulk something he has actively tried to avaoid.

I dont understand why people limit the hulks anger? He isnt human and I have never seen him say hulk not getting angrier. He always gets angrier. Its like an additional super power. And his strength increases with other emotional stressors besides anger anyways. He should keep getting angrier through a fight to win yes and this usually happens. When thor beats him remember Thor likes to hold back. Even against hulk. I think what happens is eventual through the fight thor gets pissed off and finally starts hitting the hulk as hard as he can. He likes fighting the hulk. He loves matching brawn with him. The hulk has unlimited strength. It is a plot device, his character, and his entire reason for being in the marvel universe. Accept and enjoy or despise it. I personally dont like him all that much.

Yes, the beyonder has said he has not finite element inside of him. He can get to infinite levels as Hercules protested once.

guys marvel vs dc will help with this think about it they are in the same omniverse wich means that this could happen. The red lantern ring gives the wearer infnite rage and the hulk would be unbeatable with it. But with what weve seen in the marvel world he doesnt need it because im talking savage hulk where he is only pure rage not little smart hulk in the newer series who is so weak compared to savage because the only thing savage hulk feels is rage henceforth i tell you he has unlimited rage causing him to be the strongest. Of course that doesnt mean he's used all of his strength. no if he wants to he would have to go through something to unlock it all. like in world war hulk if hulk had won the what if the earth was tooken over by skrulls the world destroyed by galactus at the request of hulk. If it was savage hulk and he remembered every thing that happened. he would destroy the universes greates people he could destroy anyone galactus beyonder death with the infinity gauntlet. Hed be that pissed

Short answer yes.

Hulk An Infinity of Power. Secret Wars 4

The Beyonder calls out Hulk, Hulk attacks. Beyonder states

"You are nothing but raging power personified! An infinity of power with no finite element inside!"

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Hulk Boundless Power and Rage. Incredible Hulk 198

"His rage and his power are boundless"

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