magnetos children

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#1 Posted by Banshee bitch (88 posts) - - Show Bio

i think someone should make another little part for all his kids and people who claim to be his like that zaradean girl? i would but dont know how to

#2 Posted by Shatterstar (4522 posts) - - Show Bio
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#3 Posted by The_Martian (36980 posts) - - Show Bio

Doesn't he only have two or am I missing a few?

#4 Posted by Shatterstar (4522 posts) - - Show Bio

There's the dead one, the crazy alleged savage land one Zaladane, Polaris I guess, Wanda & Pietro. Then there's AoA baby Charles, i'm sure there's others.

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#5 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Shatterstar says:

"All that should be put here
" />http://www.comicvine.com/magneto/1441/friends/"

Yeah, all the kids are listed there.

Anya, who died in the fire when she was four or five.

Pietro and Wanda

Polaris (though that one is on pretty shaky grounds and I wouldn't be surprised if it was retconned back out)

And possibly Zaladane (though that one is on even shakier grounds than Lorna is)

In alternate realities we have AoA Charles and Magnus from Exiles.

Luna, Wiccan, Speed and Nocturne are also listed as grandchildren. (Or potential grandchildren in Wiccan and Speed's case).
Post Edited:2007-11-29 01:45:35

#6 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Polaris certainly is his kid, Zaladane according to Joe Q was lying about being Lorna's sister.

#7 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Like Marvel has never retconned a backstory in their extistance. rolls eyes

Why don't you go ask Spider Man fans what Marvel is doing right now?

The "blind genetic test" was not only weak in circumstance (just how did she managed to walk into Magneto private medical facility when she had been declared an enemy of the state? And just how did Magneto know of the test results in advance to announce them to the adoring Genoshan public?) but it was also weak scientifically, as she would have had to run tests against her adoptive family as she was related to them as well.

Then there is the matter of the entire situation Austin set up.

To fit into Austin's scenario it would have to be out of character. You remember that Lorna went and investigated the plane crash that killed her parents...and found out that the pieces of debris were highly magnetized. Austin seems to be implying that Magneto not only had an adulterous affair with a woman (as she was married to the man everyone has assumed to be Lorna's father), but that he killed Lorna's mother and her husband.

I really can't see Magneto doing that. Deep down Magneto is very traditional (and chauvanist), especially when it comes to women. Part of that is he takes marriage very seriously. While he's shown himself to be a red blooded male, but I doubt he would ever sleep with married woman that was not married to him. Two, having lost one daughter to tragedy, why did he not claim Lorna as his own on the spot? The instant he found out the twins were his, he ran off to tell them, despite everything he had put them through and their feelings toward him. Why didn't he try to do the same with Lorna? Three, kill the mother of his child? I don't think so. Magda abandoned him after Anya's death and he still carried a torch for year 30 years later, still regretted her leaving, still mourned her...while he almost assuredly would not have loved Lorna's mother as he did Magda, I don't see him murdering the mother of his kid. What I see as more likely is that he would have tried to create a family with this woman and if she refused, he would have watched over them in secret.

So somehow, he would have had to have an adulterous affair, not known the woman bore his child, and then for some random reason killed the woman and her husband, never knowing Lorna was his...but then when Lorna stole the tissue sample from his lab (which how she just walked into his private medical facility and stole a blood sample is anyone's guess...unless of course Magneto meant for her to), Magneto seemed to know the results of the test ahead of time to announce it to the adoring public of Genosha...

ugh.

Compare all that to: "Magneto lied in order to regain her loyalty so she would cover for him (as she did when he was powerless before) after he was paralyzed during Eve of Destruction."

Occam's razor: The explanation that requires the least leaps of logic is the most likely to be true.
Post Edited:2008-01-10 18:55:06

#8 Posted by Mighty Magneto (13027 posts) - - Show Bio

Come my children

#9 Posted by Hagane Enna (7450 posts) - - Show Bio

Mighty Magneto says:

"Come my children"

I've got Pietro. We pushed that wife of his off the cliff a while ago.

#10 Posted by Mighty Magneto (13027 posts) - - Show Bio

Hagane Enna says:

"Mighty Magneto says:
"Come my children"

I've got Pietro. We pushed that wife of his off the cliff a while ago."

We or just you

#11 Posted by Hagane Enna (7450 posts) - - Show Bio

Mighty Magneto says:

"Hagane Enna says:
"Mighty Magneto says:
"Come my children"

I've got Pietro. We pushed that wife of his off the cliff a while ago."

We or just you"

Hey, he didn't stop me :-P

#12 Posted by Mighty Magneto (13027 posts) - - Show Bio

Hagane Enna says:

"Mighty Magneto says:
"Hagane Enna says:
"Mighty Magneto says:
"Come my children"

I've got Pietro. We pushed that wife of his off the cliff a while ago."

We or just you"

Hey, he didn't stop me :-P"

She was no good for him anyways

#13 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

*Compare all that to: "Magneto lied in order to regain her loyalty so she would cover for him (as she did when he was powerless before)

She was already helping him maintain order after his spine was cut, that is why she was in his throne room in the first place. And, your idea that Magneto could have known ahead of time that Lorna was going to take some of his DNA is a joke.

That is not to say the story is possibly retconnable anything in Marvel can be retconned, but if it was true Magneto lied to her why the hell would he have not told Xavier in the months they said together. He didn't need nor want her loyality anymore, so why? The answer is you are wrong. Marvel isn't going to make Magneto look like a super a$$hole with his big film coming up. And, they aren't going to make themselves look like fools for promoting her as the daughter of Magneto only to say several years later we were just kidding.

#14 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

#15 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Weren't you the one that said in another thread that alternate timelines/universes (such as AoA) don't count?

"First off that was AU. Everything from Magneto meeting Xavier onword was changed."

Can't have it both ways. Sorry.

#16 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

I said that in AoA Magneto never gave over his DNA to Dark Beast so they would have had to have gotten it from a government bank, which Magneto would have had great reason to make sure didn't have his real blood sample to avoid the government or someone else trying to clone him. The other possibility is they found a hair or other bodily fluid they think is Magneto's, but that certainly is not reliable either.

My personal opinion is alternate universes matter alot. What are the chances Magneto would have a child named Lorna Dane with the same powers as 616 Lorna and the same personality as Lorna? The chances are beyond infinitesimal. And, times that by Lorna being his daughter in at least 5 different realities and it is pretty clear what the answer is.

I didn't even include the realities where it was strongly implied, but not stated for certain she was his daughter

#17 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

jmc247 says:

"*Compare all that to: "Magneto lied in order to regain her loyalty so she would cover for him (as she did when he was powerless before)She was already helping him maintain order after his spine was cut, that is why she was in his throne room in the first place. And, your idea that Magneto could have known ahead of time that Lorna was going to take some of his DNA is a joke.

And just how did she come to be helping him when she had been declared an enemy of the state (other than Chuck Austin's crappy writing)? And you still have not explained how Magneto knew about and announced the test results in advance...

...unless he planned the entire thing.

That is not to say the story is possibly retconnable anything in Marvel can be retconned, but if it was true Magneto lied to her why the hell would he have not told Xavier in the months they said together.

Why the heck did Charles never ask? Why has Magneto never said a single word about it? Ever.

Hrm....

What is more likely? Magneto would not discuss that fact that he has another child with his best friend, or Magneto would not discuss that fact that he shamelessly, hurtfully, manipulated one of his best friend's students?

Hrm.

He didn't need nor want her loyality anymore, so why?

Uhm...wait, first you say she was already there helping him because of his parallyzation...then you say he didn't need her loyalty? Make up your mind.

The answer is you are wrong. Marvel isn't going to make Magneto look like a super a$$hole with his big film coming up. And, they aren't going to make themselves look like fools for promoting her as the daughter of Magneto only to say several years later we were just kidding."

Guess what? You can retreat into your little "Lehnsherr family incest fetish" all you like, but there are truths in this world:

  1. Marvel can retcon anything they want. If you don't think they have a problem looking like fools, just look at the Spider Man "Clone Saga" or what is happening with Spider Man now. How about "Xorneto"...don't you think they looked rather foolish then? And how long was it between the the single most important and well written storyline in the X-Men, Dark Phoenix saga, and it's retcon that it was never Jean Grey to begin with? Ten years?

  2. Making Lorna Magneto's daughter was extremely detrimental to her character (shoving her back to the 1960's) and hasn't done a darn thing for his. Hence the reason that so many fans feel either ambivalent about it or think it was a stupid idea.

  3. David Goyer sucks as a director (just check out the rating of all the films directed on rottentomatoes.com or IMDB) and from the script rumors that have been hitting the net, he thinks he's re-filming "Hannibal Rising".

#18 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

OH...now your bringing in the Ultimate universe to try and back up your point?

Your getting desperate. It has not been established that Lorna is his daughter in the Ultimate universe.

#19 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Hahahahaha, I knew it was you Kat, inspite of your username. Your attacks on Goyer gave it away.

You hate the idea of her as his daughter I feel the opposite. Live with it.

#20 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

jmc247 says:

"Hahahahaha, I knew it was you Kat, inspite of your username. Your attacks on Goyer gave it away.

Well, duh it's in my profile.

You hate the idea of her as his daughter I feel the opposite. Live with it."

And you have serious issues with this topic.

#21 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84610 posts) - - Show Bio

I like Polaris as Magneto's daughter.

They may in fact retcon that part of both, there histories. But as it stands now, Marvel considers Polaris his daughter.

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#22 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

"OH...now your bringing in the Ultimate universe to try and back up your point? Your getting desperate. It has not been established that Lorna is his daughter in the Ultimate universe. "

I just included that for AU where it was hinted at, but not stated it either way and that was true in both the Ultimate Universe and in the alternate universe in Uncanny 378.

You can't argue that repeatly calling Lorna my child in the Ultimate universe wasn't the writer doing a certain level of hinting.

#23 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

<blockquote.And you have serious issues with this topic. "

Coming from the one person on the internet who follows me onto different boards to debate the point. And, every time Lorna is brought up brings up that you don't want her to be his daughter.

Look into the bloody mirror.

#24 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

"Magneto called her "his child" while manipulting her is not even implication. Or are you going to try to link everyone Magneto has called "my child" to his genetic line? Because that would include many of the Acolytes. P.S. You forgot to put in that scan a short while later when he hits her with a chair and calls her a fat cow. "

And you forgot to include that he shot Pietro in the kneecaps.

#25 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

And you have serious issues with this topic.

Look into the mirror, every time Lorna is talked about you bring up that you don't want her to be his daughter. And, I know you well enough to know why you feel that way. Because, you think it damages Magneto's backstory, which is what you really care about and I care about as well.

But, it only damages his backstory if the blanks are filled in by a bad writer.

#26 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Magneto called her "his child" while manipulting her is not even implication. Or are you going to try to link everyone Magneto has called "my child" to his genetic line? Because that would include many of the Acolytes.

P.S. You forgot to put in that scan a short while later when he hits her with a chair and calls her a fat cow.

#27 Posted by weather witch (3188 posts) - - Show Bio

all i kno is magneto was a wh@re big time!!!! he got around

#28 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

jmc247 says:

"Pania says:"

Excuse me...?

Gee, who had been a member of scans daily for a year before you showed up and starting posting a bunch of incest crap about Magneto and his family. And then proceeded to lie on the CBR forums about what people were saying on scans-daily about Lorna being Magneto's daughter?

Who's little buddy followed me onto the Marvel Boards months ago to tell me what a horrible person I was for not thinking that Lorna was Magneto's daughter?

Who has been a member here for months before you showed up and jumped into the Magneto thread to argue with me?

Try again.

#29 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

weather witch says:

"all i kno is magneto was a wh@re big time!!!! he got around"

Meh...moderate. Five or six women that we know about in 60 years. Pretty tame really. Nothing compared to Tony Stark's track record.

#30 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

You are so scared to death of the notion of a writer messing with Magneto's backstory that you sent off a long letter to Marvel. You are also scared to death of Carey a great writer messing with Magneto's backstory. That is what you really care about, Magneto's backstory. You fear writers will screw with it. But, I am willing to take the chance on Goyer and Carey and if they dissapoint then fine, I will be pissed. But, if they do a good job then it will be more then worth it.
Post Edited:2008-01-11 14:10:57

#31 Posted by weather witch (3188 posts) - - Show Bio

ooo r u two rivals of some kind...LOL well im gettin entertained :)

#32 Posted by weather witch (3188 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

"weather witch says:
"all i kno is magneto was a wh@re big time!!!! he got around"
Meh...moderate. Five or six women that we know about in 60 years. Pretty tame really. Nothing compared to Tony Stark's track record. "

ok maybe not a wh@re but he sure got unlucky in the "protection" catagory!!! lol

#33 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

jmc247 says:

"Pania says:

>And you have serious issues with this topic.

Look into the mirror, every time Lorna is talked about you bring up that you don't want her to be his daughter.

Only when the discussion is abouther being his daughter. Beyond that, I would love for PAD to take her back and write her as a strong female character again.

And, I know you well enough to know why you feel that way. Because, you think it damages Magneto's backstory, which is what you really care about and I care about as well.

No, you don't. Because you said, and I quote, "No one cares about what Magneto's childhood was like." That you considered Polaris to be "Magneto greatest mystery" when we don't even know the man's real name. All you care about is Polaris and the fact that Magneto may have slept with her. You just want some crappy writer come in and give you a Harlequin romance involving Magneto and Polaris' mother, which from the situation Austin set up, is simply not possible.

The fact is we already went through "Polaris is Magneto's daughter...No, she's not" back in the 1960's. Austin retconned a retcon. It was stupid and did nothing for either of them as a character except to give Polaris even less self-identity than she had before.

But, it only damages his backstory if the blanks are filled in by a bad writer."

Which Chuck Austin is.


Post Edited:2008-01-11 16:13:29

#34 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

jmc247 says:

"You are so scared to death of the notion of a writer messing with Magneto's backstory that you sent off a long letter to Marvel. You are also scared to death of Carey a great writer messing with Magneto's backstory. That is what you really care about, Magneto's backstory. You fear writers will screw with it. But, I am willing to take the chance on Goyer and Carey and if they dissapoint then fine, I will be pissed. But, if they do a good job then it will be more then worth it.
Post Edited:2008-01-11 14:10:57"

Actually, that letter (I don't know where you got the idea that is was "long") was sent when Carey decided that Magneto was "peripheral to the entire Messiah CompleX schema". I protested that that did not make any sense.

I sent a second letter to Marvel studios protesting the choices Goyer was making with the script in that he was selling the character short by turning him into a two dimensional villain with nothing but hate and revenge motivating him, cheapening the film to be nothing more than an excuse for special effects when a lot more "good buzz", and therefore money, could be made if they took the character seriously.

#35 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84610 posts) - - Show Bio

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#36 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Gambler says:

""

Ahem didn't you cut off the "Your" as in "Your father says..."

#37 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

Which Chuck Austin is. "
Chuck Austen didn't really fill in the blanks all that well, he left the story wide open. He could have shown Magneto killing Lorna's mother or done alot of ugly crap. Instead the door was left intentionally or otherwise open enough so that Lorna's mother might not even be dead today. Thus, I will perfectly admit the whole thing will be a roll of the dice. You could get a crap Morrison type writer that fills in his back story and makes him into an adulterous killer. And, you could get the next Claremont that improves his backstory greatly. I am willing to take the risk. That is my last comment on the issue on this thread.
Post Edited:2008-01-11 14:27:49
#38 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Let me scan and post the entire image. Hold on.

#39 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84610 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

"Gambler says:
""

Ahem didn't you cut off the "Your" as in "Your father says...""

I didn't cut it, to be honest I didn't even notice. So who saying that then?

Moderator
#40 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

She said your father

#41 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio
#42 Posted by jmc247 (122 posts) - - Show Bio

The last time she talked about Mags was to Val Cooper. Nothing in the whole X-Men in space arc, which isn't that unexpected.

#43 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

jmc247 says:

"The last time she talked about Mags was to Val Cooper. Nothing in the whole X-Men in space arc, which isn't that unexpected.
" />http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f132/jmc247/PolarisMags102.jpg"

So she believed the potential lie Magneto's was her father, so what. We've seen that before.

#44 Posted by fesak (7031 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't understand why you're arguing. The Marvel Handbooks says Magneto is her father. What's to argue?

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#45 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84610 posts) - - Show Bio

Thank you kindly. You wouldn't by chance have any scans from Uncanny X-Men #431? I believe that would answer some questions.

Moderator
#46 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

fesak says:

"I don't understand why you're arguing. The Marvel Handbooks says Magneto is her father. What's to argue?"

Because this is the stetcon of a retcon that took place back in the 1960's and it's based on a very weak premise set up by Chuck Austin. I acknowledge that at this time, she is considered his daughter.

But Magneto has never spoken about this, at all. We have no idea of the circumstances of her conception. The gate is wide open for it to be yanked back out.

That's all I am saying.

All I have said was that the premise was weak and easily retconable (for a second time). Whenever I say that, wherever I say it, jmc swoops in posts a ton of scans and throws a fit that she is his daughter and (this is the point where it gets incredulous) Marvel would never retcon something like that....

Do I like the idea that she is his daughter? At first I was ambivalent about it, it certainly didn't do anything for her as a character but I could see where it would work as well as see the flaws. But with JMC and co. constantly hammering at me about it while constantly asserting that Magneto may have slept with his own daughter (on other boards) while cutting images to fit their theories, going so far as to erase posts of anyone that didn't agree with them, and then finally lying about what people on one board were saying about the topic...

My patience frayed. I'm pretty much dead set against it now.
Post Edited:2008-01-11 15:02:48

#47 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Gambler says:

"Thank you kindly. You wouldn't by chance have any scans from Uncanny X-Men #431? I believe that would answer some questions."

Unfortunately, #431 I have on the "40 years of the X-Men DVD". I haven't figured out how to circumvent the copyright protection on it yet. If someone could tell me how, I can throw them up for you.

What would you like to know?

#48 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84610 posts) - - Show Bio

Pania says:

"Gambler says:
"Thank you kindly. You wouldn't by chance have any scans from Uncanny X-Men #431? I believe that would answer some questions."

Unfortunately, #431 I have on the "40 years of the X-Men DVD". I haven't figured out how to circumvent the copyright protection on it yet. If someone could tell me how, I can throw them up for you.

What would you like to know?

"

Its suppose to be the issue where it is revealed that Polaris is in fact, Magneto's daughter.

Moderator
#49 Posted by Pania (1759 posts) - - Show Bio

Gambler says:

Its suppose to be the issue where it is revealed that Polaris is in fact, Magneto's daughter.

It does.

Xavier is "treating" Lorna after she flipped out when Alex dumped her at the alter by attacking all the X-men, putting on a Magneto helmet, and spouting anti-human sentiments. When shuffling through her memories Xavier finds that shortly before the Sentinel attack on Genosha Lorna secretly stole a vial of Magneto's blood. (This was after Magneto had been paralyzed by Wolverine in Eve of Destruction, which also cut off his powers as it always does when he is severely injured, and was looking for a cure.)

So she takes the blood off shore to have a "blind genetic test" run, which confirmed Magneto was her father (never mind that since she was closely related to her adoptive family, she would have to check against their blood as well). She then dashes off to the FAA and investigates the plane crash that killed her parents. She discovered in the report that the pieces of the wreckage were highly magnetized. Pissed off, she returns to Genosha to confront Magneto, only to find that he has announced that Polaris is his daughter to the adoring Genoshan populace, who start to fawn over her (how he knew about the result of Lorna's secret test is anyone guess). As Lorna is standing there in confusion the super sentinel arrives and wipes out Genosha.

We also find out after the entire Xorn debacle that Magneto also amended his will to leave rule of Genosha to Polaris. Though obviously, she never took it up.

And Magneto has never actually spoken about this on panel, ever. Despite the fact that Charles and Lorna had a show down over Magneto policies only hours before he met up with Magneto in Excalibur Vol. 3. They never discussed it.

So the entire thing is pretty weak at this point.
Post Edited:2008-01-11 15:04:46

#50 Posted by Quintus_Knightfall (84610 posts) - - Show Bio

I don't know, the fact that there a DNA match is pretty strong in my opinion. Even if she did check her adoptive families DNA, at best it would only confirm that they to where related to Magneto. Right?

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